Underworld Trading, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!

[TrooperCam]

I have to agree with the above as well. My 3rd alt is learning synth just to use all the schems.

 

Its freakin hard to get purple grade 6 mats which is fine if there was another way to get them. Perhaps they could drop as random loot from daily missions?

[Mithros]

Dev's have said that the crew mission selections are made in a way to prevent people from over-farming only one mission type. They have controls in place that you should only be able to collect a certain amount mats at any given time. I'll edit when I find the exact quote or thread.

 

Except it doesn't work that way.

 

I can enter and exit my ship multiple times and end up with four companions running the tier 6 UT metal missions.

If I am far from my ship and not wanting to go all the way back to it, I can send however many companiosn on however many metal missions that are available, and then periodically check the list and see if it has changed (and it will change) and send more companions out at that time.

 

It doesn't restrict what is available in that way, it just makes the players jump through extra hoops to get what they really want.

The restriction is only in that there is a finite number of missions available for metals or fabrics at each tier, that they take the time that they take, and that there is a maximum amount of materials that a mission can provide.

 

If they let the players just select those missions that they wanted up front, it would cut only a few minutes out of the process (the time that is spent entering and exiting the ship or whatever to repopulate the list), but would cut out a lot of the frustration that the players feel from having to do what they have to do to repopulate the list.

 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

But, as I agreed with someone else earlier, I think that going with three mission skills is the way to go, with two associated crafting skills for each one.

 

Have eight mission at ever tier, and two missions of every level.

 

One mission to gather the rare materials, and the other for a random loot box.

(I do not know about anyone else, but I think that treasure hunting's loot boxes are far superior to underworld trading's companion gifts, even if the loot box might occasionally contain a gift. It's just more fun to open the box and get a surprise than to know that it is going to be a gift, and hope that it is something that a companion that doesn't already have a maxxed affection might actually be interested in).

 

When a player advances in the skill to unlock a particular level of mission, that mission is always on their list (unless, of course, they already have a companion out on the mission).

[Umrattawil]

If this is now the "official" UWT discussion thread, what more needs to be discussed? We already have a rough idea of the mission distributions for a few of the grade tiers. We know that the mechanism for populating the five missions in the Crew Skill window is pretty random. We know that there are tedious ways to circumvent the randomness (ship hopping or staggered companion missions to narrow the pool of possible missions).

 

People have discussed ways to broaden the the draw on resources provided by UWT so that there is a demand for Fabric. There have also been suggestions to place more control in the hands of the user so they can select which types of missions they want to have their companions tackle (to avoid the randomness of populating the crew skill window with missions). And yet another suggestion is to have at least one of each type of mission (per loot type) available in the Crew Skill window for each graded tier each time it gets populated.

 

What more do you need to hear from your user base Bioware?

[Sindistical]

Underworld trading is absolute BS!!! Is is epicly, monumentally stupid that players have to to such extremes just to get mats for their prospective professions. For god's sake take your heads out of your butts and listen to the players!!! We need more metals and fabrics missions that are above moderate. I haven't gotten a metals mission above moderate in 2 damn months!!!! Change this crap soon please. What more do we have to say?

[Foxfirerose]

Underworld trading is absolute BS!!! Is is epicly, monumentally stupid that players have to to such extremes just to get mats for their prospective professions. For god's sake take your heads out of your butts and listen to the players!!! We need more metals and fabrics missions that are above moderate. I haven't gotten a metals mission above moderate in 2 damn months!!!! Change this crap soon please. What more do we have to say?

 

DITTO in caps 10 feet tall!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sonaria]

/signed

 

They really need to change what crew skills use UWT. Only 1/3 of one crew skill uses fabrics... I mean really?! The other 2/3 of synthweaving, and all of armormech and cybertech uses metals. They need to do something here..

[Blackardin]

If this is now the "official" UWT discussion thread,

 

What more do you need to hear from your user base Bioware?

 

Edited:

 

I've changed this post as I'm really not up for board politics and such so I'll just "refine" this post. ;p

 

There's been a wealth of information sufficient just on this board to identify some key areas and patterns. I've found some interesting trends just looking at mean and median values.

 

It has to be priorities and resources. Maybe coding? Crafting eventually gets love, but its always low on the priority list and I'm wondering if there is even a development team on it presently. As others have noted, the information is limited.

 

Anyway. I'm out of here for now. Hope it gets fixed. ;p

Edited July 18, 2012 by Blackardin

[symke]

I agree. The number of gift mission in comparison to others is absurd. But I can see why there is none official response to this thread.

They want it to work this way! They made such a big difference in type of missions on purpose, because they want us to spend huge amounts of money as this is the only way for us to be constantly crafting and buying/selling on GTN.

[Blackardin]

I don't understand it. I really don't.

 

No secret that UWT is broken. One can get 30 companion gift misisons and nothing else. Very often there will be little more then 3 UWM missions on the entire rack (all moderate). My average log-outs to get a single bountiful mission are in the range of 6 to 10. UWM are going for outragous prices on the GTN (when you can find them).

 

It is bottle-necking the entire process, people are throwing up their hands and quitting the game because of it, it is contributing greatly to the negativity campaign, the "market players" are taking over the economy, and they are sitting on their hands. Even hard core fans like myself are getting fed up with it and growing tired of the game because of it.

 

I mean, for a company that is scratching their heads about how to retain subs they certainly can't seem to find this issue that is written like a flash burnt across the sky.

 

Boggles my mind how people, especially in business, can defeat themselves.

[Glower]

I noticed a lot of Metal missions with 1-390 leveling, but very little at 400-400 cap. Is this a bug? Edited July 27, 2012 by Glower

[JediKurgen]

While UT has been the most irritating and frustrating gaming experiences EVER! I'm glad to see that it isn't only me. However, it was a bit disturbing to see that this complaint has been going on since SWTOR was launched and it hasn't been addressed. Well I'm paying to be entertained not frustrated or aggravated. Well if I don't seeing some proper materials showing up by the end of the month SWTOR can kiss me and credit card good-bye! Then back to LOTRO (where the devs actually listen to the players)

[finelinebob]

But mission selection gives you such a great chance to RP! It's all about story after all, isn't it? Here's an example I use with my Sentinel:

 

"Hey Doc, we need some supplies. I know you have contacts in the Underworld and you're better at it than anyone else, so see if you can score some Mandalorian Iron. I know, I know, it's not like going to Walmart or something, more often than not nothing is available, just see if you can get it. If not, pick up some Ciridium. Or even some Nanosilk if you can't get anything else ... maybe that new Sage at the Temple is crafting some light armor and will buy from us. You'd think with all the Mandalorians around, SOMEONE would have a nice, stable supply of this stuff on hand. Well, if all else fails, can you pick me up a gift for Kira? Our anniversary is coming up and she force pushes me into the crew quarters if I forget it. I don't CARE if she doesn't like Vials of Gree Nanite Paste, just get SOMETHING so it looks like I'm thoughtful ... maybe T7 would like it."

 

See? Takes the sting out of having no control over anything, even if your skill level is 400/400, doesn't it? And it adds to the STORY!

[Blackardin]

I noticed a lot of Metal missions with 1-390 leveling, but very little at 400-400 cap. Is this a bug?

 

Just did a random test, first log on, first attempt.

 

These are the results through all levels of missions

 

Companion gifts

 

Moderate-4

Abundant-4

Bountiful-10

 

Luxury Fabrics

 

Moderate-3

Abundant-4

Bountiful-0

 

Underworld metals

 

Moderate-4

Abundant-1

Bountiful-0

 

In total,

 

Companion gifts- 18

Luxury fabrics- 7

Und Metals- 5

 

As can be seen, there is a great disparity in the amount of missions, but what is telling is the mission level (10-0 disparity between Rich UWM, and Companion gifts). This demonstrates the crux of the problem.

 

This overall rate of return coincides with previous, more extensive testing that I've done that demonstrates a 3.2 rate of return for UWM in comparison to companion gifts. This rate is almost constant, with very little variation in the mean.

 

I'm at a loss at this point in time. I'm not sure what further indication they require to at least explore this issue.

[MorgonKara]

I think the metal missions are meant to be somewhat rare but it can definitely seem like some tiers are more rare than others (for example tier 2 Alusteel). I have rerolled 6 characters, one for each craft, and I gave up on trying to make tier 2 purples for my people because the Alusteel returns are so low and players on my server try to jack the prices on the GTN to absurd levels. I mean, you out-level lower tiers so quickly anyways it's not worth the extreme effort trying to keep your characters maxed.

 

Endgame just takes a lot of persistence and the UWT crafting material special missions. Dailies give you boatloads of free credits so it's not that hard.

Edited July 30, 2012 by MorgonKara

[asbalana]

I think the metal missions are meant to be somewhat rare but it can definitely seem like some tiers are more rare than others (for example tier 2 Alusteel). I have rerolled 6 characters, one for each craft, and I gave up on trying to make tier 2 purples for my people because the Alusteel returns are so low and players on my server try to jack the prices on the GTN to absurd levels. I mean, you out-level lower tiers so quickly anyways it's not worth the extreme effort trying to keep your characters maxed.

 

Endgame just takes a lot of persistence and the UWT crafting material special missions. Dailies give you boatloads of free credits so it's not that hard.

 

Basically the metal missions are not plentyful to say the least. I just pull up my UT guy (s) whenever I can and on average will find two rich metal missions at different levels or an abundant at 6 and run them. On the occasions that there are no rich UT metal missions, I run Investigation rich missions. That way over time I end up with a good deal of purple metal mats which I store. I have not had a problem with sufficient numbers of Alusteel (or any other rare metal) by doing that. Also watch the GTN, yesterday my wife picked up 27 Karyt (sp?) dragon scales for 10k, you never know what you will find.

[Umrattawil]

Just did a random test, first log on, first attempt.

These are the results through all levels of missions

>snip<

As you know, just one snap shot does not paint an accurate picture. This is what I know about the distributions so far. I think I'll try to nail down the grade 2 & 3 missions too.

Grade 6 missions (Imperial)

• 1700 Mod Met - Assemble Your Team
  
• 1700 Mod Met - Consolidation
  
• 1700 Mod Met - No Redeeming Value
  
• 1700 Mod Fab - Breaking In
  
• 1700 Mod Fab - Desperation
  
• 1780 Abu Met - A Volatile Gift
  
• 1780 Abu Fab - The Sinews of War
  
• 2125 Rich Gift - Fair Play
  
• 2125 Rich Gift - Irreplaceable Parts
  
• 2125 Rich Gift - Match Fixing
  
• 2125 Rich Gift - Planting Seeds
  
• 2125 Rich Gift - Table Talk
  
• 2225 Rich Gift - Gaining Favor
  
• 2225 Rich Gift - Discreet Exit
  
• 2225 Rich Gift - No Competition
  

Fifteen missions. Eight are Gift (all Rich), four are Metals (3 moderate & 1 abundant), three are Fabric (2 moderate & 1 abundant).

 

Grade 5 missions (Imperial)

• 1020 Mod Gift - Questionable Content
  
• 1020 Mod Gift - Uplifting Spirits
  
• 1135 Abu Gift - One-Sided Relationships
  
• 1135 Abu Gift - Into the Sabacc Pit
  
• 1190 Mod Fab - Silencing the Snitch
  
• 1190 Mod Met - Military Takeover
  
• 1290 Abu Fab - Overdue
  
• 1290 Abu Met - Passing on the Business
  
• 2025 Rich Gift - A Convincing Argument
  
• 2025 Rich Gift - Exchange Envy
  
• 2025 Rich Gift - Special Delivery
  
• 2150 Bou Fab - Arbitration
  
• 2150 Bou Met - Feeding the People
  
• 2200 Bou Fab - Hide in Plain Sight
  
• 2200 Bou Met - Ancient Armament
  
• 2430 Rich Fab - Shakedown
  
• 2430 Rich Met - Cherished Memento
  

Seventeen missions (maybe missing a gift). Seven are Gift, five are Fabric (1 moderate, 1 abundant, 2 bountiful & 1 rich), five are metal (1 moderate, 1 abundant, 2 bountiful & 1 rich).

Grade 4 missions (Imperial)

• 665 Mod Gift - A Winning Hand
  
• 710 Abu Gift - Ransom Demands
  
• 775 Mod Met - A Simple Job
  
• 880 Abu Fab - A Tiny Cut
  
• 880 Abu Fab - Working the Market
  
• 880 Abu Met - Back-alley Bartering
  
• 1175 Bou Gift - Trust Issues
  
• 1175 Bou Gift - Detour
  
• 1250 Bou Gift - Crossing the Line
  
• 1250 Bou Gift - The Spice of Life
  
• 1405 Rich Gift - Sith Fodder
  
• 1405 Rich Gift - Stolen Plans
  
• 1410 Bou Met - Too Hot to handle
  
• 1500 Bou Fab - Overpossessive
  
• 1590 Rich Fab - Unauthorized R & R
  
• 1590 Rich Met - Political Favors
  

Sixteen missions. Eight are Gift, Four are Fabric (0 moderate, 2 abundant, 1 bountiful, 1 rich), Four are Metal (1 moderate, 1 abundant, 1 bountiful, 1 rich).

Edited August 1, 2012 by Umrattawil

[finelinebob]

I just logged in and went to send my comps on UT missions. My list for Grade 6 missions included 1 Moderate Underworld Metals, 1 Abundant Underworld Metals, 1 Moderate Luxury Fabrics, 1 Abundant Luxury Fabrics, and 1 Companion Gifts. I know, I know, some of you want to cry "LIES!", others "Hacks!!", but it's true ... just wish I would have remembered to screen shot it....

[Mithros]

I just logged in and went to send my comps on UT missions. My list for Grade 6 missions included 1 Moderate Underworld Metals, 1 Abundant Underworld Metals, 1 Moderate Luxury Fabrics, 1 Abundant Luxury Fabrics, and 1 Companion Gifts. I know, I know, some of you want to cry "LIES!", others "Hacks!!", but it's true ... just wish I would have remembered to screen shot it....

 

It's going to happen once in a while.

 

But it still doesn't mean that armormechs (who have no use for fabric other than to sell it or give it to a friend/alt) won't just grab the two metal missions and look for the nearest loading screen to try and find the other two metal missions.

[Umrattawil]

Ok, updated the UWT mission distribution list. It now covers grades 2-6.

 

Each grade dedicates at least 50% of the missions to Gifts. The remain portions are split between Fabric & Metal.

[ShawnFish]

I really do not see what the fuss is all about. I have Armormech/UT on my main and Cyber on an alt, and I have stockpiles of blue and purple level metals in my cargo hold.

 

It is not broken, the metals are MEANT to be rare. Especially the purples. And guess what! They are rare so they are going to be expensive. I just dont understand all the whining.

 

Although, I'm prly a little biased because I've made millions of selling UT metals on the GTN.

[meatlocker]

It feels impossible to find mandalorian iron.

[theStirge]

I really do not see what the fuss is all about. I have Armormech/UT on my main and Cyber on an alt, and I have stockpiles of blue and purple level metals in my cargo hold.

 

It is not broken, the metals are MEANT to be rare. Especially the purples. And guess what! They are rare so they are going to be expensive. I just dont understand all the whining.

 

Although, I'm prly a little biased because I've made millions of selling UT metals on the GTN.

 

The issue, I think, is that in the other mission skills, Investigation, Treasure Hunting, and Diplomacy, not only is there only one type of non-gift mission, but the materials gathered are only used by one crafting skill each. UT has 2 types of non-gift missions, and the materials gathered by one of those types is used by three different crafting skills. So Underworld Metals are rarer than anything else but Luxury Fabrics, and are in more demand than anything else.

[Shar-Ee]

When I can't get a mission to pop, I run all three of my companions on bogus missions at that level. Usually what I want will pop by then, I delete two of the missions and have my favorite companion do the one I want. Not saying it's fool proof, but it has worked for me and I've only been 400/400/400 for a few days. I have pulled plenty of purples, and more than enough blues to make what I need and to sell too.

 

I do agree that the amount of gift missions is insane. That really needs to be fixed.

[Glower]

 

It is not broken, the metals are MEANT to be rare. Especially the purples. And guess what! They are rare so they are going to be expensive. I just dont understand all the whining.

 

They not just rare, they VERY RARE at now, especially if you do not use bonus-missions!

Edited August 3, 2012 by Glower

[Blackardin]

As you know, just one snap shot does not paint an accurate picture. This is what I know about the distributions so far. I think I'll try to nail down the grade 2 & 3 missions too.

 

If you had noticed, I stated that the finding of that one run coincided with the more extensive testing that i've done.

 

Ive done this in approximately 8 sets of 40 across all levels. That would be 320 runs. The findings that I quoted were from that testing. If you do 3 to 4 hundred runs I am certain that your findings will match mine as the mean, median, mode and ranger were virtually unchanged through-out the process. That, in an of itself, is very telling regarding this problem.