1.3 Darth Hater article

[Jederix]

The Fatman

 

The Fatman is a PvP server. I can only imagine the "community" that resides there.

[JeramieCrowe]

The Fatman is a PvP server. I can only imagine the "community" that resides there.

 

We have a fairly large community on The Ebon Hawk, RP-PvE.

[shefdawg]

All is hear about is Wow this and wow that....wow had it so this game should, well if you like wow so much go back to panda city(lol) ohhh yeah and tell me how you like your cartoons. 6 mos past launch and you guys dont get it do you, they dont give a flying ....... about you, they say they do to keep you happy, but if they really cared they would do what is asked. And speaking of asking, think of this, they have what 1.3 million people streaming ideas at them from the forums. How can anyone make that happen. Have you ever tried having amillion freinds.....guess what you cant please them all. So if your going to unsub, do it already and dont let the door hit you where the good lord split you. as for the rest of us that do have a community of players we play with, yeah we are not exstatic about the movement but we shall wait till they fix it and do what they promised us. And btw im not a fanboi either i agree they could have done things better, but hey the chinese could have found America first, but they didnt get over it and move on...............Lasiak out

[EcrirTwyLar]

Maybe. But this says they're still looking to replace him.

 

Good point! Also... Look who else they are looking to hire.

[JeramieCrowe]

Good point! Also... Look who else they are looking to hire.

 

Yeah, a bunch of QA. I don't blame them. The current low morale of players are mostly from low-pops, and there are still low-pops ONLY because QA let a Legacy element through that broke the server transfer software they had ready since launch and were about to implement.

 

It's almost the sole reason there is so much discontent and declining subs. You have no one to play with, suddenly even the trivial things look like a bigger problem than it really is.

[Gamstun]

Best article about 1.3 that ive seen yet,

 

http://www.darthhater.com/articles/swtor-news/20452-darth-hater-interview-game-update-1-3-with-swtor

 

 

 

 

 

"At the launch of this feature (Game Update 1.3), we will not be doing cross-server flashpoints. There are a couple of reasons – first off, it’s a significant technical achievement, and we felt that pursuing it would not allow us to get the feature to you guys as quickly as it needs to happen. Secondly, most of the design team thinks that it’s not necessarily good for the community. When the odds are very low that you will never group with another player again, there is very little social pressure to not be a complete jerk to that person, which is not a particularly positive game experience. We may revisit this decision in the future if our metrics show that flashpoint queues are not firing enough, but in general, queue firing should be more about distribution of key roles (tank, healer, DPS) than about overall population."-------Damion Schubert, Lead Systems Designer

 

Well atleast they have opened the doors to x server lfg tool for the first tme ever. and atleast now we know its most of the design team that doesnt understand modern mmos and not just one person who is calling the shots. lets just hope that their metrics tell them that the same server lfg tool isnt good enough and they fix it before everyone else leaves the game.

 

I 100% agree with this IF and this is a big IF, the servers are full enough to get groups with a server only LFG tool.

 

but from what i've been reading the past month or so this is NOT the case....

[Jederix]

I keep suggesting a X-server toggle on the LFG tool, but they'd rather argue instead of embrace a solution.

 

I'd wager that xserver proponents, like myself, would be perfectly fine with this plan (I am). The other side, however, is so adamant about the "evils of the LFG tool" that no compromise short of "never put this in ever, other players on other servers might hurt my feelings" is going to suffice.

 

Honestly, I'd never use the toggle because I see no issue with xserver. I have no objections to having a tool with both options. I do know that just single server may alleviate the issue somewhat, but it is not going to help the way an xserver would.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Jederix

[Jederix]

We have a fairly large community on The Ebon Hawk, RP-PvE.

 

I am sure there are several servers with good populations; my server, Darth Bandon, seems to be fairly lively on the Republic side, anyway. My comment was more a jab at the type of player who flocks to a PvP server than the posters comment on the server itself; those communities are usually festering, abhorant playlands for adolescents who passed adolescence many years ago.

[Kelenan]

The Fatman

 

That's No MOON!

[GalacticKegger]

All is hear about is Wow this and wow that....wow had it so this game should, well if you like wow so much go back to panda city(lol) ohhh yeah and tell me how you like your cartoons. 6 mos past launch and you guys dont get it do you, they dont give a flying ....... about you, they say they do to keep you happy, but if they really cared they would do what is asked. And speaking of asking, think of this, they have what 1.3 million people streaming ideas at them from the forums. How can anyone make that happen. Have you ever tried having amillion freinds.....guess what you cant please them all. So if your going to unsub, do it already and dont let the door hit you where the good lord split you. as for the rest of us that do have a community of players we play with, yeah we are not exstatic about the movement but we shall wait till they fix it and do what they promised us. And btw im not a fanboi either i agree they could have done things better, but hey the chinese could have found America first, but they didnt get over it and move on...............Lasiak out

Actually, BW already tried bending over backwards for the community during early access when the people who cried for more servers to avoid login queues were granted their wish with 6 dozen shiny new servers at launch - only to find out their overblown concern wasn't a real problem. Not when dev had the queues resolved within weeks.

 

Because Bioware responded to the community the way the community wanted them to, there is now a server population imbalance. A population issue that would not have existed had BW simply /ignored them and stuck to their plan. I don't think Bioware can afford to take they who scream the loudest seriously anymore.

[Arkerus]

I 100% agree with this IF and this is a big IF, the servers are full enough to get groups with a server only LFG tool.

 

but from what i've been reading the past month or so this is NOT the case....

 

Agreed. IF and only IF they get the servers merged correctly and "delete" the extra launch servers, we will have enough people in each server.

 

The game's biggest problem now is not content nor is it PvP related. Its simply that each server is so thinned out that people can't find anyone else to run with.

[Arkerus]

Actually, BW already tried bending over backwards for the community during early access when the people who cried for more servers to avoid login queues were granted their wish with 6 dozen shiny new servers at launch - only to find out their overblown concern wasn't a real problem. Not when dev had the queues resolved within weeks.

 

Because Bioware responded to the community the way the community wanted them to, there is now a server population imbalance. A population issue that would not have existed had BW simply /ignored them and stuck to their plan. I don't think Bioware can afford to take they who scream the loudest seriously anymore.

 

I can't possibly type "THIS" any harder than I am right now.

 

I remember reading about the new servers and thinking "why didn't they just ignore the complainers and raise the population ceilings. Too many servers is going to kill this game." I am not joking when I say that. I hated seeing them open more servers.

 

Look what it did. None of the loudest complainers even stuck around after a couple months and now we have people stranded on servers with literally less than 100 people on them.

 

That's a prime example of the community thinking they know the answer when in reality its just noise. Sometimes your customer has no idea what they really want.

[Zannis]

'Players can also use the group finder to queue up for Planetary Destinations and Operations. Queueing for a planet is relatively freeform – it’s done purely at the planet level – as there may be multiple reasons people are queueing for a planet (heroics, world bosses, general questing).

 

So what I take this to mean is that if I want to do a specific planetary heroic, I have to queue for a general, vague, 'planetary' queue. Which means the group I get will have completely different agendas. People will drop the group, and subsequently stop using the feature for planetary heroics.

 

Back to spamming general we go. I truly believe the dev team is not really thinking things through.

[GalacticKegger]

I can't possibly type "THIS" any harder than I am right now.

 

I remember reading about the new servers and thinking "why didn't they just ignore the complainers and raise the population ceilings. Too many servers is going to kill this game." I am not joking when I say that. I hated seeing them open more servers.

 

Look what it did. None of the loudest complainers even stuck around after a couple months and now we have people stranded on servers with literally less than 100 people on them.

 

That's a prime example of the community thinking they know the answer when in reality its just noise. Sometimes your customer has no idea what they really want.

I think Bioware, stating that they learned a few things from other MMO release mistakes, looked at how Blizz screwed the pooch during WoW's launch when it took that game almost a year to find & test a fix that alleviated server crashes. Problem is, BW tried too hard to avoid Blizzard's faux pas and overshot the mark completely.

 

I think opening up character transfers and introducing a more robust same server LFG tool is a decent compromise that parallels their original design vision.

Edited May 23, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[GalacticKegger]

'Players can also use the group finder to queue up for Planetary Destinations and Operations. Queueing for a planet is relatively freeform – it’s done purely at the planet level – as there may be multiple reasons people are queueing for a planet (heroics, world bosses, general questing).

 

So what I take this to mean is that if I want to do a specific planetary heroic, I have to queue for a general, vague, 'planetary' queue. Which means the group I get will have completely different agendas. People will drop the group, and subsequently stop using the feature for planetary heroics.

 

Back to spamming general we go. I truly believe the dev team is not really thinking things through.

 

If the 1.3 video was any indication it looks like planetary heroics will get the same menu treatment as FPs, HMs & OPs.

Edited May 23, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[JeramieCrowe]

'Players can also use the group finder to queue up for Planetary Destinations and Operations. Queueing for a planet is relatively freeform – it’s done purely at the planet level – as there may be multiple reasons people are queueing for a planet (heroics, world bosses, general questing).

 

So what I take this to mean is that if I want to do a specific planetary heroic, I have to queue for a general, vague, 'planetary' queue. Which means the group I get will have completely different agendas. People will drop the group, and subsequently stop using the feature for planetary heroics.

 

Back to spamming general we go. I truly believe the dev team is not really thinking things through.

 

That's a LOT of assuming you just did...

[Mallorik]

I keep suggesting a X-server toggle on the LFG tool, but they'd rather argue instead of embrace a solution.

 

When swtor devs return from 2004 and seriously talk about a x-server tool or even mention once a xserver/same server toggle we can talk about it.

 

Anti x server lfg people will still fight it, its not about what they want, its about what they dont want other people to have.

 

The same reason the anti lfg people (who lets face it are the same people) refuse to just not use an lfg tool if they dont like it and quit worryng about what other players are doing.

 

For them it is not a question of what is good for the game and what will keep people playing, its an ideological "Feeling" that they cannot explain or justify.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Mallorik

[Arkerus]

I think Bioware, stating that they learned a few things from other MMO release mistakes, looked at how Blizz screwed the pooch during WoW's launch when it took that game almost a year to find & test a fix that alleviated server crashes. Problem is, BW tried too hard to avoid Blizzard's faux pas and overshot the mark completely.

 

I think opening up character transfers and introducing a more robust same server LFG tool is a decent compromise that parallels their original design vision.

 

Yep. I think your right.

[JeramieCrowe]

When swtor devs return from 2004 and seriously talk about a x-server tool or even mention once a xserver/same server toggle we can talk about it.

 

Anti x server lfg people will still fight it, its not about what they want, its about what they dont want other people to have.

 

The same reason the anti lfg people (who lets face it are the same people) refuse to just not use an lfg tool if they dont like it and quit worryng about what other players are doing.

 

For them it is not a question of what is good for the game and what will keep people playing, its an ideological "Feeling" that they cannot explain or justify.

 

You might be surprised. I was one of those "no x-server for community reasons" buffs. But I'm willing to compromise and say that as long as MY group is not x-server, I don't care if yours is or not.

Edited May 23, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[Ironcleaver]

I can't possibly type "THIS" any harder than I am right now.

 

I remember reading about the new servers and thinking "why didn't they just ignore the complainers and raise the population ceilings. Too many servers is going to kill this game." I am not joking when I say that. I hated seeing them open more servers.

 

Look what it did. None of the loudest complainers even stuck around after a couple months and now we have people stranded on servers with literally less than 100 people on them.

 

That's a prime example of the community thinking they know the answer when in reality its just noise. Sometimes your customer has no idea what they really want.

 

Completely Agreed. Just to add....

 

There seems to be a few different types of players here on the boards.

 

1) The exWoW player. The game needs to be like WoW or it will fail, period, no way around it. Though they have never touched another AAA mmo, this is the way they feel at heart and will defend it to the death. The issue is that they -only- have experience with WoW and they do not understand the genre has been around far longer then WoW was a twinkle in Blizzards eye. These are the same players that hate TORs graphics but will defende WoWs to the bitter end... really?!

 

2) Then you have the players that have a huge list of games under their belt. They will easily rattle off a dozen, 2 dozen or even 3 dozen games. The problem here, to squeeze in that many games they are not loyal to a single game and couldn't possibility of played a single game for longer then a month or two, possibility even less time.

 

3) Now you have the people that say they play a game but trully have not. The example here would be all those that said they played SWG (launch) but have no clue what their talking about. If SWG had as many people playing the game as claimed to have played it, it would still be around and the NGE would of never of happened. A lot of people did play the game, I'm not taking away anything from them, but we all know there are a ton of people that claim to have played that have not.

 

Now filtering out a lot of the above - game companies can start getting some good feedback.. There are, of course, more areas they must filter; the above is just a small example or what to watch for.

 

The companies that do best are the ones that will take the feedback but implement changes slowly over time, if at all. EQ1 was huge and is still considered a more "hardcore" game then what the current genre offers - but people still play it even though its 13(?) years old? This shows that not all gamers want rewards handed to them, they want to earn them.. yes.. sometimes that involves some grinding, or, heaven forbid, the accutal loss of experiance when you die.

 

People say they want a game thats all instant gratification.. Well, here you go, you now have TOR.... But people are leaving the game regardless... sure transfers/mergers will help at first... but in the end, when you have instant gratification, there is no reason to stick around for the long haul.

 

Anyway - just my opinion... :-/

[GalacticKegger]

When swtor devs return from 2004 and seriously talk about a x-server tool or even mention once a xserver/same server toggle we can talk about it.

 

Anti x server lfg people will still fight it, its not about what they want, its about what they dont want other people to have.

 

The same reason the anti lfg people (who lets face it are the same people) refuse to just not use an lfg tool if they dont like it and quit worryng about what other players are doing.

 

For them it is not a question of what is good for the game and what will keep people playing, its an ideological "Feeling" that they cannot explain or justify.

SWTOR spawned from KOTOR, NWN and ME, not Diablo & Warcraft. Like it or not ... different animals with different core gameplay philosophies. A technology comparison has nothing to do with it. Bioware said "no" and narcissists simply don't accept what that word means.

 

Now BW recently mentioned they are looking at a x-server LFG tool, but that in no way indicates a commitment to the project. I'm sure they are looking at a great many things because that's what developers do. But "looking at it" and "it's coming" aren't even on the same continent.

[Mallorik]

What color is the sky in your world? ;p How did you interpret that to be "opening the door?".

 

I think that you are hearing only what you want to hear in light of the facts. What they said was, that unlike you and the others that support this tool without merit, that they understand how it can destroy a game, which has been the same thing many of us have been saying regarding community. They are stating that they will only do it as an absolute last resort.

 

In short, the door was just slammed on this nonsense feature. I thank the maker that they get it. ;p

 

They have been running this game for the last 6 months with the same naive uninformed beliefs that you have. Doing great so far! if your goal was to make the biggest most expensive flop in mmo history.

[Darkulous]

All is hear about is Wow this and wow that....wow had it so this game should, well if you like wow so much go back to panda city(lol) ohhh yeah and tell me how you like your cartoons. 6 mos past launch and you guys dont get it do you, they dont give a flying ....... about you, they say they do to keep you happy, but if they really cared they would do what is asked. And speaking of asking, think of this, they have what 1.3 million people streaming ideas at them from the forums. How can anyone make that happen. Have you ever tried having amillion freinds.....guess what you cant please them all. So if your going to unsub, do it already and dont let the door hit you where the good lord split you. as for the rest of us that do have a community of players we play with, yeah we are not exstatic about the movement but we shall wait till they fix it and do what they promised us. And btw im not a fanboi either i agree they could have done things better, but hey the chinese could have found America first, but they didnt get over it and move on...............Lasiak out

 

Well, people talk about WoW a lot because the "Mega" team (EA,BW.LA) brought it up themselves. Make no mistake, they were targeting a large audience and called out WoW by name.

[Darkulous]

Completely Agreed. Just to add....

 

There seems to be a few different types of players here on the boards.

 

1) The exWoW player. The game needs to be like WoW or it will fail, period, no way around it. Though they have never touched another AAA mmo, this is the way they feel at heart and will defend it to the death. The issue is that they -only- have experience with WoW and they do not understand the genre has been around far longer then WoW was a twinkle in Blizzards eye. These are the same players that hate TORs graphics but will defende WoWs to the bitter end... really?!

The "mega" team made no secret that they wanted WoWs numbers. Currently there is only one model on how to achieve 10+ mill subs.

People say they want a game thats all instant gratification.. Well, here you go, you now have TOR.... But people are leaving the game regardless... sure transfers/mergers will help at first... but in the end, when you have instant gratification, there is no reason to stick around for the long haul.

Instant Gratification in TOR? Where? When I spam LFG for hours? This entire world is revolving around insta-grat tools more and more every day. You don't want insta-grat in your life? Don't use google. Don't use your computer in general. Throw your smart phone away. Don't text. Don't email. I can go on and on about the technological advances we've seen in just the last 10 years that revolve around insta-grat. The hypocracy surrounding the topic of Instant Gratification is ridiculous.

 

Anyway - just my opinion... :-/

[Mallorik]

SWTOR spawned from KOTOR, NWN and ME, not Diablo & Warcraft. Like it or not ... different animals with different core gameplay philosophies. A technology comparison has nothing to do with it. Bioware said "no" and narcissists simply don't accept what that word means.

 

Now BW recently mentioned they are looking at a x-server LFG tool, but that in no way indicates a commitment to the project. I'm sure they are looking at a great many things because that's what developers do. But "looking at it" and "it's coming" aren't even on the same continent.

 

Really? have you not seen the copy and paste skills comparing swtor and wow? if this game has a different core gameplay and philosphy than wow does, what is the difference between this game and wow?

 

I dont want another wow, but this game is just a vanilla wow clone and i can live with that if its a good game (which i think it is) and has enough of a player base to support expansions and updates. The only way to do that is to bring this game up to date.

 

The only things that seperates this game from wow are things that it does not have. If anyone told you that releasing any other product with less features than your competition has for the same money is a good idea would you not think they were an idiot?

Edited May 23, 2012 by Mallorik