Do you support an in game version of Recount. Please give reasons for your answer.

[copter]

Addons and LFD tool will be in after launch.

 

16:42 "Addons? We're working on that right now. Will be a post launch feature."

 

 

 

"IGN: Moving forward might there be something like a group finder or something like that? An auto-finder implemented into the game?"

 

"James Ohlen: Some people ask for a dungeon finder system but the thing about those systems is they're really for more of a mature online game. If you put a system in early on it really takes away from the exploration of the level up game. If you have people all just basically waiting around their dungeon finder and all being grouped up together, they're going to actually take the time to explore all the worlds that are available in the Old Republic galaxy. So it's definitely a feature that we want to put in, we just want to put it in at the right time. However, the looking for group feature is something that we continue to work on, we want to make that more robust and more powerful. "

 

http://pc.ign.com/articles/121/1214438p1.html

 

Your point is what?

 

There is no mention that Recount, damage meters, threat meters, or any specific addon is going to be allowed. For all we know they may only allow UI addons that allow you to rearrange you UI and nothing more.

[Nakraka]

That is a meter.

 

A rough one, but a meter.

 

you would have to kill that mob about 100 times to get an acurate meter... depending on how the RNG works

[Colobulous]

Only if the percentage wanting the meters is over 50%. Otherwise it is not a large percentage when compared to those not wanting them.

 

I guess then we don't read the phrase "large percentage" the same. I would say that "large percentage" doesn't have to represent a majority, but would be a bit of a broader term.

 

Especially since "not wanting" ranges from "No, must not have" to "I just don't give a damn" which is a rather inclusive term itself.

[CorvusKahn]

Sadly, I'm sure there will be some sort of Recount-like system added eventually. And I know, for a FACT, that once it is added the community will suffer for it. Sure, groups might become more efficient, but they won't be quite as friendly!

[RamataKahn]

Your point is what?

 

There is no mention that Recount, damage meters, threat meters, or any specific addon is going to be allowed. For all we know they may only allow UI addons that allow you to rearrange you UI and nothing more.

 

Yeah, that's what all you anti-addon people say when I post that. We'll have stuff like damage meters and DBM, just watch, they'll allow full support like any other large & successful MMO, because overall the positives far outweigh any alleged negatives.

[RamataKahn]

Sadly, I'm sure there will be some sort of Recount-like system added eventually. And I know, for a FACT, that once it is added the community will suffer for it. Sure, groups might become more efficient, but they won't be quite as friendly!

 

They'll be as many friendly groups as there always are, contrary to popular belief addons or meters don't turn people into jerks, they were already like that to begin with.

[copter]

Especially since "not wanting" ranges from "No, must not have" to "I just don't give a damn" which is a rather inclusive term itself.

 

The same can be said of those wanting them ranging anywhere from "must have" to "only for personal use and no linking in public chat".

 

The point is simple, saying it is needed for any reason is a fallacy.

Edited December 14, 2011 by copter

[copter]

Yeah, that's what all you anti-addon people say when I post that. We'll have stuff like damage meters and DBM, just watch, they'll allow full support like any other large & successful MMO, because overall the positives far outweigh any alleged negatives.

 

And your proof of this is where?

[Tarholy]

I will support all addons like:

 

- Recount

- GRID / HEALBOT / VUDHI

- NPC Scan

- Auctioneer

 

 

But I dont support others like DBM / BIG WIGS

 

 

-

[CorvusKahn]

They'll be as many friendly groups as there always are, contrary to popular belief addons or meters don't turn people into jerks, they were already like that to begin with.

 

Nope. You're wrong.

 

If you need proof, then here it is.

I can sense a disturbance in the force. It's as if two million voices all at once cried out for more DPS, but weren't silenced.

[Nakraka]

actually maybe they should make a dps meter that is 1 bar and it shows the potential dps that you could do... and fills up depending on what your actually doing. that way you have to actually figure out what your doing wrong and fix it...

[Dukorse]

part of the fun with wow was changing out gear and specs to see how high you could push your dps/healing etc. A recount-type addon is great for this.

 

as for elitist, as long as you clear the encounters you shouldn't care if anyone whines about your dps. If someone is clearly doing much less DPS then they should, they should be told so.

[Zania]

Ok, I'll explain why I personally feel that damage meters of any kind are bad for the game.

 

1) Yes, they allow you to get higher performance out of your character by watching the meter. Which honestly helps bad players a lot more than good players. Good player will learn how to play their class and get the most out of it without addon's help. Thus, you are actually reducing the value of personal ability to play character and substituting it with mindless number watching.

 

2) With that established, now only thing separating players is gear. Since everyone with same gear will be using exact same rotation (as they have hard evidence that it provides them with maximum damage) and have exact damage output.

 

3) With THAT established, we now have developers designing encounters solely based on DPS output (and since that is now known) based on gear alone.

 

So whereas without meters the performance of characters is uneven, and encounters are created to accommodate for it, with meters the playing field is evened. And yes, I consider that to be a BAD thing. It takes the player skill out of equation completely when balancing encounters. Whereas before a group with decent gear but exceptional skill could get through an encounter, now you need X bodies with Y gear and you are set.

 

The people who can't perform on-par with the rest of the group even with meters available either have some handicap and should not be expected to perform on the same level, or are plain out horrible. Without the meters players with THAT horrible of performance should be pretty obvious anyway.

[Colobulous]

The same can be said of those wanting them ranging anywhere from "must have" to "only for personal use and no linking in public chat".

 

Well, if you want a more granular polling option, that'd be on you, but hey, I'm not making claims about that.

 

The point is simple, saying it is needed for any reason is a fallacy.

 

Your point is silly to me, because you know what? I have explicitly disclaimed the description of it, or anything else in the game as a necessity, because the game itself isn't necessary for me to play.

 

It's all a matter of desire.

[CorvusKahn]

Ok, I'll explain why I personally feel that damage meters of any kind are bad for the game.

 

1) Yes, they allow you to get higher performance out of your character by watching the meter. Which honestly helps bad players a lot more than good players. Good player will learn how to play their class and get the most out of it without addon's help. Thus, you are actually reducing the value of personal ability to play character and substituting it with mindless number watching.

 

2) With that established, now only thing separating players is gear. Since everyone with same gear will be using exact same rotation (as they have hard evidence that it provides them with maximum damage) and have exact damage output.

 

3) With THAT established, we now have developers designing encounters solely based on DPS output (and since that is now known) based on gear alone.

 

So whereas without meters the performance of characters is uneven, and encounters are created to accommodate for it, with meters the playing field is evened. And yes, I consider that to be a BAD thing. It takes the player skill out of equation completely when balancing encounters. Whereas before a group with decent gear but exceptional skill could get through an encounter, now you need X bodies with Y gear and you are set.

 

The people who can't perform on-par with the rest of the group even with meters available either have some handicap and should not be expected to perform on the same level, or are plain out horrible. Without the meters players with THAT horrible of performance should be pretty obvious anyway.

 

Well said. I really hate how these sorts of addons turn the game all into numbers. It takes the fun out of it. I also hate rotations. It's like being given an assignment. Stand near mob and press the keys in this order or you're out of the group.

[Colobulous]

Whereas before a group with decent gear but exceptional skill could get through an encounter, now you need X bodies with Y gear and you are set.

 

With many mechanics, this is going to be true regardless. Y may inflate to large values, but without some particular gotcha mechanics, it's going to happen. And there's only so often they can include such encounter mechanics, before they become more of a burden than a challenge.

 

 

I also hate rotations. It's like being given an assignment. Stand near mob and press the keys in this order or you're out of the group.

 

What's the alternative to rotations then? You do want some choices to be less desirable than others, don't you?

Edited December 15, 2011 by Colobulous

[CorvusKahn]

What's the alternative to rotations then? You do want some choices to be less desirable than others, don't you?

 

I want personal choice to make the decision, not someone doing the math somewhere else. I've always considered rotation a weakness. Locking your mind into a set of pushing the same buttons over and over again is insane. Might as well just put a macro on and eat some popcorn.

[Msbungle]

I believe these tools play an important role in identifying whether a player is doing well or under-performing.

 

In my experience, they make people focus solely on the meter. So even if they could step forward with another aspect of their toon that does not do damage, but would help the group get past the encounter, they will not risk their place on a meter. And to me? Being able to step out of a set rotation quickly and easily when needed says more about your capabilities as a player than a meter does. Most people learned how to play their class in a way that would put them at the top of a meter rather than fully learning their classes capabilities.

[RamataKahn]

I want personal choice to make the decision, not someone doing the math somewhere else. I've always considered rotation a weakness. Locking your mind into a set of pushing the same buttons over and over again is insane. Might as well just put a macro on and eat some popcorn.

 

See, this goes to show why meters are needed and that most of the anti-addon crowd is so against them because they are bad or sub par players. Rotations are the way to do encounters efficiently and effectively in any MMO. If you don't like that you might as well not play them or deal with players telling you about it when you dps sucks as they rightly should.

 

 

Rotation a weakness, wow give me a break, I've heard it all now.

[CorvusKahn]

See, this goes to show why meters are needed and that most of the anti-addon crowd is so against them because they are bad or sub par players. Rotations are the way to do encounters efficiently and effectively in any MMO. If you don't like that you might as well not play them or deal with players telling you about it when you dps sucks as they rightly should.

 

 

Rotation a weakness, wow give me a break, I've heard it all now.

 

Yeah, I've heard this before. I stand by my opinion though. You lose the ability to react to changes quickly when your mind is stuck in a rotation. It's also very boring. I'd honestly rather be a piss poor player than have to mindlessly follow a rotation like a trained monkey.

 

Whatever, I'll play the way I want, you play the way you want. I just hope we don't have to group up someday, because then we'll both end up dead while you're complaining and not playing.

[Msbungle]

See, this goes to show why meters are needed and that most of the anti-addon crowd is so against them because they are bad or sub par players.

 

Just because you were a poor player before meters were intro'd doesn't mean we all were. But I know you are just trolling.

[RamataKahn]

Yeah, I've heard this before. I stand by my opinion though. You lose the ability to react to changes quickly when your mind is stuck in a rotation. It's also very boring. I'd honestly rather be a piss poor player than have to mindlessly follow a rotation like a trained monkey.

 

Whatever, I'll play the way I want, you play the way you want. I just hope we don't have to group up someday, because then we'll both end up dead while you're complaining and not playing.

 

Your mind might get stuck, but mine doesn't. I always did the best rotations for my character and always reacted if the situation changed or went bad. It's called being a good player and know how to play. I liked your comment about being a piss poor player, just continues to prove my point.

[RamataKahn]

Just because you were a poor player before meters were intro'd doesn't mean we all were. But I know you are just trolling.

 

I was a good player before then and a good one after I used them as well. It's called tweaking and improving performance.

[Sigmah]

Yeah, I've heard this before. I stand by my opinion though. You lose the ability to react to changes quickly when your mind is stuck in a rotation. It's also very boring. I'd honestly rather be a piss poor player than have to mindlessly follow a rotation like a trained monkey.

 

Whatever, I'll play the way I want, you play the way you want. I just hope we don't have to group up someday, because then we'll both end up dead while you're complaining and not playing.

 

Actually I'll be the person who is able to watch meters, do more damage than you, and react more quickly than you, because im good.

[Dark-of-Knight]

No. Not now. Not ever. That is all