We would like to encourage the use of less Grav round.

[Hudgaar]

As a commando I would like to encourage the use of less grav round in gunnery. Don't make it a bloody requirement to make three abilities at all worth anything, make it an instant ability on a CD, Give us a new abilitiy that also helps build what grav round builds that is not easily interruptable.

 

Otherwise, grav round is still essential to close to every other attack ability that a gunnery commando has. I know what you're saying now. Herpaderp, go assault in pvp. If I wanted to be vanguards handicapped little brother I would have rolled vanguard. I rolled Commando to havea big gun, shoot big blaster bolts, for big damage. Apparently i chose incorrectly.

 

Now I am relegated to shooting highly visible green beams to heal my allies, use abilities that have the same cast time and heal for less, and otherwise make a nuisance of myself by healing in warzones. Congratulations Bioware. You remade the paladin class in wow for all of 2006 to 2008. A healer who brings less to the table than other healers, and a laughable pvp dpser.

 

Just a matter of waiting till my sub runs out now. Might see yall again in 6 months, who knows maybe by that time the withdrawls and the addiction will be over.

[GrantyJPS]

They were supposed to resolve this spamming problem in 1.2 but apparently they couldn't be arsed so they changed a couple of numbers in a couple of functions and went down the pub.

[TrooperSol]

To reduce spamming they should make Charged bolts also build stacks of Charged barrel in addition to the barrier. That way if grav round does get interrupted, using bolts can still build both. It doesn't make sense that CHARGED bolts wouldn't already do that. Also increasing the amount of time by a couple of seconds that gravity vortices stay on a target would also reduce us having to spam grav round just to keep it applied.

[Hudgaar]

to reduce spamming they should make charged bolts also build stacks of charged barrel in addition to the barrier. That way if grav round does get interrupted, using bolts can still build both. It doesn't make sense that charged bolts wouldn't already do that. Also increasing the amount of time by a couple of seconds that gravity vortices stay on a target would also reduce us having to spam grav round just to keep it applied.

 

but that would make too much sense!

[_gideon]

I really like the idea of adding a CD to grav round, with accompanying changes to keep DPS on target.

[sensiblepoast]

They were supposed to resolve this spamming problem in 1.2 but apparently they couldn't be arsed so they changed a couple of numbers in a couple of functions and went down the pub.

 

According to their latest statements you are wrong. They only wanted to shift the damage coming from grav round to other abilities. Of course that's not what they appeared to be saying initially but hey, just look at mortar strike: fix aoe marker radius by nerfing aoe radius.

[Hudgaar]

They wanted to shift damage coming from grav round yet they still require all damaging abilities use grav round. Sooo we'll still be grav rounding as much as possible to get those charges, procs, debuffs on the enemy or else we use a less effective level of our other damaging abilities.

 

1. change grav round to an on cd instant.

or

2. make in non interruptable. (like master strike! except with less damage than master strike.)

 

These would lead the way for:

Longer time on gravity vortex, so if for some reason im not spamming grav round every 1.5 seconds. (intterupts, movement, being stunned, being pushed.) That debuff doesnt fall off in the time it takes me to get back into a worthwhile position, and cast that grav round.

[Asavar]

It's cool guys, maybe they'll finally fix the class in 4 months... long after my sub ends.

[ArchangelLBC]

Honestly, at this point, if they want us to have a more dynamic rotation, they would have to basically tear the entire tree, and perhaps the entire class DPS wise, and try again. Changing Grav Round to be a cooldown is just going to piss people off more. Giving more of the procs to Charged Bolts doesn't change the rotation, it just gives us the same basic rotation with Charged Bolts in place of Grav Round. Nothing truly changes.

 

Now do I have some great redesign that would make the class super awesome to play? Not really, and I also don't really care about spamming grav round, though I also don't PVP. My point is that if what we're after is a far more dynamic playstyle in gunnery, we're long past the point where minor tweaks are going to help I think. Maybe improve the damage of Sticky and put procs on it to encourage it's use? I honestly don't know.

[Troelsen]

I like the idea of changing Grav Round to an instant on CD. I think 15 sec cooldown with 30 second duration, applies 20% arpen on use.

 

Then, Charged Barrel should be rolled into Charged Bolts baseline. Assault would benefit with their frequent use of HiB but would have to spam Charged Bolts more. Gunnery would benefit from a talent that applies 2 stacks of Charged Barrel on each use, up to 5 stacks. On top of that, Charged Bolts should be uninterruptable.

 

I didn't like finding out that Commando is basically just a caster with less tools. They shouldn't be. Commandos are not magic casters, projecting lightning or throwing rocks. They carry turrets, pull the trigger and blast their enemies away with bombs and blaster bolts or they're rushing around the battlefield, keeping allies alive.

Edited May 22, 2012 by Troelsen

[sensiblepoast]

I like the idea of changing Grav Round to an instant on CD. I think 15 sec cooldown with 30 second duration, applies 20% arpen on use.

 

May I present you gunslinger's flourish shot? One single shot does the following:

 

1. Deals some damage.

2. Reduces armor by 20%! for 45!! seconds

3. Debufs incoming heals 20% for 9 seconds.

 

Oh and on a 4.5 second cooldown so pretty much spammable.

 

The commando, compared with the gunslinger, is not only a spit to the face but also a kick to the balls. But then I don't care anymore, my sub expires in a few days.

Edited May 22, 2012 by sensiblepoast

[Troelsen]

May I present you gunslinger's flourish shot? One single shot does the following:

 

1. Deals some damage.

2. Reduces armor by 20%! for 45!! seconds

3. Debufs incoming heals 20% for 9 seconds.

 

Oh and on a 4.5 second cooldown so pretty much spammable.

 

The commando, compared with the gunslinger, is not only a spit to the face but also a kick to the balls. But then I don't care anymore, my sub expires in a few days.

 

Dude! Well that doesn't seem very fair. . . Now I'm on board with having the Commando broken down and rebuilt.

Edited May 22, 2012 by Troelsen

[Troelsen]

I think Mercs are having similar conversions on their forums.

 

Before I went over there, I just had a thought. Through Gunnery talents or baseline, make Concussion Charge generate a stationary Particle Shield, making you immune to physics (push/pull effects) and preventing attackers from entering the shield for x seconds (provides protection against melee and especially Charges/Leaps).

 

There's more good ideas there.

[sensiblepoast]

There's more good ideas there.

 

The problem is that bioware seems to be happy with the current status quo so ideas, no matter how good, go nowhere :|

[Troelsen]

The problem is that bioware seems to be happy with the current status quo so ideas, no matter how good, go nowhere :|

 

I'm sure they read the forums. It's just a matter of collecting ideas/issues, posting them concisely and hoping from a response or update. I haven't yet read anything from BW stating that they are (un)happy with Mercs/Commandos current state.

[Hudgaar]

Mmm, and yet there have been weeks gone by with no word whatsoever.

 

There have been plenty of well thought posts as to what could be changed, what should be changed and what has been done? Not a thing.

 

Just waiting for my sub to end.

[theeANGELofDEATH]

I am very disappointed in the way the commando has been gimped in 1.2. As part of a progression group trying to drop EC HM, I am definitely the weak link in the group, not matter what spec I go to. One of our Commandos, who also respec'd for heals depending on need, already quit the raid group to raid with his Imp sniper, another is trying his best to level his gunslinger up so he can leave his commando as an alt. Of course the gunslinger/sniper class is pure DPS, so they are going to be more efficient in the DPS department, but they also nerfed the CM to the point that it is no longer a really viable healer in raids where the group is taking huge amounts of AoE damage.

 

I understand that the hybrid class of commando isnt going to be doing the DPS that a gunslinger or sentinel will deal. BUT, if we are specing into a tree that is DPS, or heals, we should be able to do close to the amount that a pure class can deal. I am being blown out of the water in parser stats by a balanced sage, who is easily dealing 100k more in damage than I can on long boss fights. Even a DPS spec'd Vanguard is beating me by close to 50k. Of course in burst, trash mob clearings, my DPS is up there, but not even close in boss fights. I know it may be a L2P better issue, but I have tried everything, talked to many commandos on our server, and they all agree that they are being out dps'd by just about everyone. One was telling me that he is being outdone by a scoundrel who is less geared than him.

 

As for this thread.. There have been a lot of great ideas on how to "fix" the class, I dont know what to say, or which way they need to go. I also agree that Bioware must think that the class is now where they want it, as they have not said anything about any voiced concerns.. I think we all just got screwed because of the one button spammers, since it was pretty silly pre-1.2 to see those videos of comm/BH just spamming Grav/HSM in PvP.

[ArchangelLBC]

In Bioware's defense, based on their MO, if they WERE gonna basically tear the class down and try again, or do any sort of major overhaul, I doubt they WOULD be very vocal about it, at least not before they felt that had it somewhat nailed down. I'm more concerned by posts from the devs, few as they've been, that basically say they think commando/merc is now working fine, or at least that's the message they are communicating, though mostly they've just defended the decision to nerf grav round.

 

 

So it may be that they hear our concerns, and just aren't communicating much about it till they figure out how to fix it, cause till then all they could tell us is they're working on it, which would be taken with a grain of salt by most people here since I think they've burned most of their credibility with us. Without something concrete most of us would either think they were lying and just trying to save face, or that they were too incompetent to do it right. And that may sound harsh, but that's what happens when you do something so incredibly stupid as the series of nerfs of 1.2 through 1.2.3

[Fhrosty]

I haven't yet read anything from BW stating that they are (un)happy with Mercs/Commandos current state.

 

I have, unfortunately. I don't have the time atm to track down the post, but it's in the dev tracker where they're defending the changes to Troopers. They claim to believe after 1.2 that troopers are now "much closer to their target" or something like that.

[sensiblepoast]

I have, unfortunately. I don't have the time atm to track down the post, but it's in the dev tracker where they're defending the changes to Troopers. They claim to believe after 1.2 that troopers are now "much closer to their target" or something like that.

 

Yes. Then they proceeded to significantly lower twice their damage due to fixes.