My server is dead - we need transfers now, not in early summer

[Rayla_Felana]

So biodrones like yourself dont seem to understand that at launch server caps low and bioware increased it as time went along. Bioware could have allowed a lot more people on servers at launch but no they had them reduced. They even said server pop caps are double now than what they were at launch.

 

Not only that but i clearly remember Bioware saying pick a server with no queues at the time. This is all Biowares fault. And so what if people wanted more servers at launch? Does it matter no? What matters is Bioware was not prepared for transfers. Transfers should have been ready AT LAUNCH or even in BETA to be used as a back up.

 

Ah doing anything but not bashing the game makes me a biodrone? okay.

[Wisnoe]

I would advise people to either reroll or cancel subs until transfers are here.

Played since early access, but because of the queues, decided to reroll to a new server that opened Eye of Ashlanae (EU PVE). First 3 months were good, regular groups going Flashpoints while leveling, pvp happened. However we never ever hit more than 100 on Fleet during its existence.

 

 

Since 3 weeks, we are lucky if we have more than 40-60 on the Fleet on primetime. PVP at 50 still happens but only in the evening. Since 1,5 week we don't have more than 20 on the Fleet on primetime. PVP is dead, GTN is dead. People are rerolling or quitting. My guild decided to reroll because we want to play this game and not be on a dead server.

 

Because I still enjoy leveling alts, me and a friend decided to reroll to The Red Eclipse (EU PVE). 200 on republic fleet primetime, 130 on Coruscant. It feels like a MMO again. People asking for Flashpoints, when I have a day off, I can pvp early in the day etc. Rerolling really made me enjoy this game better and more.

So rerolled Republic on The Red Eclipse and rerolled Empire on Nightmare Lands with the old guild.

 

The game is better with a healthy population, so if you're also stuck on a dead server, reroll or cancel until transfers are here. Losing 1 50 and legacy level 26, but don't care, my fun in the game is back!

[Mallorik]

Now when has bioware ever been on time? Early summer means early fall duh. By the time this happens there won't be a population to transfer as everyone will have quit. Seriously, what is BW doing? Even fatman population has declined. The only reason it went up was cause people started rerolling, but they stopped cause how boring and repetitious the leveling experience its. Oh well, they tried,, they just have the wrong people running the show.

 

Thats what happened to me, i rerolled on several servers to try to find a good one (including fatman but left because of que times) i finaly decided on the swiftsure, but after awhile just thinking abut all the legacy i lost, the other level 50 and 2 level 35's i lost, the 65 levels of valor i lost, all the pvp gear i lost and all the crafting skillss it just got too depressing and i gave up, so they have until my sub expires when i go play tera, gw2 or secret world, three games i had absolutely no interest in before being let down so thoroughly by bioware.

[Rutrict]

I'm a CTO for a software company and I approve this message. Id of fired my DBA for being incompetent. If our company did what this company has done let's just say I wouldn't have a job. Being publicly traded as well, our shareholders would sell and the company would fold... Just upsets me seeing developers lead by morons ruin a product.

 

I think the most hilarious thing about this game.. is when you call into Customer Service you get that "I'm Dr. Givemeyourmoney and I am Dr. Nogivemeyourmoney, thanks for playing STWOR"

 

Who the **** cares they're Drs?????? EA is the people we should all be blaming... not BioWare.

[DarthNiktu]

I would advise people to either reroll or cancel subs until transfers are here.

 

GZ if you have time to "reroll". Also GZ that you lightheartedly throw away a few months work

[Nighthawked]

You sound like a low level office clone and not a software architect.

To be honest. Moving digital data between databases over internet was tried and tested last millenia.

The fact that character transfers was not in the database/game design from day one just tells me that someone should be shot. (No, not you)

 

Don't pretend to know what I do. I have a programming job and in my spare time I program video games for fun. So I think I know just a little bit about how much it takes to test and make sure things work properly ok?

 

Look, they should have been prepared for this from the beginning. I guess they were not. Therefore, they need to get everything ready before they release it and that does include testing.

 

Threatening them will not benefit anybody. Can we please just stop it with the threats already? A few weeks ago, the threats were all about UI customization: "Give it to us NOW or else!!!"

 

They will give us transfers whenever they give us transfers. They will not stop EVERYTHING they are doing and only focus on transfers because of a few forum postings.

Edited May 5, 2012 by Nighthawked

[Rutrict]

I feel even more cheated, I bought the Collectors Edition ( which I love soley for the Malgus statue / book ), I got 6 months of time, but I paid $150 for the Razer mouse. Sure the mouse will be useful in other games.. but it'll be a constant reminder of the game I once loved to play that ultimately failed because of EAs meddling.

[skygon]

Im from Port Nowhere, it was one of the most populated PvP servers, now is dying, and in 2 weeks, dont know what will happen with this server, my guild is almost empty now and still no news about ranked wz or transfers. We have a free month i know, but people is just not playing and at the end of the free month if nothing change people just wont resub.

[Sorrasht]

Don't pretend to know what I do. I have a programming job and in my spare time I program video games for fun. So I think I know just a little bit about how much it takes to test and make sure things work properly ok?

 

Look, they should have been prepared for this from the beginning. I guess they were not. Therefore, they need to get everything ready before they release it and that does include testing.

 

Threatening them will not benefit anybody. Can we please just stop it with the threats already? A few weeks ago, the threats were all about UI customization: "Give it to us NOW or else!!!"

 

They will give us transfers whenever they give us transfers. They will not stop EVERYTHING they are doing and only focus on transfers because of a few forum postings.

 

"Programming" excel formulas and making a Visual Basic Hangman game does not exactly qualify you as an expert. We're not talking about reworking the engine, or even developing customizable UI, which can take time too. This is all about servers getting data from a database. And how frigging basic it is to migrate data between databases. If you were indeed a programmer you'd know this. They could've stated they're delaying this to have a firm grasp on how populations are evolving, or that they were still discussing the best way to deal with legacy binding and the "problem" of previous subscribers returning and filling an already heavily populated server. This would still not justify their timeframe but at least it would vaguely resemble the truth.

 

However, they chose to state that it's a technological issue, one that professionals of the industry know doesn't trully exist.

 

And yes, we have a right to complain and to say we're thinking about quitting because, well, our time is not free of charge either. That's not a threat, it's simple honesty. EA/BW could give a rat's *** about a single player quitting but what i'm seeing in my guild/server is a mass exodus. And since this is not my first MMO ride, i know that once players stop playing it's twice as hard to get them back. As such, and because i TRULLY wanted this game to succeed, i feel obligated to point out the obvious.

 

If, however, i wanted this game to fail, i wouldn't be posting here and would have already uninstalled it.

Edited May 5, 2012 by Sorrasht

[Daasca]

I feel even more cheated, I bought the Collectors Edition ( which I love soley for the Malgus statue / book ), I got 6 months of time, but I paid $150 for the Razer mouse. Sure the mouse will be useful in other games.. but it'll be a constant reminder of the game I once loved to play that ultimately failed because of EAs meddling.

 

Same thing here. I bought the collector's edition and enjoyed my early access. I also purchased a Razer Naga just for this game. I also bought the game for my son for which we both have an active account. My son no longer plays but I keep his account active in hopes that he will join me again.

 

Unfortunately, this delay in transferring characters may be the last nail in the coffin for swtor. I have also kept an eye on the swtor status website. Maybe not the most accurate but I am amazed how much it shows the decline in people logging in.

 

When I rerolled on The Fatman I was very enthusiastic about the game again. Then the problem of que time became an issue because of all of the rerolls. Seems like I had to wait an hour sometimes but no big deal cause the game seemed to be thriving at this point in time. Now there is no que time any longer which I thought was cool until I started to consider The Fatman could become as lost cause as well. If the The Fatman server declines to a low level I am done. I always said to myself that I am going to be here until the end and that may be soon. Not sure where I will go next but at least there are many choices of mmos out there.

 

Bioware screwed up with this delay in transfers. Maybe it was EA that caused it and not Bioware but in the end people will remember it as being Bioware who failed. Some people are saying that Bioware is waiting until the summer break for the transfers. Way too late to do that. Probably too late even at this point.

Edited May 5, 2012 by Daasca

[-Kelerak-]

If, however, i wanted this game to fail, i wouldn't be posting here and would have already uninstalled it.

 

First of all... You look a bit like a babie boy... Just for saying that....

 

Bioware, if u dont give us servers merge and chars transfer soon many players will quite the game, not me. Please, rush that....

[Nighthawked]

"Programming" excel formulas and making a Visual Basic Hangman game does not exactly qualify you as an expert. We're not talking about reworking the engine, or even developing customizable UI, which can take time too. This is all about servers getting data from a database. And how frigging basic it is to migrate data between databases. If you were indeed a programmer you'd know this. They could've stated they're delaying this to have a firm grasp on how populations are evolving, or that they were still discussing the best way to deal with legacy binding and the "problem" of previous subscribers returning and filling an already heavily populated server. This would still not justify their timeframe but at least it would vaguely resemble the truth.

 

However, they chose to state that it's a technological issue, one that professionals of the industry know doesn't trully exist.

 

And yes, we have a right to complain and to say we're thinking about quitting because, well, our time is not free of charge either. That's not a threat, it's simple honesty. EA/BW could give a rat's *** about a single player quitting but what i'm seeing in my guild/server is a mass exodus. And since this is not my first MMO ride, i know that once players stop playing it's twice as hard to get them back. As such, and because i TRULLY wanted this game to succeed, i feel obligated to point out the obvious.

 

If, however, i wanted this game to fail, i wouldn't be posting here and would have already uninstalled it.

 

Again, do not pretend to know what I do. Just because I think something like this needs to be tested means I only program in excel formulas and create visual basic hang man? What the is wrong with the MMO communities? I program in C# ASP.net and yes I do database programming. I create fully developed video games in C# and XNA. So please, stop telling me what I do. Oh wait, I guess now you want me to video tape my life so you can have Proof that I am a programmer? Come on, this is getting ridiculous.

 

Even if I have a database query all made and up ready to go, guess what? The bosses want me to TEST FOR WEEKS before I push it to the live server. Even if I guarantee that this is just "a simple database query, nothing can go wrong", they still want me to test for weeks.

 

Even if I use the same database and SQL as another server, I still need to test when trying it on a different server. With BWs patches that supposedly go through testing, do you want this to be done without testing or only testing it for an hour?

[Rayla_Felana]

Again, do not pretend to know what I do. Just because I think something like this needs to be tested means I only program in excel formulas and create visual basic hang man? What the is wrong with the MMO communities? I program in C# ASP.net and yes I do database programming. I create fully developed video games in C# and XNA. So please, stop telling me what I do. Oh wait, I guess now you want me to video tape my life so you can have Proof that I am a programmer? Come on, this is getting ridiculous.

 

Even if I have a database query all made and up ready to go, guess what? The bosses want me to TEST FOR WEEKS before I push it to the live server. Even if I guarantee that this is just "a simple database query, nothing can go wrong", they still want me to test for weeks.

 

Even if I use the same database and SQL as another server, I still need to test when trying it on a different server. With BWs patches that supposedly go through testing, do you want this to be done without testing or only testing it for an hour?

 

Doesn't matter what you say, as long as it brings any reason for BioWare to look even remotely positive, they will debunk it and make inexplicable excuses about why it is wrong and yet again is BioWare's fault, welcome to General Discussion, escape whilst you can.

[Nighthawked]

Doesn't matter what you say, as long as it brings any reason for BioWare to look even remotely positive, they will debunk it and make inexplicable excuses about why it is wrong and yet again is BioWare's fault, welcome to General Discussion, escape whilst you can.

 

 

Agreed. Plus they resort to personal attacks saying I am not a true programmer just because I think this should be tested? Yes even if the query is already built to perfection, you should always test it when implementing it somewhere else.

Edited May 5, 2012 by Nighthawked

[Sorrasht]

Again, do not pretend to know what I do. Just because I think something like this needs to be tested means I only program in excel formulas and create visual basic hang man? What the is wrong with the MMO communities? I program in C# ASP.net and yes I do database programming. I create fully developed video games in C# and XNA. So please, stop telling me what I do. Oh wait, I guess now you want me to video tape my life so you can have Proof that I am a programmer? Come on, this is getting ridiculous.

 

Even if I have a database query all made and up ready to go, guess what? The bosses want me to TEST FOR WEEKS before I push it to the live server. Even if I guarantee that this is just "a simple database query, nothing can go wrong", they still want me to test for weeks.

 

Even if I use the same database and SQL as another server, I still need to test when trying it on a different server. With BWs patches that supposedly go through testing, do you want this to be done without testing or only testing it for an hour?

 

I question the truthfulness of your considerations based on your conclusions. And it's not as if i don't know what i'm talking about either. When EA was getting it's first big bucks with C&C i already programmed C++. And before we had smart pointers and the zillion libraries we have today. So yeah, i know what complex code looks like, and i'm versed in memory management, something far more complicated and prone to error than database management.

 

Yes. You need to test, and test thoroughly. No one disputes this. To do this you get a test database or databases (or a copy of a live database, preferably) and proceed on simulating the transfer process on hardware that is identical to what's being used on live. Once you're happy with it, you proceed testing with live databases/servers, always ready to rollback at the first sign of trouble. All that process (testing) takes time, but not even CLOSE to the time being asked for by EA/BW. It's something that can be done in weeks, not something that takes 3 months. It's also a testing process, not development of new technology, a pompous name given to the process of writing basic code.

 

So my initial argument stands. It's not so much about competence (or lack thereof) but about truthfulness. There are other reasons why this is getting delayed, and few of them are technological.

 

Doesn't matter what you say, as long as it brings any reason for BioWare to look even remotely positive, they will debunk it and make inexplicable excuses about why it is wrong and yet again is BioWare's fault, welcome to General Discussion, escape whilst you can.

 

I have no derivatives betting on EA's stock losing value. I have nothing to gain from inventing facts. I waste my time writing here because i honestly care more about SWTOR than i care about EA/BW. It's the game that i'm interested about, not in how a company looks to its investors and potential costumers. You can't escape from facts, as much as they are inconvenient.

Edited May 5, 2012 by Sorrasht

[ironix]

Agreed. Plus they resort to personal attacks saying I am not a true programmer just because I think this should be tested? Yes even if the query is already built to perfection, you should always test it when implementing it somewhere else.

 

Throughout all my arguments, I stated very clearly that this is a relatively simple problem to solve that does not require 4+ months of development and testing. What I have stated many times is that the only reason we don't have this now is because of management. If we're waiting until July for server transfers because it is a development issue, then the developers should be fired. However, I don't believe this is the case.

 

Also, nobody is saying stuff shouldn't be tested. You're the only one accusing people of suggesting this. Though, apart from one or two self-professed developers, everyone agrees that this is not a feature that should take 4+ months to develop even when you include extensive testing.

 

Even if this feature required a full month of non-stop testing since the end of the APAC transfers, it still should be ready well before early summer.

 

Regardless of all of this, don't you think one of the best ways to test this on the user base would be to implement a character copy feature to the PTR? This is essentially the same as a server transfer, but you leave the source intact. Why something like this wasn't implemented in beta just smacks of incompetence if you ask me...

Edited May 5, 2012 by ironix

[Nighthawked]

Throughout all my arguments, I stated very clearly that this is a relatively simple problem to solve that does not require 4+ months of development and testing. What I have stated many times is that the only reason we don't have this now is because of management. If we're waiting until July for server transfers because it is a development issue, then the developers should be fired. However, I don't believe this is the case.

 

Also, nobody is saying stuff shouldn't be tested. You're the only one accusing people of suggesting this. Though, apart from one or two self-professed developers, everyone agrees that this is not a feature that should take 4+ months to develop even when you include extensive testing.

 

Even if this feature required a full month of non-stop testing since the end of the APAC transfers, it still should be ready well before early summer.

 

Regardless of all of this, don't you think one of the best ways to test this on the user base would be to implement a character copy feature to the PTR? This is essentially the same as a server transfer, but you leave the source intact. Why something like this wasn't implemented in beta just smacks of incompetence if you ask me...

 

Oh I agree. Their design should have anticipated transfers. But without seeing their database first hand and seeing if it is an easy thing to do, I cannot make the argument that it will only take a week to give us the feature.

 

Maybe Joe the database creator messed up when creating ours at launch, but the APAC databases were built correctly? I do not know all the details about the APAC transfers, but could there be a reason why it was easy for those servers and not ours? Maybe they did not have to worry about same character/legacy names as they do for our servers?

[ironix]

Oh I agree. Their design should have anticipated transfers. But without seeing their database first hand and seeing if it is an easy thing to do, I cannot make the argument that it will only take a week to give us the feature.

 

Maybe Joe the database creator messed up when creating ours at launch, but the APAC databases were built correctly? I do not know all the details about the APAC transfers, but could there be a reason why it was easy for those servers and not ours? Maybe they did not have to worry about same character/legacy names as they do for our servers?

 

The source servers for the APAC transfers were ALL servers. These people weren't all occupying one or two servers or databases, they were people spread across every single server. Also, you do know that database administrators do NOT create databases by hand or with any real manual intervention, thereby allowing someone to screw up with building the database. Databases are created through a standard SQL script that can be applied over and over again to create new identical databases on demand; there is no realistic chance this process could be fouled up.

 

Anyhow, given what you just said, I really doubt that you understand the difficulty of the problem at hand.

[Nighthawked]

The source servers for the APAC transfers were ALL servers. These people weren't all occupying one or two servers or databases, they were people spread across every single server. Also, you do know that database administrators do NOT create databases by hand or with any real manual intervention, thereby allowing someone to screw up with building the database. Databases are created through a standard SQL script that can be applied over and over again to create new identical databases on demand; there is no realistic chance this process could be fouled up.

 

Anyhow, given what you just said, I really doubt that you understand the difficulty of the problem at hand.

 

Again, you guys can skip the lecture. I have made those SQL scripts myself.

 

Anyway, without seeing their databases first hand and know their internal procedures, then I will believe there is some reason as to why they cannot have it in there now. I am not the tinfoil hat type of person that thinks they have a secret agenda for something.

[ironix]

Again, you guys can skip the lecture. I have made those SQL scripts myself.

 

Anyway, without seeing their databases first hand and know their internal procedures, then I will believe there is some reason as to why they cannot have it in there now. I am not the tinfoil hat type of person that thinks they have a secret agenda for something.

 

From my point of view, we can blame the obscene delay on management. For you see, the only other reason would be gross incompetence, and I'd rather give the developers the benefit of the doubt in that regard.

 

EDIT: Though maybe I shouldn't.

Edited May 5, 2012 by ironix

[Nighthawked]

From my point of view, we can blame the obscene delay on management. For you see, the only other reason would be gross incompetence, and I'd rather give the developers the benefit of the doubt in that regard.

 

EDIT: Though maybe I shouldn't.

 

Oh that I agree with. Most of the time, developers do what they are told and nothing else. So if management wants them to wait, or whatever the problem is, it is the problem with Management.

 

However, since all the servers on Light now, don't you think if they could do it now, they would?

[recsa]

As side note i would like to say that im pretty worried about human being's future, if one of the TOP videogames companies, in the self proclamated TOP country in this world needs months to develope a few database scripts and a web interface .... something is not working as intended in USA

 

But dont worry, we can help you BW, here we have monkeys that can do this for you in a few hours, just call it

[ironix]

Oh that I agree with. Most of the time, developers do what they are told and nothing else. So if management wants them to wait, or whatever the problem is, it is the problem with Management.

 

However, since all the servers on Light now, don't you think if they could do it now, they would?

 

Not if what they're implementing will result in anything that remotely resembles server mergers or shutting down servers. That's something they'd probably prefer to put off for the 2nd fiscal quarter (early summer) than the 1st (now).

 

EDIT: This article refers to Dallas Dickenson's statement about server transfers being done in waves:

According to Senior Producer Dallas Dickinson, the service will be made available in waves. The studio will begin by offering free transfers to and from specific servers, but later on there will be a more widespread system that will allow anyone to transfer to the server of their choice. The service should help alleviate issues with low population servers by offering transfers to high-pop ones.

 

Given the statement of low->high-pop transfers, this would suggest the low-pop server would become a dessicated husk -- a dead server. Wouldn't they want to close those down? What looks bad on a financial report?

Edited May 5, 2012 by ironix

[Brosephiine]

It's hilarious to read all these QQ posts when it was the QQ'ing about needing more servers that caused this mess in the first place....

 

 

Keep doing what you're doing BW. I'd rather things run smoothly than you rush something because the entitlement crowd has ADD.

 

If they leave... let them leave.... They'll be back... watch.

 

I gotta agree with this. The Silver Platter Elite need to seriously bring it down a few notches. I'd like to see them do better than Bioware has.

[DjSnazzyduds]

Not if what they're implementing will result in anything that remotely resembles server mergers or shutting down servers. That's something they'd probably prefer to put off for the 2nd fiscal quarter (early summer) than the 1st (now).

 

Oh I would actually welcome the idea of them shutting down the servers for an extended period of time to put some more work into the game, get things up and running much more swiftly, fix bugs, major issues, and add a couple more content from the suggestion box forums. It's awesome to see how many players have great ideas.

 

On a side note, this "biodrone" name has got to go, it's a childish name. Just because a player enjoys this game and defends that which he/she enjoys doesn't make them a drone. It means they have an opinion just as you. Many players such as myself, see the many issues of this game, we are not blind, we just rather enjoy a game that to our preference, is still worth playing. We relate to the crowd which wants change, but we don't feel the need to bash the game and it's developers, comparing it to other MMO's and ridiculing the way this game is handled.

 

I don't go around calling the complainers the "pitchfork crowd" or the "raging nerds" because a lot of you have good points, I just don't agree that shouting out that a developer is incompetent in various ways, and demeaning the future of this game will make any difference. It's counter productive honestly. There are a lot of issues sure, but the difference between us "biodrones" as you prefer to call us and the players pushing for change, is that we have patience.

 

That last part wasn't for you Ironex lol.