Save The Sorc/Sage Healers!

[Sulenia]

I would like to ask everyone who has an issue with the huge nerf to sage and sorc healers to post a reply to this forum so Bioware can realize its mistake. I hope that if this thread gets enough attention Bioware will undo some of their changes. They buffed the other heals and nerfed sages they tried to make them equal and as a result they made sages worse than every other heal class. Noble Sacrifice? What is that spell now, its only use now is to get your 5k heal crit medal easier. Sages had force regeneration issues before the patch, now they have to literally stop healing for 2mins after 1 minute of healing in order to not run out of force, at least in my experience since the patch. Prior to 1.2 my healing record in voidstar was 863131 heals. I used to have no issues whatsoever doing 350k+ in huttballs now? im lucky if i can get over 200k. I am planning on quitting swtor, a game I adore, if these changes are not reversed, yes I have alts I could play but this fact simply disappoints me too much to log in to do more than check if they fixed the issue yet. My sage runs out of force about twice as fast, heal spec sages are simply a hindrance to pvp as they are nearly useless in their current state. My sage now does about the same dps in heal spec as she did in dps spec before as in telekinetic throw now ticks for what it did in balance spec before, etc. If you currently wish to play a healer you may as well reroll if you're playing a sage, because they're not worth playing as anything other than dps now. Thank-you for kindly listening to my "nerd rage"-like rant and I really appreciate any responses. Preferrably only respond if you are a 50 heal sage as its hard to notice the changes if you are not playing one or not at level cap.

[maamets]

OMG Wall Of Text

 

Learn to write so that people will actually bother to read it.

 

My response - sorc/sage were imba so far. This nerf was needed (and my main is a sorc). Learn to cope with changes in life.

[Ghost_Spectre]

OMG Wall Of Text

 

Learn to write so that people will actually bother to read it.

 

My response - sorc/sage were imba so far. This nerf was needed (and my main is a sorc). Learn to cope with changes in life.

 

I am with you. My Sage (29) shares equal time with my Shadow. I ran her this weekend and found her, for the most part, not any different from before except for the time it takes 'Deliverance' to activate and the force point usage. I changed up to using 'Benevolence' more during battle in support of my friend's Jedi Guardian noting that I can use that constantly without fear of draining my force points. When I have to use 'Deliverance,' I do so. Since I have Theran with me on healing mode, I find that it helps make up some of the slack. With him, Theran, I can concentrate throwing more attacks. When I obtain 'Rejuvenate,' I will add more to my healing. So far, I am happy with the way my character is now, even after 1.2.

[fnak]

I also feel like the nerf to sages really did help balance things in PvP

 

 

 

Before 1.2, sages could heal more than scoundrels, and had tons of utility: Knockback, pull, force speed, shield.

 

Commandos also had some utility and a lot more survivability

 

 

Scoundrels had... an AoE breakable CC. Not to mention that their single target stun and most of their damage was melee range.

 

 

 

After 1.2, scoundrels can heal a lot, but still dont have the utility the other classes have, so it got a little more balanced

Edited April 16, 2012 by fnak

[lafr]

The main problem is not what they said about balance, but the weak shield, cast of deliverance taking much more time (about 4 seconds) and resplendence that is still on the tree but do nothing more than take 2 skill points if you try to use it.

 

Yes, we have to deal with the chances, but in life we do more over the time. We learn to do better and we don't need to run with one leg because we already run too fast.

 

Sage level 29? How about get your lvl 50, full equiped. Go to an operation and you can go back say that again.

Edited April 16, 2012 by lafr

[NemurY]

rofl sage lvl 29 ))))

 

Get to lvl 50, gear up with augmented armor then we will talk.

[Ghost_Spectre]

Sage level 29? How about get your lvl 50, full equiped. Go to an operation and you can go back say that again.

 

&

 

rofl sage lvl 29 ))))

 

Get to lvl 50, gear up with augmented armor then we will talk.

 

Scoff all you want. I shall reach level 50 and by that time, I will have developed a sound strategy and tactic that will allow me to do what my Sage does best, heal. Then I will reiterate my statement. Unlike most who only complain about this "nerf," I welcome this challenge 1.2 brought. I will overcome and adapt. Quitting and complaining are what people do when they cannot stand and face a challenge, overcome, or adapt. As for me, I am about finding solutions to improve and relish in the challenges that I face. Not what I see from people now, it is all about entitlement and microwave mentality of have to have it now. The old saying of 'Nothing venture, nothing gained,' is very appropriate here.

 

You do not like what has happened, you have three choices: 1) Quit (unsub), 2) Reroll another character, or 3) adapt, overcome, and own the challenge. The formers are the easy path, the latter, is a difficult road that will reap great rewards and a sense of accomplishment when reaching the goal. As far as I am concern, either you possess the will or you do not. In my mind's eye, crying and complaining is counter-productive and wastes time. Do what you want; I will seek the path with the greater rewards and accomplishment.

Edited April 16, 2012 by Ghost_Spectre

[hlavinkaXVX]

&

 

 

 

Scoff all you want. I shall reach level 50 and by that time, I will have developed a sound strategy and tactic that will allow me to do what my Sage does best, heal. Then I will reiterate my statement. Unlike most who only complain about this "nerf," I welcome this challenge 1.2 brought. I will overcome and adapt.

 

you have no idea what youre talking about other than spewing some heroic/overcome/hallmark card nonsense.

 

you will be dead in less than 10 seconds when someone focuses you of equivalent gear for their class who isnt a complete dufus at 50. your DPS will be garbage against most, and a decent percentage of your heals will be interrupted by melee hits, stuns, etc... and smart teams focus healers fast, consistently.

 

the healer class has become sufficiently boring in PVP unless youre part a premade with equal-to-or-higher gear advantage.

 

not to mention, just grinding for new gear because ranked zones didnt make it into the patch is making this game, PVP wise, super boring. the new map is fun, but thats not enough to keep a rat on a treadmill for long.

 

unless you can stay safe, where you arent threatened (which means your team hardly "needs" you, you just supplement the advantage... and thats when youll see higher stats. which really begs the point of the class), youre worthless. you will be trying to self-heal yourself more time than not after you get Force Armor up and then youll get interrupted from focus and die when you dont have advantage. its a blast.

 

Edited April 16, 2012 by hlavinkaXVX

[NoFishing]

I am with you. My Sage (29) shares equal time with my Shadow. I ran her this weekend and found her, for the most part, not any different from before except for the time it takes 'Deliverance' to activate and the force point usage. I changed up to using 'Benevolence' more during battle in support of my friend's Jedi Guardian noting that I can use that constantly without fear of draining my force points. When I have to use 'Deliverance,' I do so. Since I have Theran with me on healing mode, I find that it helps make up some of the slack. With him, Theran, I can concentrate throwing more attacks. When I obtain 'Rejuvenate,' I will add more to my healing. So far, I am happy with the way my character is now, even after 1.2.

 

Lol, you are basing your opinion on leveling content in a party while also having a healer pet out. Get to 50 and start healing hard/nightmare mode raids, and then you'll know what your sage is really capable (or not capable) of.

[Ghost_Spectre]

you have no idea what youre talking about other than spewing some heroic/overcome/hallmark card nonsense.

 

That is because you cannot comprehend the meaning of accepting and overcoming a challenge. I on the other hand know how to do what you are incapable of doing regardless of how “hard” you want to make it appear. It is all in the strategy and tactics one must develop, perfect, and use.

 

You continue to believe that the Sage is useless now. Of course, you are entitled to your opinion. Nonetheless, it is a one I call a defeatist opinion. Conversely, from your missive here, it appears you have given yourself only two options to choose from, quit, or reroll. I suggest you do the latter so at least you can still enjoy playing the game using a different AT.

[Ghost_Spectre]

Lol, you are basing your opinion on leveling content in a party while also having a healer pet out. Get to 50 and start healing hard/nightmare mode raids, and then you'll know what your sage is really capable (or not capable) of.

 

I know Sage’s capably now and what it will be when I reach level 50. This is not my first MMO. Nor would it be my first time in a PvP environment either. Therefore, your statement is hollow and holds no credibility with me. Moreover, there are others Sage/Seer players that have already overcome the changes and adapted their play. Some have even uploaded videos of their Sages that dismiss the entire naysayers and their assumptive predictions.

[Drayoc]

I know Sage’s capably now and what it will be when I reach level 50. This is not my first MMO. Nor would it be my first time in a PvP environment either. Therefore, your statement is hollow and holds no credibility with me. Moreover, there are others Sage/Seer players that have already overcome the changes and adapted their play. Some have even uploaded videos of their Sages that dismiss the entire naysayers and their assumptive predictions.

 

*sigh... one of the biggest things they changed in 1.2 are the two talents in the Seer tree that you do not and have never had access to on your level 29 Sage. So you have no way of knowing what changes occurred. You have never even played as a Sage in a level 50 WZ, where people are geared with Expertise (They changed the Expertise formula as well) and play very smart. You have also never run an Ops in HM or NM with that Sage so you have no idea how long your force lasts.

 

I am one of the people who is trying to cope and adapt with the changes because I love my Sage and admit that we were overpowered before. However this is too much and I find myself just getting depressed every time I play with my Sage.

 

So please, don't open your mouth and start babbling when you have NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. Since you will never be able to play as a level 50 Sage prior to 1.2 and "watching YouTube videos" does not count as having experience, you can not compare the changes and therefore your opinion on the subject is flawed. So please stop inciting a flame war.

Edited April 16, 2012 by Drayoc

[Ghost_Spectre]

So please, don't open your mouth and start babbling when you have NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

 

You are making assumptions that I have no idea. You know what they say about assumptions. I am not a stupid person. I am highly educated earning an MBA. I do not take kindly your belittling remarks. I know how to study, read, and research. Whether or not I have actually used a Sage in PvP is immaterial. I have a damn good idea of what the changes have done and how they affect the Sage (before & after 1.2). I can damn well see them at the current level of my character now.

 

I know how cause and effect works. I know and understand how to recognize, analyze, and find resolutions to certain issues, such as what Sages are facing now. It does not take some life-long MMO player of umpteen game systems (PvE or PvP) to figure out how to learn and come to a good understanding through observance, reading, researching, and analyzing; otherwise known as cognitive reasoning. Furthermore, do not EVER assume I am some brainless idiot who does not know understand how things work especially if I have not specifically done something, because clearly, you are wrong.

[Drayoc]

You are making assumptions that I have no idea. You know what they say about assumptions. I am not a stupid person. I am highly educated earning an MBA. I do not take kindly your belittling remarks. I know how to study, read, and research. Whether or not I have actually used a Sage in PvP is immaterial. I have a damn good idea of what the changes have done and how they affect the Sage (before & after 1.2). I can damn well see them at the current level of my character now.

 

I know how cause and effect works. I know and understand how to recognize, analyze, and find resolutions to certain issues, such as what Sages are facing now. It does not take some life-long MMO player of umpteen game systems (PvE or PvP) to figure out how to learn and come to a good understanding through observance, reading, researching, and analyzing; otherwise known as cognitive reasoning. Furthermore, do not EVER assume I am some brainless idiot who does not know understand how things work especially if I have not specifically done something, because clearly, you are wrong.

 

I don't think you are brainless or an idiot, I am merely stating that no matter how much you analyze numbers and data, you can not reach an accurate conclusion untill you apply them into the real world.

 

Which you have not.

[Talzed]

You are making assumptions that I have no idea. You know what they say about assumptions. I am not a stupid person. I am highly educated earning an MBA.

 

 

Just an FYI, one of the things that I learned while receiving my MBA was that you allow experts to be experts. You can plan, theorize, and number crunch to any extent you feel necessary but those results are only as good as the underlying assumptions.

 

Healing HARD now. I base this on my PVE experience while leveling AND by the considerable anecdotal evidence offered by people with considerably more practical experience in many other aspects of the game where I am not the expert.

 

Please note that I said hard, not impossible. I believe that successful strategies and tactics are available, but it will take experience and adaptation.

 

I also choose to believe that when Bioware realizes that they have gone too far that we will be buffed, hopefully to a happy medium. But I don't expect that to happen soon.

[Cire_Valthar]

Lulz...Ghost_Spectre, why would you get on the sage forum when you don't have a sage character at 50? Instant backlash waiting to happen. I'm not attacking you, but like some of my fellow >>50<< Sages have said you don't have any idea of how it was post or better yet pre-patch. No one is calling you stupid....well some people are, but you can't give a accurate response to the 1.2 changes after you have been through it all. 100's of wz and millions of heals. I've been there, and I, like others, can give their distaste for the patch because we know what it was like. *Daydreams....* (snort) Anyways! Yea so just be careful before you go on a heroic rant about how things are now to how they will be because its a whole other ball game once you have 2 marauders on your light armor butt.

[Ultraviolence]

I am not a stupid person.

 

How many geared out 50's have you fought at 50? Yeah ok, so your observations mean what?

 

Zero is the answer we're looking for on both of those.

Edited April 17, 2012 by Ultraviolence

[Dodasa]

Healing high pre 1.2 on voidstar 425k

 

 

After 1.2 on voidstar 506k

 

Stat wise similar but higher since 1.2

Ability to handle 1 v1 situations seems easier from an offensive stand point but for each opponent added the difficulty increases as compared to pre 1.2 for me. Level of competition due to player reroll and server transfer may have affected my opinions

[alexsamma]

Healing high pre 1.2 on voidstar 425k

 

 

After 1.2 on voidstar 506k

 

Stat wise similar but higher since 1.2

Ability to handle 1 v1 situations seems easier from an offensive stand point but for each opponent added the difficulty increases as compared to pre 1.2 for me. Level of competition due to player reroll and server transfer may have affected my opinions

 

It's still possible to pull 500K+ on voidstar, but I have yet to see anyone hit 600k-700k+ since the patch, which was normal for voidstar prior to 1.2.

 

Not sure where you get the "easier to handle 1v1," sure our dps is higher now, but any pure DPS class can crush us 1v1 since 1.2 went live.

[Khadroth]

Sages are fine still in dps and healing. In pve and pvp. If you're complaining that you're broken and unviable, you're doing something wrong, because others are handling the changes just fine.

 

If you're threatening to quit over it like the OP, please do.

[NemurY]

That is because you cannot comprehend the meaning of accepting and overcoming a challenge. I on the other hand know how to do what you are incapable of doing regardless of how “hard” you want to make it appear. It is all in the strategy and tactics one must develop, perfect, and use.

 

You continue to believe that the Sage is useless now. Of course, you are entitled to your opinion. Nonetheless, it is a one I call a defeatist opinion. Conversely, from your missive here, it appears you have given yourself only two options to choose from, quit, or reroll. I suggest you do the latter so at least you can still enjoy playing the game using a different AT.

 

One guardian can CC / interrupt a jedi Sage for 12 seconds, imagine having more then that on yourself, lets say, a marauder? Do the math Interrupt + cc + interrupt. How many heals can you cast on yoursefl. Oh, by the way. Your team is dead they died while you got passed your second resolve bar.

Stop debating what you cannot understand. People are playing sages at lvl 50 for a long time. Either one of you are whinning about sages are fine, you either HAVE a different class, or you just making conversation.