1.2 Carnage Spec + ravage.... holy !@#$?

[Pondarro]

Hi all,

Abit of background first:

 

lvl 50 marauder

full BM gear (around 1100 expertise)

 

Was always Anni spec pre-1.2 patch (leveled as carnage, never tried rage, but intend on doing so now post 1.2 patch after ive had a good run with carnage).

 

Swapped over to Carnage spec this morning, and holy crap... anyone else feel a little OP right now?

Ravage is doing between 6-9k in damage on some non-PVP geared enemies...

Battering Assault > (bust Bloodthirst + relic) > Gore > Berserk > Ravage - damage can get anywhere between 7-10k (armor / expertise / shields etc will reduce these figures of course)

 

This is the spec i am currently using (its not 100% refined i know, but it was a good quick spec before work this morning)

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/marauder#c-1kdec88dki-e8

 

How are Rage and Anni spec's post 1.2? Worth a try?

 

Cheers,

Edited April 13, 2012 by Pondarro

[Jaidn]

Been a while since I tried carnage, but why did you pop beserk before ravage? Plus did you already have 30 stacks of fury built up so you could pop both bloodthirst and beserk?

[atreyuz]

How are Rage and Anni spec's post 1.2? Worth a try?

 

PvPed around 10 hours today, mostly RAGE and then ANNI.

 

Rage 1.2 is amazing.

 

Anni is still beastly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PS: that carnage spec you linked is kinda fail.

Edited April 13, 2012 by atreyuz

[Cegenaus]

PS: that carnage spec you linked is kinda fail.

 

id say

 

Hi all,

Abit of background first:

 

lvl 50 marauder

full BM gear (around 1100 expertise)

 

Was always Anni spec pre-1.2 patch (leveled as carnage, never tried rage, but intend on doing so now post 1.2 patch after ive had a good run with carnage).

 

Swapped over to Carnage spec this morning, and holy crap... anyone else feel a little OP right now?

Ravage is doing between 6-9k in damage on some non-PVP geared enemies...

Battering Assault > (bust Bloodthirst + relic) > Gore > Berserk > Ravage - damage can get anywhere between 7-10k (armor / expertise / shields etc will reduce these figures of course)

 

This is the spec i am currently using (its not 100% refined i know, but it was a good quick spec before work this morning)

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/marauder#c-1kdec88dki-e8

 

How are Rage and Anni spec's post 1.2? Worth a try?

 

Cheers,

 

you definately need points in towering rage. gore > ravage > force scream is awesome

[Pondarro]

Been a while since I tried carnage, but why did you pop beserk before ravage? Plus did you already have 30 stacks of fury built up so you could pop both bloodthirst and beserk?

 

Use predation before hand to get full 30 stacks then pop bloodthirst - my bad. But you guys get the gist - you should totally give it a go, especially with BM gear > 1k+ expertise on someone with little to no expertise, u can litterally kill them with ravage alone....

 

 

PvPed around 10 hours today, mostly RAGE and then ANNI.

 

Rage 1.2 is amazing.

 

Anni is still beastly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PS: that carnage spec you linked is kinda fail.

 

I am very keen to try out Rage spec (post 1.2) i never tried it before, but it looks really good now. Will definately be in my dual spec.

 

Yeh that spec isnt as refined as i would like it, but all you really need is Gore, reduced cooldown/rage cost on Ravage in the rage tree, the immobolise from the top of the carnage tree and bust a few cooldowns and watch their health melt away.... ESPECIALLY now that the Ravage spell doesnt CAST and not do damage.... that was rediculous... how many times that bugged out on me pre 1.2 - it deserves the massive buff it has on it now

 

 

 

One thing i have noticed tho, we are now seem to die alot more, not sure why... maybe it was becoz i swapped from Anni spec to Carn as well - seems tho with an upgrade from 650expertise to 1100... i would be about the same... but i guess not

[tehrad]

PS: that carnage spec you linked is kinda fail.

 

What about something like this: http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f4ef8ef4e6fefe9f7ef2ef9:

 

Haven't spent enough time with carnage but I am very tempted to try it out again now that I have some better gear

[Aragost]

Coming up against most players now is a joke, but coming up against the horde of people who rolled a mara in the last month? It feels like cheating

[coldserpent]

What about something like this: http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f4ef8ef4e6fefe9f7ef2ef9:

 

Haven't spent enough time with carnage but I am very tempted to try it out again now that I have some better gear

 

Still a shyte build. Your force attack, aka Force Scream, will always be a guaranteed critical when you get an Ataru proc(Massacre), so Malice is worthless really. Not having Cloak of Carnage talented also starves your rage generation a bit. Not having a root effect on Deadly Throw also reduces your effective crowd control(not to mention the range reduction on Obfuscate reduces your defensive option there some).

 

You want at least 34 points into Carnage to really start to do well. Two in Ravager from the Rage tree, three in Annihilation for the rage refund of Enraged Slash. That gives you two points to decide to put somewhere else, whether it's Short Fuse, Stagger, finishing off Narrowed Hatred, or even throwing them into Decimate. This would actually be a more effective build here:

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f13ef4de17f7ef12:

 

Note that I did say that it currently leaves two points leftover to decide where to put them in my previous paragraph.

[Pondarro]

Ive changed the Carnage spec up a bit.

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/marauder#3c-1kdec882ki-k

 

I find this one would go alot better with my play style.

I dont really monitor (with carnage spec) the buffs to see when "Blood Frenzy" is avaliable. So casting force scream as that comes avaliable for 100% chance to crit isnt that useful for me. 2 Points better spent else where.... but for other people i can see how its a very viable choice.

[tehrad]

Still a shyte build. Your force attack, aka Force Scream, will always be a guaranteed critical when you get an Ataru proc(Massacre), so Malice is worthless really. Not having Cloak of Carnage talented also starves your rage generation a bit. Not having a root effect on Deadly Throw also reduces your effective crowd control(not to mention the range reduction on Obfuscate reduces your defensive option there some).

 

You want at least 34 points into Carnage to really start to do well. Two in Ravager from the Rage tree, three in Annihilation for the rage refund of Enraged Slash. That gives you two points to decide to put somewhere else, whether it's Short Fuse, Stagger, finishing off Narrowed Hatred, or even throwing them into Decimate. This would actually be a more effective build here:

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f13ef4de17f7ef12:

 

Note that I did say that it currently leaves two points leftover to decide where to put them in my previous paragraph.

 

Yeah I had a feeling that malice is pretty lack lustre. Didn't realise CoC would make that big of a difference tho.

 

Damn carnage has a metric f**kton of roots, no wonder people cry hard Will have to play with this some more see if I can get used to it over Anni

Edited April 13, 2012 by tehrad

[VoidSpectre]

havnt tried rage as I am not a fan of the spec

 

but carnage is still WAY worse than annihilation. all the marauders in my guild gathered and tried different specs vs the healers in our guild and all the healers still say annihilation is a beast to fight compared

[Cegenaus]

Ive changed the Carnage spec up a bit.

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/marauder#3c-1kdec882ki-k

 

I find this one would go alot better with my play style.

I dont really monitor (with carnage spec) the buffs to see when "Blood Frenzy" is avaliable. So casting force scream as that comes avaliable for 100% chance to crit isnt that useful for me. 2 Points better spent else where.... but for other people i can see how its a very viable choice.

 

if speccing force scream as an insta crit isnt your playstyle then you probably shouldnt be using carnage. that would be like a rage spec not grabbing shockwave because they dont like stacking buffs or an anni not grabbing deadly saber because theyd rather not use dots

[BobaStyx]

Still a shyte build. Your force attack, aka Force Scream, will always be a guaranteed critical when you get an Ataru proc(Massacre), so Malice is worthless really. Not having Cloak of Carnage talented also starves your rage generation a bit. Not having a root effect on Deadly Throw also reduces your effective crowd control(not to mention the range reduction on Obfuscate reduces your defensive option there some).

 

You want at least 34 points into Carnage to really start to do well. Two in Ravager from the Rage tree, three in Annihilation for the rage refund of Enraged Slash. That gives you two points to decide to put somewhere else, whether it's Short Fuse, Stagger, finishing off Narrowed Hatred, or even throwing them into Decimate. This would actually be a more effective build here:

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f13ef4de17f7ef12:

 

Note that I did say that it currently leaves two points leftover to decide where to put them in my previous paragraph.

 

You're absolutely out of your mind if you don't put 2 points into short fuse. That's the whole reason why it was moved from an Anni near top-tier talent to a first tier because every class besides Anni was fury starved (except for Rage if you wanted to do anything besides Predation). Now Rage, which is constantly blowing through rage can get Berserk up, get your 4 shockwaves, obliterate/force charge and pop your smash. Then you can spam Vicious Slash and generate MORE rage for after it ends. It also allows Carnage to freely use predation because it's always up, or Berserk for the 1 rage massacres.

 

Cloak of Carnage isn't much of a filler talent. I've never had an issue with Rage in Carnage, and if you have that extra 3 secs off of BA you shouldn't ever really have an issue. Massacre is 2 rage (3 to use it), Gore is 3 rage, Force Scream is 2. Besides those 3 moves, you really don't have a lot of rage using talents, that's why I use the extra one second root on FC because you never know when you need yet another snare.

 

If you haven't tried Carnage I would suggest it. You're an absolute nightmare in Huttball and you can dish out some serious focus-style damage, esp with Gore-Ravage and the old tried and true Gore/Massacre/Scream.

[babiegirlla]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100bcZhrrRRrrdGzZM.1

[TheNotorius]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100bcZhrrRRrrdGzZM.1

 

^ This is the right spec. Optionally, you swap the 2 points from Narrowed Hatred to Cloak of Carnage

[coldserpent]

Cloak of Carnage isn't much of a filler talent. I've never had an issue with Rage in Carnage, and if you have that extra 3 secs off of BA you shouldn't ever really have an issue. Massacre is 2 rage (3 to use it), Gore is 3 rage, Force Scream is 2. Besides those 3 moves, you really don't have a lot of rage using talents, that's why I use the extra one second root on FC because you never know when you need yet another snare.

If you haven't tried Carnage I would suggest it. You're an absolute nightmare in Huttball and you can dish out some serious focus-style damage, esp with Gore-Ravage and the old tried and true Gore/Massacre/Scream.

 

You've also got Smash, Rupture, Vicious Throw, Crippling Slash, Deadly Throw, Sweeping Slash. Each of these still cost rage, and if none of these are used ever, something's wrong(or you're killing too fast for them to be of use, in which case, I agree that Stagger might be a better skill to max out).

 

And wouldn't you want to use Gore/Massacre/Ravage/Scream as a new rotation? Or Gore/Ravage/Scream?

Edited April 13, 2012 by coldserpent

[Teqie]

Carnage Spec

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f13ef4e6fef2e9f6ef2e2f8

 

I haven't tried it out yet, but it should work quite fine. Some explaination of my choosing.

 

1. I put 2 points in Payback (Rage tree), for increased survivability.

2. Ataru Mastery (Carnage tree) must be a joke. 30% extra damage on procc. Shouldn't give more than 400 dmg in total. Waste of points imo.

3. Displacement (Carnage tree). I use this as a finisher, not as a stun. Waste of points imo. There might be situations where it would be of help but nah.

4. Narrowed Hatred (Carnage tree). Not really useful, but it gives me the oppurtunity to change a mod to surge instead of accuracy.

 

Comments?

[AGoldCrayon]

Ive changed the Carnage spec up a bit.

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/marauder#3c-1kdec882ki-k

 

I find this one would go alot better with my play style.

I dont really monitor (with carnage spec) the buffs to see when "Blood Frenzy" is avaliable. So casting force scream as that comes avaliable for 100% chance to crit isnt that useful for me. 2 Points better spent else where.... but for other people i can see how its a very viable choice.

 

How can you not monitor when blood frenzy comes up? You can force a blood frenzy proc just by using massacre. You are giving up alot of burst damage. Massacre -> gore -> ravage -> FS

[AGoldCrayon]

Carnage Spec

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/marauder/#::f13ef4e6fef2e9f6ef2e2f8

 

I haven't tried it out yet, but it should work quite fine. Some explaination of my choosing.

 

1. I put 2 points in Payback (Rage tree), for increased survivability.

2. Ataru Mastery (Carnage tree) must be a joke. 30% extra damage on procc. Shouldn't give more than 400 dmg in total. Waste of points imo.

3. Displacement (Carnage tree). I use this as a finisher, not as a stun. Waste of points imo. There might be situations where it would be of help but nah.

4. Narrowed Hatred (Carnage tree). Not really useful, but it gives me the oppurtunity to change a mod to surge instead of accuracy.

 

Comments?

 

As much as I like payback, it just isn't worth getting unless you're going rage. You're basically spending 5 points to get it (2 for payback, and 3 wasted points in malice). Malice is wasted because FS is already going to be a 100% crit, and force choke and rupture are your only other force attacks.

 

You skipped short fuse, which is baffling, and chose 3/3 DWM over 2/2 CoC 1/3 DWM. DWM might be nice for raiding, but if this is a pvp build, get CoC. DWM is for sustained dps, the math works out to be something like 1% extra dmg per point.

 

And I disagree about displacement being wasted points. Deadly throw is not a finisher, its a heal debuff, and something you're going to want to keep on any primary focus target. You're confusing that with your sub30% execute. Deadly throw root is a great way to stop a kiter, or pin someone down in a fire pit that already has full resolve. Not to mention the extra range on your blind is underrated.

[Teqie]

As much as I like payback, it just isn't worth getting unless you're going rage. You're basically spending 5 points to get it (2 for payback, and 3 wasted points in malice). Malice is wasted because FS is already going to be a 100% crit, and force choke and rupture are your only other force attacks.

 

You skipped short fuse, which is baffling, and chose 3/3 DWM over 2/2 CoC 1/3 DWM. DWM might be nice for raiding, but if this is a pvp build, get CoC. DWM is for sustained dps, the math works out to be something like 1% extra dmg per point.

 

And I disagree about displacement being wasted points. Deadly throw is not a finisher, its a heal debuff, and something you're going to want to keep on any primary focus target. You're confusing that with your sub30% execute. Deadly throw root is a great way to stop a kiter, or pin someone down in a fire pit that already has full resolve. Not to mention the extra range on your blind is underrated.

 

Good points. I'll take it into concideration when testing it out tonight. I'm looking for a spec to use in both PvE and PvP. Cant be arsed respeccing every day. And yes I confused Deadly Throw with Vicious Throw.

[AGoldCrayon]

If you're looking for a build that has decent overlap of pve and pvp, I would suggest annihilate, you'll end up wasting fewer points I think to get a strong build for both pve and pvp.

[Teqie]

I've been Anni since I got 50. With rated warzones coming, cleansing dots will be an issue. At least when you fight teams with decent healers. That's why I'm interesed to see what Carnage can offer.

 

I got MOX damage meter installed so I will do some testing on PvE / PvP dummies. I got full Rakata / BM gear atm.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Teqie

[-Oreos-]

i specced carnage today to try it out. the dmg output is def pretty nice. i would say that in a pve setting, carnage and anni probably come real close, depending on your playstyle.

 

pvp wise i prefer anni only because of close quarters. yes, some people don't like it, but i personally think it's beneficial due to the fact that marauders are super deadly when up close. i think if they moved close quarters to the carnage tree, i'd be all over it lol.

 

in wzs today, i feel that i def do more dmg than i did before. i think this is mainly because healers are not as strong in the survivability as they were pre patch and when i fight groups, i always take the healer down first. did many 2v1's today and came out pretty strong. (i play anni). it all really comes down to what u are comfortable with but i'm glad they did something with carnage because it's much more attractive to play. seeing the multiple 2.5k hits pop up like 4-5 times when u spam massacre is really amazing.

[EasymodeX]

This is teh specz0r:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100bcZurMRRrrdGzZM.1

[Neflarion]

You've also got Smash, Rupture, Vicious Throw, Crippling Slash, Deadly Throw, Sweeping Slash. Each of these still cost rage, and if none of these are used ever, something's wrong(or you're killing too fast for them to be of use, in which case, I agree that Stagger might be a better skill to max out).

 

And wouldn't you want to use Gore/Massacre/Ravage/Scream as a new rotation? Or Gore/Ravage/Scream?

 

 

I think you're a little confused on the Carnage tree. Rupture is not really used if used at all as Carnage. Also Smash and Sweeping Slash are used when stopping a group from capping something. Vicious throw is an execute and Deadly Throw is used when a healing debuff or a ranged root is needed.

 

As far as your proposed rotation. Nothing comes between Gore and Ravage, if you do something, Gore has a chance of falling off before you get your 3rd strike off, and if it does you lose your armor pen for the hardest hitting of all 3 strikes. Generally it should go Massacre>Gore>Ravage>Scream.

 

Carnage is not really a rotation spec, it's more a priority spec. That priority didn't change from what I can tell, we just hit harder now. If you want to know what your priorities should be as a Carnage Mara, the stick at the top haas good information for you.