Algaaa Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Wrong. The game earns money from subs regardless of how often and for how long they play. If half the players subbed, but never log in, BioWare still gets the money. Subs =/= concurrent play times. Anyway what they point to have million subs if only couple thousnds playing the game. I dont know wgat TOR plans but in charts is very very low now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Anyway what they point to have million subs if only couple thousnds playing the game. I dont know wgat TOR plans but in charts is very very low now Are you having a hard time understanding me or something? I'm kind getting the vibe that English isn't your first language... Over a million are still playing the game. When a game first launches, people take time off work, stay up later, get up earlier, all to play the game for a lot more hours than they normally do. That only lasts so long. People have to get back to their lives. Thus, the time they actually play drops by half or more, on average. So, there are still over a million playing, but not at the same times anymore. Read this a few times before posting again, please. Make sure you understand. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanxxx Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Are you having a hard time understanding me or something? I'm kind getting the vibe that English isn't your first language... Over a million are still playing the game. When a game first launches, people take time off work, stay up later, get up earlier, all to play the game for a lot more hours than they normally do. That only lasts so long. People have to get back to their lives. Thus, the time they actually play drops by half or more, on average. So, there are still over a million playing, but not at the same times anymore. Read this a few times before posting again, please. Make sure you understand. Thanks. 'Over a million are still playing the game. '. Hmmm that's one thing we don't know, could be 500k could be more than 1m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 'Over a million are still playing the game. '. Hmmm that's one thing we don't know, could be 500k could be more than 1m. Conceded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakazia Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) Wrong. The game earns money from subs regardless of how often and for how long they play. If half the players subbed, but never log in, BioWare still gets the money. Subs =/= concurrent play times. They may get sub $ off of people that are no longer into playing the game, but it won't last. The point is you've undervalued a player who pays & plays the game. These are the people who will ultimately help this game suceed. Are you having a hard time understanding me or something? I'm kind getting the vibe that English isn't your first language... Over a million are still playing the game. When a game first launches, people take time off work, stay up later, get up earlier, all to play the game for a lot more hours than they normally do. That only lasts so long. People have to get back to their lives. Thus, the time they actually play drops by half or more, on average. So, there are still over a million playing, but not at the same times anymore. Read this a few times before posting again, please. Make sure you understand. Thanks. You can tell everyone there's a million bajillion people playing till you're blue in the face. It won't matter when a person logs into their server and it's dead. I couldn't get into a game of PvP all morning yesterday and if you're going to tell me it's because most swtor players are avid church goers I'm going to laugh in your face. Even trying to get a group together for a flash point during prime time is a joke. It's not acceptable in an MMO that there's a monthly fee attached to. Before launch Bioware put guilds that were registered on to servers. In early access there were far too few servers to choose from. Then huge queues came.... it seemed like the caps on servers were increased and then a buttload of servers that shouldn't have been added were added anyways in anticipation of an influx that never happened. Sure people will plunk in a lot of time when a game first launches, sure that will drop off after a while... the problem is Bioware didn't have the foresight to recognize this and populations have kept dropping on some servers to an unacceptable level. Now we're all spread apart on too many servers and no one but people on a handful of servers are really getting an MMO experience at all. Edited April 30, 2012 by Nakazia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) They may get sub $ off of people that are no longer into playing the game, but it won't last. The point is you've undervalued a player who pays & plays the game. These are the people who will ultimately help this game suceed or fail. You can tell everyone there's a million bajillion people playing till you're blue in the face. It won't matter when a person logs into their server and it's dead. I couldn't get into a game of PvP all morning yesterday and if you're going to tell me it's because most swtor players are avid church goers I'm going to laugh in your face. Even trying to get a group together for a flash point during prime time is a joke. It's not acceptable in an MMO that there's a monthly fee attached to. Before launch Bioware put guilds that were registered on to servers. In early access there were far too few servers to choose from. Then huge queues came.... it seemed like the caps on servers were increased and then a buttload of servers that shouldn't have been added were added anyways in anticipation of an influx that never happened. Sure people will plunk in a lot of time when a game first launches, sure that will drop off after a while... the problem is Bioware didn't have the foresight to recognize this and populations have kept dropping on some servers to an unacceptable level. Now we're all spread apart on too many servers and no one but people on a handful of servers are really getting an MMO experience at all. I agree with a lot of this. Hard for me to agree that BioWare didn't have the "foresight", though, when they even mentioned this typical trend on the pre-launch forums... I mention subs, though, in an attempt to prevent the spread of false information. I completely acknowledge that there are servers where concurrent play has fallen sharply, and have even acknowldeged this is a normal MMO trend. I've stated even before the announcement that server transfers (and NOT merges) were needed. But falling concurrent playtimes =/= declining subs. Plain and simple. Edited April 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Kraxis- Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) The largest, most active Empire guild on our server (Daragon Trail) recently quit for Tera. :\.. some other guilds have left too... the population on our server is DEFINITELY dropping - I know because I /play almost every day/ and I see the trend. Some people in my guild have rolled characters on Fatman... and they seem to love it due to the high population. Bioware... you better merge these servers and save your game because it's going downhill fast. IMO, Bioware should DROP EVERYTHING (except bug fixes) and get server merges done. It will breathe new life into this game, more-so than 1.3 will. Edited April 30, 2012 by -Kraxis- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakazia Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I agree with a lot of this. Hard for me to agree that BioWare didn't have the "foresight", though, when they even mentioned this typical trend on the pre-launch forums... I mention subs, though, in an attempt to prevent the spread of false information. I completely acknowledge that there are servers where concurrent play has fallen sharply, and have even acknowldeged this is a normal MMO trend. I've stated even before the announcement that server transfers (and NOT merges) were needed. But falling concurrent playtimes =/= declining subs. Plain and simple. If they really did have the foresight.. a lot more US servers wouldn't be in the dire situation that they are in now. I did notice what seemed to be an extremely large influx of people playing during the rakghoul event but it has since dropped... to less players than before the release of 1.2 which is concerning. I think server transfers, merges, along with cross server queueing for PvE & PvP would definitely help this game move in the right direction again. It's not too much to ask that we be able to play with people in an MMO and you can't fault a player for their server choice when they began playing either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 IMO, Bioware should DROP EVERYTHING (except bug fixes) and get server merges done. It will breathe new life into this game, more-so than 1.3 will. They can't drop everything, it's not a "zero sum" development department.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Algaaa Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Are you having a hard time understanding me or something? I'm kind getting the vibe that English isn't your first language... Over a million are still playing the game. When a game first launches, people take time off work, stay up later, get up earlier, all to play the game for a lot more hours than they normally do. That only lasts so long. People have to get back to their lives. Thus, the time they actually play drops by half or more, on average. So, there are still over a million playing, but not at the same times anymore. Read this a few times before posting again, please. Make sure you understand. Thanks. ye english isnt my first language it is true. before i poste i read and i know what you mean ppl working etc. but i still cant believe Over a million are still playing the game. Discussion about low server population become very hot at this week. specially this week and last week... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Kraxis- Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) They can't drop everything, it's not a "zero sum" development department.... We don't need 1.3, we need server merges FIRST, end of story. Priorities..... theirs are messed up. Fix the population, then worry about new features. Edited April 30, 2012 by -Kraxis- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 we need server merges FIRST, end of story. Public service announcement: They will offer transfers, NOT merge servers. Read the BLOG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I agree with a lot of this. Hard for me to agree that BioWare didn't have the "foresight", though, when they even mentioned this typical trend on the pre-launch forums... I mention subs, though, in an attempt to prevent the spread of false information. I completely acknowledge that there are servers where concurrent play has fallen sharply, and have even acknowldeged this is a normal MMO trend. I've stated even before the announcement that server transfers (and NOT merges) were needed. But falling concurrent playtimes =/= declining subs. Plain and simple. Perhaps Bioware didn't lack the foresight, but EA just saw big money being made during the Christmas holiday. The worse time to release an MMO is during a major holiday break. That act alone made them create way more servers then what really is needed. There was even more of an unusual influx of people playing for 2+ weeks because of the major holiday break. MMOs should only be released when there is normal work and school going on. That way you only get an unusual influx of people for a couple of days before everyone is back to normal work and school schedules. But releasing during the major holiday break made it so that influx was even bigger and lasted even longer. And now because of EA wanting the big end of year pay off, the game is going to suffer for it. Bioware needs to drop at least 40% of the servers, perhaps more, to give all servers a more healthy population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Kraxis- Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Public service announcement: They will offer transfers, NOT merge servers. Read the BLOG. ... there are TOO MANY SERVERS as it stands now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I think with all these years since WoW, with all these MMO consistently merging servers, that the industry would get a frakin clue and not have separate servers in the first place. Have everyone on one big server, with all the zones instanced to control population in a zone. Then they can drop or add servers as needed without effecting anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 To show that there are to many servers look at the math: Last number of subscribers I last saw was 1.7 million 225 servers If spread out equally 7555 subscribers per server Industry normal for peak time population is roughly 20%, thats 20% that is playing during the same 4 hour period on a server, with the other 80% playing at various times throughout the other 20 hours per day. That is 1511 people during the peak times on the server. Lets go with 50/50 for the factions 755 people per side if all things are equal, during the peak time. 755? that is abysmally low. IMO, a healthy server population should be roughly 2000 per side during peak times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Kraxis- Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) To show that there are to many servers look at the math: Last number of subscribers I last saw was 1.7 million So you are basing your math on estimates and an outdated subscription report that doesn't even count whether the players are active or not.. got it. A lot has changed in the past 30 days. I'll come back to argue more when official North American numbers are updated. Edited April 30, 2012 by -Kraxis- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkenpig Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Public service announcement: They will offer transfers, NOT merge servers. Read the BLOG. Public service announcement: We know BW is planning transfers in the future. Transfers are not as effective a way to deal with the population fiasco as is a planned server merger process. Read other posts here and learn to THINK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 So you are basing your math on estimates and an outdated subscription report that doesn't even count whether the players are active or not.. got it. A lot has changed in the past 30 days. I'll come back to argue more when official North American numbers are updated. What are you expecting? That there More then 1.7 million players? That there would be more then 755 per side at peak times? I mean, if you are going to argue with me, I assume that you are going to argue that there are the right amount of servers? Cause I am trying to show that there are way to many servers, even basing it on the the last known subscriber numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caligari Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 They would have to increase character slots before they can even think about server merges. People's heads will explode if they are forced to decide which 8 toons to keep and which 8 to delete (assuming you had 8 toons each on both servers that were being merged). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinlynn Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Public service announcement: They will offer transfers, NOT merge servers. Read the BLOG. That's becuase they are too nuttless to admit they F'ed up and released the game with too many servers. IE, the market perception of merges will be that the game is not as successful as anticpated, which would be accurate. The truth hurts and free transfers will not fix the population issues overall. IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakazia Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 That's becuase they are too nuttless to admit they F'ed up and released the game with too many servers. IE, the market perception of merges will be that the game is not as successful as anticpated, which would be accurate. The truth hurts and free transfers will not fix the population issues overall. IMHO. While your correct for the most part, I think free transfers is a step in the right direction to aleviate some of the frustrations people who play on low population servers have been facing. If it's implemented correctly it could help balance out the overall population a lot better than it currently is... not saying it'll be perfect, not saying people are going to be 100% happy about how it will effect their server, not saying it's not going to be painful while waiting for server transfers to happen either. Take away the ability to PvE or PvP on a server and what you've got left really isn't anything you'd call an MMO. This is a critical issue. It should be priority #1 and it needs to be done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarfux Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Can't people see what they are doing? They are offering free server transfers. THEN after people go to what server they want, they are going to merge them. Daniel Erickson even said in an interview when somebody asked him "are server merges a possibility? absolutely!" so they are coming. Just have patience. I know to some of you people waiting 2 days seems like 10 days with this game. But it's not. Damn...just ride and have fun. If not, gthl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 We don't need 1.3, we need server merges FIRST, end of story. Priorities..... theirs are messed up. Fix the population, then worry about new features. What? Do you even know what "zero sum" means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 ... there are TOO MANY SERVERS as it stands now. And moving everyone off a low-pop and shutting it down is NOT merging servers. It's transferring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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