SIDIOUSFAN Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) It's not in the patch notes, but juggernaut who went on the test server said me that decimation (swelling winds ?) is now a 2 points feat instead of 3, while still providing a 10% damage increase per point. So overall, it's 10% damages nerf. Edited March 17, 2012 by SIDIOUSFAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) But 3 seconds? I'm struggling to see it as a HUGE game breaking nerf. It's a nerf no doubt, but with the changes to Zephyr it's sort of like there giving us (Focus) a better way to manage our focus with a penalty of 3 seconds to our sweep. If you gave us the increased Focus and left the 9 second Sweep then it would have been a boost. So they "balanced" it. It's a nerf and it will drop the DPS a bit but we'll just have to wait and see. Operatives got what was perceived as a nefr when they reduced there knock down. It turned out not to affect them at all. It's a nerf however you look at it, those 3 seconds are a 25% increase in CD, and considering how much DPS comes out of that one ability in any rotation. Personally I was never really waiting on focus for 3 seconds, but I was occasionally waiting on it at 9 seconds CD, never mind 12 seconds. Sentinels however got Focus spec seriously buffed, seemingly at the expense of Guardians. Edited March 17, 2012 by Goretzu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 3 seconds is a huge bad deal when it comes to a boss fight in pve. It also makes the difference between life and death in pvp. On top of that, decimation now provides a 20% smash (leep ?) damage increase instead of 30%. That means a 10% nerf to our main damage ability. What did we gain in exchange for that ? A medium boost to a mediocre ability (high cost for low damages) and a defensive cooldown that costs 4+ rage/focus.... Now just take a look at what marauder/sentinel got and you'll understand how we got the shaft It does seem a bit lope-sided. Focus Guardian getting an overall significant nerf, with Sentinel getting an overall significant buff. Looking like Sentinel will be by far the stronger in Focus now..... strangely Guardians don't seem to have gained anywhere else (Veng or Tank-wise) either though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted March 17, 2012 Author Share Posted March 17, 2012 It does seem a bit lope-sided. Focus Guardian getting an overall significant nerf, with Sentinel getting an overall significant buff. Looking like Sentinel will be by far the stronger in Focus now..... strangely Guardians don't seem to have gained anywhere else (Veng or Tank-wise) either though. Yes, this is my major gripe. The patch notes don't seem to follow any coherent logic or reasoning. While some changes make sense (Focused Defense) most of the ability changes seem completely arbitrary. If Sweep Bombs are considered a problem, why not nerf "focused resonance" directly? Why increase the cooldown on AoE on a class that already has weak AoE? Why buff Sentinel Focus DPS and leave Guardian DPs out to dry? And this how I feel about most of the class changes. Yes, some make sense, but most just seem to be completely unwarranted. But that's just me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therouterninja Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 Another consideration: with our leaps now causing a stun effect, it becomes much more difficult to avoid our bombs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maticlandarr Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) Another consideration: with our leaps now causing a stun effect, it becomes much more difficult to avoid our bombs. Until we fill up their resolve bars with all that leap-stunning. Im a bit disappointed with the changes, since i just found my perfect dps spec. Hybrid focus/vig to take advantage of storm and sweep by lowering cds to 6sec and 9sec. Itll still be a viable spec but im going to look into alternatives when the patch hits. Edited March 17, 2012 by maticlandarr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Yes, this is my major gripe. The patch notes don't seem to follow any coherent logic or reasoning. While some changes make sense (Focused Defense) most of the ability changes seem completely arbitrary. If Sweep Bombs are considered a problem, why not nerf "focused resonance" directly? Why increase the cooldown on AoE on a class that already has weak AoE? Why buff Sentinel Focus DPS and leave Guardian DPs out to dry? And this how I feel about most of the class changes. Yes, some make sense, but most just seem to be completely unwarranted. But that's just me... Indeed. Plus if sweep bombs were considered a problem, then why buff Sentinel into the role? It makes little sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Indeed. Plus if sweep bombs were considered a problem, then why buff Sentinel into the role? It makes little sense. Or you know.....change our 4-piece PvP Bonus. I mean really, there'd be 10 more sensible ways to nerf Sweep Bombing without gutting it completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramonium Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Sentinels focus tree has been change in the exactly same way even worse:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Sentinels focus tree has been change in the exactly same way even worse:( It is my understanding that the Sentinel Focus DPS tree was significantly buffed. But whatever...this isn't about Sentinels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramonium Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) It is my understanding that the Sentinel Focus DPS tree was significantly buffed. But whatever...this isn't about Sentinels. Unforchantly not, so now it's our common problems as the tree is shared:) Edited March 18, 2012 by Stramonium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Unforchantly not, so now it's our common problems as the tree is shared:) How so? Sentinels now have access to Swelling Winds, am ability previously exclusive to Guardians that boosts theirs Sweeps by 30% and reduces the CD by 3 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stramonium Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) I wrote about it here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=366241, in some details:) Edited March 18, 2012 by Stramonium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tictrictrac Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Some guys talked about 12sec CD on Sweep in 1.2 But with 2 pts Swelling Winds, doesn´t it end /w 13sec CD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 None of you are even considering the implications of this post: Let me also say that there's significant under the hood changes to stats, diminishing returns, itemization stat budget, a new tier of gear with different stats and more diverse mods, changes to PvE and PvP math, etc. That means that it is not possible to assess impact of class changes in regards to power gain or loss from the patch notes alone, people will have to go on PTS and actually play to get the full picture. Which we highly encourage you to do! sooooo...yeah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beergogglez Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 None of you are even considering the implications of this post: sooooo...yeah I'd love to play on the PTS, but i'd be wasting my time ..since they never listen to anything you say lol? You'd be wasting your time lvling up too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 I'd love to play on the PTS, but i'd be wasting my time ..since they never listen to anything you say lol? You'd be wasting your time lvling up too. True, but if the changes Zoeller talks about are significant it matters to this conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 None of you are even considering the implications of this post: sooooo...yeah Sounds like some good PR "obscurification", but little else to me. It's like all good magic tricks, it only works if you can keep the audiences eyes off what it actually going on. It would take an awful lot of under the hood changes to make up for what is changing, and still Focus Guards are likely to be less DPS and less surviabilty than Focus Sents post 1.2 not matter what changes they make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hadrians Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 (edited) I play a rage spec sith juggernaut, (mirror class of focus guardian). Focus/rage has been badly nerfed. Looks like decimate now provides a 20% damage increase on smash (sweep ?) instead of 30%. This plus the nerfed cooldown results in a huge nerf. Great :-) u know that u are Op? with ur 9sec Cd of Smash with Hits above 6K Komma Crits? Edited March 19, 2012 by Hadrians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Great :-) u know that u are Op? with ur 9sec Cd of Smash with Hits above 6K Komma Crits? Rage/Focus Mara/Sents have been buffed. They'll be hitting with as much DPS, but still with better surviability than Rage/Focus Juggs/Gaurds currently are. Which makes little sense if 1.2 is supposed to nerf Juggs/Guards, why do it then buff Mara/Sents back past them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Good post on the changes, pretty in depth as to the problems with the changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nahtanoz Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Sounds like some good PR "obscurification", but little else to me. It's like all good magic tricks, it only works if you can keep the audiences eyes off what it actually going on. It would take an awful lot of under the hood changes to make up for what is changing, and still Focus Guards are likely to be less DPS and less surviabilty than Focus Sents post 1.2 not matter what changes they make. exactly, i'm really quite sad that these are the type of responses we get. it's extremely demeaning because the responses tell you absolutely nothing at all. they are just a moderately sized paragraph telling you that you're wrong and giving you completely ambiguous reasons (read: BS) why. "stats, diminishing returns, itemization stat budget, a new tier of gear with different stats and more diverse mods, changes to PvE and PvP math, etc." ALL of those undoubtedly will affect ALL classes in the SAME way. unless they are going to purposefully itemize certain classes better (or make, say, aim give more benefit than cunning) than others to compensate for the nerfs that certain classes are getting, it's ENTIRELY possible to assess the impact of class changes from patch notes. honestly this type of response was not surprising from that dev, his attitude towards the player base is extremely poor and his lack of respect is really obvious. i'm sure you can find his "troll" post in the operative forum somewhere. point is don't fall for the BS, focus got a nerf. biggest question for 1.2 is really where we are in the pecking order. lots of other classes got nerfed too, but it's probably safe to say that sentinels probably got the better end of the stick (but who knows, rated WZs may change a lot of people's minds because of the different environment/group play) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 exactly, i'm really quite sad that these are the type of responses we get. it's extremely demeaning because the responses tell you absolutely nothing at all. they are just a moderately sized paragraph telling you that you're wrong and giving you completely ambiguous reasons (read: BS) why. "stats, diminishing returns, itemization stat budget, a new tier of gear with different stats and more diverse mods, changes to PvE and PvP math, etc." ALL of those undoubtedly will affect ALL classes in the SAME way. unless they are going to purposefully itemize certain classes better (or make, say, aim give more benefit than cunning) than others to compensate for the nerfs that certain classes are getting, it's ENTIRELY possible to assess the impact of class changes from patch notes. honestly this type of response was not surprising from that dev, his attitude towards the player base is extremely poor and his lack of respect is really obvious. i'm sure you can find his "troll" post in the operative forum somewhere. point is don't fall for the BS, focus got a nerf. biggest question for 1.2 is really where we are in the pecking order. lots of other classes got nerfed too, but it's probably safe to say that sentinels probably got the better end of the stick (but who knows, rated WZs may change a lot of people's minds because of the different environment/group play) That's it, they maybe changing things, but unless they are changing it class by class (and I doubt they will as any MMORPG that has gone that route has had a nightmare and ended up changing back), then it won't changing anything vs class balance. The thing I don't understand is why Guard Focus is seriously nerfed, yet Sent Focus is seriously buffed, leaving the Sent Focus spec superior in every way to the Guard Focus spec (Focus Sents will have more DPS, more and easier focus gen and still have more surviablity in this spec than Focus Guards:eek:). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCcarroll Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 I love playing a Focus Guardian, though it's definitley not as easy playing, say, a Carnage Marauder. I hope these changes can help me, and most seem pretty useful. Swelling Winds being moved into Focus is definitley good, but I don't know about changing Zephyr. Other than that, though, I don't know if it'll affect my actual distribution of the skills. I've got 2 points with Stagger and 2 with Swelling Winds, so it's not a huge change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightmist Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 About sentinels, on the previous patch notes, they didn't add that "Quick Recovery" was removed so focus sentinels will also have 12 sec cd on sweep with a %20 damage increase and no focus reduction whatsoever to cyclone slash and force sweep, which should decrease their AE ability considerably. Still centering buff to focus may just break it all and make them overpowered tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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