Skorpeo Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 PvP exploit ruins PvE tanking, news at 11. oh wai.... this isn't anything new. Wrecking pve tanking threat and damage because gearing exploits is ridiculous and ruins game experince for pve tanks. Using the word "exploits" would refer to people cheating the game. Thats like saying that when you go 5mph over the speed limit, you should be arrested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyrit Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Using the word "exploits" would refer to people cheating the game. Thats like saying that when you go 5mph over the speed limit, you should be arrested. Taking advantage of game mechanics to play it in a manner it was not intended for, is an exploit. One of these days they will make an mmo without pvp. That day we can play the classes we like to play, rather than rerolling because of pvp nerfs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skorpeo Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) Im sorry, but every MMO has tank spec players using DPS gear. IE, Blood DKs in WoW using PVP gear. Exploits are based on conquering content in a matter not based on game ethics. Its not based on gearing a toon in such a matter to kill another player. Edited March 15, 2012 by Skorpeo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skorpeo Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) One of these days they will make an mmo without pvp. That day we can play the classes we like to play, rather than rerolling because of pvp nerfs. I here Hello Kitty Adventure Island has no PVP! Edited March 15, 2012 by Skorpeo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I always wonder how people can think of their 'focused DPS' is somehow more useful than someone's 'unfocused DPS' when they're spending 1/3 of their time back at spawn, where your DPS obviously isn't focused on anybody. Deception/Madness isn't even a strong burst DPS class. If you want one, try an Operative or a Smash-oriented Juggernaut. By the way, even Darkness Assassins finish enemies with Assassinate, and a 5% damage reduction on that is basically meaningless (nobody survives 2 Assassinates without CDs). A Darkness Assassin isn't going to do worse in kill to death blow ratio because he still uses the same move (Assassinate) to finish people off as any other spec. At any rate, surviving longer is more DPS because you don't get to Jedi mind trick your way out of a messy situation in PvP. It's not like other spec (especially Deception) can somehow avoid death by clever playing. Assuming equal level opposition, they will have no problem taking out a weak defense class every single time. In fact as skill level increases, it's probably more likely the easy to kill classes die even faster, because having a man advantage is huge when fighting difficult opponents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyrit Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) Im sorry, but every MMO has tank spec players using DPS gear. IE, Blood DKs in WoW using PVP gear. Exploits are based on conquering content in a matter not based on ethics. Its not based on gearing a toon in such a matter to kill another player. I got news for you, I quit wow because of spec chasing and rift because of the same thing. Throwing out all my effort and time, because of some environment I don't even participate in, is ridiculous. And a get used to it attitude it just as ignorant. The simple fact of the matter is PvE and PvP fuction differently, and that balance is impossible with only 1 set of trees, ask blizzard I hear they are dumping the tree system altogather, 2 sets of trees one for pve and one for pvp is the only way to balance each environment properly. It is the only way to achieve the best balance in a game with two different environments. edit You do realize they are adding taunt off mechanics in raiding right wth is a tank supposed to do with nerfed damage, tickle the boss with a feather? Edited March 15, 2012 by Spyrit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotm Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 You all get that they deliberately designed the tank tree with a plethora of damage talents right? They also designed tanking stats and the way weapon/skill damage works so they are pve only. It would be a huge stretch to imagine all of this was somehow unintended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordbishopX Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I here Hello Kitty Adventure Island has no PVP! Final Fantasy MMO's are pretty much PVP free what they tried to do as pvp in 11 no one would call real pvp lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyrit Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 You all get that they deliberately designed the tank tree with a plethora of damage talents right? They also designed tanking stats and the way weapon/skill damage works so they are pve only. It would be a huge stretch to imagine all of this was somehow unintended. Initially the archetype system was never designed for pvp at all. Even trion is discussing doing away with it. Took blizzard years to figure out it just doesn't work for balancing two very different enrionments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordbishopX Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 You all get that they deliberately designed the tank tree with a plethora of damage talents right? They also designed tanking stats and the way weapon/skill damage works so they are pve only. It would be a huge stretch to imagine all of this was somehow unintended. Yeah they just didn't forsee peeps using focus and full stalker gear with upgraded mods tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkDruidSS Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) Taking advantage of game mechanics to play it in a manner it was not intended for, is an exploit. One of these days they will make an mmo without pvp. That day we can play the classes we like to play, rather than rerolling because of pvp nerfs. Nerfs happen in PvE games too. PvE'ers just like to blame PvP'ers because Devs can't make abilities function differently for PvE and PvP until after launch. One of these days a dev team will make the abilities function separately so they can balance them separately before launch. I guess you weren't around when games were PvE only huh? Edited March 15, 2012 by DarkDruidSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyrit Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Nerfs happen in PvE games too. PvE'ers just like to blame PvP'ers because Devs can't make abilities function differently for PvE and PvP until after launch. One of these days a dev team will make the abilities function separately so they can balance them separately before luanch. I guess you weren't around when games were PvE only huh? Nerfs in PvE don't happen nearly as much as PvP. Yes I played ffxi, class balance for PvE were nearly non existant, for my duration of playing it, which was 4 and a half years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkDruidSS Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) Nerfs in PvE don't happen nearly as much as PvP. Yes I played ffxi, class balance for PvE were nearly non existant, for my duration of playing it, which was 4 and a half years. Yea, they do. EQ2 had huge nerf swings based on PvE feedback before they ever got to the PvPers issues. Not all changes made in SWTOR are based on PvP feedback. The Sorc/Sage change is PvE specific.. they simply out heal the other classes.. in PvP they are reasonably easy to shut down unless you have a bunch of cross healing. Anyway, the point is the Devs shoot themselves in the foot when they should have learned this already from other games. I played FFXI too.. that game didn't get any real patches for anything very often. It took them MONTHS to correct problems. Plus that game had the most OP class of all time... Ninja. They killed the game with that class single handedly. Edited March 15, 2012 by DarkDruidSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithrilSoul Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 The reason most dedicated PvP tanks use gear/armor with offensive mods is the fact that the defensive mods are almost worthless. Now, if you do something like change the mechanics such that tank's shield chance affects ALL incoming damage, no matter what the source/type.... then suddenly you'll see a lot of tanks go back to using tanking mods. Maybe not all, but a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kornaker Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 The reason most dedicated PvP tanks use gear/armor with offensive mods is the fact that the defensive mods are almost worthless. Now, if you do something like change the mechanics such that tank's shield chance affects ALL incoming damage, no matter what the source/type.... then suddenly you'll see a lot of tanks go back to using tanking mods. Maybe not all, but a lot. I can't disagree, yeah, it will be so awesome to a real shield/absorb. Like that it will be better for us to guard, because dying just by guard is so terrible for us -_-". Sorry to quote warhammer online BW but it was a great system of guard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyfy Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 "Oh America, I could never leave you, you amuse me. You're like my dog, dumb as a post, but you make me laugh." -Bill Maher I see no reason to quote a pompous *** like that. It has nothing to do with the topic even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotm Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) Yeah they just didn't forsee peeps using focus and full stalker gear with upgraded mods tho. Its simply not possible that they make tank stats pve only then are too stupid to think people wouldn't use them anyway. They would have had to have never seen an mmo or rpg before. Much less worked on 2 or 3 of them prior that contained the exact same concept. I see no reason to quote a pompous *** like that. It has nothing to do with the topic even. It does if the op is ripping people for responding to his troll post. Edited March 15, 2012 by Rotm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercykiller Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Hint for those taking any of this seriously: click on his "source" link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helig Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) "...one of our concerns regarding pvp are players utilizing tanking trees in dps gear and the damage they're capable of putting out" i c wut u did thur. 10\10, good Sir. Hint for those taking any of this seriously: click on his "source" link. Eyup. Edited March 15, 2012 by Helig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsidermatt Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 i c wut u did thur. 10\10, good Sir. Yeah, this guy gets a 10/10. I've been hinting since the first page that people should actually check out the source, but even here on page 7 there are still people that can't be bothered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercykiller Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Page 7? Page 2 for me heh. And yeah, excellent troll, only the truly talented can link their own "this is not a real source" as well as keep throwing out quotes about human stupidity and still go undetected by the majority of posters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsidermatt Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Page 7? Page 2 for me heh. And yeah, excellent troll, only the truly talented can link their own "this is not a real source" as well as keep throwing out quotes about human stupidity and still go undetected by the majority of posters Yeah. At first it was pretty funny to me, so I kept playing along, posting jokes and hints to look at the freaking link. The longer it went with people arguing without verifying the OP's claims though, the more disappointed I got in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 The source is pretty much irrelevent (yes I saw it too) because he's more likely to be right and wrong even if he just made it up. It'd be like if someone faked a source about Tracer Missile being nerfed before the actual dev post confirmed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercykiller Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 "That's not fear I smell, is it?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsidermatt Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 The source is pretty much irrelevent And this is what is wrong with mmo forums. This belief causes so much misinformation to be spread, that it almost completely devalues the forums. People need to inform themselves more before going off on a rant, supporting nerf/buff calls, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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