Watchman, Combat, and Focus, Oh My!

[Vasinar]

I'm sorry if I misunderstood then. Yeah, it was a rude awakening for me when I finally decided to try Watchman and found my performance boosted, because I didn't want a valid reason to give up Combat. I don't personally rag on another sentinel when I see him in Ataru, but I'm only a mild elitist, so maybe I'm too nice. I don't take criticism from anybody other than other Sentinels, because if you don't have a 50 of my class, you shouldn't comment on it, since you have no hands on experience.

 

I miss my ranged snare, and my MS snare (when it worked), and my guaranteed crits and 100% armor pen...I miss it all. I can't wait for them to fix the problems. And I really, really hope they make Precision Strike identical to Overload Saber, give it charges instead of a minuscule window of time for you to push out damage. Not gonna hold my breath though...

 

As an aside, you seem to be set in stone for Combat, and I was too. Honest, I stuck with Combat wellllllllll into 50 and scoffed at other specs, even when told otherwise by people I trusted. Then my curiosity got the better of me, I tried Watchman, and sucked. Because I didn't know how to play it well (I'm still learning for that matter). But if you put in the time, the spec is actually really fun. 80% run speed, a 4 second stealth/damage immunity, 4-5k Merc Slash (even though it counts as two hits so you don't get the 5k PvP medal) and pushing over 100k healing in a WZ...it's all pretty ******. It really is worthwhile to maybe expand your horizons and at least contemplate trying other specs. Gives you insight if nothing else.

 

That is almost word for word my experience. If they make some changes to combat in 1.2 I will return to it...but some of the tools in watch are really nice to have

[Dizzident]

Since I'm running a Combat spec as well and tried Watchman but couldn't get the hang of it...any resources on how to play a Watchman Sentinel properly? Yea use DOTs but there's gotta be more than that. I just didn't get the mental picture of the spec probably.

 

I didn't have the same problems leveling as combat other people seem to have. Getting Doc at one point did make it easier, but it wasn't a HUGE difference. In PvP, I don't really have any issues either..yea, you win some, you lose some but I don't feel especially underpowered or anything with a Combat build.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Dizzident

[Enexemander]

Not an easy question, and I'm out of practice now, so I'd likely fail at it. But the largest handicap for the spec right now is the mechanical flaws in it. Stutter and ability misfire are at the top of that list.

 

I never really found Combat all that complicated, but who knows if I was playing it correctly? It's all priority based.

 

Once you leap in, unlike Watchman, you never have to leap again. Then Strike and Zealous Strike become your only source of Focus. Combat revolves around Precision Slash. You want to get the most out of it, which means using those 6 seconds as efficiently as possible.

 

As often as possible, you want to combine Precision with Master Strike. This is your single highest source of damage, hands down. I easily did 6-8k (with outdated gear since I haven't been Combat in over a month). Second priority, which will be more frequent, is combining Precision with a guaranteed crit Blade Storm. Since Blade Storm is kinetic damage, which is influenced by armor, this is perfect. Lastly, combine Precision with Zen whenever possible. Blade Rush hits for weapon damage, and Ataru strike is Energy damage which is also influenced by armor pen. These are the three abilities you most often want to use while paired with Precision.

 

The problem comes from the 9 seconds of downtime between when Precision wears off and when you can use it again. During this time your damage lags a bit, since 100% of your damage is mitigated by armor. It's during this time you want to pool (but not waste) your Focus. Try to get into a groove where you use Zealous and one to two Strikes in order to be ready to dump next time Precision is available.

 

It all comes down to priorities, knowing what to use and when. Just like any resource system that builds up instead of wears down (Focus vs. Ammo) you are never 'wasting' resources by building them up, so long as you don't hit, say, Precision Strike with 7 or more Focus. This is already long enough, probably put you to sleep...

 

Thanks! I've already put some of this advice to use in pvp and done really well so far, as well as getting down gold star mobs much faster.

 

My only real question is, why is Precision->Master Strike a high priority? Does it really do that much damage non-crit? I'll have to test this for myself.

 

One thing that I like about combat is that I have enough focus to use riposte, so I can see myself dropping talent points into Recompense for PvP. I never had the focus for riposte as Watchman. It also seems that using riposte (extra attack ignoring the gcd) while my blade rush buff is up is naturally upping my chances for an ataru strike. Regardless, between Recompense and Jedi Crusader, I'm willing to bet riposte will pay for itself when used with strike in the same gcd.

[Mal-Sharran]

Thanks! I've already put some of this advice to use in pvp and done really well so far, as well as getting down gold star mobs much faster.

 

My only real question is, why is Precision->Master Strike a high priority? Does it really do that much damage non-crit? I'll have to test this for myself.

 

One thing that I like about combat is that I have enough focus to use riposte, so I can see myself dropping talent points into Recompense for PvP. I never had the focus for riposte as Watchman. It also seems that using riposte (extra attack ignoring the gcd) while my blade rush buff is up is naturally upping my chances for an ataru strike. Regardless, between Recompense and Jedi Crusader, I'm willing to bet riposte will pay for itself when used with strike in the same gcd.

 

Sorry, at the very end of my quote, I said not to use Precision Strike with 7 or more Focus, when I meant Zealous.

 

And Master Strike is simply unbeatable as Combat for damage. No two single abilities (with a combined cd of 3 seconds) can output as much damage as Master Strike with Precision up. My typical Blade Storm crits were about 3600, and my typical Blade Rush crits (including the Ataru proc) were about 3100. So say you crit with both of these while Precision is up, you just did 6700. Master Strike can easily do 7k+ during Precision, and it costs no Focus. That's the key. Your hardest hitting ability is free, it's pretty ridiculous. Then you can usually follow a Master Strike with a guarantee crit BS for 10k damage in 3 seconds (because the GCD is ready by the time Master Strike is over). It's really pretty crazy burst potential.

 

*edit* And a side note, Master Strike counts as three separate hits, so each one of them has a chance to crit. I personally have never seen all three crit, but I have seen two of them crit.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Mal-Sharran

[GamewizX]

Thanks for all the input. I love burst damage, so it seems like Combat is just the way to go for me. Sure, it may be somewhat underpowered right now compared to other builds, but that is ALWAYS the case with some build somewhere, and it always changes and the abilities get adjusted by the developers. Sooner or later Combat will get some love, and by then I'll be very comfortable with the build and will be able to destroy all in my path.

[JustinxDuff]

watchman > combat for PvP in every way .

[Psybin]

Kudos =} And it will take very little tweaking to bring combat right up there with the others... I reckon slightly increasing the baseline damage of blade rush would do it.

 

What I suspect might be the case, this is purely guess work so dont take it as gospel. But it seems like combat is more gear dependent than the others.

And it could be that when the higher tier gears come out it will perform better than it is at the moment. And it could be that BW, aware of this are holding back on "fixing" it, so they do not have to "unfix" it later... Or maybe I am giving them way too much credit ;p

[PantsOn]

Kudos =} And it will take very little tweaking to bring combat right up there with the others... I reckon slightly increasing the baseline damage of blade rush would do it.

 

What I suspect might be the case, this is purely guess work so dont take it as gospel. But it seems like combat is more gear dependent than the others.

And it could be that when the higher tier gears come out it will perform better than it is at the moment. And it could be that BW, aware of this are holding back on "fixing" it, so they do not have to "unfix" it later... Or maybe I am giving them way too much credit ;p

 

IMO, the only thing needed to make Combat 100% viable is like a 30% increase in Centering generation. You can have Zen up about 60%-70% of the time in Watchman while in Combat, you feel like you're dealing with a precious resource.

Edited March 14, 2012 by PantsOn

[Enexemander]

watchman > combat for PvP in every way .

 

Except against healers that use their dispel button, or for movement control. Or for when you really need to burst down a high armor target.

 

Watchman is good, but it's not the end all be all spec (unfortunately).

[JustinxDuff]

Except against healers that use their dispel button, or for movement control. Or for when you really need to burst down a high armor target.

 

Watchman is good, but it's not the end all be all spec (unfortunately).

 

If a healer is dispelling then they are not healing and when they do try to heal after the dispel your interrupt will take advantage of the GCD they spent on the dispel.

 

Watchman can take down a high armor target just fine. Combat is just subpar compared to watchman in PvP. I switched to Combat a week ago to give it a fair shot with good gear and it still doesn't compare to Watchman.

 

Come rated WZs Watchman is going to be the superior choice (even though it currently is).

Edited March 14, 2012 by JustinxDuff

[YourMomWasHere]

Anecdotally, I seem to do more damage from my 21, bolstered Watchman missing half her talented skills than on my 48 Combat with everything specced but for two "you can put them where you like" points.

 

This may just mean that I suck at Combat, or in general and it's more noticeable in Combat. But the disparity is clearly noticeable.

[LancerKagato]

Combat is less effective, if people want to play handicapp let them so they can just talk up how awesome combat is. As sents it seems we have nuff issues. i played combat and switched it to Watchman and noticed an immediate difference...i have no hate toward combat fanatics, but they tend to pump themselves up saying combat is viable esp in PvP and talk bout how Watchman are using a crutch....combat is currently not properly balanced maybe it will eventually ut right now its not nearly as viable as Watchman or even Focus for pvp

[Mrrshan]

Combat is less effective, if people want to play handicapp let them so they can just talk up how awesome combat is. As sents it seems we have nuff issues. i played combat and switched it to Watchman and noticed an immediate difference...i have no hate toward combat fanatics, but they tend to pump themselves up saying combat is viable esp in PvP and talk bout how Watchman are using a crutch....combat is currently not properly balanced maybe it will eventually ut right now its not nearly as viable as Watchman or even Focus for pvp

 

So effectively everyone should play the same spec in your eyes ?

 

We have 3 trees for a reason, people should just choose whatever they want and have fun with. It sure helps more than everyone being a copy cat and afraid to experiment.

[LancerKagato]

So effectively everyone should play the same spec in your eyes ?

 

We have 3 trees for a reason, people should just choose whatever they want and have fun with. It sure helps more than everyone being a copy cat and afraid to experiment.

 

you've got it wrong, i started combat, and couldnt do anything with it, people are free to play as they wish, i could play as a focus combat watchman hybrid doesnt mean id be better just cause i swear by it, but your right people can play as they wish, i wish to play a specific way and think that its the best so i'll give my opinion how i see fit

[GamewizX]

So I'm only level 16 now with my Sentinel but dear god this class is fun to play. In fact I'm doing almost everything without a companion because it's so fun jumping into the middle of a group and destroying them in mere seconds, leaving the fight with at LEAST 85% health remaining. I don't need my companion for questing, so I figured I might as well just have him out doing crew skill missions.

 

Even the two +2 heroics on Coruscant proved to be easily accomplished (for the most part). With T-7 I was able to take on 4 strongs without breaking a sweat. The only difficulty I encountered was one of the two champion mobs in "Republic's Most Wanted" I had to use one stim and one medpac (and a few tries) in order to defeat him. That could also be because I was level 12 (he was 11) and I hadn't trained my abilities for level 12 yet (like Cauterize).

 

From what I'm seeing, sustained fights is where my Sentinel's weakness is, but in shorter fights, even against 4 strongs, I can burst down the enemy insanely fast.

 

I think I found my new favorite class.