PLEASE VOTE: Give Us Real Combat Logs

[MetallicSimpson]

LOL, most people use the combat logs in other games in exactly that way. I'm no elite player, as I said I've been in both positions. People screw up, even decent players, and don't need the DPS weenie throwing out their combat log info. I'm very much in the camp of 'if you're clearing content, you're doing something right' and parsing every last digit of dps or threat or healing is dick measuring.

 

this ^ im not an elite player and know i wont be but as long as were clearing content theres no need to say ohh you did horrible dps u suck l2p or whatever and getting kicked. I went through that **** in wow I do NOT want it here. If its used JUST to see why you wiped like ok x player forgot to intrupt or whatever then sure. so bioware please no dps meter

[Nightshrike]

No.

 

(char. limit ...)

[Galius]

So if you don't want to utilize it, just DON'T. I don't understand why you want to prevent other people from using such a tool. Nobody is forcing you to. It has nothing to do with "epeens" except maybe in the imaginations of the paranoid.

 

Not paranoia. Those that have played enough WoW know exactly what a tool such as being proposed is actually used for more often than not. To insult, belittle, and annoy.

[Andryah]

so if you don't want to utilize it, just don't. I don't understand why you want to prevent other people from using such a tool. Nobody is forcing you to. It has nothing to do with "epeens" except maybe in the imaginations of the paranoid.

 

 

this is why:

 

starglide....

 

Your assertion is false. Just because people won't be able to "gear up" in lower difficulty flash points this does not preclude them for playing them anyways to have fun insulting noobs.

 

It happens all the time in wow. Also, when people are playing alts and leveling up they are still posting dps/hps data to group channel as spam even though it really does not matter at all.

 

That is what he current proposed combat logs will prevent and i support that.

Edited March 10, 2012 by LexiCazam
Rude comment

[Roalmo]

So if you don't want to utilize it, just DON'T. I don't understand why you want to prevent other people from using such a tool. Nobody is forcing you to. It has nothing to do with "epeens" except maybe in the imaginations of the paranoid.

 

Told you they would never get it.

 

And this one obviously didn't.

 

QED.

[Taroen]

Not paranoia. Those that have played enough WoW know exactly what a tool such as being proposed is actually used for more often than not. To insult, belittle, and annoy.

 

So why are you so desperate to play with idiots that want to insult, belittle and annoy you..?

 

Those guys make it to my ignore list pretty quick. I don't shed a tear.

 

Seems like at least a few very vocal people here are afraid they would either get insulted, or "forced" to use metrics if they wanted to raid, but there should be enough of you to band together and form your OWN raids, where you don't have to require anything that you don't want to require.

[Punnkin]

Not paranoia. Those that have played enough WoW know exactly what a tool such as being proposed is actually used for more often than not. To insult, belittle, and annoy.

 

It really shouldn't be a big deal. First of all, it usually is used more as a learning tool than to belittle. Second of all, if someone annoys you because of it, just ignore them. That's no reason to say such logs shouldn't be implemented ever. Feelings shouldn't be so fragile.

[TalkingDinosaur]

You are pretending like you are a good player and don't need a flip chart to whack someone about with. I have a feeling it's the other way around, else you wouldn't be hating on combat logs

/kick isn't a way to be a "good" player.

[MisterData]

Starglide....

 

Your assertion is false. Just because people won't be able to "gear up" in lower difficulty flash points this does not preclude them for playing them anyways to have fun insulting noobs.

 

It happens all the time in WoW.

 

You must have played on a horrible battle group.

[MrXen]

You are ignoring the fact Starglide that I already complete and enjoy hard modes and nightmare modes for the challenge.

 

BioWare didn't give me my own difficulty because I play the game at the harder difficulties. You want to take my difficulty away from me and I don't like that one bit. You know you don't need a combat log yet you persist.

 

You don't need a comprehensive log to improve yourself.

You don't need a comprehensive log to complete Hard Modes.

You don't need a comprehensive log to complete Nightmare Modes.

You don't have the right to look at another player's character's combat data.

 

 

You don't need to play this game. See what I did there? Your argument is meaningless entirely.

 

 

 

As far as rights go? Its clearly stated in that thing above where you clicked that "I agree" button when buying the game (you know, that thing you skipped) that information on the game/about your character but not involving you personally belongs to bioware and can be distributed. So that argument of yours is ALSO meaningless and a flat piece of misinformation.

 

 

 

Think about it in game terms: if you are in pvp and some player is doing x ability to you, this means that you still "don't" have the right to know whats being done to your character? You have no concept of action-reaction do you?

 

 

 

 

No one needs combat logs, or content, or an mmo, or a computer...get over yourself and your bad argument. Combat logs are convenient so people can focus on actually...playing the game, instead of doing what YOU prescribed: downloading a third party program to record your dps/hps then combine with some "guild master man" etc etc etc.

 

 

 

The people that use these combat logs to be dumb trolls have already gone out and downloaded these logs or just accuse everyone of having poor dps anyway (without proof).

Edited March 10, 2012 by LexiCazam
Rude comment

[Stupiddrummer]

vote no for combat logs.

 

Combat logs killed my father and hid my television remote. They called me mean once too. I'm pretty sure combat logs are also racist.

 

If they add combat logs, it will ruin the immersion. I like not knowing what killed me. In real life, do you ever find out what kills you? HELL NO!

 

Also, The Mask. You know with Jim Carrey? It was really a metaphor for combat logs. If you put in combat logs (aka "The Mask") you lose all self control and begin to belittle the non-competitive players in multiplayer video game. It ruins society.

 

I also hate numbers.

Edited March 9, 2012 by Stupiddrummer

[Galius]

It really shouldn't be a big deal. First of all, it usually is used more as a learning tool than to belittle. Second of all, if someone annoys you because of it, just ignore them. That's no reason to say such logs shouldn't be implemented ever. Feelings shouldn't be so fragile.

 

Typical... let's make the people that are being pissed off by bad behaviour created by the thing you want the bad guys... ya, that makes sense.

 

The attitude and the log spam is quite prevalent in WoW and I don't want to see it here.

[Galius]

You must have played on a horrible battle group.

 

No.. just a normal one. You give anonymous people a tool to grief and they WILL.

[MisterData]

No.. just a normal one. You give anonymous people a tool to grief and they WILL.

 

Last month I leveled a few alts to 85 in WoW(I've since cancelled yet again, still the same boring game) and I can count the amount of times someone spammed their dps in a group on one hand, with one finger. It was some teenager playing an arcane mage in an early level 70s instance. At level cap you don't really see anyone do that, at least I never do.

 

And in raids, the only time that happens is when your group isn't hitting the enrage timer. In those instances, I think it's pretty important to be looking at your people's output.

Edited March 9, 2012 by MisterData

[casirabit]

As I figured when I read this forum last night.

 

You created this "supposedly" poll to argue with anyone that disagreed with you and made your title misleading on purpose.

 

Your whole point it seems in creating this topic was to argue and belittle anyone who disagreed with you.

 

No matter if they have a different opinion than your you start accusing them of not understanding when it is you that doesn't understand.

 

Maybe you need the defintion of opinion so you will understand:

 

In general, an opinion is a subjective belief, and is the result of emotion or interpretation of facts. An opinion may be supported by an argument, although people may draw opposing opinions from the same set of facts. Opinions rarely change without new arguments being presented. However, it can be reasoned that one opinion is better supported by the facts than another by analysing the supporting arguments.[1] In casual use, the term opinion may be the result of a person's perspective, understanding, particular feelings, beliefs, and desires. It may refer to unsubstantiated information, in contrast to knowledge and fact-based beliefs.

 

 

You need to stop making comments that they don't understand because they do. They just don't agree with you.

 

The way you are acting because someone has a different opinion than you makes me wonder about your maturity level.

 

People are entitled to their own opinions without someone constantly belittling them as you have done constantly since you started this thread.

 

You seem to have wanted to start argument because they only ones you pester are the ones that say no because their opinions differ from yours.

 

Why start a poll if all you are going to do is act like a child because they disagree with you.

 

Stop pestering them they are allowed their opinions just like you are and everyone else.

Edited March 9, 2012 by casi

[Galius]

And in raids, the only time that happens is when your group isn't hitting the enrage timer. In those instances, I think it's pretty important to be looking at your people's output.

 

Which is totally doable with the current proposed private logs.

[xworndownx]

I have to admit that I really needed a good laugh today and this was absolutely priceless. I'll try to keep this short. Won't happen. TLDR is at the bottom.

 

Personally, I don't care either way about the combat logs. I've been able to look at the damage on my screen to determine how well I am doing just fine. It is my responsibility to be a good player and not anyone else to concern themselves over.

 

That said, since the start of this whole debate over combat logs there have been literally thousands of posts about the topic. Threads have been created, made, re-made, deleted, filled and had to be re-created by mods because they have hit the thread limitations of the forums.

 

An INSANE amount of posts have been made. So many that some have suggested it as being a fact that the 'majority' of players want combat logs. I mean, that is a TON of posts by.. people.. that.. want.. the combat logs. To see everything that they and others are doing right?

 

This, so called, 'majority' of players have the opportunity to vote now. On some random website and what do we see? There are 32 votes who are for and 118 are against traditional combat logs. Yet, there are literally thousands of posts and only 150 people actually voted!

 

I'm sure that I may be the only one who finds this remotely hilarious as this so called 'majority of the players want combat logs!' has been reduced this small number. If we go by the poll and take it seriously: out of the million or so players only 150 people care enough vote.

 

After reviewing said poll I would assume that the majority doesn't even care at all. Yet there sure are thousands of posts by the same people who are clearly assuming that they are the 'majority' of the population.

 

INB4: Not everyone votes and reads the forums.

- The heck they don't! Those people that were complaining that they wanted combat logs were constantly participating in the threads which is why they are being added! They are either here and have voted or went back to their old game or they just don't care anymore.

 

TLDR: If we take this poll as being anything accurate as of how the current community feels then BW just wasted a HUGE amount of time and money for 150 people. What a waste of time! That and people should vote more to also help out. hah!

[myriadical]

I have to admit that I really needed a good laugh today and this was absolutely priceless...<snip>

 

 

Yep, pretty much why I lurk in here.

 

Also, I agree with pretty much everything you posted.

[Seregul]

but your guild could easily consolidate logs and do the same with ease.

 

Easily with ease. You don't know that, at all. It's interesting to me that the same people who insist hard data is completely unnecessary and in fact damaging to the game are also the same ones who are perfectly comfortable making blanket assertions about something they know virtually nothing about.

[ProfessorWalsh]

Easily with ease. You don't know that, at all. It's interesting to me that the same people who insist hard data is completely unnecessary and in fact damaging to the game are also the same ones who are perfectly comfortable making blanket assertions about something they know virtually nothing about.

 

I teach computer game design for a living. I teach programming. I teach C++, C#, and XNA (which is just C# with some extras) and I have over 6 years teaching experience and another 6 years working professionally in the game design industry.

 

Writing a program that would look in multiple logs all located in the same folder/directory is time consuming, and moderately difficult. Using such a program is extremely easy.

 

I know a lot about it actually.

Edited March 9, 2012 by ProfessorWalsh

[Taroen]

She has a right to her opinion just as you do. To belittle someone because their opinion is different is wrong.

 

You may disagree with it and that's fine but to belittle or say someone is paranoid is not fair or right to the other person.

 

Very sensitive people in this thread, eh...?

 

My opinion is that her opinion smacks of paranoia. You want to shut that down by claiming that I shouldn't be able to voice my opinion because it somehow belittles her or anyone else that shares it.

 

It's simple, really. If you don't want to be griefed by e-peen strokers that misuse tools, don't play with those people. I certainly won't. And I'm rather glad that they announce to the server that they are jerks by publicly stroking their e-peen, because it allows me to quickly add them to ignore.

 

But denying a tool to people who would use it properly just because you're afraid of what some jerk might do is ludicrous.

Edited March 9, 2012 by Taroen

[casirabit]

Very sensitive people in this thread, eh...?

 

My opinion is that her opinion smacks of paranoia. You want to shut that down by claiming that I shouldn't be able to voice my opinion because it somehow belittles her or anyone else that shares it.

 

It's simple, really. If you don't want to be griefed by e-peen strokers that misuse tools, don't play with those people. I certainly won't. And I'm rather glad that they announce to the server that they are jerks by publicly stroking their e-peen, because it allows me to quickly add them to ignore.

 

But denying a tool to people who would use it properly just because you're afraid of what some jerk might do is ludicrous.

 

So no one has a right to disagree with you because you think your view is the only one that is right? Interesting theory. Maybe you are in the category with the ones that use the tools incorrectly to since you think anyone that disagrees with you is parnanoid.

 

No one is denying a tool they just disagree that it should be public. Some like the way bioware is doing it and some don't and that is normal but to call someone paranoid becasue someone happens to respect someone's privacy first and foremost and they care about the other player for a refreshing change.

[Taroen]

So no one has a right to disagree with you because you think your view is the only one that is right? Interesting theory. Maybe you are in the category with the ones that use the tools incorrectly to since you think anyone that disagrees with you is parnanoid.

 

No one is denying a tool they just disagree that it should be public. Some like the way bioware is doing it and some don't and that is normal but to call someone paranoid becasue someone happens to respect someone's privacy first and foremost and they care about the other player for a refreshing change.

 

When did I say no one had a right to disagree with me..? Seems like you're the one that wants to shut other people down by claiming offense and saying that we don't have a right to say it.

 

No combat log or parsing tool has EVER been public in any game that I have ever played, and I've played all of the AAA MMOs and most of the minor ones. You actually have to group with someone for them to be able to consistantly monitor your performance.

 

As for e-peen strokers... What's to stop them from doing it under the current proposal? They can just copy their own logs and paste them to general.

 

The paranoid part comes when you insist that some meanie might upset you because they have metrics they can somehow grief you with.

[Andryah]

My opinion is that her opinion smacks of paranoia.

 

Your opinion about me is incorrect. Thanks for sharing though.

 

You want to shut that down by claiming that I shouldn't be able to voice my opinion because it somehow belittles her or anyone else that shares it.

 

You are just as entitled to express your opinion about the topic of this thread. You are however not allowed to name call or belittle others to make your point. Don't believe me? Check the forum rules.

[Andryah]

No combat log or parsing tool has EVER been public in any game that I have ever played, and I've played all of the AAA MMOs and most of the minor ones. You actually have to group with someone for them to be able to consistantly monitor your performance.

 

I guess you don't know everything then.

 

In Rift, you can enable combat logging and push it to ACT in real time and you can capture, plot, analyze and even cut and paste the info for every player within log range of you. They do not have to be in group with you. The logging is indiscriminate. And it just so happens that in Rift, there were a fair number of douche bags that would use this wide open logging capability to publicly grief people in game, for no other reasons then getting their jollies, people they are not even grouped with.