Remec Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I'm really disappointed in the way that bioware as made things easier and easier in this game. Can't afford a high end speeder? we'll just make it cheaper. Can't get battlemaster gear because you're not valor rank 60? we'll just increase valor gains. Can't get VIP items because you didn't pay for the collector's edition? we'll make them available to everyone. You are diminishing people's accomplishments ever time you make something easier to attain. Why not just call this legoland starwars and start everyone off with top tier sets of PvE and PvP gear? Sorry for the sarcasm, but this has been bugging me for quite some time now. And i'm not alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiknAdobo Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I wouldn't mind pvp being at an even playing field for everyone, but this is my first mmo. I'm use to competitive games where one player doesn't have an advantage simply because they have paid more or played more hours. Usually their advantage comes from hard work and natrual talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remec Posted March 8, 2012 Author Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) All my hopes are on 1.2 Edited March 8, 2012 by Remec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdkmaster Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I agree with the OP. If this game gets dumbed down any further, you'll be able to drool on your keyboard and still win...oh wait. Its there already. Thats why I am not re-subbing. I worked damn hard for my complete re-modded champ gear. Was working towards BM. Almost there to. Then this patch came out. I'm not even going to bother getting BM, its all welfare **** now. If this is the game star wars fans really want, **** they're welcome to it. I, however, expected alot more. I expected the game world to be more adaptive to responses in quests. I expected pvp to engage me more. I was ready to go against better geared opponents, because thats what mmos generally are about. I'm not all about mashing under geared opponents. I'm about being the under geared opponent working for my ****, to LEVEL MY OWN PLAYING FIELD. All this crap about "having an even playing field" is just that, crap. You make your own toon, you play your own toon, YOU LEVEL YOUR OWN PLAYING FIELD. Everyone is just self entitled ******es, being given everything in the game by inexperienced devs who have absolutely no idea how to make a self sustaining player model. Ilum, for example, needs objectives that focuses players in various directions to accomplish something that will overall help their faction, and force encounters with the opposing faction to create pvp. There is no need for a third faction, if the design of the open pvp area has any form of intelligent design. Anyone who states that open pvp requires a third faction, is only taking the easy road out and allowing the developers of a game, to also take the easy road out. Two factions just requires attention to detail, which obviously isn't happening in SWTOR. Valor. Why give out valor now, when they're destroying the mechanic in another patch? I don't see why they didn't just remove valor requirements this time around, and save everyone some time, effort, and grief. Everyone seems to want everything now, and the devs of SWTOR are *********** hell bent on giving it to them. The only longevity this game has, depends on how long the devs keep handing out candy. At this point, if they stop, half the whiney ******es playing will quit anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussiedroid Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I have to agree, as far as games go this is rather easy and it keeps getting easier from what I read on the updates. My last char I dont think I died till over L20 and that was simply a mistake on a silly pull of 2 mobs. I have started playing without companions to try to make things harder. I would love a difficulty boost, or some option to increase the difficultly if you find the game too easy - a difficulty slider or something or something that automatically adjusts this for you in game. Or increase difficulty once you get to L50 .. all further alts then have a harder or longer leveling. Casual gamers are in the majority these days regrettably so they want something they can get into and enjoy. Thats cool, I have friends like that who would simply be turned off with the difficultly that you or I may want and would unsub but likewise we may also get to the point where we unsub because there is no challenge left, no mastery etc So how do you cater for both?? End game? Nightmare modes? I think we need more options here ... Our guild is probabily slower than most but it only took us 3-4 goes to master the bosses in Ops, Hardmode FP were only hard when u have no gear suitable and hit the enrage timers, as soon as you get this you fly through them as with normal mode. PVP is the same, becomes easier once you get your gear (which is not hard to get anymore). There is nowhere I need to tread carefully out on the open worlds either, even at the L50 Ilum its really run of the mill mob killing. Please give us seasoned MMO players a real mountain to climb that will take us months to master or complete... something very complex and challenging. What do you guys think they could do to improve this element of the game and cater for both types of players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 How are your accomplishments being diminished? Especially in pvp, when supposedly it's all about playing against a human opponent and not "scripted ai". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussiedroid Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 How are your accomplishments being diminished? Especially in pvp, when supposedly it's all about playing against a human opponent and not "scripted ai". I didnt word it well I think. My point is that it was harder to get to your higher Valor level and get the better gear, but with the changes coming in I understand it will take far less time to get to this. Hence its easier. Also, once you are there its easier to survive, kill etc from my perspective. The main issue I think still is around PVE scenario and the measures Bioware is taking to make it quicker and easier to achieve these goals. I want more of a challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iraqcombatvet Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I'm really disappointed in the way that bioware as made things easier and easier in this game. Can't afford a high end speeder? we'll just make it cheaper. Can't get battlemaster gear because you're not valor rank 60? we'll just increase valor gains. Can't get VIP items because you didn't pay for the collector's edition? we'll make them available to everyone. You are diminishing people's accomplishments ever time you make something easier to attain. Why not just call this legoland starwars and start everyone off with top tier sets of PvE and PvP gear? Sorry for the sarcasm, but this has been bugging me for quite some time now. And i'm not alone. I agree with you 100 percent. They are making this game way too easy now. I haven't played all day, because it's just not worth my time anymore. What is so special about BM gear when everyone and their brother is becoming BM with the valor increase. When I had to work my *** off for it. I honestly wonder what goes through Biowares head when they make these decisions. They screwed me over with almost every patch release thus far. And 1.1.5 really pushed that over the edge. I don't see the point of playing anymore, when everyone is basically the same in the game. There is no challenge at all. I *********** wasted my time grinding BM gear. *********** ******es! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELECTRICJUDGMENT Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) I really don't think they are making the game easier, but more accessible and reasonable for players that just aren't able to dump 12 hours a day into grinding PvP, or hit 50 in the first two weeks after launch. I support what they have done here, except the insane price of the white crystals lol Edited March 8, 2012 by ELECTRICJUDGMENT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzone Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I'm really disappointed in the way that bioware as made things easier and easier in this game. Disappointment seems to be contagious in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzone Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I really don't think they are making the game easier... I stopped right there. They are making it easier. Remec is 100% right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaliceX Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) Joining an OPS and staying in combat to get Valor wasn't "hard" stop pretending it was. Time does not mean hard. It means boring. Edited March 8, 2012 by MaliceX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iraqcombatvet Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Here's an honest opionion. I have never, in any game, raged consistently after patches. lol. It seems like everytime they release a patch, I find my self raging in chat and on the forums because they keep ruining this game. It's getting worse, when they are trying to make it better. This game is so easy a cave man can level to 50 and then become Battlemaster. There is no uniqueness about the game anymore. Everyone has the highest tiered stuff now and it just seems blah. Thanks Bioware. I wish you would personally call me so I Can tell you how stupid you are. lol.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iraqcombatvet Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Joining an OPS and staying in combat to get Valor wasn't "hard" stop pretending it was. Time does not mean hard. It means boring. If only, that statement made any sense..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mgilbrtsn Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 ...+1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syncourt Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) I think you are confusing difficulty with grind. "Stop making things so quick to attain" would be much more appropriate given the issues you bought up are all based on how long it took compared to how long it now takes. VIP complaint aside. Edited March 8, 2012 by Syncourt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoxiousAlby Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I'm really disappointed in the way that bioware as made things easier and easier in this game. Can't afford a high end speeder? we'll just make it cheaper. Can't get battlemaster gear because you're not valor rank 60? we'll just increase valor gains. Can't get VIP items because you didn't pay for the collector's edition? we'll make them available to everyone. You are diminishing people's accomplishments ever time you make something easier to attain. Why not just call this legoland starwars and start everyone off with top tier sets of PvE and PvP gear? Sorry for the sarcasm, but this has been bugging me for quite some time now. And i'm not alone. I dont see games as establishing personal accomplishments personaly, games are for fun and entertainment. Earning a six figure salary, or sponsoring a child, or raising well rounded successfull childen I see as accomplishments. But each to their own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raximillian Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I agree with the OP. If the game becomes too convenient, too easy, no challenge, then the sense of accomplishment goes to 0. So we should have a game that is convenient to play, but without going too far. If there is no sense of accomplishment, people will eventually get bored. I do not mind if they lower the cost of some speeders, if they add 10 more speeders that cost twice as much as before as well. That way, people will have some cheap speeders, but there will be more to work towards to. BW should not lower one bar without raising another one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xontier Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Oh yay, another person confusing "Boring grind" with "difficulty". Cheaper speeders? Doesn't mean its difficult. It just means it takes less time to get money. Quicker to 60 Valor and Battlemaster gear? Good. Now those people that don't have battlemaster like me will be on an even footing and have a higher chance of beating me. So actually, PvP becomes harder because I have less of an advantage, not easier. The only argument you have that could hold any value is making VIP items available to all ONLY if they don't add new items to the VIP vendor. Oh, and incase you missed it, they're ramping up the difficulty of Nightmare FP and releasing more difficult FP in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzone Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Cheaper speeders? Doesn't mean its difficult. It just means it takes less time to get money. If something takes less time or costs less, it makes it easier to get. Quicker to 60 Valor and Battlemaster gear? Good. Now those people that don't have battlemaster like me will be on an even footing and have a higher chance of beating me. So actually, PvP becomes harder because I have less of an advantage, not easier. Nowhere did Remec say he didn't want an even footing. The only argument you have that could hold any value is making VIP items available to all ONLY if they don't add new items to the VIP vendor. Everything he said holds value, the VIP item change is an example that reinforces the other examples. Oh, and incase you missed it, they're ramping up the difficulty of Nightmare FP and releasing more difficult FP in general. Unlike the other examples he gave, there has been a huge consensus from the community that Nightmare FP was a joke in relation to hard mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nala Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Easier games are more inclusive and thus tend to do better. The trend in electronic gaming generally is towards easier, more casual, and immediately rewarding play experiences. I understand why this causes consternation among those who are used to a more challenging play experience, but I don't expect it to change materially. Hardcore video game experiences are considered niche and there's no way a 9 figure budget game is going niche as its primary play experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroCaptMaximus Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 I agree with you 100 percent. They are making this game way too easy now. I haven't played all day, because it's just not worth my time anymore. What is so special about BM gear when everyone and their brother is becoming BM with the valor increase. When I had to work my *** off for it. I honestly wonder what goes through Biowares head when they make these decisions. They screwed me over with almost every patch release thus far. And 1.1.5 really pushed that over the edge. I don't see the point of playing anymore, when everyone is basically the same in the game. There is no challenge at all. I *********** wasted my time grinding BM gear. *********** ******es! I have news for you, the entire game is a waste of time. I suspect before you spent all that time grinding out BM gear you had some clue how much work it would be. Then you did a work/reward analysis and determined that you were willing to invest that time to get those rewards. Stop QQ, accept the consequences of your actions and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anathar Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 im disappointed at how game makers make games fun to play..make them more boring!! especially around lvl 30 we need to have even more of a drastic loss in xp gains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmthethird Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 you do know this is not new and its not a BW thing. MMOs in general use this method when something gets old. it is made easier to obtain for those that couldn't get it. but at the same time new things are brought out for ppl to try and get, this does 2 things 1) you hardcore playes get new content with new goals and gear to aim for. 2) doesn't make your casual players, feel like they are second class citizens. if you don't understand this, then it is the genre you don't understand, don't blame BW for using a tried and tested model. and get ready for the new content with the new gear, its the must have for this spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baelish Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 If this is the game star wars fans really want... Frankly, I don't think it is. It's just the only SW game they're likely to get any time soon, so they're making the best of it. Whether that'll be enough to sustain a paying subscriber base remains to be seen. Even with 1.2 on the horizon, I'm not expecting to see much more than my 6 month Sub out of this game, and I'm not rushin' anythin'. There are just too many basic flaws in the implementation for it ever to be viscerally satisfying. If only BW had been allowed/had the guts to actually try something novel with the MMO genre, with the strength of the IP to back it up and make it stick against the ingrained prejudices and expectations of the habitues of the field, rather than reskinning the existing market leader (without having learned any of the lessons taught or learned by that market leader). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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