Harnessed Darkness\Shadows - The most OP talent in the game

[AtahualpaCapac]

I approve this post 100%!

[Anelyn]

The problem with sin tanks, is not their dmg or survability, all tanks must have both in a balanced way, but they are only tank class with force speed and knockback and CC. There is too much in 1 package compared to other tanks in game, which should be addressed in some form.

 

I understand the whole package adds flavor to the class, which am fine with it, but there should be some tweaks made to put them on par with SW / BH and JK / Trooper counterparts.

 

I only bring Huttball in discussion, neither a jugg or PT can do **** when they are permanently snared, rooted (no DR), then stunned, pulled w/e you want to prevent them from getting to the line with the ball. A sin / shadow tank just pops immunity+sprint and you're left scratching your head. Is not hard to time them at right times, and is just stupid.

 

PS: no I don't have problems killing tank sin / shadows on my operative, I know how to speculate their class limitations, but in a WZ they are a TOP class.

[HuorEarfalas]

Still remember the olds times when many people said Shadows can't do anything in wz?

 

Now look at this.

 

Jokes

[savionen]

Shadow-tank has the worst actual defense out of the 3 tanks, but in exchange they get Resilience.

 

In terms of burst damage, they really don't have any aside from Telekinetic Throw with Harnessed Shadow. They Double Strike and Project spam. The highest damage Shadow attack is Force Breach in Shadow Techniques, which isn't the tanking stance.

 

I'd much rather play a Vanguard in warzones, and Ilum. Half of my attacks are ranged, have a ton more armor/defense and then charge+harpoon.

Edited March 3, 2012 by savionen

[Reveillere]

Shadow-tank has the worst actual defense out of the 3 tanks, but in exchange they get Resilience.

 

In terms of burst damage, they really don't have any aside from Telekinetic Throw with Harnessed Shadow. They Double Strike and Project spam. The highest damage Shadow attack is Force Breach in Shadow Techniques, which isn't the tanking stance.

 

l2p. seriously

[Dissey]

I'm guessing I'm not the only one that has noticed the Sith Assassins\Jedi Shadows have turned into the most OP class in the game right now - when tank specced.

 

Unlike other heavy tank specs, like juggernauts or powertechs and their mirrors, which balance their survivability with lower damage output - it seems assassin specs mostly just lose a measly 5% to bonus damage from the stance but that's about it.

 

The main reason i'm seeing for this is the harnessed darkness talent - Here we have a talent that allows them to do

amount of damage in 3 seconds

 

If you're too lazy to check the video - it's 8k damage, immediately followed by a 2.2k crit.

 

This is done outside of melee range, is uninterruptable, and takes 6 seconds max to setup to get full stacks - if that's not enough, it also slows you to 50% and the icing on the cake - it also heals them for 12% of their HP (for comparison, powertechs have a 3min CD that heals them for 15% hp over 10 seconds...).

 

You may say its unreliable that all ticks will crit, but with recklessness at only a 1:30 CD and 1:15 with full pvp (not to mention an additional charge that makes sure the shock after the lightning also crits) - an assassin tank can easily get 90% crit chance for the duration of this up almost every fight.

 

Why in the world would a tank spec get access to a talent and burst damage like that? It would make sense to have this on the madness tree - but on their tank tree? why?

 

This reminds me of the (very short) time in WoW that druids bears got overbuffed and were dealing too much damage in bear (tank) form - which brought on a nerf very soon afterwards.

 

Just to remind you - operatives got nerfed for being able to deal this sort of damage situationally - while an assassin can do this potentially every 6 seconds.

 

Nerf incoming soon.

 

 

Flame all you want now...

 

 

Edit: Going over the posts and the discussion - I agree (and this is something I did refer to in the original post) that the Harnessed Darkness talent by itself is not the issue but the build itself and being connected to the tanking tree +all the utility of the class as well - as I noted, i can see this talent being in the madness tree and giving the madness tree much needed survivability & better burst (not sure if the latter is needed) - So i changed the title to what it is now.

 

And if you're bored, here's another example of what a good geared (and skilled, I'll give him that) Darkness assassin can do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FngwdbAANJ4&feature=related

 

Are you kidding me? to be honest this is the most dumb post i ever seen, theres nothing op about this. you should watch bm marauders go 4v1 before you start posting this. I watched both of these vids and didnt see 1 thing that i considered op, low crappy hits with some good survability - nothing special -.- i know tank sins with 20k hp and they cant even tuch my marauder, if theres even a slightest thought of nerfing any class, then marauders is the only one they should consider.

Edited March 3, 2012 by Dissey

[Lasarith]

Shadows with thier pebbels are a Pain, -They should Just change the Animation to them Force slowing you (+ the damage)

 

Sin Have A Lot of instant hits, (=where the damage is Comming from) but Force runs out Very very fast, even with the 30% bonus.

[Zastio]

I play a shadow with tank/dps gear and right now its my only 50 but I have others that are mid 40s.

 

Thing is though that you ask to nerf this class then I will just play my scoundrel where I also get highest damage/kills. Nerf that.

 

I will then play my Vanguard and burn everyone down and still get up there with high damage and kills. Nerf that.

 

I will play my JK Guardian where I will also stomp around in tank spec dps gear and get high damage like I do now with him. Nerf that.

 

I will play my sentinal and its over now cause that class is by far the deadliest in the game I refrain from playing to hopefully not force a nerf on it. Nerf it.

 

YOU CAN'T NERF ME.

[icecoldone]

I'm sorry but the OP doesn't understand the class and sees one aspect of us an cries op op.

 

Let me explain a few things about darkness

 

They can't do that burst damage all the time. That kind of insane damage showed in the video can only be performed with recklessness up. That's on a long CD.

 

Does Darkness have good burst. Yes it does. but no all the time. before the buff we couldn't kill anyone. We aren't DPs nor can we do any where near the damage as dps classes. I have played both. Deception can consistently do high damage. The word you are looking for is consistenicy. So can Operatives. There is an operative on my server that can take me down from 20k to 0 in 8 secs. Every time. We can't do anything like that. That is dps. That is true dps. YEs darkness is very powerfull in the hands of the right player but that's only cos it allows for dynamic fighters. If you understand our class we can be beaten.

 

you don't seem to understand how we work.

 

I have given you proof. We can't do that burst damage all the time. It's in stops and starts. We need those moments of burst damage to actually kill.

 

Don't tell me tanks should always have low damage.

 

That's as good as telling me tanks shouldn't pvp

 

Why ?

 

cos in Wow they didn't?

 

So there for that's the rule.

 

All that is happening here is the wow veterans angry that their tried and test notion of tanks being crap in pvp is wrong.

 

So they say the game is broken and try and use half truths to prove it.

 

Not all darkness assassins can be good.

 

Not everyone can play it.

 

And the last video you showed. of that guy playing.

 

Trust me. That's NOT how i would have handled those melee.

 

That guy didn't win cos of damage. You've again failed to mention. He won cos he used his stuns and strength to good effect.

[Abiza]

brb, claiming a class is OP because I got my feeling hurt in a WZ.

[cycao]

 

 

Edit: Going over the posts and the discussion - I agree (and this is something I did refer to in the original post) that the Harnessed Darkness talent by itself is not the issue but the build itself and being connected to the tanking tree +all the utility of the class as well - as I noted, i can see this talent being in the madness tree and giving the madness tree much needed survivability & better burst (not sure if the latter is needed) - So i changed the title to what it is now.

 

And if you're bored, here's another example of what a good geared (and skilled, I'll give him that) Darkness assassin can do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FngwdbAANJ4&feature=related

 

I like the fact that you added that to the post. This class is not a fu**cking I win class because because someone rolled it. It is not the easiest class in the game. When i go against a fotm darkness i just laugh after i destroy them. This class has been changed alot already. There are other classes that need fixing.

 

here are 2 games of my just plain crazy stupid damage i can do.(note the first one, these games from thursday)

http://imageshack.us/f/833/screenshot2012030119164.jpg/

 

http://imageshack.us/content_round.php?page=done&l=img405/7711/screenshot2012022614041.jpg

[Korrigan]

Actually, it ISNT interuptable if you have 3 stacks other than via CC.

It isn't... other than with?

You realize you contradict yourself here, right?

Either it is, or not. Here, it is.