No Cross Realm LFG tool please!

[Aiysis]

The Group Finder feature we've discussed for the near future is definitely single-server only.

How does that help people stuck on really low pop servers do group content? Is anything ever going to be done to help people stuck on low pop servers?

[CJAShadow]

A good enough portion of the Forum playerbase doesn't like cross server LFG for many reasons. I myself am indifferent to it. If there's an option to only server LFG though, I would probably do that to have more.... control over who I group with and later interactions with that person.

 

Honestly, low pop servers should just be merged with Standard servers asap.

 

PVE will go to PVE, and so on.

 

If you have a cross-server LFG tool, that doesn't fix low pop server Heroics (not instanced), bad GTN economy, low guild involvement, new player help and information, drawing in new players to balance out leaving players.

 

Its not really Biowares fault either, this was the biggest MMO launch in history and people were hating the queue times (I avoided them by joining later).

 

I myself am on a standard server (Master Zhar Lestin) and I think the main problem is people don't know how to use the LFG tool we have right now. An updated one would be great.

[oakamp]

 

If you have a cross-server LFG tool, that doesn't fix low pop server Heroics (not instanced), bad GTN economy, low guild involvement, new player help and information, drawing in new players to balance out leaving players.

 

Its not really Biowares fault either, this was the biggest MMO launch in history and people were hating the queue times (I avoided them by joining later).

 

I myself am on a standard server (Master Zhar Lestin) and I think the main problem is people don't know how to use the LFG tool we have right now. An updated one would be great.

no, we dont need server merge , cause our primary time just few ppl,

merge to different time zone player is just useless.

we need a free server transfer system or x-LFM tool ASAP.

[Touchbass]

no, we dont need server merge , cause our primary time just few ppl,

merge to different time zone player is just useless.

we need a free server transfer system or x-LFM tool ASAP.

 

Hold your breath, Bioware is gambling on a massive content patch before addressing these issues. Interesting decision, big gamble imo

[ferroz]

If you have a cross-server LFG tool, that doesn't fix low pop server Heroics (not instanced), bad GTN economy, low guild involvement, new player help and information, drawing in new players to balance out leaving players.

Actually a cross server lfg can help almost all of those.

• Heroics: every zone in the game is instanced, even the ones that aren't behind green doors. Right now, you can pull someone who's not in your instance into it; there's no reason that couldn't work cross server
  
• Bad gtn: yep, doesn't fix this one; but mergers don't necessarily fix it either. THe biggest problem with the gtn has nothing to do with the number of people playing on a server; rather it has to do with the lack of things that are really worth buying. There's the level 11/15/19 orange armor pieces, and a few other pieces, but for the most part you can easily get everything you'd want for leveling gear just by leveling.
  
• low guild involvement: can totally be helped with cross server; there have been a couple of folks to kick around the idea of cross server guilds, and if there's a readily available free server transfer mechanism, you can easily move to be with your new guild. Beyond that: guilds that are having problesm with having membership numbers % 4 != 0 can benefit, by being able to always field groups for it's members even if they have 6 people on...
  
• cross server help can certainly be done cross server; add cross server class channels (we had them set up in EQ a decade ago, eg: serverwide.bard)
  

Edited March 15, 2012 by ferroz

[ferroz]

As for LFG I don't like it. Less from a "It harms the community" perspective and more from a whats the point? perspective.

Oh the point is simple: it vastly speeds up group formation time: average, best case and worst case all.

 

There are less tanks and healers than DPS so even with cross server wait times for DPS are long.

Long is a relative term. In wow, at the worst, it was 40 minute waits as a dps, instant for tanks and near instant for healers. More recently it's closer to 10 minutes for dps, maybe 15 on a really bad day way off peak, and tanks/healers are still instant or nearly so.

 

It's not like there is some server where all the tanks and healers play and can't get groups waiting for DPS to log on.

There doesn't need to be.... there just needs to be a more dense queue.

 

 

You're also totally ignoring the fact that the flashpoints between the first ones (BT/Esseles) and the level 50 hardmodes are going to get steadily less and less usage.

 

Cross server lfg totally changes that; it certainly did in wow.

Edited March 15, 2012 by ferroz

[ferroz]

How does that help people stuck on really low pop servers do group content? Is anything ever going to be done to help people stuck on low pop servers?

my guess? you'll be in the same position I was on Kaleida in RIFT: SOL

[Nitewolfe]

Actually a cross server lfg can help almost all of those.

• Heroics: every zone in the game is instanced, even the ones that aren't behind green doors. Right now, you can pull someone who's not in your instance into it; there's no reason that couldn't work cross server
  
• Bad gtn: yep, doesn't fix this one; but mergers don't necessarily fix it either. THe biggest problem with the gtn has nothing to do with the number of people playing on a server; rather it has to do with the lack of things that are really worth buying. There's the level 11/15/19 orange armor pieces, and a few other pieces, but for the most part you can easily get everything you'd want for leveling gear just by leveling.
  
• low guild involvement: can totally be helped with cross server; there have been a couple of folks to kick around the idea of cross server guilds, and if there's a readily available free server transfer mechanism, you can easily move to be with your new guild. Beyond that: guilds that are having problesm with having membership numbers % 4 != 0 can benefit, by being able to always field groups for it's members even if they have 6 people on...
  
• cross server help can certainly be done cross server; add cross server class channels (we had them set up in EQ a decade ago, eg: serverwide.bard)
  

 

Man thanks for reminding me of that on eq2 we had cross server chats also i had totally forgotten.

[ferroz]

Man thanks for reminding me of that on eq2 we had cross server chats also i had totally forgotten.

EQ and EQ2 had cross GAME chat... you could

/tell eq.tribunal.jayabalard yo!

 

Heck, for a while, you could hook into the chat server with a non-game client; they had an external chat client, and I remember that I had a plugin for trillian that worked that.

 

I mean... cross server/cross game chat is not rocket science.

Edited March 15, 2012 by ferroz

[Esproc]

Originally Posted by GeorgZoeller The Group Finder feature we've discussed for the near future is definitely single-server only.

 

Well, enough said.

 

Just as they are going to add in meters, even if to a limited extent, against others concerns.

 

Remember, Jagger said it best ...

[ferroz]

Originally Posted by GeorgZoeller The Group Finder feature we've discussed for the near future is definitely single-server only.

 

Well, enough said.

No, if that's not sufficient for people, they should continue to say so.

[Touchbass]

No, if that's not sufficient for people, they should continue to say so.

 

I don't raid or ever really plan to outside of filling in a spot for the guild in a pinch but I find it hilarious that there isn't proper metrics for raiding guilds. It's not fun bashing your head against a wall for hours not knowing if your DPS or healing is too low for the strategy your using. This isn't a big issue now cause no serious raiders are playing this Tier but if the next tier comes out without raid wide recognition metrics it's going to be a field day on the forums.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Touchbass

[lordmallick]

I think the addition of a LFG button is a must. i have played casually over the past 2 months and have never even done a flashpoint.

 

the main reason for this is after getting a flashpoint quest, you have to make a desicion do i stand here and spam LFG in chat or continue lvling?

 

Now i personally play in off peak hours because of life stuff, so generally im in areas with only a few people in them, at the lowest off peak times of the day there can be as little as 6 people in the areas.

 

under these conditions it is hard enough getting a heroic done let alone worrying about the flashpoints.

 

Even if they ad server only LFG its a start.

 

My suggestion would be that the LFG works for Flashpoints and heroics, doesnt have to be complicated just a few tick boxes, you no tick the heroic you want to complete tick that youre a healer, tank or dps, best way to regulate it would be making it so you have to be on the same planet as the heroic you are looking for.

[Touchbass]

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/03/13/epic-in-scope-swtors-james-ohlen-explains-plans-for-the-future/

 

Interview with game designer, he basically says they were going to work on a SWTOR dungeon finder but figured they had 3-4 months to work on it but thats no longer the case. He further states that it's the biggest complaint at level 50 and people aren't doing a lot of PvE stuff cause they can't form groups.

[Bobinator]

I say keep it to the server....LFD based on server is just fine.

 

 

IF they make it cross realm...keep it to the realm style...RP-PvE/RP-PvP group only...PvE group only PvP group only. When you start mixing different realm styles it gets bad.

[finkelmana]

Im all for cross server LFG and PvP, as well as server merges and/or transfers.

 

For those of you against it, roll a toon on a low pop server and try to run a flashpoint. After hours of spamming in fleet general chat that you are looking for a group, you will pull your hair out. You may get lucky and find someone who wants to run it too... Naturally you wont have a tank or a healer. Personally, I was never able to run a level appropriate flashpoint, until level 50.

 

Same goes for PvP. You can sit in the queue for hours. Ive waited as long as 6 before giving up. If you do get a match, you end up playing the same people over and over. On my server, there are almost no empire players. You can get lucky in the evenings, but the Republic tends to faceroll them and if you string a couple of wins in a row, they give up for a while. If you are lucky, you might get a bunch of same faction PvP, ie nonstop Huttball. Also, on low pop servers PvP matches end after 2 minutes if not enough people queue. You spend more time on loading screens than in the match. With the match ending early. it is almost always a loss for attackers on VS, a win for the first team to get the ball in HB, and a win for the team that has an extra player (or more) in ACW. And with that, you find some people win their 3 matches and stop queuing.

 

I can see no downside to cross server groups. People will actually get to run flashpoints. People will actually get to do PvP. Some people want to stay "same" server, well thats not going to be an issue as BW said same server players will be the priority.

[Kuuraien]

To those saying that the tool isn't responsible for player's actions need to study psychology a little.

 

Removing the sense of community will reduce perceived and real consequences for going against the norm. Go to 4chan and see how anonymity makes their community. While you wouldn't be anonymous, the odds of people remembering you, or your rudeness having an effect on your way of life is minimal to non existant, so it's nearly the same.

 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deindividuation

 

I do not support cross server lfg, but support same server.

 

lol person talking about psychology and quoting 4chan, your point isnt absurd, but there is no solution to the current problem other than implementing a cross realm LFG or adding an "online" cap for both sides which no one really wants and would cause more problems than it would solve, hence cross-realm lfg is the only real option, trying to defy the only solution to a problem is completly useless, so far no one presented a realistic alternative and neither have you, so lol please enlighten us why communities should be people confined to small guilds of friends, there are no "communities" rep side on any servers.

 

And dont come around with the bs that there are big rep guilds, please lol, thats laudable, guilds arent communities, in my server im on a guild that has about 20 persons online at peak hour and thats 1/3 of the population on rep side, but they are mostly alts swaping around etc, the population problem is real you cant just ignore it, its causing people to have trouble looking for group for flashpoints and heroics, its causing people to have to wait for pvp queving, and its preventing the formation of any type of community in the game since servers individually lack the ammount of republics to have a decent community rep side, and subsequently causing people to drop the game since its not functioning properly... game feels like playing an online multiplayer session of a single player rpg online (oblivion etc).

Edited March 15, 2012 by Kuuraien

[CJAShadow]

Wouldn't low pop server merges because Bioware had too many open for the first month fix the problems that everyone is complaining about on these servers?

 

I would like some low/standard pop merge/action for a beautiful lovechild.

 

Even on standard servers there is a lack of people questing and it is hard to party. Many people dont know about the LFG tool. Cross-Server LFG won't solve all the problems with a low pop server, just slow down the degradation.

Edited March 15, 2012 by CJAShadow

[Touchbass]

Wouldn't low pop server merges because Bioware had too many open for the first month fix the problems that everyone is complaining about on these servers?

 

I would like some low/standard pop merge/action for a beautiful lovechild.

 

Even on standard servers there is a lack of people questing and it is hard to party. Many people dont know about the LFG tool. Cross-Server LFG won't solve all the problems with a low pop server, just slow down the degradation.

 

Even on WoW's most popular servers, that had 20+ 25 man raiding guilds that were progressing through the top tiers, people couldn't find groups for leveling content

 

1) The player bubble moved past it

 

2) The requirements of fullfilling the trinity to do said content was slower then other alternatives

 

For the first time EVER with cross server people got to experience leveling content, anti-LFD often forget to mention that

[Dreign]

I for one DON'T want crossserver LFG, at least not for Warzones.

 

Why? Because i got to know these people i've been pvping all this time with. Yesterday we ended up in the fleet, in front of the pvp vendors talking while waiting for the next WZ. That was 10+ people from different guilds, just sitting there, socializing, having fun.

 

Not to mention the fact that knowing who the people are improves teamwork: You see that guy and remembers he's a tank, you throw him the ball. See that other guy get attacked, remembers he's a healer, you go help him.

 

THIS!

 

Who in their right mind wouldn't want to keep their community intact so as to build camaraderie amongst the PvP community?

 

Please, Bioware, if you must use cross-server WZ queuing to fill up where some servers lack PvP population, at least don't ruin the ones that don't need the help, like Jung Ma (PvP-RP).

 

Keep it on a need-only basis, like perhaps linking 3 PvE servers together, not to PvP servers with good populations.

[ferroz]

I don't raid or ever really plan to outside of filling in a spot for the guild in a pinch but I find it hilarious that there isn't proper metrics for raiding guilds. It's not fun bashing your head against a wall for hours not knowing if your DPS or healing is too low for the strategy your using. This isn't a big issue now cause no serious raiders are playing this Tier but if the next tier comes out without raid wide recognition metrics it's going to be a field day on the forums.

yeah... so... if you aren't happy with the metrics you're getting, you should ask for them. But you'd probably be better off asking in a thread about that instead of this one

 

 

Wouldn't low pop server merges because Bioware had too many open for the first month fix the problems that everyone is complaining about on these servers?

No, there are still problems in the low-mid levels (post esseles/BT and pre hard mode 50) flash points. And there are still probably off peak times. Cross server does a lot to fix both of those.

Cross-Server LFG won't solve all the problems with a low pop server, just slow down the degradation.

It fixes some of them; and since I'm in favor of cross server in general, that's definitely good by me.

[saviorez]

Don't do it Bioware just make improvement to the current LFG don't add this system.

[ElevenX]

Players against making it easier to find groups always boggle my mind.

[DarthGygax]

I for one want to see this implemented, What would you rather do, Get into a Flashpoint quickly or sit around the fleet for hours & hours asking if anyone wants to do a specific Flashpoint, I'd rather be questing & advancing my toon than just sitting around reading endless fleet chat hoping in vain that you'll see someone putting together a group for the Flashpoint your looking for.

[dondiwayne]

I think this is semi true. In that they have expectations of how people will play vs. how people do play. Lets look at the ready check issue. It's a good feature and should be in. It has likely been in in one from or another at various points in the dev cycle. It however didn't make it into release (Ui revisions or just plain missed in assorted changes) now people who play pretty much exclusively with their guild and on vent/TS may not ever have need of a ready check. they just use voice which is quicker anyway.

 

As for LFG I don't like it. Less from a "It harms the community" perspective and more from a whats the point? perspective.

 

There are less tanks and healers than DPS so even with cross server wait times for DPS are long. It's not like there is some server where all the tanks and healers play and can't get groups waiting for DPS to log on.

 

So for no real benefit you put at risk the community building opportunities of in server LFG. Once again the Devs expect you to build robust guilds and friends lists not just spam general chat. If you do so and are not a total tool in the flashpoints you do you'll not have trouble finding groups.

 

I liked your post.

 

I thought about this but never knew how to really express it. Probably the only people who have problems finding groups are DEEPEESSSSS, as Tank or Healer you basically instantly find a group.

So it is not a LFG tool it is a LFSPWROOTBC-Tool (Looking for stupid person who rolled one of those boring classes - Tool)

Thats why i disliked LFG Tools Single or X-Server in any form.

 

As a Tank people expect you to be well geared for the content so you can sustain enough damage, as a Healer people expect you to have enought gear to keep everyone alive (even stupid DEEPEESSERS who stand in fire) and as DEEPEESSSS you basically have a white card.

With LFG Tools you get matched with random people and it often takes a +-30% more time to complete a dungeon because of undergeared underskilled people.

 

As someone already stated, the only real argument the Pro-X-Server-LFGers have is that they want to experience every content. It is a game and if you are not able to do reach all content it is like that. In Mario you also didnt get to see the last level if you didn't do the levels before. Its basic, its an effort-reward problem, people want to put in less possible effort with maximum possible reward.

 

Any player who plays in a proper and social manner shouldnt have problems finding a group. If you ignore the other players and solo your way trough the game, you cant expect other people to be ready when you want to do some content with you. It is so simple, play, make friends, form groups, or are you such jerks noone wants to socialize with you?