Ycoga Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 This is just an observation. Bioware's writers tend to make use of interesting computer-based scenarios (such as hacking software systems to finish a quest and the use of AI's and holograms as characters). One prime example of this is the Reapers in ME. Such trends have been continued in TOR: Tharan's holographic companion is an AI, for example. Also there are several examples of system hacking (one republic agent on Balmorra is a hacker by trade, in all but name). The major concern I have with this is that the concept of an 'AI' is too hard-sci-fi a concept for the science-fantasy world of Star Wars. This is true also for the concepts of hacking computer systems. I feel that these do not thematically fit Star Wars. Am I the only one that sees it this way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Journeyer Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 It *does* seem peculiar that 3000 years later, sentient holographic entities and Geth-like machine factions aren't running around. Holographic communication is employed in the movies, though, as well as various bits of tech hacking. In some sense, I think TOR feels a bit un-movie-like just because we're seeing it a bit more close-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamsterboom Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 did you not notice that in the "films" the galaxy is run down to hell ? society degraded and such ..easy as Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenovan Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) The scrappy gang from the original trilogy did have a master hacker with them pretty often -- R2-D2. Yes, he's a droid, with a theoretical advantage in the field, but there is an implication that computer systems are open to exploitation by even non-droid slicers. R2's only an astromech droid, after all. Edited February 14, 2012 by Jenovan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ycoga Posted February 14, 2012 Author Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) The scrappy gang from the original trilogy did have a master hacker with them pretty often -- R2-D2. Yes, he's a droid, with a theoretical advantage in the field, but the implication is that computer systems are open to exploitation by even non-droid slicers. R2's only an astromech droid, after all All droids in SW had pet-like levels of sophistication; even the ones used for manual labour and as astromechs. What I mean is that Lucas had no idea what a BIOS was, nor that an astromech might need to boot up if you swtich one on, for example. society degraded and such ..easy as This makes sense, but what I'm getting at is that, for me, SW is a child of the 70's. George Lucas was working with a new age of hardware, where computers had big red light bulbs on them and programming was just coming out of the 'insert tabbed slip into slot A' stage. Mass Effect, on the other hand, is thoroughly modern and was built by proficient, technical people using software as their medium. I wonder how much the writers just relied on an approach they used for the ME series; and whether more could have been done to keep a more authentic SW feel? Edited February 14, 2012 by Moitteva Removed quoted rude and response Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretha Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Sorry, lad. Seems like you are aren't Star-Warsy enough anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meira_Arirai Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 "Slicers" are a relatively common feature in the New Republic-era EU. It would be silly to think that even a space opera/space fantasy-flavored society that's so reliant on computers (everyone uses commlinks, every ship that's hyperspace capable needs a navcomp, droids are ubiquitous) wouldn't have people who were talented at exploiting them, just like it would be hard to imagine a D&D-style high fantasy world of dungeons and castles without people who specialized in circumventing locks, traps, and traditional methods of warfare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ycoga Posted February 14, 2012 Author Share Posted February 14, 2012 And what of the AI? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleak_Carrion Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I wouldn't let it bother you. The galaxy is an enormous place with tons of secrets. It's possible that technology is lost due to war, disease etc, and then rediscovered or reinvented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtikLYar Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 And what of the AI? I don't understand your problem here. Droids are, and always have been since the original trilogy, AIs. The only differance between C-3PO and Holiday is that one uses a hologram as her form, and one is shoved inside a machine so he can walk around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylriana Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 And what of the AI? What of it? It's standard fare in SW... I mean, pretty much every droid you meet in the movies at least has the ability to emulate sentience if they aren't a proper AI outright. If anything some of the more mindless droids you see in TOR are the anomaly, not the AI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorander Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 This is just an observation. Bioware's writers tend to make use of interesting computer-based scenarios (such as hacking software systems to finish a quest and the use of AI's and holograms as characters). One prime example of this is the Reapers in ME. Such trends have been continued in TOR: Tharan's holographic companion is an AI, for example. Also there are several examples of system hacking (one republic agent on Balmorra is a hacker by trade, in all but name). The major concern I have with this is that the concept of an 'AI' is too hard-sci-fi a concept for the science-fantasy world of Star Wars. This is true also for the concepts of hacking computer systems. I feel that these do not thematically fit Star Wars. Am I the only one that sees it this way? "Threepio, would you shut up and listen to me?!? Shut down all the garbage mashers on the detention level! Shut down all the garbage mashers on the detention level!" I can cite more examples of good ol' Artoo hacking stuff in the movies, but that makes my point well enough, and it is the funniest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorander Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 All droids in SW had pet-like levels of sophistication; even the ones used for manual labour and as astromechs. So I guess we are just ignoring the fact that Threepio functioned and felt exactly as a human does in the Original Trilogy. Cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ycoga Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 I agree with everyone's observations here. Droids are certainly AI's. Perhaps I get a sense of cross-pollination when I think of the Reapers and EDI, then Holiday... I'm sort of waiting for an evil AI to come and cause trouble in the SW universe when, traditionally, droids are hopeless and tend to stay out of the affairs of sentient races in SW lore. Hmm. Interesting, nevertheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arivael Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I agree with everyone's observations here. Droids are certainly AI's. Perhaps I get a sense of cross-pollination when I think of the Reapers and EDI, then Holiday... I'm sort of waiting for an evil AI to come and cause trouble in the SW universe when, traditionally, droids are hopeless and tend to stay out of the affairs of sentient races in SW lore. Hmm. Interesting, nevertheless. In SW most droids get memory wiped on a regular bases to prevent them breaking their behavrioral inhibitors, R2 though for exsample has likely not been memory wiped since the events of Episode 1 and C3-PO was wiped at the end of episode 3 (solo due to the fact he needed to not remeber Obi in episode 4) and HK-47 well he has gone what 300 years now (ok he's been blown up a few times but still) without one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heley Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) I agree with everyone's observations here. Droids are certainly AI's. Perhaps I get a sense of cross-pollination when I think of the Reapers and EDI, then Holiday... I'm sort of waiting for an evil AI to come and cause trouble in the SW universe when, traditionally, droids are hopeless and tend to stay out of the affairs of sentient races in SW lore. Hmm. Interesting, nevertheless. Directive 7 Edited February 15, 2012 by Heley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ycoga Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 Directive 7 I have yet to play it, but am not sure I want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamaranis Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 This is just an observation. Bioware's writers tend to make use of interesting computer-based scenarios (such as hacking software systems to finish a quest and the use of AI's and holograms as characters). One prime example of this is the Reapers in ME. Such trends have been continued in TOR: Tharan's holographic companion is an AI, for example. Also there are several examples of system hacking (one republic agent on Balmorra is a hacker by trade, in all but name). The major concern I have with this is that the concept of an 'AI' is too hard-sci-fi a concept for the science-fantasy world of Star Wars. This is true also for the concepts of hacking computer systems. I feel that these do not thematically fit Star Wars. Am I the only one that sees it this way? Well, probably not. But given that hacking and AIs were present in the original set of films you and whoever will have a hard time making a case that it contradicts the spirit of the setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloro Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 It *does* seem peculiar that 3000 years later, sentient holographic entities and Geth-like machine factions aren't running around. Holiday is a unique lifeform, probably exotech. We don't see another like her in this era that I'm aware of, so why would we expect to see more like her several millennia later? There were sentient machine cultures in the Star Wars galaxy. E.g. the Silentium or Abominor. They just didn't have anything to do with the main storyline of the Chosen One so weren't part of the movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jellison Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 There's a lot you can forget over 3k years. After you've got hyperspace travel, what else is there to get? Hyperspace travel- Now with BACON! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Man people are so Myopic when it comes to Star Wars. Anything that deviates from their personal narrow view of what Star Wars is causes outrage......unless of Course it s a fan made YouTube Video that Retcons Star Wars and makes it all Battlestar Galaticy...then they cheer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LyriaFrost Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) There's a lot you can forget over 3k years. After you've got hyperspace travel, what else is there to get? Hyperspace travel- Now with BACON! Ensign: Captain, why are we using the hyperdrive to travel between the planet and the starport? You're only saving-- *hyperdrive engines turn on, and everyone receives free bacon* Ensign: ...protest withdrawn, captain. *noms* Edited February 15, 2012 by LyriaFrost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cythereal Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 For another example of an AI, you have Scorpio, a companion of the Imperial Agent. "She" was expressly designed to constantly adapt and improve herself, and notes that her first several incarnations were non-sentient. She bootstrapped her way up and seeks to improve herself further still. She's an adaptive, self-directing, self-improving AI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intarabus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Nice Thread, at least a new topic. Really recent addition to Star Wars is that they have actually internet ingame. You can download missions, and it is even interstellar, as you can check your E-Mail anywhere. They did it a little over the top, as you can't download only money, but also stuff (the boxes look, like they have a lot of storage, so maybe they have some delivery guys who put in the gear by hyperdrive, if needed). Anyway, they did not cross the "Neuromancer line", where you play "hacker missions" in an alternate reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ycoga Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 For another example of an AI, you have Scorpio, a companion of the Imperial Agent. "She" was expressly designed to constantly adapt and improve herself, and notes that her first several incarnations were non-sentient. She bootstrapped her way up and seeks to improve herself further still. She's an adaptive, self-directing, self-improving AI. This is an example of why I thought that perhaps the story tools and techniques that the team developed during Mass Effect have made their way into TOR. The conclusions that people seem to have reached in this thread are that self-evolving, sentient AI's are not very Star Warsy. However the AI approach was well received in ME... it could be that the writing team used it as a template for this game, favouring a formulaic writing approach, which can detract from the immersive experience of SW in this game. Bioware: you may need to freshen up your tropes with regards to rogue AI's. You may be giving away plot details for ME3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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