"Advanced Classes = Fundamentally Different Class Designs"

[MajikMyst]

The Advanced Classes are just glorified specs though. Again there's been no argument that can justify this, most popular is "Cause Bioware said so."

 

How exactly can you support that statement?? They are not glorified specs.. They are classes.. In every sense of the word.. They are classes..

 

Please explain otherwise..

[littleming]

Really? sure, they are different specs because an assasin plays just like a sorcerer. Same rotations, same skills, just a couple of different abilities... oh wait... Ok, ok, then let's look at the sniper and operative. They both play the same, same rotations, same skills, just a few different... oh wait...

 

Then you're not playing the class right. I can speak from personal experience as I have a sorc, assassin, mercenary, and powertech. My girlfriend has an Operative and I have played with enough Snipers to see how the play style is vastly different in each and every AC.

 

Example, as a Sorcerer, depending on if you're DPS or Heals, your rotation is VERY different. You have different abilities you use regularly. Even among the two different DPS trees as a sorcerer you are utilizing different abilities as your primary attack. Assassin is the same. Whether you are Tank, or DPS, plays a huge role in your rotation and the only thing assassin and sorc share is 'force lightning'. I wouldn't call that the same rotation. Not to mention, sorcs have heals, assassins do not.

 

For Agents, Operative doesn't need Cover to do the majority of their abilities. They are a far more mobile class, they are stealth, and they use a lot more melee and close ranged attacks. Sniper is long range, requires cover for the majority of its higher damage attacks, and is not very mobile at all.

 

Bounty Hunter, mercenaries use tracer, or power shot as their primary attack depending on their dps tree. I don't even need to mention healing, because powertechs don't have the heals at all. They are range, and utilize that to their advantage. They can't take hits nearly as well as a powertech, and they don't use shields. Powertech is melee with a gun. You are up close, in their face, and most of your attacks are fire/flamethrower based as opposed to Mercenaries being missile or blaster based.

 

Yes you share some of the same abilities across different ACs, but the playstyle and how they are utilized are vastly different depending not only on your AC choice, but your skill tree as well.

[chaosdefined]

Really? sure, they are different specs because an assasin plays just like a sorcerer. Same rotations, same skills, just a couple of different abilities... oh wait... Ok, ok, then let's look at the sniper and operative. They both play the same, same rotations, same skills, just a few different... oh wait...

 

They are different classes. COMPLETELY different classes. You do not seem to understand what "spec" means. It means "specialization". It does not mean "redefinition". A spec is just something to boost a specific playstyle of your class. It does not mean it CHANGES your class. Specs and classes should be kept separate, or, as I already stated, it DILUTES the game. And I know WoW does it with druids and paladins, but I still consider it a bad idea.

 

And yeah, giving in to one demand will empower the "demandee" to demand more. That's the way things work.

 

So just in the same way that a Feral Druid plays exactly the same as a Moonkin Druid?

Oh wait...

[MajikMyst]

So just in the same way that a Feral Druid plays exactly the same as a Moonkin Druid?

Oh wait...

 

And Mages and Warlocks play almost exacly the same, wear the same gear, use the same stats, play the same roles.. Oh wait!!

 

A druid is a horrilbe example as it is a shape shifter.. It is a hybrid.. Every paladin spec uses a sword and shield.. Whether it is Holy or Retribution..

 

Feral is cat or bear and moonkin is a bird.. Do any of the classes in this game shape shift?? Oh wait!!

 

Edit: They do have shape shifters in Star Wars.. Zam Wesell was a Shape Shifter..

 

Zam Wesell

 

So it would be interesting if they added a shape shifting class..

Edited March 2, 2012 by MajikMyst

[Raximillian]

So just in the same way that a Feral Druid plays exactly the same as a Moonkin Druid?

Oh wait...

 

And that shows you did not even read my post. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

Again, that argument is weak. Just because WoW does it, does not mean it is the ONLY way, or the CORRECT way to do it. It seems your vision is quite limited.

[chaosdefined]

And that shows you did not even read my post. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

Again, that argument is weak. Just because WoW does it, does not mean it is the ONLY way, or the CORRECT way to do it. It seems your vision is quite limited.

 

Oh the hypocrisy, my vision is limted because I believe a game can expand on its original ideas and become more open minded about choices given to players.

 

Anyway this argument is going around in circles, we each have other opinions on why it is good or bad.

 

But at the end of the day, we're just arguing with each other and it's going to get us nowhere.

 

I will say this though, AC Change is a very strong possibility for the future. Maybe not now, or maybe not in the next year. But at the point when subscription numbers begin to take a big enough drop, Bioware will attempt to do anything to get people back, and you can sure as hell bet that AC change will be one of those ploys.

Personally, I think it's smarter if they do it sooner rather than later to avoid drops in subscriptions.

 

But hey, that's just my opinion on how this game could improve and survive.

[Raximillian]

Then you're not playing the class right. I can speak from personal experience as I have a sorc, assassin, mercenary, and powertech. My girlfriend has an Operative and I have played with enough Snipers to see how the play style is vastly different in each and every AC.

 

Example, as a Sorcerer, depending on if you're DPS or Heals, your rotation is VERY different. You have different abilities you use regularly. Even among the two different DPS trees as a sorcerer you are utilizing different abilities as your primary attack. Assassin is the same. Whether you are Tank, or DPS, plays a huge role in your rotation and the only thing assassin and sorc share is 'force lightning'. I wouldn't call that the same rotation. Not to mention, sorcs have heals, assassins do not.

 

For Agents, Operative doesn't need Cover to do the majority of their abilities. They are a far more mobile class, they are stealth, and they use a lot more melee and close ranged attacks. Sniper is long range, requires cover for the majority of its higher damage attacks, and is not very mobile at all.

 

Bounty Hunter, mercenaries use tracer, or power shot as their primary attack depending on their dps tree. I don't even need to mention healing, because powertechs don't have the heals at all. They are range, and utilize that to their advantage. They can't take hits nearly as well as a powertech, and they don't use shields. Powertech is melee with a gun. You are up close, in their face, and most of your attacks are fire/flamethrower based as opposed to Mercenaries being missile or blaster based.

 

Yes you share some of the same abilities across different ACs, but the playstyle and how they are utilized are vastly different depending not only on your AC choice, but your skill tree as well.

 

Sorry, I used a very broad example to make a point. You are right, different specs will change your "playstyle", exactly as they should. It will just not change your "classstyle" if you get what I mean.

[littleming]

Sorry, I used a very broad example to make a point. You are right, different specs will change your "playstyle", exactly as they should. It will just not change your "classstyle" if you get what I mean.

 

Then I shall quote myself.

 

To me, this argument that AC swapping is a 'quality of life' issue, doesn't hold water. What I am hearing more, is that each class needs to be optimized better to be viable end-game characters so it does not matter if you have a Operative healer instead of a Sorcerer. There should be no 'optimal best in slot class'. So, I vote for class optimization over AC swapping.

 

To clarify, each class should be just as useful as the counterparts and the differences should come in with play style, story, and appearance, not performance.

Edited March 2, 2012 by littleming

[MajikMyst]

Then I shall quote myself.

 

 

 

To clarify, each class should be just as useful as the counterparts and the differences should come in with play style, story, and appearance, not performance.

 

Hmmmm.. Where is your other quote..

 

I agree 100% that class optimization is an issue.. WOW has been tweaking the classes since release and I susptect Bioware will be doing the same..

 

Something that I believe is biggest reason is one that is there by design.. No single class can both tank and heal.. A class can either tank or it can heal, but it can't do both.. Which means if you want a tank and a healer, you are going need to roll two characters..

 

I may be wrong here, but that to me seems to be the biggest reason why people are wanting AC speccing.. Even though the arguement itself isn't actually made.. It isn't enough that they will most likely get dual speccing.. They need AC speccing too to allow them to both tank and heal.. This is a line that I hope Bioware never crosses and never gives in on.. This is of course my opinion.. But it seems reasonable..

[Raximillian]

Then I shall quote myself.

 

 

 

To clarify, each class should be just as useful as the counterparts and the differences should come in with play style, story, and appearance, not performance.

 

Oh, I agree. I hold the opinion against AC switching as well. And yes, class balance should be there. All healers should be viable, all DPSers should be viable, as well as tanks. I feel that is a different discussion, but I do agree.

[CorellianWannabe]

Hmmmm.. Where is your other quote..

 

I agree 100% that class optimization is an issue.. WOW has been tweaking the classes since release and I susptect Bioware will be doing the same..

 

Something that I believe is biggest reason is one that is there by design.. No single class can both tank and heal.. A class can either tank or it can heal, but it can't do both.. Which means if you want a tank and a healer, you are going need to roll two characters..

 

I may be wrong here, but that to me seems to be the biggest reason why people are wanting AC speccing.. Even though the arguement itself isn't actually made.. It isn't enough that they will most likely get dual speccing.. They need AC speccing too to allow them to both tank and heal.. This is a line that I hope Bioware never crosses and never gives in on.. This is of course my opinion.. But it seems reasonable..

 

For me it's because there is no difference between choosing an 'advanced class' spec and choosing a 'put your points here' spec. The idea that switching from saber and shield to 2 sabers is more damaging than 1 saber and shield to saber and strength offhand boggles my mind.

 

Also, as I stated before consulars/inquisitors have 10m ranged attacks and no stealth on the starting planet. Based on this overwhelming experience with the playstyles you are asked to make a permanent decision with nothing else to help but a splash of talent trees that effectively tell you nothing. Telling someone to reroll and waste 2-3 hours releveling due to making a 'wrong' choice (really more ill-informed) is ridiculous. Might as well tell people to reroll after placing a talent point in a non-optimized position-after all, choices should matter according to a lot of people.

 

Finally why is a class that can heal and tank so horrible? Do all the other healing and tank classes feel envy that requires an ego stroke? Did paladins and druids somehow ruin the other game and now we must protect the casting healer and sword and board 'true' tanks from becoming obsolete? This to me makes as much sense as the people that apparently can't resist peer pressure to respec into a healing or tank role when told the group needs one.

[aznthecapn]

So just in the same way that a Feral Druid plays exactly the same as a Moonkin Druid?

Oh wait...

 

NOT a valid argument. Druids and Paladins are the only classes who can fill all three roles in that game. Two out of TEN classes. They are an exception, not the rule. They are also notoriously difficult to balance and have been for 7+ years. They still haven't found the perfect balance for all three paladin specs. Stop referring to druids and paladins, they do not support your argument.

 

No argument against AC is anything more than weak, narrow-minded and selfish.

 

This is an absurdly immature viewpoint. If you really think you can whittle down all opposing view points in this fashion, then you aren't paying attention and you're just interested in sticking your fingers in your ears and saying "NAANAANAANAANAANAANAA". That doesn't support a discussion or discourse.

 

Your purpose here is not to convince ME or anyone else that AC changing is a good idea - its to convince the developers. They are the ones who make the decisions. They should be the focus of your argument. Especially since they have already said "no". Not "maybe" or "keep discussing it, we may change our minds". They said "no".

Edited March 2, 2012 by aznthecapn

[Maltra]

Ac switching as easily as changing talents will eventually happen, they just say "no" for now because from a money making perspective it's still better for them to have people pay for more gametime and reroll a different spec of the same class (because yeah, that's what they are).

 

From a gameplay perspective, however, ac switching should have been there since day 1. It doesn't affect the gameplay in any negative way, only positive ones, especially for small groups of guilds/players. It's just an option and people who want to roll 100 characters can do so regardless.

 

No one can change the devs mind on this. They simply think they make more money this way for the aforementioned reasons, so until at least a few months have passed and everyone has 4-5-6 50s, they won't allow ac switching. But when those conditions will be met, they will, because from a functionality standpoint it makes no sense whatsoever to not be allowed to change ac just as you change your spec.

 

Everyone fooling her/himself into thinking there's any other reason other than money behind the devs stance, like, they're some sort of holy crusaders who think that is evil to change ac because it's a different class and such thoughts have to be purged with fire by the righteous, and prides her/himself for being on "the devs' side" is delusional.

 

Give it time, and it will happen, no matter what the insane roleplayers/community people have to say on the matter.

 

Cross server, dual spec, dungeon tool, color crystals come to mind. If it makes sense from a gameplay/functionality/convenience standpoint, it will happen. Unless money dictates otherwise of course.

Edited March 2, 2012 by Maltra

[Sapphix]

I think they should have a paid service that allows you to change your ac. It would give the option to people who want it and it would limit it's usage to the people who don't.

[MajikMyst]

For me it's because there is no difference between choosing an 'advanced class' spec and choosing a 'put your points here' spec. The idea that switching from saber and shield to 2 sabers is more damaging than 1 saber and shield to saber and strength offhand boggles my mind.

 

Also, as I stated before consulars/inquisitors have 10m ranged attacks and no stealth on the starting planet. Based on this overwhelming experience with the playstyles you are asked to make a permanent decision with nothing else to help but a splash of talent trees that effectively tell you nothing. Telling someone to reroll and waste 2-3 hours releveling due to making a 'wrong' choice (really more ill-informed) is ridiculous. Might as well tell people to reroll after placing a talent point in a non-optimized position-after all, choices should matter according to a lot of people.

 

Finally why is a class that can heal and tank so horrible? Do all the other healing and tank classes feel envy that requires an ego stroke? Did paladins and druids somehow ruin the other game and now we must protect the casting healer and sword and board 'true' tanks from becoming obsolete? This to me makes as much sense as the people that apparently can't resist peer pressure to respec into a healing or tank role when told the group needs one.

 

Warlocks and mages both are casters, use mana, wear the same gear, use the same stats , are strictly DPS as a role, and nobody argues they aren't the same class.. I fail to see how anyone in this game can use basic simularities as a basis to say that the AC's are not classes..

 

2-3 hours of time is a short time in comparison to how long and how many hours we will be playing this game.. So again, I fail to see the basis in complaining about it.. WOW never allowed class changes.. I don't remember seeing to many people asking about it either.. The only real difference was, you chose your class at lvl 0 during character creation and not lvl 10.. I would guess that if we chose our AC during character creation, we wouldn't have to entertain this meaningless arguement all the time.. This wouldn't have become a product of 'We got Bioware to agree to dual speccing, what else can we get??'.. You just have to love the slippery slope mentality.. It has destroyed many a MMO's..

 

Druids and Paladins really didn't harm WOW until dual speccing and LFG was implemented.. It was much easier to find a group on my Paladin as a tank or healer than it was on my lock.. I can even remember denying some DPS classes on the off chance of needing another tank or healer.. Countless people, like my wife were pushed to different specs that they really didn't want to play.. "ShadowAura' a priest my wife created.. Always destined to be a Shadow priest, hence the name.. Over 90% of the time was a holy priest instead..

 

There are certian things that just destroy the ability to be different in an MMO.. AC switching is one such thing.. Not only does it cut the number of classes in half.. But people will be expected to maintain the tank or healing spec available to them above the spec they really want to play for their own enjoyment..

 

During the time of BC.. It didn't matter if you were a Paladin or a druid.. You still had just one spec and you were whatever you were.. Guilds made do with that reality.. All these so called wonderful conveniences that were supposedly going to make WOW easier and more fun actually distroyed it in many ways.. A cross server LFG destroys the need for a guild.. Why join a guild when you can just push a button and be placed into a group?? I sat and watched people leave my old WOW guild to the point where we didn't have enough people to regularly do a 10 man raid.. All thanks to the LFG system they added.. If you were a tank your wait time was almost none existent, healers would sometimes have about 10 to 20 minutes, and my lock could often still have over an hour to get into a group.. In some cases it was better to just pug..

 

As I have said, there is absolutely no reason to allow AC switching.. It would destroy and limit this game.. I fail to see how anything that would limit this game is a good thing..

Edited March 2, 2012 by MajikMyst

[aznthecapn]

Ac switching as easily as changing talents will eventually happen, they just say "no" for now because from a money making perspective it's still better for them to have people pay for more gametime and reroll a different spec of the same class (because yeah, that's what they are).

 

From a gameplay perspective, however, ac switching should have been there since day 1. It doesn't affect the gameplay in any negative way, only positive ones, especially for small groups of guilds/players. It's just an option and people who want to roll 100 characters can do so regardless.

 

No one can change the devs mind on this. They simply think they make more money this way for the aforementioned reasons, so until at least a few months have passed and everyone has 4-5-6 50s, they won't allow ac switching. But when those conditions will be met, they will, because from a functionality standpoint it makes no sense whatsoever to not be allowed to change ac just as you change your spec.

 

Everyone fooling her/himself into thinking there's any other reason other than money behind the devs stance, like, they're some sort of holy crusaders who think that is evil to change ac because it's a different class and such thoughts have to be purged with fire by the righteous, and prides her/himself for being on "the devs' side" is delusional.

 

Give it time, and it will happen, no matter what the insane roleplayers/community people have to say on the matter.

 

Cross server, dual spec, dungeon tool, color crystals come to mind. If it makes sense from a gameplay/functionality/convenience standpoint, it will happen. Unless money dictates otherwise of course.

 

No. You don't get it. Educate yourself on the topic before posting.

[Gabrielnz]

I really hope that advanced class switches are never allowed but I would like to see in future expansions/content patches the different advanced classes having different story lines. Either that or the same over arching storyline but with different approaches to it.

 

An Agent could either sneak in somewhere as an Op using stealth etc or a Sniper could have to get into a position to eliminate targets as a Sniper would... long ranged.

[Morticoccus]

So basically you guys want a druid?

I've always been more of a shaman player myself, but I like druids too...

[Dayfax]

There are certian things that just destroy the ability to be different in an MMO.. AC switching is one such thing.. Not only does it cut the number of classes in half.. But people will be expected to maintain the tank or healing spec available to them above the spec they really want to play for their own enjoyment.

 

Majik, I think you hit on the reason why the devs don't want to allow AC respects -- because then it'd be readily apparent that there's some really limited choices in the game at a fundamental level.

 

While I kinda like the idea of getting away from paladin or druid style class design, there's only 4 stories per faction in the game.

 

I love my Vanguard, but requiring me to grind out the same quests & the same class story if I want to try Commando healing is, frankly, just stupid.

 

And please, people, don't mention balance. The AC system creates an inordinate amount of DPS specs. Do you really believe those will be balanced? Smugglers and Agents have a whopping 5 DPS specs each.

[Stenrik]

Personally (and this is just speculation) I believe that Legacy will open up the possibility to roll a new AC with accelerated XP, or maybe at a high starter level. Either way it would just require doing the class quest and not much else.

 

However, it would require having a level 50 character of that same base class on your server. So if you have a 50 vanguard you'd be able to get this benefit on a new commando, but not a new jedi knight.

 

It could be sorta like how Death Knights are handled in WoW.

 

Just a thought...

[MajikMyst]

Personally (and this is just speculation) I believe that Legacy will open up the possibility to roll a new AC with accelerated XP, or maybe at a high starter level. Either way it would just require doing the class quest and not much else.

 

However, it would require having a level 50 character of that same base class on your server. So if you have a 50 vanguard you'd be able to get this benefit on a new commando, but not a new jedi knight.

 

It could be sorta like how Death Knights are handled in WoW.

 

Just a thought...

 

I could go for somthing like this if it had the following restrictions.. It couldn't be used to just level any character.. It could only be used to create a chacter of a different AC that you currently have a lvl 50 of.. In other words, if you wanted to use it to create a guardian, you had to have a lvl 50 Sentinel.. If you had a lvl 50 Sentinel, you couldn't use it to speed level a smuggler..

 

Starting at say Nar Shaddaa after a semi brief baby area like the DK's have would be fine I suppose.. There is still some leveling that needs to be done.. So it isn't totally a free ride..

[Autorch]

Generally when evaluating who's out to lunch on a particular issue, I look at who appears to be more intellectually dishonest or clueless. This applies just about everywhere. When one side is misrepresenting the other's arguments, using bad argumentative tactics such as oversimplification, slippery-sloping, appeals to authority, and the like, it's usually a clue as to who's either on the wrong side of history or simply the wrong side of the argument.

 

I'm finding the pro-AC-respec camp to be the more intellectually honest here. The amount of straw men being set up by the other side could consume the entire hay-producing capacity of the Midwestern United States.

[MajikMyst]

Generally when evaluating who's out to lunch on a particular issue, I look at who appears to be more intellectually dishonest or clueless. This applies just about everywhere. When one side is misrepresenting the other's arguments, using bad argumentative tactics such as oversimplification, slippery-sloping, appeals to authority, and the like, it's usually a clue as to who's either on the wrong side of history or simply the wrong side of the argument.

 

I'm finding the pro-AC-respec camp to be the more intellectually honest here. The amount of straw men being set up by the other side could consume the entire hay-producing capacity of the Midwestern United States.

 

This is actually funny.. The Pro-AC camp has yet to make a valid arguement.. They argue what is or isn't a class by using standards that don't exist.. Using examples from other games debunks their arguements easily..

 

There is nothing wrong with a slippery slope arguement.. The fact that you think there is deminishes your credibility in your statements.. Ever heard the saying 'Give them an inch and they take a mile..' Back in the days of the beta.. We originally started out by discussing Dual speccing.. Of course, many of the people knew that if dual speccing was allowed it wouldn't stop there.. The way the game was setup.. AC speccing would be next on the list.. Of course dual speccing was confirmed and AC speccing here we come.. Sometimes the slippery slope arguement just applies.. This is one such issue..

 

The Pro-AC camps arguements are mostly wrapped around the premise that there aren't 16 classes in this game but only 8.. First they can't even see that they shot themselves in the foot by cutting the number of classes in the game by 50%.. People talk about choices, how does this help the choices issues?? The reason they try this arguement is that it is a tougher sell to demand that class changes be allowed.. Which is what they are asking for.. So they attempt to make it more of just a spec change.. Which is intellectually dishonest and a misrepresentation of the facts.. Thanks for noticing..

 

The other tactic they will try is the 'Just allow it once or twice.' arguement.. It doesn't take a genius to realize that if they allow it once or twice, we will be slammed with countless threads about lifting the once or twice limit.. Hence the slippery slope.. Give them an inch and they will take a mile.. So there is a reason that arguement is there.. First, it has already happened.. We aren't talking about dual speccing anymore.. We have all been told it will be added.. We have moved on to AC speccing.. Dual speccing just wasn't enough..

 

You are of course entitled to your opinion.. But.. I can't really give a post like that much credibility when it appears to me you are doing the very thing you are accusing others of doing..

 

The problems with this issue is simple.. There are no guildlines or ruling body that would determine what is or isn't a class in a video game.. Absent that, it is baseless for anyone to attempt to say that their are 8 classes in this game or even 16.. Bioware says their are 16.. So in this sense they are the ruling body.. The other issue is that any guideline would also have to be used against other MMO's of the same type.. Such as WOW.. You can't say that the simularities of two characters means they are not different classes here and not make the same ruling in another game.. Again that is intellectually dishonest.. You can't complain about story or quests.. Sure.. From 1-58, we have a choice of 2 maybe 3 areas we can quest in.. From Outland on, you are pretty much doing the same quests all the way to 85.. You may have some options here and there.. But then WOW doesn't have the story that this game has either.. So again.. An intellectual misrepresentation of the facts.. The arguement of doing quests over is really just nit picking.. It seems that nobody has heard of dailies.. If WOW proved anything it is that people will do the same quests over and over and over and over and over again.. So using the same quests as a basis to determine classhood is rediculous at best since one really has nothing to do with the other..

 

I am sorry you have the opinion that you do..

Edited March 3, 2012 by MajikMyst

[CorellianWannabe]

Warlocks and mages both are casters, use mana, wear the same gear, use the same stats , are strictly DPS as a role, and nobody argues they aren't the same class.. I fail to see how anyone in this game can use basic simularities as a basis to say that the AC's are not classes..

 

So assassination combat and subtlety rogues all play the same then? By your logic they are all different classes as well.

 

2-3 hours of time is a short time in comparison to how long and how many hours we will be playing this game.. So again, I fail to see the basis in complaining about it.. WOW never allowed class changes.. I don't remember seeing to many people asking about it either.. The only real difference was, you chose your class at lvl 0 during character creation and not lvl 10.. I would guess that if we chose our AC during character creation, we wouldn't have to entertain this meaningless arguement all the time.. This wouldn't have become a product of 'We got Bioware to agree to dual speccing, what else can we get??'.. You just have to love the slippery slope mentality.. It has destroyed many a MMO's..

 

Ah the old 'game begins at 50' idea. Hell, who cares if a class isn't viable until 50? You'll spend more time at max level than you did getting there!

 

Dual spec is a horrible idea as well by that logic-pick a role and stick to it. Why should your character be able to change his/her focus with one click?

 

Druids and Paladins really didn't harm WOW until dual speccing and LFG was implemented.. It was much easier to find a group on my Paladin as a tank or healer than it was on my lock.. I can even remember denying some DPS classes on the off chance of needing another tank or healer.. Countless people, like my wife were pushed to different specs that they really didn't want to play.. "ShadowAura' a priest my wife created.. Always destined to be a Shadow priest, hence the name.. Over 90% of the time was a holy priest instead..

 

There are certian things that just destroy the ability to be different in an MMO.. AC switching is one such thing.. Not only does it cut the number of classes in half.. But people will be expected to maintain the tank or healing spec available to them above the spec they really want to play for their own enjoyment..

 

So you admit to punishing players for playing dps classes because you expected them to change roles, then complain that your wife was expected to do that very same thing? How about she got some assertiveness training and said 'I am not a healer'? Barring that she could have rolled a warlock if she wanted DoT-based damage.

 

BTW how do dual spec and respecs help you maintain your difference if people apparently still expect you to play a role your class is capable of but you don't enjoy? I assume you argue against them as well for destroying choice and freedom?

 

The number of classes is already cut in half-a sage and shadow have the same story and same companions, despite being 'totally different'.

 

During the time of BC.. It didn't matter if you were a Paladin or a druid.. You still had just one spec and you were whatever you were.. Guilds made do with that reality.. All these so called wonderful conveniences that were supposedly going to make WOW easier and more fun actually distroyed it in many ways.. A cross server LFG destroys the need for a guild.. Why join a guild when you can just push a button and be placed into a group?? I sat and watched people leave my old WOW guild to the point where we didn't have enough people to regularly do a 10 man raid.. All thanks to the LFG system they added.. If you were a tank your wait time was almost none existent, healers would sometimes have about 10 to 20 minutes, and my lock could often still have over an hour to get into a group.. In some cases it was better to just pug..

 

As I have said, there is absolutely no reason to allow AC switching.. It would destroy and limit this game.. I fail to see how anything that would limit this game is a good thing..

 

Do you want attunements in Old Republic? Getting rid of those supposedly made WoW easier.

 

I'm sorry that players wanting to group outside of your guild schedule destroyed your clique-hopefully you never use the evil LFG option in this game since PUGs are so horrible. Good luck with your guild-may your players all roll hybrid classes or else risk being the benched sniper.

 

BTW the wait times were 1) dungeons require 3 dps for every tank/healer and 2) most people don't want the headache of being blamed for the least little thing that goes wrong.

Hell if anything this game is worse by leaving more dps waiting in queues since you only need 2 rather than 3.

 

It would only destroy the game by not forcing players to level another toon and go through the EXACT same story, thereby not forcing them to pay for another month. Dual specs will already 'force' hybrids to maintain a tank/heal role-you've admitted to forcing players to do that yourself. Talk about destroying the game.. Bioware has already done so.

[Maltra]

No. You don't get it. Educate yourself on the topic before posting.

 

I'm not the one popping in every ac switching thread bringing zero valid arguments to the table and just telling everyone who actually has some insight on the matter or actually makes some valid points that she/he is wrong. That, would be you.

 

Maybe you should follow your own advice, unless you are trolling, which i suspect is the case.