Poogination Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 This has to be the dumbest argument I've ever seen. GW2 has far more potential because it actually innovates. There you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morthis Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 That may be a given, but going back to my WoW comparison, NO ONE was telling ANYONE to PvP as prot before we had Warbringer (charge in combat, break snares with charge). Yet, from 60 vanilla WoW forward, I PvP'd Prot and beat people. The cookie cutter specs would only be a must if most MMO players were good. Since most MMO players are not good, and most are actually laughably terrible, you can play whatever spec you want and still win often as long as you're slightly better than terrible. Except that being the "good" spec is still better. For one, if you do more competitive PvP, nobody is even gonna bother with people who have their special spec that is just not good in PvP. Also, the times when you do run into an actual good PvP player with a proper spec, he'll just proceed to destroy you, and then laugh as he farms you the rest of the match because you decided to use a special spec. There is a reason some specs are considered cookie cutter, and it's not just because everybody else is bad and needs the superior spec to stand a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 You know a lot of Mothers that play SWTOR. Actually I know quite a few.... in our guild we have four families three of the couples play we have a sixty year old Grandmother who you don't want to mess with in a Wazone' We have a Captain in the Airforce and a retired postal worker...oh and my daughter who is ten and a very good healer. That is what makes SWTOR succeed like WoW people from all walks of life are playing....even Anet acknowledged this at Gamescom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Except that being the "good" spec is still better. For one, if you do more competitive PvP, nobody is even gonna bother with people who have their special spec that is just not good in PvP. Also, the times when you do run into an actual good PvP player with a proper spec, he'll just proceed to destroy you, and then laugh as he farms you the rest of the match because you decided to use a special spec. There is a reason some specs are considered cookie cutter, and it's not just because everybody else is bad and needs the superior spec to stand a chance. Yes, having the good spec is better, but when you're beating up 8 year olds you don't need a black belt in karate. Would the black belt make you beat up 8 year old better? Sure. But you'll still win without it. Since the skill level of most MMO players is about equivalent to an 8 year old fighting an adult, you can play what you want. I dunno about you, but I've only ever met one player in MMOs that I would concretely say "You are far, far better than me at this game." The rest are either only slightly better, equal or, mostly, WAY LOWER. And I'm not even that good, but it's AMAZING how terrible most MMO players are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morthis Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Yes, having the good spec is better, but when you're beating up 8 year olds you don't need a black belt in karate. Would the black belt make you beat up 8 year old better? Sure. But you'll still win without it. Since the skill level of most MMO players is about equivalent to an 8 year old fighting an adult, you can play what you want. I dunno about you, but I've only ever met one player in MMOs that I would concretely say "You are far, far better than me at this game." The rest are either only slightly better, equal or, mostly, WAY LOWER. And I'm not even that good, but it's AMAZING how terrible most MMO players are. Yeah but PvP is never filled with just 8 year olds. Then suddenly you run into someone with a purple belt or a green belt (whatever color rankings Karate use, I recall those two being high-ish back when I did it, but it's been forever). If you were in your black belt spec, hey, np, stomp them too. But if you're in your white belt spec, suddenly they'll be beating you, potentially even if you're technically a better player (they just aren't terrible). Now you might say: "Eh it happens, I don't mind", and that's great, but I know personally, that would bug the crap out of me, losing a fight I know I should have easily won if I hadn't played in a "bad" spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mindwormbified Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) People forget that GW2 is not sub based MMO. People don't need to play it for it to "succeed". They just need to buy the box once. Imagine full-scale MMO without "I cancel my sub naow!" threads. Pure gold. It will be success not matter what. Edited February 13, 2012 by Mindwormbified Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xabos Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Hehe... have you thought about it though? How will you level when theres no events going on? Besides PvP i only see the old mob grinding. The events are dynamic and continuous. Think WAR and the public type quests, only they don't "reset" so often, the event morphs to another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigaus Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) The Guild Wars franchise is such a different type of game that I'm going to LOL @ the wave of worn out SW/WoW players looking for their next level cap gear grind treadmill MMO to get their WoW-crack fix... they won't like it. I, for one, loved GW and will love GW2, but the need for actual gaming/twitch skills will limit its appeal... imo. It will not be a game your keyboard turning crowd will enjoy edit: if they want to compete in higher end PvP/PvE... and since there are no monthly fees.. I can play it and continue to sub to another MMO The DDO/Diablo style dungeons in exploration mode are right up my alley. Edited February 13, 2012 by Bigaus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotalKitty Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Simple answer really: The Star Wars universe. The universe has incredible popular appeal and long-lasting popularity. The plot-line is classic and amazing as is the story. They even taught Star Wars as a classic example of an ideal plot/character development in my American lit class in prep school (a pretty preftigious one with preftigious trees and a preftigious wall). Anyways, I'm not talking about the merits of the game. Sure there are problems with it. I"m simply talking about the potential. And that's why I'm sticking around. To give it a shot. A diamond in the rough. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1KM3E0emjg I mean seriously. Yeah yeah the game isn't exactly like the trailers, but I believe the devs are working towards that goal. And man, if it ever gets there, this game will be the mother of all games. So what if they got the universe? If the Devs can't find a way to explot such universe, then what good is it? At this point, BioWare did not exploit and use this great universe they had ahead of them. They spend all the money on voice-acting. Well done, BioWare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Yeah but PvP is never filled with just 8 year olds. Then suddenly you run into someone with a purple belt or a green belt (whatever color rankings Karate use, I recall those two being high-ish back when I did it, but it's been forever). If you were in your black belt spec, hey, np, stomp them too. But if you're in your white belt spec, suddenly they'll be beating you, potentially even if you're technically a better player (they just aren't terrible). Now you might say: "Eh it happens, I don't mind", and that's great, but I know personally, that would bug the crap out of me, losing a fight I know I should have easily won if I hadn't played in a "bad" spec. In my experience, PvP is filled with 8 year olds 99.9% of the time. And it's not like my terrible specs are THAT terrible. They're just atypical. Prot in WoW, for example, was a monster when you learned how to play it, it was just harder to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proto Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 oh **** I just fell out of my chair laughing Same here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khryn Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 But.. but.. GW2 and WoW HAVE EVERYTHING!!!!!1111 This post is blasphemous. GW2 will make you not be able to enjoy any other MMO because of it's extreme perfection! And how dare you challenge the king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zannis Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 You know a lot of Mothers that play SWTOR. There are 3 in my guild at this very moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerokTalram Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 that a whole bunch of stuff they had to do doesn't make all that much sense in Star Wars lore (like people shrugging off being hit by a lightsaber repeatedly). Stop trolling. It's well known that everyone 1 hitting everyone else doesn't work in games like these. Even in Force Unleased, only the normals occasionally dropped to one hit. They use the fantasy model of gaming because there isn't really an alternative. Unless you can give me one that would work. Games structures are like story plots, there's only some many to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itukaaj Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 What I would like SWTOR to add is dynamic events and to have characters decisions to create lasting changes. The story is incomplete if it doesn't matter what you choose. I would like Bioware to start taking it to the next level and make the "world" more dynamic. The continuous world in WOW gives you a sense that things are bigger even though the realms themselves are smaller than the planets but the need to jump into an orbital base to go to s hanger to go to a ship to go to a hanger to go to a shuttle base breaks up the adventure of maybe flirting with a nearby zone and making the game world feel bigger. I would like the existing high level worlds to have more real estate added. The layouts are canyons or obstructed paths. I like Tatooine because I can go in any direction to explore, not for any predesigned game purpose, but for myself. I want more things like that built. I love blasters going off around me. I love the music. I love my lightsaber makes contact with things. I hate that I still have ability delay on overload. That I can't have a stopcasting macro. And that reaction time is crap in PVP. Speed this up. Steal from other games if necessary to learn from how they code this. The combat needs to be more responsive to my microsecond demands because that is what other games have gotten me used to. Keep the visual effects and make them more dynamic. FPS and getting kicked to loading screen is frustrating. Aldo you need to improve client server response in warzones and in Ilum PVP area. It is not epic to have 20 v 20 at 3 FPS and to be mashing AOE to try to farm kills you can't see. Fix these and this game will go from good to epic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) Potential is all very well and good, but it doesn't put food on the table. The devs need to turn such potential into a reality to do that. Many MMO's have had "potential" but often that's all its been, nothing more. Edited February 13, 2012 by Tarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartnyc Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 The Star Wars universe? What's so special about that? Sure the (original) movies were great, but I don't see what's so special about the SW universe in general. It's filled with contradictions and silly things (granted I didn't read the books or anything). From a literary perspective, SW is a masterpiece. Really. You have a flawed hero (Luke) who is easy to relate to. He feels useless, like his life is going nowhere. You have clear dark evil, and clear good (Obi Wan). Luke must constantly choose between good and evil (the same turmoil in all of us). He is faced with a big challenge when his aunt/uncle are killed. Like a big turmoil in our lives. Climax is him against insurmountable odds, 2 photon torpedos against the Death Star. He prevails. And you wonder why people are still obsessed with Star Wars 35 years later? Look how quickly LOTR fanboism died out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomeclipse Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 WvWvW. Scaling DE... and the simple fact that having someone else around won't be a complete nuissance like 'fetch quest' levelling. Other people will be awesome to have around because of cross-profession combos. Not much info out about guilds yet, but it's safe to say it will be the most advanced 'guild system' ever in an MMO. How about we wait and see instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomeclipse Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Many MMO's have had "potential" but often that's all its been, nothing more. Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning is the biggest example of this ever, in the world, solar system & universe. Great game, ***t management Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartnyc Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 This has to be the dumbest argument I've ever seen. GW2 has far more potential because it actually innovates. There you go. Naw. Just as SW hasn't died after 35 years, SWTOR will not die so easily. Seriously, SW fans are probably the most obsessed fans of any genre anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synfoola Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Potential is all very well and good, but it doesn't put food on the table. The devs need to turn such potential into a reality to do that. Many MMO's have had "potential" but often that's all its been, nothing more. This. Age of Conan had potential, too. Head on over to the US forums and see how dead it is even as an F2P game...mainly due to them not attempting to utilize their potential until it was too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning is the biggest example of this ever, in the world, solar system & universe. Great game, ***t management Agreed. VanguardTabula RasaWARAOCSTOAnd many others. All had recognisable "potential". All flopped due to bad management, refusal to listen to players (until it had to bite them in the ***), Edited February 13, 2012 by Tarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) This. Age of Conan had potential, too. Head on over to the US forums and see how dead it is even as an F2P game...mainly due to them not attempting to utilize their potential until it was too late. As much as I like Sillirrion (the AOC Game Director) for his honesty, I had to laugh one day whilst trying to justify their decisions for not doing things in accordance with the wishes of the players, he replied with "we feel that this is the best way". Which is a brilliant example of the level of arrogance shown by investors and dev teams towards a customerbase. And to me, Bioware seem to be already showing a similar level of arrogance. For instance, when someone asked about the possibility of pvp in space combat, a certain representative of bioware (one that isn't actually a developer) responded with "There are other games on the market that do that, it ain't ours.". Thankfully, Mr Ohlen jumped in and was a little more diplomatic with his response and gave a shred of hope to the one asking the question. Edited February 13, 2012 by Tarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthgamer Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Well, everybody knows its true Any decent gamer who is not such an amazing SW fan already quit the game..cause from the game perspective its rubbish. Then why are you still here please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomeclipse Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Which is a brilliant example of the level of arrogance shown by investors and dev teams towards a customerbase. Well they swung the nerf-bat at the Scoundrel pretty quickly after the masses highlighted it, so they listen sometimes..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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