Anelitt Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 "Its lipstick applied to a pick" is a good quote he made that fits this game pretty well imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valethar Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 How far into the future do we have to go to find the '5 years' mentioned in the OP? I've never heard of these clowns, nor has anyone else I play with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaeberain Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 There are lots of things SWTOR has that WoW did not have untill 1-2 X-pacs later. In addition it seems they are pushing content like LFD tools out pretty quickly...much quicker thant WoW did. So your compaison there is invalid tbh. In addition games =/= car companies. SWTOR even with its similarities is VASTLY different from WoW in terms of mechanics. Thus it cannot just port features from WoW over to SWTOR and assume they will work like clockwork. It takes time to refine them and implement them in a way that fits with SWTOR not just WoW. They didn't leave out character animations or quickslots or chat screens. None of the little things that players really want would have been any more difficult to implement than those things. They left them out because they didn't know we would want them this badly. Now they're scrambling to get them in game. They didn't learn from the games that came before TOR. They just used the old SPRPG method and didn't bother thinking about how much different MMOs are. They didn't reinvent the MMO with TOR, for certain, they regressed the genre back to the 90's in all the bad ways and none of the good. None of this matters anyway. This game doesn't have the longevity to need all the little tools that make a MMOers life easier. By the time they get them functional and in-game everyone will have seen all 8 class stories and moved on to the next big game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 They didn't leave out character animations or quickslots or chat screens. None of the little things that players really want would have been any more difficult to implement than those things. They left them out because they didn't know we would want them this badly. Now they're scrambling to get them in game. They didn't learn from the games that came before TOR. They just used the old SPRPG method and didn't bother thinking about how much different MMOs are. They didn't reinvent the MMO with TOR, for certain, they regressed the genre back to the 90's in all the bad ways and none of the good. None of this matters anyway. This game doesn't have the longevity to need all the little tools that make a MMOers life easier. By the time they get them functional and in-game everyone will have seen all 8 class stories and moved on to the next big game. My my my someone is a bit angry.... What are the little things to you? To me being able to que for WZa any time anywhere is awsome. Getting XP from something other than just PvE questing is a welcome feature We have transmog in the way of Item mods...something WoW JUST came out with We have a psudo LFG tool like WoW had in BC and soon we will get a full fleged one I dont really have any complants other than chat bubbles... I find it odd you can look at a game that has been out less than a year and say it is doomed to fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kubernetic Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 One of the most popular MMO blogs for the past 5 years writes a very elaborate and thorough review of Bioware's epic Star Wars project. http://www.wolfsheadonline.com/ Direct link: http://www.wolfsheadonline.com/swtors-300-million-virtual-bridge-to-nowhere/#b5414 Enjoy the good read. I lost interest as soon as I read the line about how "it copied WOW's use of two factions". Anyone who has ever watched or played Star Wars games of any kind know this is a joke. The Original Trilogy was always about the Rebel Alliance versus the Empire. The Prequel Trilogy was always about the Republic versus the Trade Federation. Obviously his bias is too strong to get around. I have no reason to read any more of his writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racheakt Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I lost interest as soon as I read the line about how "it copied WOW's use of two factions". Anyone who has ever watched or played Star Wars games of any kind know this is a joke. The Original Trilogy was always about the Rebel Alliance versus the Empire. The Prequel Trilogy was always about the Republic versus the Trade Federation. Obviously his bias is too strong to get around. I have no reason to read any more of his writing. Not realy, if you follow SW you know the Hutt Cartels are known third faction that employs the services of smugglers and Bounty hunters, and they themselves are largely neutral and would work for any side with money. I think BW took the safe route in making a two faction game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Not realy, if you follow SW you know the Hutt Cartels are known third faction that employs the services of smugglers and Bounty hunters, and they themselves are largely neutral and would work for any side with money. I think BW took the safe route in making a two faction game. The Hutt Cartels do not that that big of a role in the movies. Most people who are not SW junkies know all their SW lore from the movies and thus the Empire and Republic were obvious choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaeberain Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 My my my someone is a bit angry.... What are the little things to you? To me being able to que for WZa any time anywhere is awsome. Getting XP from something other than just PvE questing is a welcome feature We have transmog in the way of Item mods...something WoW JUST came out with We have a psudo LFG tool like WoW had in BC and soon we will get a full fleged one I dont really have any complants other than chat bubbles... I find it odd you can look at a game that has been out less than a year and say it is doomed to fail. None of the things I posted about are why it will fail. It will fail because the basis of this game is self terminating, the story. The story is finite and there's little to nothing to do after the story ends. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansultares Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) No you just agree with his opinion subjective isn't factI do agree with his opinion; I've been espousing several of his points on this very board for weeks now. But my response was in regards to the blogger being butt-hurt that this isn't EQ; that's probably accurate. Anyway, my comment was a dig at the poorly executed rant, but I guess some people are a little too sensitive about this issue. Edited February 13, 2012 by Ansultares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTuloJr Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The article looks like a total hit job. Way too obvious. At least pretend not to be infatuated with other games. A true hit job would have been vastly more appropriately scathing, without providing any information as shocking as revealing the reviewer only went to level 20, and was commenting about game difficulty, rather than mechanics and design. The article was accurate, but the reviewer clearly did not have the proper foundation to make some of their claims. That does not, however, make them any less true. It's like the reviewer came up with the correct answer to a math problem, but did not document the steps which they took to obtain it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTuloJr Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 There are lots of things SWTOR has that WoW did not have untill 1-2 X-pacs later. In addition it seems they are pushing content like LFD tools out pretty quickly...much quicker thant WoW did. So your compaison there is invalid tbh. In addition games =/= car companies. SWTOR even with its similarities is VASTLY different from WoW in terms of mechanics. Thus it cannot just port features from WoW over to SWTOR and assume they will work like clockwork. It takes time to refine them and implement them in a way that fits with SWTOR not just WoW. To paraphrase what you just said, and please correct me if I've misunderstood anything: "But... SWTOR is getting features added faster than WoW did, even though those features weren't in SWTOR at its launch." That's not a valid excuse. They designed and released a game today, to compete with its closest competitor, at the stage of development that its competitor was at 7 years ago. Maybe they'll be able to salvage it, I certainly hope they can, but in anyone's book, that's a monumental failure in management of epic proportions at the budget levels this game was at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 None of the things I posted about are why it will fail. It will fail because the basis of this game is self terminating, the story. The story is finite and there's little to nothing to do after the story ends. End of story. Again...I dont see where people are getting this. In WoW (firstly there is no story in WoW in the sense that SWTOR has) after you hit level cap you can: Run Heroic Run Raids Run PvP In SWTOR after you hit level cap you can: Run Heroics Run Ops Run PvP What about it is self terminating? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asavar Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Never heard of it, won't be clicking the link for lack of care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTuloJr Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 They left them out because they didn't know we would want them this badly. Now they're scrambling to get them in game. They didn't learn from the games that came before TOR. They just used the old SPRPG method and didn't bother thinking about how much different MMOs are. They didn't reinvent the MMO with TOR, for certain, they regressed the genre back to the 90's in all the bad ways and none of the good. Nearly every single major feature request that has hit the boards since early access and launch are a complete rehash of identical feature requests that were posted in the closed beta forums since shortly after closed beta began, over a year prior to launch. BioWare Austin was absolutely told about the deficiencies in their game design and feature set, and not a single major change was made prior to launch at the request of their testers. Game companies very rarely make changes out of the goodness of their kind and generous hearts; they do so because there is a very real money-making or money-saving business requirement for them to do so. Considering that finally, after launch, a lot of major changes have been officially *promised* to us, one has to ask why they're suddenly changing their minds. Especially when we had James Ohlen telling us that they already knew what was best... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 To paraphrase what you just said, and please correct me if I've misunderstood anything: "But... SWTOR is getting features added faster than WoW did, even though those features weren't in SWTOR at its launch." That's not a valid excuse. They designed and released a game today, to compete with its closest competitor, at the stage of development that its competitor was at 7 years ago. Maybe they'll be able to salvage it, I certainly hope they can, but in anyone's book, that's a monumental failure in management of epic proportions at the budget levels this game was at. Not really As I said before, they couldnt just port features over from WoW into SWTOR cause the mechanics of the game are different. Also the features take time to build and implement in the system. Things like LFD tool takes a bit of time to create....thus they couldnt do it at launch. Seeing as how their subs are rising I think they are doing quite a good job at competing... No SWTOR will not kill WoW...again nothing will. But I would not be shocked to see SWTOR as a cosistent #2 in the MMO charts perhaps shooting into #1 after its had the 7years to mature WoW has had. This coming from a guy who playes both and has an 85 of every class in WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krinaman Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 None of the things I posted about are why it will fail. It will fail because the basis of this game is self terminating, the story. The story is finite and there's little to nothing to do after the story ends. End of story. How about adding more story? I'm really not following you at all with this. Every MMO out there shipped with X amount of story and with each expansion they added more story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 How about adding more story? I'm really not following you at all with this. Every MMO out there shipped with X amount of story and with each expansion they added more story. This as well. I think after 3 years of WoW people are under the assumption that you can only progress in an MMO via x-pacs. And since SWTOR will not have an x-pac anytime soon, people think the story we have now is it. They can/will patch in more story as time goes on people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saitada Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 he writes this review as his character is level 20. nuff said. By level 20 you already have a good feel for how the game is. By 30 you know w/o a doubt that it isn't meeting the hype, by 40 you are wondering why you are still playing, and by 50 you quickly realize you love the idea of the game but the implementation is lacking. The game is new, and has potential. But the Hype leaves you let down -vs- the reality. ~Saitada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 By level 20 you already have a good feel for how the game is. By 30 you know w/o a doubt that it isn't meeting the hype, by 40 you are wondering why you are still playing, and by 50 you quickly realize you love the idea of the game but the implementation is lacking. The game is new, and has potential. But the Hype leaves you let down -vs- the reality. ~Saitada At 20? Not really....most classes dont get their main skills till level 25/30. In addition I dont understand the hype you are talking about...seems to me that since subs are on the rise people are quite pleased with the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaeberain Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 How about adding more story? I'm really not following you at all with this. Every MMO out there shipped with X amount of story and with each expansion they added more story. The other MMOs had a little thing called gameplay and endgame content.Some even had a ton of fluff to occupy people after they burned through the main content. Story was just a added bonus not the entire premise of the game. Sure they can add more story but they'll never be able to add it quick enough to keep people playing and paying. If you take this game at face value we all should have just waited for the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTuloJr Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Not really As I said before, they couldnt just port features over from WoW into SWTOR cause the mechanics of the game are different. Also the features take time to build and implement in the system. Things like LFD tool takes a bit of time to create....thus they couldnt do it at launch. Seeing as how their subs are rising I think they are doing quite a good job at competing... No SWTOR will not kill WoW...again nothing will. But I would not be shocked to see SWTOR as a cosistent #2 in the MMO charts perhaps shooting into #1 after its had the 7years to mature WoW has had. This coming from a guy who playes both and has an 85 of every class in WoW. From concept to launch, SWTOR took SIX YEARS to build. If they did it in say, 2 years, I'd agree with you. Not six. Not with the global resources of EA and BioWare behind its development, regardless of it being pigeon-holed into a brand new company (BioWare AUSTIN) that had never published a single game before. They dropped the ball, big time. I know for a fact that it has hurt them in a major way. Perhaps years down the road things will have improved, but I know a lot of my friends have refused to subscribe because of 1) the economy and 2) BWA released a mediocre game with a mediocre and outdated feature set. I know of plenty of others who likewise, know a few dozen people here and there, and in the end, the numbers add up; BWA's arrogance hurt themselves financially, and unless they scramble faster with damage control, it *may* undo them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The other MMOs had a little thing called gameplay and endgame content.Some even had a ton of fluff to occupy people after they burned through the main content. Story was just a added bonus not the entire premise of the game. Sure they can add more story but they'll never be able to add it quick enough to keep people playing and paying. If you take this game at face value we all should have just waited for the book. WoW Endgame content: Heroics Raids PvP SWTOR endgame content: Heroics Ops PvP Am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctimonia Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 From concept to launch, SWTOR took SIX YEARS to build. If they did it in say, 2 years, I'd agree with you. Not six. Not with the global resources of EA and BioWare behind its development, regardless of it being pigeon-holed into a brand new company (BioWare AUSTIN) that had never published a single game before. They dropped the ball, big time. I know for a fact that it has hurt them in a major way. Perhaps years down the road things will have improved, but I know a lot of my friends have refused to subscribe because of 1) the economy and 2) BWA released a mediocre game with a mediocre and outdated feature set. I know of plenty of others who likewise, know a few dozen people here and there, and in the end, the numbers add up; BWA's arrogance hurt themselves financially, and unless they scramble faster with damage control, it *may* undo them. I am glad you know people who know people.... The fact is though that you are not counting the people who are liking this game and getting their friends to join and their friends get other friends to join and so on.... Given the current rise in subs it seems as though you and your friends are a bit outnumbered. BTW how do you know for a "fact" that they have been hurt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I am glad you know people who know people.... The fact is though that you are not counting the people who are liking this game and getting their friends to join and their friends get other friends to join and so on.... Given the current rise in subs it seems as though you and your friends are a bit outnumbered. BTW how do you know for a "fact" that they have been hurt? Because his friends are clearly representative of the worldwide trend. When they start shorting a stock, it's the end of that company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaeberain Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 WoW Endgame content: Heroics Raids PvP SWTOR endgame content: Heroics Ops PvP Am I missing something? You're missing many many things. I'm not going to convince you of anything so I'm not going to try. Just trust me on this. TOR is going to collapse like a supernova and all the forgivers and excusers in the world aren't going to keep it alive. The flaw is of their own design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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