Big wins for casuals! Dual Spec - Cross server

[MalignX]

1) Cross Server DOES introduce you to a larger player base than you were capable of interacting with previously.

 

2) Cross Server DOES allow those with low population servers to experience content without having to reroll, merge, or pay to transfer to another server.

 

3) Cross Server DOES making grouping for Flash Points, Group Quests, and Heroic Group quests infinitely easier than the current mechanics in place.

[Doamy]

I'm back, but after reading and catching up, I do not have anything to really add. All I am seeing is people thinking their opinion is better than the other side, and a general stubbornness.

 

I'm going to leave on this note though: What we argue over here really doesn't matter, it's in Biowares hands and well, anything could happen and when it does, we'll have to live with it.

[Ethern]

We won on both accounts.

 

Now the question is when is that 1.2? March? I'll be back in March then.

[Sky_walkerPL]

I also can write red.

This doesn't make my posts any better than others.

[LogicalPremise]

Thank goodness I'm in a good guild, never ever PUGing again.

 

I'm sorry that all the casuals who can't figure out a decent spec or be bothered to figure out how to use /who like the game moving towards cross-server LFD, but there will be people leaving over that. Makes me giggle, but then again, if 1.2 isn't so awesome that shafts of light rain down from the sky to outline the devs in a holy aura, a lot of people will leave anyway.

 

And when the howling starts that people are acting like the immature , Ritalin-addicted loot monkeys they are, I'm just going to giggle harder.

[Doamy]

1) Cross Server DOES introduce you to a larger player base than you were capable of interacting with previously.

 

2) Cross Server DOES allow those with low population servers to experience content without having to reroll, merge, or pay to transfer to another server.

 

3) Cross Server DOES making grouping for Flash Points, Group Quests, and Heroic Group quests infinitely easier than the current mechanics in place.

 

I lied in my above post about having nothing to add, when this popped up while I was typing

 

1.) True, but depending on how it's implemented, server groups or whatever, you are very unlikely to run into the same people, or if you find friendly people you want to friend and run with again, they're on other servers. So your interactions are limited in time and continuality(sp?) (not to mention who actually interacts and not mindlessly does what they are there for in LFG tools?!)

 

2.) Low pop can already experience content, unless it is so low it should be merged anyway.

 

3.) "DOES making" ? Is that English? Sorry, could not resist. If anything it actually makes Group and Heroic quests harder, as you havn't built any relationships to ask people to help you out for them on your own server... so you'd be spending more time spamming LFG <Heroic quest> more

Edited February 12, 2012 by Doamy

[Thunderslice]

Thank goodness I'm in a good guild, never ever PUGing again.

 

I'm sorry that all the casuals who can't figure out a decent spec or be bothered to figure out how to use /who like the game moving towards cross-server LFD, but there will be people leaving over that. Makes me giggle, but then again, if 1.2 isn't so awesome that shafts of light rain down from the sky to outline the devs in a holy aura, a lot of people will leave anyway.

 

And when the howling starts that people are acting like the immature , Ritalin-addicted loot monkeys they are, I'm just going to giggle harder.

 

 

 

So because I want a lfg, I dont know how to spec or use the /who that NO ONE USES? Pull your head out it must be stuffy in there

[Basiliscus]

Thank goodness I'm in a good guild, never ever PUGing again.

 

I'm sorry that all the casuals who can't figure out a decent spec or be bothered to figure out how to use /who like the game moving towards cross-server LFD, but there will be people leaving over that. Makes me giggle, but then again, if 1.2 isn't so awesome that shafts of light rain down from the sky to outline the devs in a holy aura, a lot of people will leave anyway.

 

And when the howling starts that people are acting like the immature , Ritalin-addicted loot monkeys they are, I'm just going to giggle harder.

 

Where does this sarcasm come from? no one is helped by having an attitude like this.

 

1) not all specs are created equal. Just to name a few A dirty fighting spec is a good spec for mobile fights, where a marks spec would be a liability to the whole group, but on a stationary fight, marks shines. Heal specs in pvp are completely unbalanced for healers, meaning they dont get as many medals as a tank or dps. Good specs are VERY easy to determine in this game, so dont pull that card.

 

2) the /who is very clunky, and I have never seem more than 4-5 people on my server using it at a time, and its mostly for heroic quests that mainly get put together through chat anyway.

Edited February 12, 2012 by Basiliscus

[MalignX]

I lied in my above post about having nothing to add, when this popped up while I was typing

 

1.) True, but depending on how it's implemented, server groups or whatever, you are very unlikely to run into the same people, or if you find friendly people you want to friend and run with again, they're on other servers.

 

Solution: Cross-Server friends/ignore list.

 

2.) Low pop can already experience content, unless it is so low it should be merged anyway.

Who decides what is "so lower it should be merged"? If a Server X's population is just as varied in time schedules/player ability/play style, but has 500 less players than Server Y, does it get to experience the same content consistently enough to make Cross-Server a invalid option?

 

3.) "DOES making" ? Is that English? Sorry, could not resist. If anything it actually makes Group and Heroic quests harder, as you havn't built any relationships to ask people to help you out for them on your own server... so you'd be spending more time spamming LFG <Heroic quest> more

Couldn't resist as we try to have an adult discussion, I understand. How about I get the rest of that statement in English? Cross-Server makes Group and Heroic quests harder because you haven't built any relationships to ask people on your own server to help you? And thus you're spending more time spamming LFG instead of using the Cross-Server tool? Wanna riddle me that again?

 

Since we're being all civil.

Edited February 12, 2012 by MalignX

[Hzakalwe]

On my SWTOR server there is little which could be called a community. The starter areas have some element of community but this disappears on the later planets. The fleets do have some feeling of a community about them but it's flimsy and indistinct.

 

On these forums people argue against an LFD tool in SWTOR on the basis of how the tool impacted in WoW. WoW's LFD tool did make it easier and faster to get a group but there was a negative impact on a server population's sense of being a community, so both sides of the debate have a point - in terms of WoW.

 

But is that same debate relevant to SWTOR? SWTOR's design works against the emergence of a server community spirit because:

 

- it encourages single player play with the class quests, surely the core of the SWTOR experience.

 

- chat on planets is silent 99% of the time (on my server) because people are busy with their class stories and don't need help to progress.

 

- the sharded planets mask any visual sense of a community existing.

 

In WoW the server community feeling was well established when LFD arrived to dilute it. In SWTOR (as I have experienced it) there is no community worthy of the name so there is nothing for an LFD tool to damage.

 

So, in my opinion, an LFD tool in SWTOR would be a positive step because it would allow more people to see the FP content without being forced to move on to the next planet with a log full of FP quests which they never had a chance to do.

[MalignX]

I also can write red.

This doesn't make my posts any better than others.

 

Seeing as you don't add anything to the conversation with anything you post, it doesn't matter what color you do it in.

Edited February 12, 2012 by MalignX

[Doamy]

Answering inside my quote so I cant re-quote easily was mean

 

Solution: Cross-Server friends/ignore list.

 

I don't have faith in Bioware to be able implement something as advanced as a cross-server friends list. the reasoning behind that is a completely different discussion. It's a good solution to the problem though, Kudos.

 

Who decides what is "so lower it should be merged"? If a Server X's population is just as varied in time schedules/player ability/play style, but has 500 less players than Server Y, does it get to experience the same content consistently enough to make Cross-Server a invalid option?

 

Obviously it would have to be a Bioware decision, and they won't merge until they really have to, purely on a PR thing. I was probably being over-zealous on that one, I was more picking on the word "allows" literally meaning it is disallowed/impossible at this present time. It's a strong word to use. "Consistently" on the other hand is subjective. If you take it to mean, anytime the player wants, 24/7, with little to no wait or effort, then LFG is the only way that can be achieved.

 

Couldn't resist as we try to have an adult discussion, I understand. How about I get the rest of that statement in English? Cross-Server makes Group and Heroic quests harder because you haven't built any relationships to ask people on your own server to help you? And thus you're spending more time spamming LFG instead of using the Cross-Server tool? Wanna riddle me that again?

 

That was probably a caffeine rush and run on, sorry. A cross server LFG tool is Flash point based. If you use it all the time you do not create a network of allies. So you have to spam for the server specific Heroic and group quests.

Edited February 12, 2012 by Doamy

[Sky_walkerPL]

On my SWTOR server there is little which could be called a community. The starter areas have some element of community but this disappears on the later planets. The fleets do have some feeling of a community about them but it's flimsy and indistinct.

(...)

But is that same debate relevant to SWTOR? SWTOR's design works against the emergence of a server community spirit because:

It all depends on a server really.

Most of new and under-populated servers suffer the same issue as yours.

BUT majority of old and heavily populated servers (as well as these over-populated) have something exactly opposite with very strong communities, guilds, server events, etc. For you cross-server LFG would be a real blessing. For people on my server it'd be mostly a curse.

 

Everything depends very much on a point of view

Edited February 12, 2012 by LexiCazam
Removed personal attack

[Poisonsenvy]

Best news I've herd since launch. Now they just need to implement those Beta high-end graphics as an ultra setting option and Itemize the EG gear and gear skins. If they do this I'll definitely come back.

 

1. LFD tool.

2. Dual spec.

3. Combatlog

4. Beta Graphics that is currently being used in advertising.

5. End Game gear and Skin Itemization re-vamp.

1-3 is confirmed just need 3 and 4 now and we're good to go. I not coming back until then though. This is nothing but good news.

[MalignX]

Answering inside my quote so I cant re-quote easily was mean

 

Solution: Cross-Server friends/ignore list.

 

I don't have faith in Bioware to be able implement something as advanced as a cross-server friends list. the reasoning behind that is a completely different discussion. It's a good solution to the problem though, Kudos.

 

Who decides what is "so lower it should be merged"? If a Server X's population is just as varied in time schedules/player ability/play style, but has 500 less players than Server Y, does it get to experience the same content consistently enough to make Cross-Server a invalid option?

 

Obviously it would have to be a Bioware decision, and they won't merge until they really have to, purely on a PR thing. I was probably being over-zealous on that one, I was more picking on the word "allows" literally meaning it is disallowedimpossible at this present time. It's a strong word to use. "Consistently" on the other hand is subjective. If you take it to mean, anytime the player wants, 24/7, with little to no wait or effort, then LFG is the only way that can be achieved.

 

Couldn't resist as we try to have an adult discussion, I understand. How about I get the rest of that statement in English? Cross-Server makes Group and Heroic quests harder because you haven't built any relationships to ask people on your own server to help you? And thus you're spending more time spamming LFG instead of using the Cross-Server tool? Wanna riddle me that again?

 

That was probably a caffeine rush and run on, sorry. A cross server LFG tool is Flash point based. If you use it all the time you do not create a network of allies. So you have to spam for the server specific Heroic and group quests.

 

Fair enough. I concede to your point on "consistently" and to the fact that Cross-Server, as I understand it to work now, would not fix planetary groups/heroics.

[Doamy]

For all my anti-cross-sever counter talk, I have to balance it out by saying I'm not against a same server LFG tool and the convenience of the tool itself.

 

I'm just a bit of an idealist on MMO's should be persistent worlds, persistent enemies, persistent allies. Your actions and choices when playing with others should matter. Close knit communities, player-made reputations and infamy.

 

I've said it before in this thread, but the demographic shift, catering to those that don't wish to invest into that MMO premise really took that old complete immersive feel out.

[Arqe]

cross server lfg tool ? game is dying already ... welcome 10 yo kids now you dont even have to speak just press "x" and your group is ready to wipe !

[rzrknight]

I remm they saying they would add LFD cross server , but the game was very young and they wanted to wait a while, that is all.

 

Really this game is a COPY of WoW with lightsabers and blasters , impress me people get surprised by this kind of thing.

 

I for one hate arenas, are they coming? Most likely , devs simple will copy print WoW at some point.

[ProspectorPete]

If they throw up a teleporting, cross server queue LFG system, I'm out of here.

 

See ya, we dont need you.

[Doamy]

I remm they saying they would add LFD cross server , but the game was very young and they wanted to wait a while, that is all.

 

Really this game is a COPY of WoW with lightsabers and blasters , impress me people get surprised by this kind of thing.

 

I for one hate arenas, are they coming? Most likely , devs simple will copy print WoW at some point.

 

God, If they ever add Arena I feel sorry for the Devs. Blizzard openly admitted that adding it in the way they did was a mistake in Hindsight. A game has to be built from th ground up to cater for more competitive pvp, otherwise you are forever balancing classes.

[Ethern]

For all my anti-cross-sever counter talk, I have to balance it out by saying I'm not against a same server LFG tool and the convenience of the tool itself.

 

I'm just a bit of an idealist on MMO's should be persistent worlds, persistent enemies, persistent allies. Your actions and choices when playing with others should matter. Close knit communities, player-made reputations and infamy.

 

I've said it before in this thread, but the demographic shift, catering to those that don't wish to invest into that MMO premise really took that old complete immersive feel out.

Things change. For people who can't take part to such investing activities, the game needs to cater to them as well.

Secondly, creatinng artificial mandatory community requirements to experience the content, excludes many players for no good reasons.

The LFG tool does not disable events, guilds, chat spam, emotes, etc- all those elements that make a community build.

Thirdly the blame is more due to the lack of activities that require a community effort. So far TOR really only has the PvE group content. It's a bad excuse and design to make all the community feeling relying on one playstyle. For people whose main interest is group PvE content, and who could not car less about the community feeling , or can't invest in it, that's punishing them more than what they deserve.

[Anetsetsouken]

This posts hurts my brain to look at. Dual spec is a win for everyone. This has been intended for TOR since before release. Cross server LFD could be useful, but was implemented terribly in WoW. If they incarnate it that badly, I'm outty 5000. Edited February 12, 2012 by Anetsetsouken

[LordSinfury]

If they throw up a teleporting, cross server queue LFG system, I'm out of here.

 

Sorry but I can't wait for it. So why don't you go now and give me all your stuff before you go? lol

[IIII-IIII-IIII]

I argued/debated till I was blue in the face reasons why I was adamantly oppose to a LFG Tool/Cross-Server LFG tool.

 

Now? I think it'd be a welcomed addition. Complete 180 on the topic.

 

I'd still prefer it to be same-server as I'm already starting to recognize Legacy titles, guilds & players and I feel like that adds to the "community" everyone talks about (or at least takes positive steps in building one).

 

However, I want everyone to have fun and be able to play, rather than standing LFG in general chat and/or waiting for friends/guildies to log on to fill out a group.

 

If a modified LFG system is implemented, I hope you can see who's LFG rather than it instantly invited them/you to group. I'd like to be able to round out a group of my choosing classes/AC's/etc.

 

Either way, it's needed and I never thought I'd say that.

[Doamy]

Things change. For people who can't take part to such investing activities, the game needs to cater to them as well.

Secondly, creatinng artificial mandatory community requirements to experience the content, excludes many players for no good reasons.

The LFG tool does not disable events, guilds, chat spam, emotes, etc- all those elements that make a community build.

Thirdly the blame is more due to the lack of activities that require a community effort. So far TOR really only has the PvE group content. It's a bad excuse and design to make all the community feeling relying on one playstyle. For people whose main interest is group PvE content, and who could not car less about the community feeling , or can't invest in it, that's punishing them more than what they deserve.

 

The game, or the Genre itself does not *need* to cater to people who might be better off in facebook gaming. I could probably blame that on blizzard getting greedy and doing a great job of it. They sold out MMO gamers really.

 

Maybe a little dramatic, but i just dont see games truely aimed at giving players that epic experience anymore. It's focused on the formula that will get money. Personally I am holding out to see if Guild Wars 2 lives up to their marketing hype, if not I might just pull out of the watered-down MMO genre for a while.