30Minute LOCKOUT For Deserters

[Tyrias]

No, you're view of reality is that "everyone is out for themselves" because that is the narrow-minded way that you can justify your own narcissistic behavior.

 

You're either young, failed to develop abstract thinking, or have been utterly brainwashed by consumerism. People lived in structured communities, helping each other for 1,000's of years and it is only recently that this society of selfishness has spawned.

 

So, what you're saying is that "only recently this society of selfishness HAS spawned" when you've literally just said that that it is in fact just someone's narrow-minded narcissism justification. They can't BOTH be true.

 

You are correct that in the past, people have been more team-oriented. Hell, even in past MMOs there has been more teamwork and co-operation then in present day ones. But that doesn't change the fact that team-spirit is significantly reduced in current society.

 

I'm not saying it's how it should be, but with most of the PUG players I've played with who have little to no gear or PvP experience, it's how it IS. As a general rule of thumb, people actually interested in PvP will have been doing so while leveling, and will consequently know they need to competitively geared and to work together to achieve victory. And they'll go out of their way to do it.

 

The problem is the people who level to 50, see the PvP gear on the vendors, know they can Solo queue to PvP, and assume that "Hey Presto, I can solo my way to good gear". The lack of team work isn't even ON the side of the veterans, it's on the side of many (obviously not all, and not even necessarily most) of the solo-ers who queue for PvP. Gearaed players/Veterans actively WANT teamwork, because they know it's more fun and results in more wins.

 

As a side note: You do not need to idle to log out of a Warzone. You can simply right click the warzone button next to the mini-map, and select "Leave Warzone". It's not as if the you're abusing a game system to leave, it's a deliberate option. How else do you think people log out "As soon as the first Hutball score is made"?

 

I'm not advocating such behaviour simply on the basis of a first score within 30 seconds (because it could be a fluke or just a bad start), but when you're up against:

 

- a pre-made, while your team is a bunch 13k newbies (note that I don't refer to them as noobs, there is a vast difference),

 

- exploited 8 v 11 odds

 

- working with people who want to play everything like a death-match instead of an objective based scenario

 

what is the incentive to stay? If you want people to stick with awful team, offer them incentives to do so, not penalties for not doing so. If they introduce a desertion penalty in the game in it's current state, Any game like these wont be fun (the main reward for PvP), and it won't be worth anything very much either (the backup-reward). I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me why a player should actually want to stay in that situation?

 

Any suggestion so far about penalties of any kind that I've read in this thread that involve penalising players for leaving will encourage them to stay on, sure. But they won't care about the outcome, and I doubt very much they'll put any effort into being farmed. They're just hide in a corner somewhere and wait it out.

 

At least with no penalty, you do actually get a replacement. With a penalty, you can kiss that goodbye as well.

[Tyrias]

It will solve the issue we have right now. Yes I understand you will hate it, but thats cause you are a leaver.

 

But of course they still need to fix the reason why people are leaving.

 

And they will, its in the patchnotes.

 

So what this really boils down to is:

 

You hate people who leave, so they should fix it so they don't. That will make YOU happy. In doing so, people who don't like being stuck in a dead-end war-zone are forced into something they hate or suffer for it. But that doesn't matter, because you're happier?

 

I fail to see how one is better than the other.

[skyflash]

So what this really boils down to is:

You hate people who leave, so they should fix it so they don't. That will make YOU happy. In doing so, people who don't like being stuck in a dead-end war-zone are forced into something they hate or suffer for it. But that doesn't matter, because you're happier?

I fail to see how one is better than the other.

 

No, everyone will be happier because the group jumping will go away.

 

I hate being stuck in a group as well, but this is for the greater good.

[Tyrias]

No, everyone will be happier because the group jumping will go away.

 

I hate being stuck in a group as well, but this is for the greater good.

 

Everyone wont be happier though. People who have done enough PvP to know the difference between a challenging fight and face-roll will be stuck in a situation that makes them unhappy or will have to suffer the consequences of, God forbid, enjoying their leisure time.

 

You're just trading a bad situation for one group (in which you are a part) for a bad situation for another group. There is really no "greater good" resolution here. The group jumping will go away, but the AFK/leecher population will soar. You'd be replacing one problem with another.

 

A desertion penalty shouldn't even be considered until such time as the main reasons for people WANTING to desert have been addressed. Then I would happily accept a desertion penalty.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Tyrias

[origional]

people who are of high enough valor rank dont gain Anything from a Loss.... valor and coms are maxed, and mean nothing... if they're in a warzone thats looking like a nasty loss... whats the incentive for them too stay?

 

Why should they need an incentive? are you that petty minded that your not prepared to stick around and fight just cos your not going to get a reward at the end?

[skyflash]

You're just trading a bad situation for one group (in which you are a part) for a bad situation for another group. There is really no "greater good" resolution here. The group jumping will go away, but the AFK/leecher population will soar. You'd be replacing one problem with another.

 

Players jumping through groups will ruin more groups than just one.

 

You need to realize that there are players leaving for almost no reason, like a 1:0 or the enemy capturing 2 towers. These players will rotate through groups and taint every group they leave.

 

On my server I see 5 jumpers ruining PvP the whole afternoon. They are in every new group you join, jump in and out of losing groups and just wreck PvP for everyone.

 

A very small number of jumpers will break the whole group finding process.

 

Yes AFK leeching has to be fixed, but there are tons of easy mechanics to fix it, just look to other games. AFK reporting, idle detection, all easy to implement.

[Jesmcalli]

It will solve the issue we have right now. Yes I understand you will hate it, but thats cause you are a leaver.

 

But of course they still need to fix the reason why people are leaving.

 

And they will, its in the patchnotes.

 

Unless those patchnotes are going to fix player skill and basic understanding, then it won't fix anything. People will just AFK instead.

[Menzoberanza]

FIX the mother****ing AFK bot's first THEN I will stay full match... and IF they fix AFK boting then they can ADD DESERTER

[skyflash]

Unless those patchnotes are going to fix player skill and basic understanding, then it won't fix anything. People will just AFK instead.

 

Don't worry, AFKing will soon be punished as well.

 

Both leaving BGs and AFKing BGs will go away and people will just play through a BG or log out and not play their main char at all.

[Tyrias]

Why should they need an incentive? are you that petty minded that your not prepared to stick around and fight just cos your not going to get a reward at the end?

 

Because the Main goal of PvP is fun. If you don't get fun out of something, a reason to do it could be that you get else something worth having instead. If you don't get that either, why would you WANT to stay.

 

Players jumping through groups will ruin more groups than just one.

 

You need to realize that there are players leaving for almost no reason, like a 1:0 or the enemy capturing 2 towers. These players will rotate through groups and taint every group they leave.

 

On my server I see 5 jumpers ruining PvP the whole afternoon. They are in every new group you join, jump in and out of losing groups and just wreck PvP for everyone.

 

A very small number of jumpers will break the whole group finding process.

 

Yes AFK leeching has to be fixed, but there are tons of easy mechanics to fix it, just look to other games. AFK reporting, idle detection, all easy to implement.

 

True, a jumper can ruin multiple games. But that doesn't change what I'm saying. You're still saying "fix jumpers" regardless of the effect it will have on people who don't just jump ship at the first sign of trouble, but are tired enough of the other issues with PvP to not want to sit through yet another trouncing however well they play. It's just not fun.

 

I know how annoying it is when people leave. I used to be a resolute stayer (but then I took an arro.... No, damn you Skyrim, damn you!). It used to frustrate me when people would leave mid-game. It STILL frustrates me when people look at your team, and leave before they have seen what the enemy if fielding. It could end up being a newbie-fest all round, but they don't wait to find out.

 

But after a certain point, you've played enough PvP on your server to get a real feel for which pre-mades are good, and what rough level of ability a Pug will need to compete with them, if possible. You need to play a minute or two of a warzone to know if you're going to have a good match and fun PvP, or if you're just going to get farmed. Once you find out it'll just be an exercise in futility, why stay?

 

A desertion penalty "may" slow down those few that hop several warzones, but it will hurt the real PvP-ers who do it for the fun and not the gear. And whether you agree with me or not, I believe these are the people around whom PvP should really revolve. People who enjoy even battles, and tests of actual skill instead of stoic "tolerance".

[Spartanik]

After reaching rank 60, Valor rank means quite literally Nothing.... So.. Again, why would should i want to endure a disgusting loss? There is no incentive to stay...

Then dont play at all it will make more people happy.

 

to be honest they should have death penalties. just like world of tanks.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Spartanik

[Turlinde]

Honestly if people are leaving your games and you have a full party then perhaps you should look at yourself. Perhaps you might be the reason they are leaving. .

 

LOL. So True. I am Valor 71. 99% of it was earned in Warzones. I can't ever remember anyone leaving a game I was in that was still competitive. When I hear people say "People leave every game I play!" it makes me want to suggest that perhaps they might ask a better player on their server how they can improve.

[Tyrias]

Then dont play at all it will make more people happy.

 

That's exactly what they are doing. The only way to know if something is going to be a absolute walkover for the other team is to start playing. Until better match-making comes in, that's the way it is and will stay.

 

So when they know what is what, they are doing exactly what you are asking them to. They are leaving the Warzone, and not playing.

[Caranel]

I had posted on another thread, but what about letting players choose with warzone to queue for?

 

my copy/paste from other thread:

For some people, like myself, I really dont like Huttball, but I love the 2 other instances: the 3-cannon defend and the Ship seige/defend.

The problem is you cannot queue for a specific instance -- its very random. And once you load, its the only time you can exit that instance. I only leave huttball. For the other 2, I stay whether I am at the very beginning of the instance or at the very end, winning or losing.

 

I just really dont like Huttball. And I dont want to stay and waste my limited online time playing something I dont like.

 

If there will be a way to queue for a specific PVP instance, it may help cases like mine

[Tyrias]

to be honest they should have death penalties. just like world of tanks.

 

Are you genuinely citing World of Tanks as a game with good PvP? That's really not true at all, unless PvP stand for

 

"Premium tanks" vs "People without". Or

 

"People who pay for gold for Platoons" vs "People who don't".

[Spartanik]

That's exactly what they are doing. The only way to know if something is going to be a absolute walkover for the other team is to start playing. Until better match-making comes in, that's the way it is and will stay.

 

So when they know what is what, they are doing exactly what you are asking them to. They are leaving the Warzone, and not playing.

 

you miss understand my meaning. if they want to leave a warzone because they feel their team is gonna lose, then they shouldnd even join teh warzone for starters. That is my meaning, if you dont know how to lose and how to win then you arent being competitive or a good pvpr you are just being selfish and a bratty child.

 

Example, Football macth i would love to see a football player leave his team just because they are losing...

 

Are you genuinely citing World of Tanks as a game with good PvP? That's really not true at all, unless PvP stand for

 

"Premium tanks" vs "People without". Or

 

"People who pay for gold for Platoons" vs "People who don't".

LOL obviously you dont know jack squat about world of tanks since when premium tanks are better? never they only give you good credits. And premium account only give you one thing? its fast grind. You shouldnt talk about things you dont know about.

and world of tanks is agood pvp game, because its exactly what the game is its a "online shooter with tanks" that has a MMO component meaning you grind for new tanks and parts etc, and you do so only in pvp.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Spartanik

[Jesmcalli]

Don't worry, AFKing will soon be punished as well.

 

Both leaving BGs and AFKing BGs will go away and people will just play through a BG or log out and not play their main char at all.

 

All I'm seeing in your posts is " You have gear/experience, you should be *forced* to carry bad/lazy/casual people so they can get gear too!". If *you* have 4-5 people that WZ jump, then that's a server problem, not a game mechanic problem.

[Tyrias]

I had posted on another thread, but what about letting players choose with warzone to queue for?

 

my copy/paste from other thread:

For some people, like myself, I really dont like Huttball, but I love the 2 other instances: the 3-cannon defend and the Ship seige/defend.

The problem is you cannot queue for a specific instance -- its very random. And once you load, its the only time you can exit that instance. I only leave huttball. For the other 2, I stay whether I am at the very beginning of the instance or at the very end, winning or losing.

 

I just really dont like Huttball. And I dont want to stay and waste my limited online time playing something I dont like.

 

If there will be a way to queue for a specific PVP instance, it may help cases like mine

 

Agreed. Or as I posted in another thread (Goodness, there are a lot of threads about the same darned thing), an option to not join underway warzones would be good too.

 

But in regards to the choice of War zone, they said in one of the latest news posts that they won't/can't implement that till they've got cross-server queuing sorted, else there wouldn't be the people to participate properly. So it is a sign that they're at least thinking of it.

[Tyrias]

Example, Football macth i would love to see a football player leave his team just because they are losing...

 

Exactly. That's why they have multiple different leagues and groupings. So that people of "roughly" equivalent skill play against each other, and it self balances itself as time goes on. SWTOR PvP is NOT like football at all.

 

LOL obviously you dont know jack squat about world of tanks since when premium tanks are better? never they only give you good credits. And premium account only give you one thing? its fast grind. You shouldnt talk about things you dont know about.

 

Yep more credits, fast grind so you can get everything faster BY PAYING MONEY. It's a PAID advantage. That is never going to create sensible PvP.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Tyrias

[Valeena]

10-15 minutes is long enough. 30 minutes is too long. Sometimes people DC and they're kicked out of the match, it'd be unfair to those people (and I'm sure even you will rage if you crashed during a Warzone).

[Ossos]

What about WZs where it's 6 vs. 14? How about WZs where people are still hacking doors, or teleporting between the huttball spawn point and the goal line in 2 seconds?

 

THe penalty sounds nice, but until BW actually does ONE THING about Hackers and the like, there is NO reason to stay in a WZ that is being exploited, and/or hacked.

 

Your solution would penalize people for not wanting to play with cheaters.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Ossos

[Spartanik]

Yep more credits, fast grind so you can get everything faster BY PAYING MONEY. It's a PAID advantage. That is never going to create sensible PvP.

But thats it that doesnt afect real gameplay at all mate, if you grind faster and get tier 10 tanks its ok you will only face tier 10 tanks anyway. i dont see any clarity in your theory. The only diference its a person without premium it will take longer to get there, doesnt afect real battles.

my meaning premium only afects your progression in the game doesnt affect battles at all. death penalties would be a good way, or minus valor too. It needs to be something harsh.

 

What about WZs where it's 6 vs. 14? How about WZs where people are still hacking doors, or teleporting between the huttball spawn point and the goal line in 2 seconds?

 

THe penalty sounds nice, but until BW actually does ONE THING about Hackers and the like, there is NO reason to stay in a WZ that is being exploited, and/or hacked.

 

Your solution would penalize people for not wanting to play with cheaters.

That is a good point i will also say that for some reason when the game kicks you when you enter a warzone you were trying to play in teh first place, it sucks, and getting penalties because of that isnt cool. so i guess they need t fix alot of things before even implement something like that.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Spartanik

[Rife]

instead of a lockout it should be a hit to valor. and it needs to be based on how much time you have invested in the warzone.

 

if you leave:

 

before it starts... zero

1-3mins... 1k valor loss

3-5mins... 1.5k

 

so on and so forth

 

this way even at rank 60 if you constantly leave warzones, eventually you will lose that rank

 

 

or maybe even opposite where u lost more at the start and less as it progresses. idk im not smart

Edited February 11, 2012 by Rife

[MiepMiep]

Dont want to play with op, would leave if encountered.

[Jesmcalli]

instead of a lockout it should be a hit to valor. and it needs to be based on how much time you have invested in the warzone.

 

if you leave:

 

before it starts... zero

1-3mins... 1k valor loss

3-5mins... 1.5k

 

so on and so forth

 

this way even at rank 60 if you constantly leave warzones, eventually you will lose that rank

 

 

or maybe even opposite where u lost more at the start and less as it progresses. idk im not smart

 

That's probably the dumbest idea I've seen in this thread. People that have already got to 60 and geared themselves should not be forced to carry undergeared new people if they don't want to.