People are exaggerating the few problems SWTOR has.

[face_hindu]

Not really it was stating more than likely a fact of a T Roll who shouldn't be here.

 

Oh you were announcing your presence, I get it now.

[Fiachsidhe]

Was his point; The game is missing many features and is riddled with bugs?

 

Or perhaps his point was bioware has shown a remarkable ability to not listen to it's customers when implementing any changes? did we really need the strobe light cooldowns?

 

If so I wish, Because though I really enjoy the game I don't let that blind me.

 

Defend bioware to the hilt if you like, maybe I just expect more from my money.

 

His point was that, yes the game has issues, EVERYONE knows it. However, players can't read three posts without someone like you showing up to spray the obvious all over the place as if you think problems are solved in the order of how obnoxiously they're presented. And like someone rang a magic bell above your PC, you show up right on schedule to do your little song and dance act, where you think bringing the same flaws up over and over, is going to get them fixed faster.

 

MOST players deal with the problems, because it is still fun. We understand that Bioware was rushed, but that, when given enough time, they produce gold. So you can either leave and come back when all the kinks are worked out, or you can sit on these boards crying over spilled milk just to make yourself feel better, or you can suck it up and play in spite of the flaws, because what IS there is great.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Fiachsidhe

[Sraom]

After seeing a lot of Tera beta today, and heard a lot about GW2,

I think the problem is that

 

The WoW system is old, not just WoW

[MrOrionQuest]

That's an awfully long way of saying because wow was buggy it's ok for swtor to be.

 

No it's not, that logic makes no sense this is 2012 many many years after wow's release.

 

You want a more accurate comparison, did you play rift at release? do you play rift now? weekly effective patches most released via rolling restarts.

 

That's how you release an mmo. And that this one had a far larger budget just makes the problems more embarrassing.

 

And that's just the bugs not the features we've come to expect from mmo's that are missing.

 

You'd like to compare Rift to SW:TOR, and I'm not trying to defend TOR, rather I'm giving a comparison. And yes, Rift has it's fair share of bugs, as a matter of fact, at release, half the playerbase couldn't play the game. Many people seem to forget this, but there was a major flaw with the game that prevented some people from playing. So major in fact, that Rift, as of a couple months or so ago, just now can claim they've made a profit.

 

Again I go back to raid encounters, and since I've also played Rift competitively, I can already tell you, TOR is far and beyond what Rift did. You want to say how easily Rift released, although half the playerbase couldn't play, outside of the first month, then you add how long queues were, then you add where my expertise lies, with end game competition, and you cannot say Rift did any better, as a matter of fact, without trying to game TOR with an advantage, they have done it better, far better.

 

Endgame on Rift saw 2 actual raids, with fewer bosses. Released after TOR did in timeframe. Even if we look at WoW today, they have 8 bosses at endgame currently, TOR has more than that. Apples to oranges. I'm not trying to promote TOR, but glaring opinions towards content are obviously different. People claim there's no endgame, although we've already had an Operation extension, another Flashpoint, which was only the first of 2 patches, the second of which is coming in March, we've almost had the entire content of both Rift at launch and WoW's current expansion at launch doubled in the same time frame. Nope, no end game.

 

I'm no fanboy, I don't just jump a bandwagon and blindly promote a game, let alone a BioWare game, which I think frankly is a hit-and-miss genre of RPG to go with, but opinion and fact are almost the opposite when it comes to this game, and glaring "haters" aren't very factual.

[darkcerb]

MOST players deal with the problems, because it is still fun. We understand that Bioware was rushed, but that, when given enough time, they produce gold. So you can either leave and come back when all the kinks are worked out, or you can sit on these boards crying over spilled milk just to make yourself feel better, or you can suck it up and play in spite of the flaws, because what IS there is great.

 

Or I can keep complaining until the problems are fixed.

 

Maybe I was spoiled by trions release and maintenance, maybe I expect more from mmo developers now with blizzard and trions constant patches via rolling restarts/hot fixes. Instead of constant down time with no effective fixes.

 

You can go back in game if you don't want to read what I have to say. But don't try to force me to stick my head in the sand too, I don't plan to.

[darkcerb]

You'd like to compare Rift to SW:TOR, and I'm not trying to defend TOR, rather I'm giving a comparison. And yes, Rift has it's fair share of bugs, as a matter of fact, at release, half the playerbase couldn't play the game. Many people seem to forget this, but there was a major flaw with the game that prevented some people from playing. So major in fact, that Rift, as of a couple months or so ago, just now can claim they've made a profit.

 

Again I go back to raid encounters, and since I've also played Rift competitively, I can already tell you, TOR is far and beyond what Rift did. You want to say how easily Rift released, although half the playerbase couldn't play, outside of the first month, then you add how long queues were, then you add where my expertise lies, with end game competition, and you cannot say Rift did any better, as a matter of fact, without trying to game TOR with an advantage, they have done it better, far better.

 

Endgame on Rift saw 2 actual raids, with fewer bosses. Released after TOR did in timeframe. Even if we look at WoW today, they have 8 bosses at endgame currently, TOR has more than that. Apples to oranges. I'm not trying to promote TOR, but glaring opinions towards content are obviously different. People claim there's no endgame, although we've already had an Operation extension, another Flashpoint, which was only the first of 2 patches, the second of which is coming in March, we've almost had the entire content of both Rift at launch and WoW's current expansion at launch doubled in the same time frame. Nope, no end game.

 

I'm no fanboy, I don't just jump a bandwagon and blindly promote a game, let alone a BioWare game, which I think frankly is a hit-and-miss genre of RPG to go with, but opinion and fact are almost the opposite when it comes to this game, and glaring "haters" aren't very factual.

 

So major in fact that when I got the game a week from release I had no problems and hadn't heard of the problem until you mentioned it, but sure I'll take your word for that.

 

Sure the game released with 2 raids with very few bugs and since then theirs been a constant stream of content. That's still more content then the one swtor came with at any rate so I don't really see your point here.

 

And I love the game, And want it to succeed or I wouldn't waste my time here would I?

 

And on the topic of swtor end game, how's the last boss soa is it? still completely bug out every second go? because that's what I'm hearing in game from guilds raiding atm.

[Fiachsidhe]

That's an awfully long way of saying because wow was buggy it's ok for swtor to be.

 

No it's not, that logic makes no sense this is 2012 many many years after wow's release.

 

You want a more accurate comparison, did you play rift at release? do you play rift now? weekly effective patches most released via rolling restarts.

 

That's how you release an mmo. And that this one had a far larger budget just makes the problems more embarrassing.

 

And that's just the bugs not the features we've come to expect from mmo's that are missing.

 

Really? Because I played in Rift's beta and was there for the first two months and there were bugs. In fact one issue that many had to deal with, was the security hole in their forums, that allowed hackers to access your account through the use of the address bar. Due to the hole, they didn't need to even guess your password and waltzed right in. People would be talking to their friends' hackers while they were being cleaned out as GM's were unavailable until it was too late. Do you know what it's like to be taunted by the person hacking and stealing from you while GM's sit out of reach?

People would literally have "log in battles" with hackers until one gave up.

 

Literally thousands were hacked and their accounts drained of equipment and cash. I was locked out for about two weeks.

 

Trion was also criticized for lack of communication, until they started to take hits in subscriptions.

 

All games have issues.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Fiachsidhe

[Fenshire]

I, personally, haven't come across any of these bugs or problems that people on the general forums seem to be plagued with. The fact that the game runs flawlessly for me and I find it incredibly entertaining and fun pretty much invalidates every complaint on this forum for me.

 

I just like to troll the haters.

 

But I do agree with the OP. Most of the issues are blown way out of proportion. All I know is that my server is bustling, my guild loves the game, and I'm always seeing new people playing and applying to the guild. *shrug*

[Candykissesxoxo]

I don't have a problem with bugs myself. I have a problem with bad games though....this game falls under such category.

[gurugeorge]

 

If so I wish, Because though I really enjoy the game I don't let that blind me.

 

Defend bioware to the hilt if you like, maybe I just expect more from my money.

 

So you "really enjoy the game", but you expect more from your money.

 

Uh-huh.

[darkcerb]

So you "really enjoy the game", but you expect more from your money.

 

Uh-huh.

 

Correct.

 

I do enjoy the game or I wouldn't bother posting, but I do expect far more features then are currently here and thankfully they're on route.

 

Cross server pvp and pve, character customization. To name two features the dev's have mentioned recently.

 

I'm not sure where your confusion comes from in regards to my post.

Edited February 11, 2012 by darkcerb

[GalacticKegger]

I don't have a problem with bugs myself. I have a problem with bad games though....this game falls under such category.

Guess it's not your kinda game. What kinda game would that be pray tell?

[Montai]

The bugs aint the problem, the retarded amount of downtime for EU players is. Once a week is acceptable, but 2 or 3 times a week taking down the servers for 3 bug repairs.. **** -.-

[kufa]

My only hope was that I would get to raid from 7-11 three days a week and get the respectable gear that comes with such a time investment and at the same time enjoying a real challenge. It is also part of the fun to see the guild get better and stronger the more you play. Instead everything has been dead since the beginning of January and I have no reason to play the game for now. If I want to see the other class stories I will see them on youtube so I don't have to do mostly the same quests all over again. And no, raiding is a challenge so it's not the same as mindless alt leveling.

[Llann]

People are also exaggerating how fun and innovative this game is.

[GalacticKegger]

Secondly, I am disappointed by the quality of the writing and the plot development of the stories. The class stories are about what I'd expect from any voiced rpg, and nothing more. The side-quest stories are also pedestrian, and I have yet to see one that compares with my favourite quests from, say, Fallout 3.

 

I'm not saying it fails on story; I'm saying it doesn't excel because of story.

Beautious! It's all about personal preference, correct? One man's fart can drop an army but be a woman's perfume? Curious though (and please forgive my ignorance), but isn't Fallout 3 a first person shooter? I'm familiar with apples and oranges comparisons, but ... you lost me. And how does TOR not excel at story? Edited February 11, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[kufa]

People are also exaggerating how fun and innovative this game is.

 

If you remove the dialogues and the star wars name it really isn't that great.

[GalacticKegger]

People are also exaggerating how fun and innovative this game is.

If you remove the dialogues and the star wars name it really isn't that great.

Until they actually play it without being bought out to bash it. What time zone are you folks in? And who cuts your paychecks? Edited February 11, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[kufa]

Until they actually play it without being bought out to bash it. What time zone are you folks in? And who cuts your paychecks?

 

I am one of the Europeans who gets beaten constantly by the dev team. Saturday maintenance that lasts until the afternoon, daily quests that reset at 1pm (no reason to play before 1pm), every maintenance (and there are a lot) is in the middle of the day here, etc. If you add this with the broken endgame it is just to much. I played the game and I loved it until I became 50 and started to raid. Just check my first comments on the forum and you will see for your self. The game isn't that great but it will just take longer time for you to realize that since you don't play as much as others. I was level 50 around Christmas and had killed all raid bosses in the beginning of January. Why should I continue my subscription?

Edited February 11, 2012 by kufa

[zoofar]

-snip-

 

And how does TOR not excel at story?

 

He said it didn't excel (as in overall) because of story. What you think he/she said has a different meaning.

Edited February 11, 2012 by zoofar

[face_hindu]

Beautious! It's all about personal preference, correct? One man's fart can drop an army but be a woman's perfume? Curious though (and please forgive my ignorance), but isn't Fallout 3 a first person shooter? I'm familiar with apples and oranges comparisons, but ... you lost me. And how does TOR not excel at story?

 

I'd say comparing Side Quest in RPG A with Side Quest in RPG B is an acceptable comparison, regardless of POV. You saying it's "apples and oranges" is not a valid argument. If this logical comparison "loses" you, then I don't think we can continue this discussion.

 

I won't go into the childish space-similes which abound in the dialogue (e.g. take a common simile or adage and swap the words out to make them sound "spacey" ("Even the most advanced droid can't make a shimmersilk purse out of a Bantha's ear" is an example of writing so hokey that it could be called puerile). I'm sure I don't have to explain this further.

 

I will, however, humour you with but one example of TOR not excelling at "story".

 

 

In the Jedi Consular class quest, you have the opportunity to murder your Master and, through inaction, cause the deaths of dozens of Jedi Masters. Pursuant to doing this, the Jedi Council awards you with the exclusive title Barsen'thor, which is not only continuity-breaking, but ridiculous plot-wise. RIDICULOUS.

 

[Rigota]

This game doesn't have any issues at all!! and its everything but boring and linear!

You trivialize it.

 

Imo the game is not good from the char selection screen to(and EVERYTHING in between) deep end game.

Edited February 11, 2012 by Rigota

[Setanian]

You'd like to compare Rift to SW:TOR, and I'm not trying to defend TOR, rather I'm giving a comparison. And yes, Rift has it's fair share of bugs, as a matter of fact, at release, half the playerbase couldn't play the game. Many people seem to forget this, but there was a major flaw with the game that prevented some people from playing. So major in fact, that Rift, as of a couple months or so ago, just now can claim they've made a profit.

 

This is somewhat disingenuous. Show me any MMO that has made a profit before it's first few months? It is universally accepted that Rift's release was one of the cleanest in MMO history. Do you deny this?

 

If you want to compare, let's look at ToR. Some 300 million dollars to make, not including the cost of buying the engine. How long do you think it's going to take to make a profit? bear in mind, that 30% of everything goes to the IP, and they have to continue to pay for the current staff and the additional CS staff.

 

Again I go back to raid encounters, and since I've also played Rift competitively, I can already tell you, TOR is far and beyond what Rift did.

 

You say it but you haven't explained why or how.

 

 

You want to say how easily Rift released, although half the playerbase couldn't play, outside of the first month, then you add how long queues were, then you add where my expertise lies, with end game competition, and you cannot say Rift did any better, as a matter of fact, without trying to game TOR with an advantage, they have done it better, far better.

 

How? Just because you've been in end-game does not make you an expert. I've 9 years of end-game content in Everquest. Am I an expert too?

 

What has long queues got to do with end-game content? You cannot argue your point by using everything wrong with any game and then blaming it on end-fame content.

 

 

Endgame on Rift saw 2 actual raids, with fewer bosses. Released after TOR did in timeframe. Even if we look at WoW today, they have 8 bosses at endgame currently, TOR has more than that.

 

And the 8 bosses were all downed within a few nights. You can have 50 bosses but if they're easily defeated they're worthless.

 

Apples to oranges. I'm not trying to promote TOR, but glaring opinions towards content are obviously different. People claim there's no endgame, although we've already had an Operation extension, another Flashpoint, which was only the first of 2 patches, the second of which is coming in March, we've almost had the entire content of both Rift at launch and WoW's current expansion at launch doubled in the same time frame. Nope, no end game.

 

Everything you have said is promotional. The ToR end-game according to many others is dismal, easily won and basically on farm and nothing more than a dps fest. If that's what you call prime end-game content, then I'm afraid, you lack any knowledge of real end-game content. Additionally, I notice how to omit to mention to mention all the other end-ga,e content that has to be bested before you get to the current content on wow.

 

Sure, for the many peeps already finished the last expansion on any game, the new expansion offers little. But don't be so fast to dismiss all the other content that came before it.

 

I'm no fanboy, I don't just jump a bandwagon and blindly promote a game, let alone a BioWare game, which I think frankly is a hit-and-miss genre of RPG to go with, but opinion and fact are almost the opposite when it comes to this game, and glaring "haters" aren't very factual.

 

But that's exactly what you done. And then, called everyone else haters. Rality is reality and the current reality is, ToR what-ever you make of it, is a fledgling MMO with little substance trying to make it in the big world of other MMOs. Right now, it is the flavor of the month because it is new. Because it has such a notable IP behind it, it is of course going to grab a huge player base.

 

The question really is this; Can the IP and presented game out-perform the needs of the many in a genre with such a wide product choice?

 

How long will the IP hold the attention of the current subscriber base? Will players stick with the game just because of the IP?

 

The presentability of the game, if you omit the VO and IP, is lackluster at best. I can point to many games of the 2000-2005 era that were better presented and had far more immersion.

 

The world changes, technology changes, presentation changes and the player-base changes, all the time. To succeed any new offering has to address all those facets of modern gaming. Does ToR do that? I don't think so. Not by a long way.

 

The closest MMO you can compare ToR to is another IP based MMO. Star Trek Online. Again possibly an even bigger IP, and look where that is.

[Necrolepsy]

Is swtor missing almost every decent feature modern mmo's have and that people take for granted? (server transfers/forums/cross server bg's, instances/in game, out of game re-customization) Sure, does it have more bugs then my ant farm? sure. Isn't it missing more graphical configuration then it has? sure.

 

But guys come on...can't we all just accept what we're given without complaint?

 

Wont sticking our heads in the sand be far better then trying to get problems addressed?

 

You could learn to distinguish between "valid complaint" and "forum whining", it'd do you a world of good in the real world.

 

For example:

Sir, you can't sit here, this seating is for restaurant patrons only.

GUY: STOP WHINIUNG FFS

 

^what not to do

 

OI, WHAT THE HELL IS THIS WAITER, THIS CHAIR IS UNCOMFORTABLE, I SAT IN A COMFIER ONE BEFORE, THIS RESTAURANT SUCKS

Waiter: Can you please specify which area of the chair is causing you discomfort?

Guy: GET ME A COMFORTABLE CHAIR NOW OR I QUIT THIS RESTAURANT

 

^what not to do also, but a similar example to forums

[PanikSpreder]

No trolling or flaming intended, by why do people keep playing/levelling if it was such a drag to them then? Anyone with half a brain would do a little research before heading into a game of this size - especially since MMO developers are famous for hyping their own games to oblivion before release, then patch content and features in as we go.

 

Any sane normal person would drop the game when they realize it just bores them or gets to repeatitive. That is probally the reason that only a minority of gamers actually finish the games they are playing (CNN Article I found interesting)

 

Staying sub'ed in hope of them changing/making the game going in a direction they MIGHT like is a little out there in my book. If you like it now, keep sub'ing. If you dont, vote with your wallet and give them clear feedback as to why you stopped. Simple really.

 

I am personally having a good time and can live with the minor problems I have experienced.