Cross Server PVP is BAD...

[Jestersdead]

The bounty hunter missions worked in swg because it was a free roam sandbox, where there were no inaccessible areas outsides of locked out player structures. The BH system would fail on many levels with this game since you can't simply track someone until you kill them. The majority of the time they would be in areas you simply can not access, and for that reason it would be a dead mechanic.

 

Cross server pvp is also good, since you don't have to fight the same 100 people over and over and over.

[LaVolpex]

Because once server start dying off and waiting hours for PvP is good, right?

 

no but they could very well merge it with another server and solve the problem for you without screwing over the servers that are NOT dying off ....get it?

[AMKSED]

no but they could very well merge it with another server and solve the problem for you without screwing over the servers that are NOT dying off ....get it?

 

Or they could just implement cross-server queues and leave it up the the server community themselves if they want to have a community.

[LightAvalon]

I do not understand why the only options are Cross Server PVP or no Cross Server PVP.

 

How about clustering servers? Instead of doing a massive cross server pvp, take 2-3 under populated servers and cluster them. It's a fair compromise imo and they used to do it in DAOC.

[BacklashEH]

Or you could build a system that keeps you in a server que for 15 minutes say, then if still no warzone has popped you get put in the collective one. I'd probably have one collective que for pve severs, and one for pvp servers, as they often don't mix well.

 

For me fast que times are the most important thing in regard to warzones, I could care less about video game drama or server communities. This is a set up that both parties could benefit from though.

[LightAvalon]

@Backlash or anyone

 

Just out of curiosity though, do you ever enjoy fighting the same people though? One thing I dislike about cross server pvp is I never get to fight the same good players I meet. Like hypothetically I meet awesome X player and he beats me. If it's cross server pvp I am probably never going to see him again.

[BacklashEH]

@Backlash or anyone

 

Just out of curiosity though, do you ever enjoy fighting the same people though? One thing I dislike about cross server pvp is I never get to fight the same good players I meet. Like hypothetically I meet awesome X player and he beats me. If it's cross server pvp I am probably never going to see him again.

 

 

 

That's a reason my idea is a best of both worlds sort, you can still get that kind of familiarity, but if your server dies or your rival guild isn't on, you won't have to sit around and wait. On my server it isn't a problem yet, in 6 months though I imagine que times will be much slower than they are now.

 

To answer your question though, if I'm going to do 20 warzones I'd rather run into the same group twice than 4 or 5 times in that span.

[Baaddare]

Everything that the OP suggests only happens in very very small communities. Nothing of which will ever happen in swtor to a meaningful level.

 

Cross server dungeon finders and pvp is needed.

 

It's the truth and people can deny it all day in hopes of creating a perfect community but that will honestly never happen.

 

oh god no no no why ruin a good game like wow did. Since we have a good community, in its infancy, already not sure why you think it will not happen.

[Baaddare]

Cross server kills community. Only helps the selfish who need disposable groups. I like that I recognize the guilds and hopefully the other players from the other side.

 

MMO is successful because players feel like they belong to something.

 

Please don't kill it.

 

Tell me about it i use to be able to go into a wz with my guild and get some heals off. Now when i go in i am the first target right off since the dam pubs figureout I am the healer in our premade. Can't blame them since we do the same.

[Thedownwarddog]

As a long time WoW player enduring each end of the spectrum from when there was no battlegrounds and everyone massed at Southshore/Tarren Mill to same server BG's to Cross Server PVP grouping, I reached the conclusion that pvp matching outside your server is bad in the long run.

 

Yes it resolves queue times; and Blizz implemented it for that purpose only. With the benefit of hindsight I think other solutions should be explored first (which i discuss at the end).

 

In terms of same server pvp - there is alot of value in forming rivalries against guilds or specific players on your opp. faction on the same server. It is a fundamental aspect of faction based MMOs that needs to be nurtured not killed like Blizzard did with the battlegroup concept.

 

BioWare needs to go in the other direction and look at enhancing faction rivalries and I think a bounty system would be a good start.

 

Guilds or other players should be able to place a bounty (or reward) on any player to kill members of a particular guild, or just straight out target a specific player.

 

Making guilds and players KoS (kill on sight), adds interesting dynamics to the game. For example: deciding on which guild to join; Who are they at war with? Will I get smashed levelling an alt because my guild is KoS? If i continue to be a ******, how high can i get my bounty? Can I be the Galaxies Most Wanted? It's all good fun and is player created immersion.

 

Who was that guy that ganked you in Tatooine you vowed revenge on. Post a bounty, get them taken out. The target also gets a game mail when the bounty is collected with details on who placed the bounty, and who collected it. This will further stoke the fire into revenge on revenge. See where its going right....

 

One could earn Most Wanted titles, Bounty Hunter titles, and make a real career of it. The bounty boards at Fleet could have Most Wanted posters or 'last sighted at x town, 3 hours ago' messages. BW could implement crew missions to find players with bounties on their heads and help you track people down.

 

This only works properly if a good level of rivalry can be generated. Same server PvP is the primary mechanism for this IMO.

 

People that "never see the opp. faction when I'm questing" are victims of low server pops. I've played both factions and have identified where BW have tried to engineer open world pvp clashes through quest placement and opposing objectives where Republic have to destroy an item that the Sith mirror quest is trying to protect.

 

It is more of a pop issue than a design issue (although they could design more of it).

 

Firstly we need server pops addressed through server merging, and its more efficient to downsize than link a whole bunch of half empty servers together through some cross server pvp mechanism. Its no good having 100 servers at 10% pop, when you could have 30 servers at 90% pop.

 

They could probably halve the amount of active servers and improve everyones experience.

 

I'd much rather play on a server that is Full than Light, even if sometimes there is a queue, its worth it. The playing experience is very different and it would alleviate boredom for those that can never find groups.

 

I read somewhere that BW's current policy is no cross server pvp. I just hope they stick to it.

 

It's really an issue of expedience over circumstance really though. Some servers are going to have bad communities and while this is a way to fix that, there's really room for both if you ask me. Taking a defensive position with this bounty hunter idea is wrong if you ask me. You should reestablish your position as one of innovation rather than a square peg argument. You can have both! I'm sure at some point Bioware is going to implement world events (or there are ones already and I don't know of them). A stronger basis in the actual world might be the wiser choice. The way to do this mystifies me.

 

However, your bounty hunter choice would make perfect sense. Perhaps a giant server hitlist with rewards for the highest player (level 1 may be formidable) that balance itself for pvp exclusively? Or maybe that the guilds might want to protect this player?

 

The constant rotation would tip gamebalance asway, sure. But that may be the best solution for the time being.

[Baaddare]

Or you could build a system that keeps you in a server que for 15 minutes say, then if still no warzone has popped you get put in the collective one. I'd probably have one collective que for pve severs, and one for pvp servers, as they often don't mix well.

 

For me fast que times are the most important thing in regard to warzones, I could care less about video game drama or server communities. This is a set up that both parties could benefit from though.

 

they have that in effect it is called Huttball. One of the reasons you get mixed teams in huttball or see it alot is to prevent people from just sitting around in ques.

[Archendrus]

Cross server PvP can be good....if you like that quick-match, red team vs. blue team crap that they call PvP nowadays.

[BacklashEH]

they have that in effect it is called Huttball. One of the reasons you get mixed teams in huttball or see it alot is to prevent people from just sitting around in ques.

 

 

 

 

I'd rather wait 15 minutes to fight sith from a different server on an actual pvp map than to suffer through another huttball.

[blakelol]

Cross PvP is kinda destroying the comunity, I agree with that. For PvE they REALLY need to implent a cross server system like WoW. Finding a group for a heroic flash point at 4 am in the morning is IMPOSSIBLE.

 

When they come out with the new competitive pvp, if it's some kind of arena or rated warzones. They will have to put that cross server or it's going to be impossible finding

people at night.

 

If bioware wants to keep their players they will have no choice to make a cross server system.

[Amp_]

I'm against the idea of cross-server in most circumstances. However, there can be a case made for it under certain circumstances, such as 8 vs 8 pre-mades in pvp whenever that comes along. I don't necessarily think cross-server across the board might be a good idea.

 

That being said, I honestly don't think I would mind that much if BioWare did it with SWTOR. Their apprehension at even giving server specific forums tells me that server community is not a priority for them because those are essential to building it.

 

In my opinion, there really isn't much of a community for cross-server whatever to hurt because BioWare didn't care enough from the start to facilitate it. I don't believe a server community exists for most of the players out there.

[rainingcrazy]

Old style wow BG's were not a land of virgins (wait, no, wai......) and honey. They were, all things considered, a pretty rotten place. In regards to this topic, rivalries were fun, but they didn't really exist at max level. It was all about farming pugs because ally outnumbered horde almost 2 to 1. So one side had hour long Q's the other instant Q's. I did get to know some "nice" chaps who had T2 gear and spent 20 minutes in our GY every time I saw them.

 

Your server mileage may have differed but cross-realm should help Q times. Besides, how often, when someone kills us, do we even get the color of the truck, much less the license plate. It's such an impersonal slog fest that it's hard to form rivalries.

[rainingcrazy]

@Backlash or anyone

 

Just out of curiosity though, do you ever enjoy fighting the same people though? One thing I dislike about cross server pvp is I never get to fight the same good players I meet. Like hypothetically I meet awesome X player and he beats me. If it's cross server pvp I am probably never going to see him again.

 

In vanilla WOW, pre 60, I had some of the best rivalries I've ever had in a game. It was a small handful of us against the same guys over and over. Went that way from 39 to 59. At 60 it turned to <insert favorite choice word>. I miss that but I think faction imbalance is a bigger problem.

[Darth-Rammstein]

I'm against cross server pve, but cross server pvp is just fine by me...infact i would prefer cross server pvp and it would make shorter queues and you would meet new people in combat outside of the normal few you get grouped up with.

[_Scattered_]

Made this in another thread, posting here.

 

They make cross-server and I unsub. Every knows everyone and its great, I don't mind the waits (I play off peak repub med pop).

 

Warzones are more competitive when you have built up rivalries with your opponents.

 

AFKers, deserters and ******es are labeled as such and get ostracised, they eventually quit.

 

When you pub you still know most of the poeple you are playing with. You get a sense of comradery, everyone tries hard to win not just get their daily done but to stick it to those imperials.

 

You make friends.

 

If you are good player you earn respect.

 

This stuff is what playing mmo is all about.

[Edgecase]

There's also a variant on cross-server where teams are always from the same server, but the opposing team can be from a different (single) server. Obviously, this only applies to PvP.

[Yare]

In vanilla WOW, pre 60, I had some of the best rivalries I've ever had in a game. It was a small handful of us against the same guys over and over. Went that way from 39 to 59. At 60 it turned to <insert favorite choice word>. I miss that but I think faction imbalance is a bigger problem.

 

There are a bunch of ways they can reduce queue times and fix faction imbalance without resorting to cross server pvp though.

 

 

 

I was one of the people who thought cross-server pvp was the greatest thing ever back when the idea was being kicked around on the WoW forums. Queue times were a bit ridiculous back then and it seemed like a clever way to fix them. As it happened, it ended up killing a lot of the fun of pvp, because though a lot of people here seem to be contemptuous of the term community, it adds a lot of life to pvp when your allies and opponents are people you recognize instead of transients you'll never see again in your life.

 

Also cross server pvp and pve together killed a lot of the ways people build social circles in an mmo.

[Oldgrimm]

Not everyone plays one one of the chosen core-servers with a healthy population, and/or good balance between the fractions.

 

I'm desperately waiting for the cross-server PvP, because not only are the Reps on my server outnumbered by 1:4, they s... so badly in PvP, that I sincerely hope, the i.....quote will be lowered in the games with players from other servers.

 

1. PvP is not fun, if you have to wait ~10-15mins for an open WZ, and if it is finally open to realize, that there is not a full group vs. 8 fullequiped Imps.

And if miraculously you have a full group, then you realize, that you will lose again, because not only have the Imps on my server more people, they also play better.

 

So you are stuck ~4-5h to do your 3 win daily, and that is, for my part, not fun.

 

2. Rivalry: Sorry, but if you want a rival, get some on Ilum.

For me it is exciting to play agains different people, to see different approaches to win the game.

 

For a PvP player now it is important:

 

- that the WZs open quickly. Because in the meantime, you are doing nothing but waiting in the fleetzone.

- that there are everytime enough players to fill up a warzone. To see, that you are starting with 5 vs. 8 enemies, is not fun. Not important how good the 5 are, the 8 from the other team have a big advantage.

- the WZ have to be without fail at the moment, because Ilum in this state is disastrous.

 

And if the people dont want to see Cross-server PvP, thats OK.

But then there has to be servermerges, and that has to be done quickly.

But... servermerges are a confession of failure, so giddy-up and get used to Cross-server PvP.

[Supersaiyanswag]

There is a reason Huttball is the most played warzone. Because it helps alleviate long queue times on servers that are faction imbalanced, which most servers are. I am opposed to cross-server PvP as I have seen what it can do to communities.

 

I played on the Ravenholdt US realm on WoW for many years, it was a very small, very tight knit community. We regularly had server events posted on the forums and everyone knew everyone else on the server, it was quite a good place to play. Now after first cross-server PvP and then the dungeon finder it is a ghost town of a server where no one cares and other players are just means to and end. I would really hate to see the in SWTOR.

 

So back to my early example of Huttball. Right now with my server (and a few others I know people on) Empire heavily outnumbers Republic. So because of that Republic has very short queues and Empire tends to have much longer queues.To help alleviate queue times without cross-server grouping why not make more warzones that allow same faction PvP? Servers with heavy imbalancing would benefit immensely from avoiding long queue times when the other faction isn't playing. You would also have the benefit of now having to play Huttball, again, and again, and again, and again.

 

You still get to know your fellow server mates and actually know your own faction even better. You can create friends and enemies within your own faction, strengthened by the fact that you can chat with/ smack talk them. It wouldn't eliminate all queue times issues but it would greatly help on the more imbalanced servers. Anyone else agree with this idea?

Edited February 10, 2012 by Supersaiyanswag

[Yare]

 

 

So back to my early example of Huttball. Right now with my server (and a few others I know people on) Empire heavily outnumbers Republic. So because of that Republic has very short queues and Empire tends to have much longer queues.To help alleviate queue times without cross-server grouping why not make more warzones that allow same faction PvP? Servers with heavy imbalancing would benefit immensely from avoiding long queue times when the other faction isn't playing. You would also have the benefit of now having to play Huttball, again, and again, and again, and again.

 

You still get to know your fellow server mates and actually know your own faction even better. You can create friends and enemies within your own faction, strengthened by the fact that you can chat with/ smack talk them. It wouldn't eliminate all queue times issues but it would greatly help on the more imbalanced servers. Anyone else agree with this idea?

 

Bioware certainly agrees, according to http://www.swtor.com/blog/new-year%E2%80%99s-pvp-update

[belialle]

 

I played on the Ravenholdt US realm on WoW for many years, it was a very small, very tight knit community. We regularly had server events posted on the forums and everyone knew everyone else on the server, it was quite a good place to play. Now after first cross-server PvP and then the dungeon finder it is a ghost town of a server where no one cares and other players are just means to and end. I would really hate to see the in SWTOR.

 

Exactly. Incidentally, I remember when Ravenholdt was brand new (/wave). I played there for a while, too, and it was a great server. It seems pretty dead now.

 

If cross-server stuff is implemented in this game, I'll just take it as the beginning of the end. It'd be hard for me to find a reason to stick around, honestly. I figure I may as well just restart my WoW accounts if this game is just going to turn into WoW in every single respect.

 

This game is brand new, and it's like people can't wait for BW to rush in and make all the same mistakes Blizzard made.

 

Cross-server = at least one less subscription. I don't expect anyone here to care, but that's how I feel about it. I've been down that road. I know what is there. I don't want to go there again.

Edited February 10, 2012 by belialle