People BAD in pvp

[Yardbird]

While I am sometimes exasperated by people, I try to remember that this simply a form of cheap, passing entertainment. There is nothing intrinsically important about any of this. People will have fun as they wish, regardless of how others demand them to conform.

 

As far as pugs go, sometimes you hit on a good group of guys that tries to compliment each other as a team, or at least are trying to make some kind of difference in some way individually; other times, you just have to do your best in spite of the questionable environment. Don't let it ruin your buzz. This ultimately just another form of wanking.

[izayoinotsuki]

You have to realise that it's not just that some people are bad, it's that they don't give a ****. Some people couldn't care less about some ridiculous American-style football game. They just want to slay the enemy. Edited February 8, 2012 by izayoinotsuki

[Lazorous]

I had a game that went complete south due simply to the lack of inaction of some really bad players.

 

In one round of Alderaan I played my team had just take two turrets. I was healing the group who took the center one and one of my guys asked if the other turret needed help. That team responded they were clear. At this point my turret defenders assume we got a rush coming our way so we buff up ready for action. 10 seconds pass and nothing is incoming. The other turret defenders also haven't typed nothing in chat. It was at this point I got a bad feeling and ran to a point where I could see the other turret.

 

What I saw was the entire opposing team there on the verge of caping the turret. There was nothing we could do to help the one remaining defender. Those 10 seconds 1/2 of our team spent expecting a rush that never came was the difference between winning and losing that match.

 

Needless to say near the end of that match, we 4 center turret defenders had quite a bit of negative things to say to the other 4 players. Not a single one even tried to defend themselves in chat.

 

But the point is that we didn't have one or two bad players. Half the team sucked. Nobody defending the other turret even bothered to take 2 seconds and warn of the danger by typing H or inc in chat.

 

And the worse part of this story ... this was a 50 only game.

 

Oh I hear ya. And simply opening up the map and doing simple math is quite hard for some people. I saw 3 enemies in center, and we're protecting West with 3-4 incoming with just two of us... I look at my map and see 6 of our members on East.

 

That tells me 6 of them were chasing down 1-2 guys while we called a big inc on West, and after a full minute of defending, no one came. If some of them would simply open up their maps and figure, "Hmmm, if we're taking a full minute to chase down this one guy... I wonder where the rest of their team went when West called Inc?", we might have won that game.

 

We just gotta deal with it.

[ForceWelder]

Please, please, PLEASE add premades. Huttball premades = actual Huttball teams/leagues. That's a concept so awesome I almost can't stand it.

 

Also, addressing the titular issue of this thread: I play on Fatman and the warzone PvP there is very enjoyable.

 

The funny thing about this is that all the premades I play with on the Imp side are Huttball premades. They all have the same skill sets. A well geared tank to push the ball, a speed runner to get the ball through obsticles, and a grappler to make up the difference.

 

Not to long ago I was on vent with one such group. They wanted a healer to add to this core group so I got fortunate enough to get in with them. When Huttball popped, this group played it like a violin. They were almost bored. But when the other two warzones popped, they talked about sitting it out or just AFKing the round.

 

Why sit it out? Because their skill sets didn't give them a distinct advantage in Voidstar or Civil War.

 

The funny thing about an official league is that all the premades would be made up of this same group. You would have 1 tank, two runners, and two grapplers. Everyone else would be lightening attackers. Why inquisitors? Because their lightening attacks just chew threw people - regardless of armor.

[skorpius]

Most "pvpers" in this game behave exactly like mobs.

 

First red nameplate = attack, no matter what he's doing or what class he is.

 

Red nameplate attacking me or watching at me funny = aggro him and NEVER EVER change target again until he is dead (or I'm dead). Who cares if I have to run througn an entire enemy group 1 km away from any objective to kill the mother****er.

 

lolol Red =Dead

[Dakan]

I admit this is the first MMO where I really got into PVP and obviously a real newb. The first time I joined a alderaan civil war warzone I have absolutely no idea what to do aside from charging in and trying to take in turrents. Then I played huttball, and again I was useless to my team. But I brushed my lameness aside and just kept on playing.

 

I started observing my teammates, I now look at the map to find out where my teammates are concentrating at etc and I am now paying attention to the chat box. In huttball, I now know where to go and what to do.

 

I rarely break the top 5 of the warzones I am in because I mainly provide support (healing, cc'ing, drawing attention away from the ball carrier, support dps etc). But anything I can do for the team.

 

I will not consider myself competent, I am far from that. I still have much to learn about voidstar tactics and my dueling skills is nothing to write home about. But chugging along (probably having a better time in moving forward to a better goal than in real life:D)

 

I enjoyed playing warzones when there is teamwork, and since in my server the 50's brackets players almost always are the same bunch so we start getting in the zone. I loved the feeling of being able to 6-0 the other team in huttball

 

+1000 for you sir.

 

You were able to admit that you were bad/useless to your team, BUT, you made the effort to learn/listen to get better.

 

Kudos to you.

 

You're the type of PvP'er I want to play with, even if you don't have a lot of experience.

 

At the very least, you want to get better, and most importantly, win.

[Lazorous]

You have to realise that it's not just that some people are bad, it's that they don't give a ****. Some people couldn't care less about some ridiculous American-style football game. They just want to slay the enemy.

 

Still justified in calling them bad.

 

If someone joined a raid and decided to ignore all game mechanics just to pewpew the boss and get killed... I'm going to call him/her bad.

[Dakan]

You have to realise that it's not just that some people are bad, it's that they don't give a ****. Some people couldn't care less about some ridiculous American-style football game. They just want to slay the enemy.

 

This behavior is seen in all three warzones, not just Huttball.

 

Bad players are bad players.

[ForceWelder]

Oh I hear ya. And simply opening up the map and doing simple math is quite hard for some people. I saw 3 enemies in center, and we're protecting West with 3-4 incoming with just two of us... I look at my map and see 6 of our members on East.

 

That tells me 6 of them were chasing down 1-2 guys while we called a big inc on West, and after a full minute of defending, no one came. If some of them would simply open up their maps and figure, "Hmmm, if we're taking a full minute to chase down this one guy... I wonder where the rest of their team went when West called Inc?", we might have won that game.

 

We just gotta deal with it.

 

Sadly, it goes much deeper than that. When you sit at the spawn site and talk strategy, it seems like nobody follows the chosen plan.

 

You tell people to take the east / west turrets and people go after the center. Thus killing your chances of getting two at the bat.

 

Or you tell two people to take left while the rest hit center and you end up 4 and 4 and you still lose the second turret.

 

Hell, as the healer I have even stated in chat for everyone to hit the sides while I keep their team members busy in the center solo only to find at least one other person following me in the center - thus reducing our chances on a second capture.

 

I don't know if it is bad players or if half the freaken people who play this game can't read.

[Lazorous]

Sadly, it goes much deeper than that. When you sit at the spawn site and talk strategy, it seems like nobody follows the chosen plan.

 

You tell people to take the east / west turrets and people go after the center. Thus killing your chances of getting two at the bat.

 

Or you tell two people to take left while the rest hit center and you end up 4 and 4 and you still lose the second turret.

 

Hell, as the healer I have even stated in chat for everyone to hit the sides while I keep their team members busy in the center solo only to find at least one other person following me in the center - thus reducing our chances on a second capture.

 

I don't know if it is bad players or if half the freaken people who play this game can't read.

 

Yep, makes me wonder if some people even attempt to read the OPs chat.

 

It also doesn't help that when you try to explain strategy, you have someone else who believes only "their" strategy will work. So he/she yells out, "No, All rush MID you noob! Then Take West afterwards!". You try to calmly suggest a different approach, or at least try to compromise with one going west if everyone agrees on mid, but the anal retentive player maintains his plan is the only way to win.

 

So of course I was the only one to cap West, while they lost Mid and no East. And the guy gets pissed that I wasn't at Mid and blames me for the loss.

 

This is an extreme case, but not the first where ideas are split and the goals are scattered.

 

We're preaching to the choir here.

[Vegathegreat]

90% of players are laughably bad at PVP.

 

90% of those bad players do not realise they are bad.

 

The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which the unskilled suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly rating their ability much higher than average. This bias is attributed to a metacognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their mistakes.

 

this guy gets it

[Rhogn]

haha...I'll bite. and @OP your situation is not unique.

 

Hutball is always a gong show in pug - the simple concept of passing seems foreign to 1/2 the population.

 

Alderan - I find generally people have ZERO awareness of map and numbers. People don't realize that if you are 6v1 at one part of the map - the rest of their team is about to zerg your node at another location (you don't all have to stay in the area until all red plates are dead when on defence - their respawn is going to attack somewhere else - a few of you can peel off to defend another area). Other pet peeve is the number of games I've lost the lead (and game) where we have 2/3 nodes (in non steam roll match) and get 2 rambos who think its a good idea to go for a 3rd - they usually fail (poor tactics usually goes along with poor skill) and spread thin our defences which usually results in a loss of a node.

 

I wish this game had ingame chat for pugs - other observation is very few people seem to read chat.

[Swijr]

That's why I never care when I end up in the middle of the ranks because I covered the ball carrier or ran around like a chicken with his head cut off on voidstar keeping folks off of doors.

 

Admittingly, I don't consider myself a great pvp'er, but I'm pretty good at WZ's in terms what I need to do. Of course, rage can take over and then it's all about

GRAV ROUND GRAV ROUND GRAV ROUND

DEMO ROUND

CRYO

 

Rinse, repeat.

 

 

Swijr

[Terrestrial]

Gong show.... bahaha. I love the analogy.

 

You always know a game is going to go south when:

 

1. The majority of the 50s in your group are unguided.

 

2. No one responds in ops.

 

3. One of the players appears to be slowly zig zagging toward the corner of your starting spawn to prepare his or her bot program.

 

4. Before the match even begins, you have 50% turnover in player composition in your game and those who come in have well thought out names like wtfpwned.

 

5. No one is interested in the ball carrier or the team carrying the ball carrier.

 

6. Six players go left in Alderaan.

 

7. Five of those six players end up defending a node that is not being attacked.

 

And on and on....

[L-RANDLE]

Here is another example of how horribly bad some players are (Last night I am playing Voidstar. We are the plant team.)

 

 

I see the vast majority Imps going to one side. I use force speed, and make a b-line to the other and go to plant. I get about half way done and two teammates (knight & smuggler) start to plant right besides me.... I am screaming at them, even though they can't hear me, "GO PROTECT ME!!" Use your stuns and snares so I can complete the task. Guess what happens? Boom!!! Imp CC AoE stops all of us.

 

 

This same type of crap happens on Alderaan too. People need to realize that you get more valor, xp, and creds for WINNING!!!! If you care more about staying alive and protecting your teammates, the other stats will follow. If I see a DPSer dying, or being double teamed, I am going to spam heal him and/or force stun the other guy, and probably AoE them both. Why? Because I know that keeping a DPSer alive is more vital than me (Sage) dying. For a DPSer/Tank, they should concentrate on drawing all attackers so they can burst on the other team. If people would stick to these rules PvP would be ALOT better.

 

You also know how I know its going to be a long match? Low levels... If my team has more low levels than high ones, you basically have gimped your team. Regardless of the ratings increase, you don't have access to all your abilities at lvl10-25ish. There should be a greater division between lvl/valor.

[Sporticus]

The irony is, even people who sometimes top the charts at the end of a match can often be considered "bad." Most people just try to kill the nearest enemy or the nearest enemy with the lowest health.

 

I enjoy kiting 3, 4 or even 5 enemy players away from a fight. I take a pounding, but it helps my team win since those players are only attacking ME and not the "important" part of the fight.

 

Not helping your team win is bad. IE., not nuking the ball carrier, not helping defend a turret, etc... Sadly, these are difficult metrics to evaluate.

 

I mean, I don't think there's a metric to show how much damage I've prevented using my taunts. 30% damage reduction can change a fight. It seems as though only "guard" shows up as a deflected damage metric.

 

If they make the rewards for winning a match even greater, this might change. But then all the issues (eg., 11+ man teams) will lead to more epic QQ and some of that might be justified. Although I hate to justify any QQ.

 

Taunt damage reduction is included in the Protection number on the final scoreboard.

[unclekaula]

What bothers me with alderaan is when I'll keep 5 people occupied at mid and get complained at for soloing or 'doing whatever i want' while they worry about 2 people on right. First of all, they shouldnt be going right and second, if theres 5 in mid why are you complaining!

[Varicite]

Guard is the only thing that shows up as protection. All the rest, mass mind control (by taunt, I assume you mean mass mind control or something similar), along with static barrier are considered healing. At least I know barrier is. I pretty sure mass mindcontrol is healing, but I don't play an assassin. Just going by what my guildies say.

 

This is false.

 

Taunts do show up as protection.

 

I play an AP/Pyro hybrid Powertech, and run exclusively in Combustible Cylinder (dps stance). I never, ever use the tank stance (Ion Gas Cylinder) because I fall over like paper and doing so twice as quickly means I am not helping my team twice as much.

 

So I taunt a lot. It is the only way that I can receive Protection medals and debuff enemies.

 

It always have points for Protection, and have always had a Healing score of 0.

 

As I never use Guard, those Protection points could only possibly come from Taunt.

[Rhogn]

 

You always know a game is going to go south when:

 

....

 

 

 

You know its going to go south when....

 

- you join Voidstar in progress, you note 2 other players left OPs group while you were logging into game, you are the attacker in round 1, your team hasn't yet got past first doors and there is 45 secs left in the round (This is true event from last night)

 

 

-other than that anytime I log into Voidstar and hear the room alarm buzzer going, while my screen is still black is usually a bad sign..... I know I'm 99% likely taking the spot of someone who just rage left the defender team that is getting stomped

[Vikassi]

there will always be new players that have to learn huttball -- you were amazing the first time you played it?

[lagwagonn]

I had a guy say I was bad because I had blues, then he strolled over in his full epics and broke my CC while someone was about to cap the turret.

[Nicain]

90% of players are laughably bad at PVP.

 

90% of those bad players do not realise they are bad.

 

The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which the unskilled suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly rating their ability much higher than average. This bias is attributed to a metacognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their mistakes.

 

And 100% of those 90% cry about making gear easier to get, and BW delivered making PVP trivial overall.

 

::suicides::

[Ruuprect]

You know its going to go south when....

 

- you join Voidstar in progress, you note 2 other players left OPs group while you were logging into game, you are the attacker in round 1, your team hasn't yet got past first doors and there is 45 secs left in the round (This is true event from last night)

 

 

-other than that anytime I log into Voidstar and hear the room alarm buzzer going, while my screen is still black is usually a bad sign..... I know I'm 99% likely taking the spot of someone who just rage left the defender team that is getting stomped

 

Lol, this happened to me like 10 times yesterday. I hate when i get there and the match is 1 min from over and they are at the last doors.

 

And the buzzer thing ROFL, I know what you mean.

[Varicite]

And 100% of those 90% cry about making gear easier to get, and BW delivered making PVP trivial overall.

 

::suicides::

 

I was under the impression that the whole point of the pvp gear was so that eventually everyone would attain the same level of gear, thus keeping the playing field relatively even and making the pvp once again about skill, strategy, and knowledge of class/pvp mechanics instead of who has the best gear.

 

Having better stats than everyone else does not make you good at pvp, being better than other people at your class does.

 

There was absolutely nothing "skill-based" or even "time-based" about obtaining gear before the change, it was all about luck, and it was a stupid system. This was a much-needed change.

 

It's ironic that you came into a thread about people being "bad" in pvp just to complain about other people being able to compete somewhat fairly now.

Edited February 8, 2012 by Varicite

[Airoper]

I know what will fix this Problem!