Is BW planning on code optimazation?

[Coffyn]

Has anyone actually said it isn't a problem? Or have we said that of course they're working on it.

 

Perhaps people have downplayed the magnitude of the problem...

[Daeborn]

You can't even spell the word "optimization" and you are criticizing code you've never set eyes on?

You can't possibly be serious.

 

Oh yes he can.

[Jeremy_Saenz]

because on that bag example you can perfectly see the bad coding...

i can also talk about the long planet loading screens, but then i m certain that fanbois will show up and blame it to the hero engine (which probably is partial true)

i cant really tell you which aspect of the game has been coded bad, since i cant look into the source code.. it could be anything or everything nor do i get paid for doing it right?

 

all i / we know is that this game is very ressuorce hungry and i guess noone would deny that one?

 

I'm sure it is being worked on. Optimization is usually a very complicated task and has to pass through multiple teams to be accomplished properly.

 

I have written a few large scale UI libraries for games, and I can tell you that the UI team gets the short end of the stick when it comes to execution time and memory. Project Managers don't want the UI team to keep widgets/windows instances floating around in memory, nor do they want us to take up a load of execution time to do rich UI.

 

In programming UI you can't have it all, so we are left with a bit of a hitch when ui is brought up, and over time when execution times from other modules are optimized (Rendering/Animation/Networking) then the hitch will feel less noticeable.

 

So give it a little time, I think the problem is less of sloppiness and more of the fact that this game is VERY complicated and has a bunch of different teams fighting over runtime resources.

 

Also... try opening up the map in Rift, I always get a hitch

[Cygnusxo]

Thats just an fanboy's defense kicking in to make them feel better bout their precious

 

Agree with you!!!

 

The problem he mention is bad response time between the client and the server. It was mention in other thread and is actually a real problem. I saw a thread from a guy who made a youtube vid about it and it is very clear there is a responsiveness problem with this game.

 

Happen all the time.. i trigger an ability 2-3-4 time before it actually fire off.. When those abilities are heals... it sucks. ;-)

 

my 2 c

 

edit: bah.. quote the wrong guy... another responsiveness problem lol

Edited February 6, 2012 by Cygnusxo

[Daeborn]

I'm sure it is being worked on. Optimization is usually a very complicated task and has to pass through multiple teams to be accomplished properly.

 

I have written a few large scale UI libraries for games, and I can tell you that the UI team gets the short end of the stick when it comes to execution time and memory. Project Managers don't want the UI team to keep widgets/windows instances floating around in memory, nor do they want us to take up a load of execution time to do rich UI.

 

In programming UI you can't have it all, so we are left with a bit of a hitch when ui is brought up, and over time when execution times from other modules are optimized (Rendering/Animation/Networking) then the hitch will feel less noticeable.

 

So give it a little time, I think the problem is less of sloppiness and more of the fact that this game is VERY complicated and has a bunch of different teams fighting over runtime resources.

 

Also... try opening up the map in Rift, I always get a hitch

 

/thread

 

But it's a lot easier to make ignorant statements about code optimization and calling people fanbois then it is to understand the complexities of large applications written to accommodate tens of thousands of system configurations across all sorts of Internet connections from multiple locations around the world and pump all that data the massive databases store to those users.

 

See, it's much easier to just make the ignorant statements about code optimization in the short term. Simple...

Edited February 6, 2012 by Daeborn

[Fantastix]

But it's a lot easier to make ignorant statements about code optimization and calling people fanbois then it is to understand the complexities of large applications written to accommodate tens of thousands of system configurations across all sorts of Internet connections from multiple locations around the world and pump all that data the massive databases store to those users.

 

See, it's much easier to just make the ignorant statements about code optimization in the short term. Simple...

 

are we getting paid for coding or understanding the codes? or do we just want a fluent game that s not gonna eat our computer?

[Qoojo]

It's an ignorant question. Of course they will be looking into improving performance. Every MMO out there worked on it over time. They have already worked on some performance issues.

[Daeborn]

are we getting paid for coding or understanding the codes? or do we just want a fluent game that s not gonna eat our computer?

 

That's a strawman, try again.

[ferroz]

Because everyone's native language is English.

Because people don't make typos on forums.

 

Oh wait...

because spellcheckers aren't embedded in browsers, and haven't been for years.

 

oh wait.

[ferroz]

He was using opening a bag as an example of poorly optimized code. The game shouldn't freeze from using the UI.

Whether the gamefreezes there or not has nothing to do with whether the code is optimized or not...

[Jeremy_Saenz]

are we getting paid for coding or understanding the codes? or do we just want a fluent game that s not gonna eat our computer?

 

You don't need to understand how computers work.

 

Believe it or not I like to make people happy when I can. When I see someone upset because of inflated expectations I try to help by using my knowledge to elaborate on the subject. I hand off my experience of being in the games industry to help clear up issues that people have and demand explanation from BW for.

 

Just helping spread the truth

[tmpearson]

But it's a lot easier to make ignorant statements about code optimization and calling people fanbois then it is to understand the complexities of large applications written to accommodate tens of thousands of system configurations across all sorts of Internet connections from multiple locations around the world and pump all that data the massive databases store to those users.

 

The longest sentence on these forums?

[mattgyver]

I'm not entirely certain why I'd want to repeatedly hit my "I" key to "spam open" my inventory. But, that said...

 

 

 

 

While you've got a certain point about spelling, the more important point is that the OP has a fairly good question.

 

The game is a VERY heavy piece of software. The amount of time it takes for areas to load (note all over the forums complaining about load screens and load wait times), begs the question: ARE they going to at least clean up the code?

 

The amount of time I sit and stare at the monitor while waiting for the game makes it feel very, very, very much like bloatware.

 

So, BioWare, were you planning on doing some code cleanup in the future? It'd probably be of marginal help to the ridiculous wait times some of us experience.

 

I spend more time waiting for areas to load in ToR than I do in:

 

• Star Trek Online
  
• City of Heroes/Villians
  
• Rift
  
• Guild Wars
  
• Forsaken World
  
• DC Universe Online
  
• Lord of the Rings Online
  
• Champions Online
  

 

Don't know about WoW. Don't play it. Wouldn't touch it. I prefer graphics that weren't made for ages 5-10.

 

^ Yep all this. OP brings up a good point. I hope they have a workgroup looking at how to do this while other sections work on content and bug fixes. If I have to choose though, I actually think endgame content should be their #1 priority. Would be great if you felt like the game Started at level 50.

[lunabaguna]

so typos are more important to you than the actual message? alright dude, troll somewhere else

 

Typos in code ruin optimization. I would challange you to try you hand at fixing it, but I'm afraid you would mess it up more.

[Farhall]

I think so. I read an article where they talked about how the majority of people on low end machines were experiencing the most problems, and he mentioned how they have a team constantly working to optimize it.

[mattgyver]

You don't need to understand how computers work.

 

Believe it or not I like to make people happy when I can. When I see someone upset because of inflated expectations I try to help by using my knowledge to elaborate on the subject. I hand off my experience of being in the games industry to help clear up issues that people have and demand explanation from BW for.

 

Just helping spread the truth

 

You know what, I appreciated your posts. It is helpful to get this insight. I wish that the devs would explain it like this, it might help with the angst.

[Napalmbrain]

You are joking right?

 

You seen the way Bioware has handled this mess so far?

 

I would get my hopes up for this, in fact I am certain in their opinion the game is perfectly optimized. You know you cannot trust a company when they will not admit to mistakes even though there is clear evidence.

[Taunque]

A computer that can run BF3 @1920 at high settings over 45 fps should be able to run SWTOR at over 60 fps even with 32+ players onscreen. Right now we have a game that looks worse than BF3 but runs slower? Does not compute.

[Jeremy_Saenz]

You are joking right?

 

You seen the way Bioware has handled this mess so far?

 

I would get my hopes up for this, in fact I am certain in their opinion the game is perfectly optimized. You know you cannot trust a company when they will not admit to mistakes even though there is clear evidence.

 

What do you mean "they will not admit to mistakes"?

 

I have seen numerous forum replies in which Bioware has recognized the performance issues and are addressing them.

 

I think Bioware knows that there are performance issues. Every single game I have shipped I have loathed shipping it at that time because I am a perfectionist at heart and want my game to be perfect.

 

There comes a time to be practical though and that is what I see BW doing.

[Jeremy_Saenz]

A computer that can run BF3 @1920 at high settings over 45 fps should be able to run SWTOR at over 60 fps even with 32+ players onscreen. Right now we have a game that looks worse than BF3 but runs slower? Does not compute.

 

Perhaps fluidity was a higher priority for BF3 because it is a fps?

 

Don't get me wrong I would like to have way better performance for swtor and I can't wait until it comes!

[Gavinhawk]

Actually, he was simply pointing out that your carelessness and lack of attention to detail undermines your position that their code is unoptimized and needs optimization.

 

And I must say, I agree with him. I can't take you seriously on the topic.

 

Because he is providing you a service you paid for and therefore should make sure it is the quality work you are forking out the cash for? Oh wait he is forking out the cash for the game in which his opinion is based. His spelling undermines nothing the point still stands.

[Jeremy_Saenz]

You know what, I appreciated your posts. It is helpful to get this insight. I wish that the devs would explain it like this, it might help with the angst.

 

Much appreciated. It is good to see a glimmer of light here on the forums

[JediRaffa]

Just my 2 cents. I dont have a totally specd out rig but a decent system.

 

For me I did not notice too many performance issues. The load screens, although may seem excessive also did not bother me much.

 

However, once I hit Alderaan, I did start to notice some choppy frame rates while moving along on the taxi/flight mounts.

 

Not sure if its because of that particular planet or something else.

 

But other than that, I have not noticed anything too significant warranting me to stop playing the game.

[ArmchairMagpie]

because on that bag example you can perfectly see the bad coding...

i can also talk about the long planet loading screens, but then i m certain that fanbois will show up and blame it to the hero engine (which probably is partial true)

i cant really tell you which aspect of the game has been coded bad, since i cant look into the source code.. it could be anything or everything nor do i get paid for doing it right?

 

all i / we know is that this game is very ressuorce hungry and i guess noone would deny that one?

 

Even if you could look at it I doubt you'd see at first glance how it is "unoptimized". I don't know your credentials in regards to software engineering but I do have decades of experience myself yet I wouldn't yell at a company to optimize their code because "I know how bad their code is". The least thing a software company wanting to stay in business will do is optimizing and revising their own existing codebase.