Vannila WoW vs SWTOR

[Zuluf]

Why do people insist on comparing tables to chairs?

 

I know what you'll say here. You'll say they copied the base mechanics bit by bit. And you'd be right.

 

But that's like the game's skeleton. Add muscles to it (the lore), a nervous system (synergy between classes and interaction with the game's world), skin tissue (the maps) and you get a fairly different end creature.

 

I think it would be much more constructive to compare vanilla SWTOR to an idealized vanilla SWTOR. I wouldn't care much for a day-night system, but I would like the second boss in D7 to not be bugged. I'd like certain aspects tweaked and certain elements added (granted, some of them would still be borrowed from WoW, like a dual-spec system, but that's only for the sake of efficiency).

 

WoW is a great source of inspiration because it already dealt with issues SWTOR will inevitably face or does already.

[Discollama]

Personally, I like the easter eggs, though I can understand if they went overboard with them. After all, the design team has underwent heavy turnover over the years; one of my issues is that they lost alot of content guys around vanilla release, though more recently I'm sure they've been shifting developers over to Titan.

 

They did a good job porting over locations seen throughout WC3. Pretty much all of the undead zones are great, for example, as is Ashenvale in particular, but in playing WC3 for the first time recently, I noticed even minor locations such as some of the centaur camps seen in the Barrens and Durotar, or some of the Furbolg camps seen in Ashenvale, actually came right out of WC3.

 

They also did a good job filling in where story was lacking. The origin of the dwarves was interesting in vanilla, there was the disappearance of the human king, the whole Blackrock Mountain region with its dungeons and its throwbacks to WC1/2, an extensive story line in the elf zones involving the Naga, practically anything involving demons...I could go on.

 

Some of the zones were just interesting places; I always liked the Hinterlands, or Azshara even when it consisted of only a few quests, Swamp of Sorrows...Dustwallow Marsh is one of my favorite zones of all time, entirely because of one incomplete quest chain.

 

There were more than a few noteworthy locations, including Greymane's Wall, the door to Uldum in Tanaris, Mt. Hyjal, Dalaaran, etc.

 

Thinking back on it, there's two running themes here; alot of the content was incomplete, and much of it was at some point reworked or expanded upon. The biggest difference, though, is that the work was obviously incomplete, not lacking wholly. What that did was leave plenty of room for speculation, and that made the IP really seem to pop.

 

It almost seems odd that because the game was less refined, it seemed more interesting. It makes sense in some ways; certainly as I detailed above, that by being incomplete it left more to the player's imagination, but also in that the developers could put more seeds for future content out than if they spent the time to refine every story line for release.

 

No matter what anyone tells you, TOR has a fractional number of quests compared to vanilla. Stranglethorn alone puts TOR to shame. Even most of the "empty" zones had several quests, or were involved in extensive quest chains.

 

Then they went back to space demons, and the content became easymode, except for the raiding, but I prefer small group over raiding.

 

Mainly in terms of the difficulty of content. Vanilla content was more difficult; more challenging pulls, more threatening patrols, greater need for CC; basically, more need to coordinate as a group. I cancelled towards the tail end of BC, around the time of Sunwell release, without having done any BC raiding, but outside of boss fights most dungeons had grown too simplistic.

 

It really sounds like you haven't gotten very close to end game (Voss for example is full of group pulls) and it also sounds like you haven't done any of the bonus quests or are even just plowing through story quests to get to the next planet. Balmorra on it's own had a TON of missions to complete, then you had the bonus series on top of that (not to mention Belsavis). If you really wanted to though you could just spacebar through the missions, do only class quests and finish catching up in lvl through PvP or space missions. I got done with Voss in a matter of hours just because I did only class quests, but that was because I wanted my last companion and have since gone back to finish up the planet.

 

Basically, everything that you've said tells me that you're not putting forth the effort to really see what the planets are like before you start trashing them for lack of difficulty/missions/whatever else you want to complain about. And WoW did go overboard with it's easter eggs and made them major quest lines in various areas. Not to mention simply not explaining why Horde would help Bronzebeard do anything (let alone discover the origins of the Dwarves) and leaving other stories dead (TotT) or incomplete isn't a good thing. Yes, you can speculate, you can use your imagination if you want to, but ultimately I expect certain things to be answered. This was a big gripe of mine with KOTOR 2.

[Llann]

Original WoW had mods and a combat log.

 

It launched having solved the majority of the bugs they knew about - even a desperate last minute redesign of the warrior class to make it interesting and not dull + OP.

 

It took a genre that was essentially a closed off cult of masochists and opened it up to a much broader audience, casual friendly without being easy.

 

And it had atmosphere in spades. SWTOR has nice static art and some okay animations when they aren't messing up your response times (and if you don't use Slash on your Jedi Knight). Frankly, the voice overs add little to nothing 99% of the time. Hells, one of my favourite BH moments so far has effectively been all text, given that the aliens involved do not speak basic.

 

WoW had story in spades. It just didn't have voiceovers. I still have yet to see a line anywhere in SWTOR to match 'Fools, kill the one in the dress!'

 

The massive, empty/lame trash filled planets, the ludicrous load times, the juvenile writing/humour... nothing really works. Even the space combat is far too easy for most of the missions.

 

Add to that the unbelievable arrogance coming out of some of the design posts - you are NOT remotely as interesting or revolutionary as half-life, my god! - and it's very easy to cultivate deep seated negative feelings about this game.

[Ansultares]

It really sounds like you haven't gotten very close to end game (Voss for example is full of group pulls) and it also sounds like you haven't done any of the bonus quests or are even just plowing through story quests to get to the next planet. Balmorra on it's own had a TON of missions to complete, then you had the bonus series on top of that (not to mention Belsavis).

I did just about every quest available to a Juggernaut, except for some heroics, the Alderaan bonus series, and most flashpoints (I've since gone back and done several of the flashpoints I had skipped).

 

I didn't even know spacebar was an option for the first 40 levels I played.

 

I set out at the beginning trying to find every last bit of content I could; I was not impressed by the lack thereof. Some of the flashpoints are alright; still, they're very simple clears, with little reason to return.

 

Few pulls require CC, often because it's so easy to level past content. Almost none even offer the opportunity to use more advanced pulling techniques, such as LoS pulls; and why should they? There's almost never a risk of agroing a patrol, and if you pull a patrol there's virtually no risk of the patrol agroing an extra pack; patrols themselves also usually have a very short, uninteresting path.

 

Sure, vanilla WoW wasn't totally free of easy pulls, but there are plenty of interesting ones, and the game is far less forgiving of recklessly running in.

 

Not to mention simply not explaining why Horde would help Bronzebeard do anything (let alone discover the origins of the Dwarves) and leaving other stories dead (TotT) or incomplete isn't a good thing. Yes, you can speculate, you can use your imagination if you want to, but ultimately I expect certain things to be answered. This was a big gripe of mine with KOTOR 2.

Am I forgetting something in the five or so years since I last played WoW, or are you referencing content that's been put in since BC?

 

I spit on pretty much anything from BC onwards; BC because I experienced it, and everything after because I've heard it only got worse.

 

Do you mean, why did the Dwarves originally reach a truce with the Horde? I really don't know, though in terms of their stories there was the least amount of overlap.

Edited February 7, 2012 by Ansultares

[Moofausa]

Oh yea because DAY / NIGHT really matters in outerspace.

 

And how do you even know what day/night or how long day/night is on other planets?

[DarthWomprat]

All of that is your opinion

 

No, it's actually quite an objective analysis.

[Discollama]

I did just about every quest available to a Juggernaut, except for some heroics, the Alderaan bonus series, and most flashpoints.

 

I didn't even know spacebar was an option for the first 40 levels I played.

 

I set out at the beginning trying to find every last bit of content I could; I was not impressed by the lack thereof.

 

And in terms of pulls, few pulls require CC, often because it's so easy to level past content. Almost none even offer the opportunity to use more advanced pulling techniques, such as LoS pulls; and why should they? There's almost never a risk of agroing a patrol, and if you pull a patrol there's virtually no risk of the patrol agroing an extra pack; patrols themselves usually have a very short path.

 

Sure, vanilla WoW wasn't totally free of easy pulls, but there are plenty of interesting ones, and the game is far less forgiving of recklessly running in.

 

Am I forgetting something in the five or so years since I last played WoW, or are you referencing content that's been put in since BC?

 

I spit on pretty much anything from BC onwards; BC because I experienced it, and everything after because I've heard it only got worse.

 

Do you mean, why did the Dwarves originally reach a truce with the Horde? I really don't know, though in terms of their stories there's the least amount of overlap.

 

Yeah, that's post vanilla, but I reference it because when you're discussing features of a game at launch and mechanics you can compare what was vs what is now but I honestly don't believe you can do that with story. So many people in this thread have bashed immersion and sited that WoW (not just in the past, but presently) has more immersion for them, however, broken stories completely ruin immersion for me (and I can't see how one could ever immerse themselves into an incomplete or broken story) and offer up examples of how going back to WoW would actually offer less immersion in my opinion. BC wasn't terrible, Wrath had it's moments, but Cataclysm was (and still is) awful and MoP was the straw that broke this camel's back.

 

No game at launch has been without it's warts, but the TOR developers seem to be pushing for fixes and polish quickly (much faster than I expected).

 

Original WoW had mods and a combat log.

 

Combat log would be nice, however I'm actually grateful for a lack of addons. Some UI options would be nice, but DBM never thrilled me, recount is prone to misuse and so is GS. I'd rather have no third party addons than to allow ones that can turn communities against themselves or dumb down game play to the point where there's no effort any more.

[Rogue_Pants]

WOW is now in the list of games I think will always be revered by all those who played it as a first MMO (there were some) I played in the first month of wow and never went back to it till BC, I stuck to eve waiting for alternatives and when I went back to wow I was left with a feeling of utter emptiness as I realised that all it had given me was an understanding of tanking proficiancy and a hole in my wallet. I felt no immersion in it. The storyline was apethetic and I felt I had I wasted nearly 3 years playing a silly game of farming. Flying endlessly round looking for resources to help me fashion gear that was second rate to the gear I already had. Farming heroics for reputation with factions I had no empathy with. Why? Becasue that is what we did.

 

I did think weather and day/night cycles and critters were a nice touch but they were not all vanilla.

 

I couldn't roll on a none full server after release so I am unsure what you meant by your stated solution to not getting in long frustrating queues.

 

I think it right that you should have an opinion but I don't think it is all based on facts, just some rose tinted memories against my glaringly (whatever kind of glasses colours are the oposite to rose coloured ones).

 

I am glad that I played wow, but there is no way that I could ever consider that first month to be pleasant. I love SW and the few bugs I repeatedly come accross at least feel like they are getting attended to (Ilum quest items for the IMP's etc and Correlium datacrones not reachable by the larger BMI types aside) I love hutball, I love finding a giant worm spring out on me while examining a dead body. I love the companions and the interaction with them, the space games, the enviroments the planet hoping (yes I am part of a guild where we interact so occasionally we hop around the planets helping the lowbies or leaarning from the highers) and I can't think of a single thing about vanilla wow that I liked anymore.

 

It is sad I guess that I can only remember the bad things becasue the good things were not good enough to overpower them.

[NasherUK]

WOW did NOT have weather in vanilla, it was added much later. Some time after the first expansion I think. Even then it's not dynamic and limited to specific areas and it doesn't even look that good. Also day/night in wow is pointless as both are equally as bright, only the sky changes. It doesn't surve any purpose.

 

Then wow has other problems, like rubbish crafting which is mostly useless at end-game (appart from potions and enchants). Dull quests and leveling, broken class balance (even after 7 years), content which is now far to simplified and easy. Also even less character custimization than TOR, everyone is the same height, build and you get about 6 faces to pick from.

 

WOW basically took ideas from older MMORPGs, made a big fuss about it and claimed it as their own. Which all their fanbois believed. Right now there is just as much to do at end-game in TOR as there ever was in wow, which didn't have battlegrounds or raids for about a year.

Edited February 7, 2012 by NasherUK

[Ansultares]

however, broken stories completely ruin immersion for me (and I can't see how one could ever immerse themselves into an incomplete or broken story)

I see it more as they had room to grow than that they were broken (and they weren't broken as in bugged, just incomplete).

 

Remember also that at the time, the genre was built heavily on just grinding mobs. WoW was the first to really incorporate heavy questing, as far as I know. So an incomplete story was, at the time, better than no story at all.

 

It was something of a middle ground; heavy questing on top of a world detailed enough that it could just be farmed. I have to give accolades to the developers who did a great job really bringing the story across in the environment.

 

But, for not having the story shoved in your face, you get all kinds of people who think it wasn't there. No surprise that they're also the same ones clamoring for constant new content.

 

No game at launch has been without it's warts, but the TOR developers seem to be pushing for fixes and polish quickly (much faster than I expected).

True, and I personally give BW a 10/10 for release stability, but I think it's easier to recover from some performance issues than a lack of leveling content. They can add all the end-game content they want, but I won't be able to bring myself to level another character without a long break. I'm re-leveling my juggernaut while riding out my remaining subscription, but plan on doing it almost purely through PvP, or flashpoints on occasion.

 

WOW is now in the list of games I think will always be revered by all those who played it as a first MMO (there were some) I played in the first month of wow and never went back to it till BC,

I bought it at release and cancelled after two days to go back to DAoC, then came back six months later.

 

But I don't rose-color WoW; I reserve that luxury for Asheron's Call.

Edited February 7, 2012 by Ansultares

[Arshgeige]

Vanilla WoW is regarded as 2.4.3 and under. All your arguements are invalid. This game was good for the first 10 days then I got bored. You cant say "Maybe if you didnt rush to 50" its an mmo of course people are going to rush to max level, what kind of mmo would it be if people didnt. Biodrones be defending their game to the bottom of the sea.

[Daedricshots]

True, but even plantes in SWTOR feel boxed, and why couldent they make more zones, connected, with different levels here for that matter?

 

I mean, town one + area outside it, clear, move to town to and area outside it, clear, etc etc.

For me it feels tedious and bulky.

 

Too many people want this to be some space copy of wow. Its not. "tedious and bulky"? What is that supposed to mean? I dont want to spend 12 levels on the same planet. Thats what gives this game variety in leveling is the different planets not questing outside a town and just moving further away from said town.

[Klinkster]

Nope.

 

WoW was and still is a kiddy game compared to EQ a the time and in many ways now. It was way easy, even in vanilla version compared to EQ. It was also very different.

 

EQ was always PVE before PVP.. PVP was an afterthought. In WoW is a PVP game, with PVE coming as an almost afterthought. The PVE aspect in WOW is nothing but a method to get you to max level so you can PVP with other max levelers.. and yes PVP sucks donkey balls.

 

EQ had dragons, WoW did not at first...!

 

EQs gameplay and online speak defined MMO up till WoW release.. things like WOOT came from EQ. WoW changed that because of the kiddies. I find it highly frustrating having to explain myself when I say GTG in a group and people say "but we on last boss!".. FFS it means GOOD TO GO! not got to go, and always has meant good to go!

 

Wow introduced the easy MMO for casual players. You could log on WoW play 30 minutes and get something done. In EQ you needed more time to get things done and if you played a few hours a week then you would level up slowly and chances were you would not be max level by the time the next expansion came out. In WoW a few hours a week would easily get you a few levels and get you to max level in a couple of months even in vanilla. I knew players in Everquest who started in 1999 who were not max level in 2002, and that was 2+ expansions into the game...

 

Dungeons in EQ were actually hard and dangerous. In fact there was zones that Customer Support refused/were forbidden to assist players in.. Veeshans Peak. Camping named mobs aka Champions in WoW, was dangerous and getting there could take time. Dieing had huge consequences since you had to corpse run plus the lost experience. In WoW pay a few credits for repair and you were golden. There was simply no death penalty in WoW (or SWTOR).

 

EQ had 72 man raids at the time of WoW release.. WoW had next to no raids and was far less people. You have not raided for real if you have not raided with 72 individuals. Sadly that has been cut to 54 now in EQ.

 

EQ had no "add-ons".. well legal ones. No help, no damage meters in game, no questhelper and all that jazz. You actually had to read the text of the quest NPC and figure out what to do. It was not shown on a map.. hell there were no maps in game! (there is now of course).

 

EQ also had ironically far fewer quests than WoW.. well obvious quests (rumour has it that there are hundreds if not thousands of undiscovered quests still in Everquest.. ). You had to really look for quests, hailing each NPC as they did not then have "QUEST" stamped over their heads. You can say that WoW somewhat improved that part, but it can be debated.

 

And most importantly... EQ had/has an endgame.. WoW did not and does not (nor does SWTOR really since it copied WoW endgame). Once you hit max level in EQ, you had raids to gear up, or champions. You also had alternative advancement abilities aka AAs to improve your character and continue to kill mobs and do quests and so on. And rare in EQ meant/means rare... just ask those Monks camping Raster for their epic piece .. In WoW you did dailies, maybe a few heroics or a raid and then you could log off till everything reset... same for SWTOR btw. Nothing really wants you to stay in the game after you done your "daily" stuff.

 

Basically WoW took players from EQ (and dragons) but very little else. EQ has since taken quite a lot from WoW and implemented, dumbing it down just like WoW, although it is a far bigger challenge raid wise and group wise than WoW will ever be.. not to mention a far far far larger game zone wise. Yes there are load times in EQ.. get over it, it is a 12 year old game after all.

 

How did this thread become a WoW vs EQ discussion??

 

I never played EQ, but most people's complaints back in Vanilla was it was too much of a grindfest so Blizz took it the other way and made it a game for casuals (post TBC). Looks like even Vanilla WoW was for casuals compared to EQ by the picture you paint.

 

Also, WoW did have dragons in Vanilla. Burning steppes? Onyxia?

 

I'm glad the whole game didn't revolve around slaying dragons the whole time.

Edited February 7, 2012 by Klinkster

[KalTorrak]

If you compare Vanilla to Vanilla, WoW = extreme lag with server crashes, SWTOR = EXTREMELY buggy game with stable servers, which would I rather? Probably the first to be honest, server fixes are faster to and easier to fix, SWTOR sometimes feels like it needs a complete rewrite with the engine and other things to fix the current issues, although this wont happen it will just be years worth of patching instead and that will never fix some of the minor and major things wrong with it.

 

For me there are just too many things wrong with it and no I will not go back to WoW, I loved and had such high hopes for SWTOR, the small (and big) things that are wrong with it ruined it for me, yes people say it will be fixed (see above what I already said about that) , also paying for what it feels like a game that should still be in beta with the amount of things I've mentioned wrong with it feels just like a game ruining experience for me.

[Xanthlor]

My only issue with this game is the linear aspect that you are forced more or less to do planets in a certain order with out a lot of variance, Wow did have multiple zones same level so you could have a varity.

[ThiborF]

WoW had night and day.

I'll give you that

 

Weather.

I've seen it rain at least in Dromund Kaas, not sure if I've noted it in other places

 

Music all the time.

While WoW's music was good, it also got monotonous. It's why so many people I know turned off WoW's music and usually had whatever of their own playing in the background.

 

Critters.

Partially true. I've seen mini droids scurrying about on Fleet (that aren't peoples' "pets")

 

Mobs patrolling.

Partial as well. There are mobs that patrol while others are in "guard post" form for last of a better phrase at static spawn points. Haven't seen any that have the lengthy patrol of say that molten giant (names starts with a V I think ... Volcanus maybe?) but some mobs do patrol.

 

Lots of crafting materials to farm... consumables.

I'm guessing you don't craft in this game much. Across 8 characters I've got one of each of the six actual crafting skills and multiples of the gathering/mission ones. There is probably as many different in mats thru level 50 in TOR as there was through the level 60 game in vanilla WoW, if not more. And TOR's system, with re-engineering added in as additional ways to learn upgraded schematics (imo) is superior to WoW's system.

 

Made you walk in the world. Since herbs for many kind of potions, Felwood consumables in an awsome ambient music etc. You even had fish to get in the RL winter and summer etc

 

And guess what? People complained so much about the amount of walking that you now get your first mount much sooner in WoW. And people are already complaining here that you have to wait so long to get Sprint and your first speeder.

 

And as mentioned before, the music was nice, the first few times I heard it. But when I was farming whatever mat in WoW for an hour or two in one zone, believe me it was not left on.

 

And I can't believe you bring up fishing. Until the introduction of archaeology in WoW fishing was the most railed against as the biggest mind numbing profession there was. I had all 10 classes to 85 in WoW ... I had 2 fishers capped and the only reason the second one got there was because of the easy dailies they added in Cata. And if it wasn't for helping out the guild with some of the foods and what not appreciated for raids, I wouldn't probably have done it at all. Still, I get your point about the seasons. Then again ... time of year didn't seem to ever thaw Winterspring, drop snow in Ashenvale, etc etc

 

Dungeons... you had to move in the world, travel.. find enemies.

 

FPs/Heroics/Areas ... quite a few of them requiring a group to do at appropriate level spread out through the leveling process.

Eternity Vault ... Molten Core.

 

No silly loads.

Hey hey what do you know ... a valid point. Though you zoned into dungeons in WoW as well.

 

Well wow didnt had much. But it had immersion with bad graphics but with good colour, music and ambients.

 

Actually WoW was decent at its launch. Not phenomenal as some fanboys wearing rose colored glasses with a +100 nostalgia on them, would have you think. But it was good. And it was fun.

But then so is TOR.

 

SWTOR got nothing of this in 2012 and it still fails at other "simple" important stuff.... like good coding.

 

I would be surprised if you know what good coding for a MMORPG even was. And given that you casually toss out the word "simple" I'm betting you don't do any sort of coding IT type job for a profession, let alone have a clue of the design process behind something as mammoth as a game like TOR.

 

I bet Bioware started to dev this game by making story and maps. Then added the rest.

A sloppy combat system, sloppy world, sloppy weather... sloppy wild life. Sloppy NPC's.

Crap travel system.

 

This game is inferior to vanilla wow... just got better graphics.

That's your opinion but, it sure as heck isn't everyones' But hey, no game is going to be everything to everybody. So you don't like it, find it inferior to another product or simply think it's sloppy ... well hey, guess what? There's plenty of other options out there for you. Even games like UO, EQ, DAoC and AC are still up in running if you want some old school mmorpg design. EVE, STO, DDO, EQ2, AOC, Rift, Aion, Lineage, WAR, etc etc etc ... all still up and running.

 

No.. I don't play wow for many years. I'm just comparing 2 diferent vanilla flavours and I think I prefer the original version.

At least you stated that part as being your opinion. Last I knew, Blizzard would be glad to have you back.

[boobaffet]

You know people are running out of things to whine about when they are whining about no critters in swtor. Edited February 8, 2012 by boobaffet

[Yuuj]

You know people are running things to whine about when they are whining about no critters in swtor.

 

Truth.

[ImpactHound]

People really shouldn't be comparing 2004 WoW to TOR. They should be comparing Rift to TOR, since Rift actually launched earlier in the same year and actually had all the features people have come to expect in MMOs on release.

 

But someone will just post about Rift's declining population and not actually talk about features, like a functioning AH interface, LFG queues, automatic group merging for open world questing (which is amazing, people can't ignore you and you share credit by proximity alone), customizable interface, more fluid combat without delays, multiple talent builds, etc.

[dirtyv]

Yea this is a tired thread. Id say most people even trying to make this comparison did not play WOW upon release. I know I did and I was disappointed and went back to SWG (which at the time was awesome)

 

They didnt have any BG at the time and the questing system was horrible with no real direction. I didnt get a sense of community, poor graphics and animations. Lets not mention that the servers were unstable way worse than SWTOR... it was pretty much pathetic and

 

Their forums looked very similar to the whiny complaints that this one has.

 

SWTOR with all its flaws completely blows day 1 wow out of the water. I dont see how its even close to comperable.

[MajikMyst]

People really shouldn't be comparing 2004 WoW to TOR. They should be comparing Rift to TOR, since Rift actually launched earlier in the same year and actually had all the features people have come to expect in MMOs on release.\.

 

The comparison of WOW and TOR is completely and 100% valid.. Date of release means nothing..

 

Come on now.. We are comparing the two games and the condition that they released in.. Bugs or no bugs.. Featurs or no features.. Content or no content..

 

Microsoft has been making Windows Software since the mid 80's.. Windows 7 still has a service pack?? With almost 30 years of making Windows software.. Why isn't windows bug free and perfect?? Isn't that the logic here?? TOR released in 2011 so it should better?? Better than what?? WOW 2011?? Talk to me when TOR has been out for almost 8 years..

 

WOW and TOR are built on different engines.. So are Rift and TOR.. Rift however isn't built based on the same concept of WOW and TOR.. Many of the mechanics are the same.. We level our characters in both games.. We to some extent choose what they look like.. TOR is completely and rigidly based on story.. WOW is loosely based on story.. PVP is largely the same.. Loot works and is based on the many of the same mechanics.. End game is also largely the same.. We have dailies, battlegrounds, heroics, and raids.. Under different names in TOR.. There is some new stuff.. We have crewskills which work a bit different than professions in WOW.. We also have companions.. Which WOW does not have.. We also have space combat.. WOW does not have a 2nd mode of game play currently available..

 

The comparions of release versions is totally acceptable and accurate.. It would be like comparing the release version of Windows 95 and the release version of Windows Vista.. Both are operating systems and perform many of the same functions.. However both are very different in many ways.. They are also over 10 years apart.. Yet the comparison is still valid..

 

There is nothing wrong with comparing WOW 2004 to STWOR 2011.. Both are release version software.. Any problems and issues in one can be compared in the other.. It is an unfair comparison to compare WOW 2011 and STWOR 2011.. WOW has had almost 8 years of bug fixes, expansion packs, and added features.. TOR has not had that.. If you are expecting TOR to be released with 8 years of evolution, patches, and expansion packs.. Then your expectations are grossly unrealistic..

 

WOW was not a demo for this game.. WOW was not a training ground for this game.. Other than basic mechanics, this game has really nothing in common with WOW.. It is built on a new game engine.. Not one that is almost 8 years old.. WOW had a lot wrong with it when it was released.. So did TOR.. So did any other MMO or game.. So did any other OS.. So did any other program.. Welcome to the realities of release software?? Why do you think they invented patches and service packs??

 

The true comparison here is how fast and how dilegent Bioware is at fixing bugs.. While I may not like all the patch nights.. I can't complain at their efforts to patch and fix the bugs in this game..

Edited February 9, 2012 by MajikMyst

[ANTIBIOTIC]

Ofc not... idnt had pvp.

 

people just raided towns by the dozens and hundreds of people fighting with no honor system even. Was fun and people did it.

 

There was a world, towns and people moved around and organized world pvp.

 

Much better than this **** 3 warzones with worse coded combat system ever.

 

And felt like a game.. with IMMERSION. Swtor got ZERO immersion

 

OP ur lies have alrdy been Pwned leave now with whatever dignity u have left....

 

trolololololololololololol.

 

P.S if u call text quests backface , immersion , then trolololololololololol.

Edited February 9, 2012 by ANTIBIOTIC

[Rigermortis]

Actually, WOW didn't have weather until patch 1.8 I think. It definitely did not have it at release.

 

**Edit Googled it, and it was actually 1.10 for the weather. 10 patches AFTER the release.

 

I remember when it came in I was like "finally".

 

It's a funny topic this because it reminds me of how I felt when I started playing WoW after EQ 2. I thought WoW was pretty buggy at the time and lacking what I believed to be some very basic features. I also felt the graphics were sub par.

 

I never thought I'd see the day when a new MMO would be compared to the WoW feature set.

 

As far as SWToR is concerned I find a very polished game at release comparatively. The story telling and quest lines are comparable to a standalone RPG.

 

I don't just mean the cut scenes, I mean the dialogue options and the ability to change outcomes and quest options by choices you make in a fairly fundamental way. Something almost completely absent in WoW when it was released.

 

Edit:

 

As far as comparing SWToR with Rift I think both games had very good launches. Probably pretty equal though the RPG elements of SWToR are better than RIFT IMO and the Instancing and world engagement better in RIFT than SWToR. If anything SWToR is like WoW compared to Rift being more an EQ. Rift looks better on paper and has more features and better graphics but SWToR has more soul.

Edited February 9, 2012 by Rigermortis

[Decreed]

Lots of crafting materials to farm... .

 

 

Glad you bought that up, I recall never ending loot lag on nodes and having to ALT F4 lol.

 

least two people can click on ***** in this game!

 

Such short memories some people have, wow was no where near as polished as swtor at launch, and had far less to do.

[Ansultares]

P.S if u call text quests backface , immersion , then trolololololololololol.

The environment itself was more immersive.

 

Better designed, deeper lore, etc.

 

TOR... not so much. Take out the cinematics and the game is a complete joke. Leave it to fanboys to hype the cinematics.

 

I caught some episodes of the Clone Wars animated series the other day; it felt like I was questing in TOR, without the hassle of having to navigate its mazelike zones, ever following red blobs to mannequin-like mobs.