Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Should be done via the matching system, which should also be in server clusters and not server only. Character progression is part of MMOs. I fail to see how they're taking that away instead of just making it more manageable and less a screw you to people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellatrix Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Aslong as the top pve raid armor is brought into line with bm gear I don't complain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 So you want hour long queues to get fair matches rather than just fair matches... you do realize at worst they'll probably reduce expertise some, right? I've played in tons of 'unfair' matches... I whined about getting rolled by pre-mades, then went to my next match. It makes you a better player, because you have to compensate and play smarter. Of course, if BW just hands me everything, that would make me an awesome player too, I bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crujido Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Because the majority of the playerbase are casual pvpers and want the system to be adjusted to such. I agree completely that new 50's should not get a boost because they aren't geared. PvP to get 1k comms and a champion bag. When you turn 50 you should be able to have 6 bags just on hitting 50. Do your dailies on illum (and if you haven't your finding of an open world pvp) and your daily warzones and you have 8. Its ridiculous. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) I've played in tons of 'unfair' matches... I whined about getting rolled by pre-mades, then went to my next match. It makes you a better player, because you have to compensate and play smarter. Of course, if BW just hands me everything, that would make me an awesome player too, I bet. Yes, they're totally giving handouts instead of fixing something that got out of hand... yep, totally. I'm also sure that the people who get geared up later totally end up amazingly better than any of the first wave of players. There is literally no explanation for complaining about a change like this other than wanting easy wins. No, there really isn't. Its that simple. You get an edge, everyone else gets a fair shot. Everyone should be happy. Period. There would be no complaints if this was done in the first place, it'd have gone unnoticed. In fact, I hope it comes quicker then they plan. Edited February 2, 2012 by Kuari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Yes, they're totally giving handouts instead of fixing something that got out of hand... yep, totally. I'm also sure that the people who get geared up later totally end up amazingly better than any of the first wave of players. Nothing has gotten out of hand, Except the degree to which BW is going to chase away all the 'hardcore' PvPers. Also, I've seen new 50's who don't even know they can take a speeder to the east and west nodes they own ... and I can't tell you what a joy it would be to know the BM's will have to get nerfed so they can be competitive against inexperienced players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedySalmon Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Do you know what level 50s do in pve when they hit 50? They do regular mode 50 dungeons, dailies, get crafted gear and do early hardmode FPs. They match the gear they have with the difficulty of the flashpoint. Do you know what level 50s do in pvp when they hit 50? They have NO CHOICE but to go up against BM players because the only way to get pvp gear is by being stomped over and over and over. Your logic would make sense if there was a matchmaker based on your expertise gear- but there isn't. This would be a more accurate way of saying it. PvErs- the moment you hit 50, you can do nothing but nightmare modes of operations until you get your gear. That seem fair? Well, that's how the pvp system works right now. But rejoice! They're nerfing BM/Champ loot drops, so that gap will be even harder to bypass! Exactly this. Your initial argument of fresh 50's in PvE vs. fresh 50's in PvP is invalid bro, and innacurate. Fresh PVP's getting facerolled over and over again by experienced PVP'ers on a basis of gear, not skill, should not exist - they shouldn't HAVE to worry about getting the gear to compete, they should worry about getting the skill to compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noollig Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 This is the response the here in regards to PvP gear being lowered. So I am taking that people who just reached 50, expected their class to hold their own and win against 50's who have been there for a long time. Are you guys serious here? This would be akin to saying, being a level 50 I should be able to do nightmare EV and nightmare KP IMMEDIATELY?!?!?! Soooo... you consider yourself a boss fight in pvp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Nothing has gotten out of hand, Except the degree to which BW is going to chase away all the 'hardcore' PvPers. Also, I've seen new 50's who don't even know they can take a speeder to the east and west nodes they own ... and I can't tell you what a joy it would be to know the BM's will have to get nerfed so they can be competitive against inexperienced players. Hardcore? Hardcore players look for a challenge, they don't ***** because their 15-20% damage increase and reduction against players is getting tweaked. The word you're looking for is elitist. These are the guys who don't give a damn about fair play and just want to be better than others without the effort. Edited February 2, 2012 by Kuari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRSturm Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I don't know what people are complaining about. Every warzone I see 1 or 2 BMs on a team, 2 champion-geared, some people working on champion gear, and a smattering of fresh 50s. I see our guild BMs get taken down all the time, since you know, warzones are not 1v1 deathmatches, they're team-based play. I simply do not know where people are coming up with these sob stories of BMs swamping warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fungihoujo Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I don't get how anyone can be saying 'they're catering now to the casuals'. Have you read the notes where it said BM bags will now drop FEWER gear tokens? Meaning, the power levelers/lots of time on their hands/exploiters who have their full BM gear got it while it was EASY. It is now HARDER to get- in what world is that catering to casuals? Let me put it in math terms. Fast 50s had a (for example) 10% per bag to get loot. Those who will hit 50 soon will have a 5% per bag chance to get loot. This is a decrease in chance in everyone's world but apparently some of the people in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razot Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) Hardcore? Hardcore players look for a challenge, they don't ***** because their 15-20% damage increase and reduction against players is getting tweaked. The word you're looking for is elitist. These are the guys who don't give a damn about fair play and just want to be better than others without the effort. So true!! Harcore PVPers generally will be happy in greens or blues cause of corpse looting is win and makes things so much more fun in open world, and really all the devs need to do is spawn some kind of cookie in the middle of the map and we will smash each others heads in for a month to get it. Harcore as in running the same 3 wfs over and over.. i call that pretty sad actually! Edited February 2, 2012 by Razot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I don't get how anyone can be saying 'they're catering now to the casuals'. Have you read the notes where it said BM bags will now drop FEWER gear tokens? Meaning, the power levelers/lots of time on their hands/exploiters who have their full BM gear got it while it was EASY. It is now HARDER to get- in what world is that catering to casuals? Let me put it in math terms. Fast 50s had a (for example) 10% per bag to get loot. Those who will hit 50 soon will have a 5% per bag chance to get loot. This is a decrease in chance in everyone's world but apparently some of the people in this thread. It said NOTHING like that about BM bags. It said that ONLY for Champion bags. ONLY FOR CHAMPION BAGS. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=260938 quit spreading FALSE information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Hardcore? Hardcore players look for a challenge, they don't ***** because their 15-20% damage increase and reduction against players is getting tweaked. The word you're looking for is elitist. These are the guys who don't give a damn about fair play and just want to be better than others without the effort. You'll notice I put 'hardcore' in single quotes. And now you're saying these BM's just want to be better than others 'without the effort', read that a couple times, and ask yourself how they became BM's if they haven't put in any effort? The answer to that question is: They HAVE put in the effort, and now BW wants to slap them in the face for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notladnai Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I want to be treated like Royalty. A Royale with cheese. Win^ PS. Its funny people feel entitled to superior veteran attitudes for a game that's been out a month... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razot Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You'll notice I put 'hardcore' in single quotes. And now you're saying these BM's just want to be better than others 'without the effort', read that a couple times, and ask yourself how they became BM's if they haven't put in any effort? The answer to that question is: They HAVE put in the effort, and now BW wants to slap them in the face for it. New to MMO's? they are always changing, and sooner or later you will get slapped in the face it happens to everyone. You have to look at the overall health of the game instead of just you. I once did my Jedi grind and it was not fun just to see SOE make Jedi a starting class. I know about loss but its the nature of the beast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You'll notice I put 'hardcore' in single quotes. And now you're saying these BM's just want to be better than others 'without the effort', read that a couple times, and ask yourself how they became BM's if they haven't put in any effort? The answer to that question is: They HAVE put in the effort, and now BW wants to slap them in the face for it. Time is not the same thing as effort. They are not getting slapped in the face, they still have an advantage. That advantage won't be broken by anyone in pure PvE gear either. If have an advantage is a slap in the face? Then yeah, get slapped again and again. Why should the egos of a few take precedence over fairness? This is a game, not life. A majority of people play games to get away from that stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 New to MMO's? they are always changing, and sooner or later you will get slapped in the face it happens to everyone. You have to look at the overall health of the game instead of just you. I once did my Jedi grind and it was not fun just to see SOE make Jedi a starting class. I know about loss but its the nature of the beast. I played SWG Pre-NCU too. But I spend most of my time Playing Lineage II. So, no, I'm not new to mmorps, and I know nerfs will happen. But what is happening now, is BW, instead of making the game more challenging, is dumbing it down. It took Sony a few years before they dumbed down SWG, apparently BW wants to do it in months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuari Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 (edited) I played SWG Pre-NCU too. But I spend most of my time Playing Lineage II. So, no, I'm not new to mmorps, and I know nerfs will happen. But what is happening now, is BW, instead of making the game more challenging, is dumbing it down. It took Sony a few years before they dumbed down SWG, apparently BW wants to do it in months. They are making it more challenging. More challenging for those with the high end gear to an acceptable level. You can't have it both ways, asking for a challenge but asking to keep something that removes it. Edited February 2, 2012 by Kuari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelligerentBob Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You guys just don't want to lose your gear advantage . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You'll notice I put 'hardcore' in single quotes. And now you're saying these BM's just want to be better than others 'without the effort', read that a couple times, and ask yourself how they became BM's if they haven't put in any effort? The answer to that question is: They HAVE put in the effort, and now BW wants to slap them in the face for it. As it was stated already, time and effort aren't the same thing. Spending hours afking in sets of 10-20 minute matches doesn't take any effort, it just takes a lot of free time. I'm not saying that you or any other specific person AFKed your way to full BM, I'm just making the point that there is no actual skill or effort required in collecting pvp gear. Hell, I could do the same thing now if I wanted; I contribute about as much to any match I queue up in as if I did AFK, considering as a tank-spec Vanguard I get ripped to shreds in a handful of seconds by any passing player in a smattering of pvp gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I played SWG Pre-NCU too. But I spend most of my time Playing Lineage II. So, no, I'm not new to mmorps, and I know nerfs will happen. But what is happening now, is BW, instead of making the game more challenging, is dumbing it down. It took Sony a few years before they dumbed down SWG, apparently BW wants to do it in months. To be completely honest, the words "casual friendly" encompass the entire design of this game. Getting upset that they're "dumbing down" this game is laughable at best, since it's already so mind-numbingly easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Time is not the same thing as effort. They are not getting slapped in the face, they still have an advantage. That advantage won't be broken by anyone in pure PvE gear either. If have an advantage is a slap in the face? Then yeah, get slapped again and again. Why should the egos of a few take precedence over fairness? This is a game, not life. A majority of people play games to get away from that stupidity. Yeah, its a game, and its fast becoming Easy Mode. Bioware should just make some Weeklies "Complete 5 Easy Mode Flashpoints" and reward people with Rakata gear. I'm not the elitist here, You seem to think that somehow people with 60 valor are unworthy of enjoying the fruits of their labor, or for some reason don't want to acknowledge that they did have to put the time and effort into getting to 60 valor. Lets just go all out, and make it fair for everyone, after the last page of the Character Creation Screen, you log into your newly minted Level 50 toon, disperse your skill points, go to your mailbox and pick up your Easy Mode Tier 3 Gear... There, now its fair for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastersloup Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 reintroduce lvl 50 blue pvp gear? Wow, it took me 1 second of thinking to come up with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFreshBrew Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 You guys just don't want to lose your gear advantage . haha, actually, that gear advantage doesn't last forever. and I don't think any BM's expect it to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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