Damage meter is like inception!

[HangmanBones]

go back to wow, if you can't understand numbers on a screen without a secondary program, its your problem. if your getting wiped you know one of your people is sucking, if your not wiping stop trying to be tunnel visioned on dps.

[Colobulous]

How is it going to help during the fight? Are you going to hit your keys harder to get more dps? See my above posts for the things I support. Some people have had some decent ideas

 

Well, I haven't seen people insisting on in-combat displays but...

 

"Hey Bob, put on your combat weapon!"

 

"Yo Joe, wake up!"

 

"Tommy, use your lightning attack!"

 

Maybe not too common a concern, but as I said, I have yet to see anybody insist on a display during combat. I've never had a desire to have it on during combat, I've always turned it off myself.

 

Now immediately after combat, and not going through a pointless exercise to display it, now that matters to me.

 

go back to wow, if you can't understand numbers on a screen without a secondary program, its your problem. if your getting wiped you know one of your people is sucking, if your not wiping stop trying to be tunnel visioned on dps.

 

There must be a lot of mathematical prodigies playing this game, who expect me to instantly calculate not just my own numbers, but those of everybody else in my group, just by reading something on a screen.

 

I'm sorry I'm not the paragon of arithmetic that you are, but I'm not going to go away just because of your elitist demands.

Edited December 15, 2011 by Colobulous

[JonathanTheBlack]

Addons are worthless. Ban them forever.

[Kurnea]

go back to wow, if you can't understand numbers on a screen without a secondary program, its your problem. if your getting wiped you know one of your people is sucking, if your not wiping stop trying to be tunnel visioned on dps.

 

I agree meters aren't needed if you're not wiping. If you are wiping, how exactly does it help to know 'one person is sucking'? Which person is sucking? How are they sucking? Can you easily explain to them that they are sucking and show them how to change? Clear data makes it much easier to handle these situations.

[Tokad]

Or how about you just play the GAME for FUN and not think about meters

 

Raids were around and working fine in games where you had exp loss , lvl loss , corpse runs etc without damage meters.

 

Sounds like you need the crutch OP that many of us didnt many years ago and still dont.

[Sangnz]

I have no issues with DPS meters, just the morons who use them.

 

That having been said they are not a tool that are 100% needed in order to play your class well, all they due is allow fine tuning. While people do like to fine tune and be the best of the best I would suspect those people will be that with or without em.

[Rykimaruh]

Oh great, a WoW Recount rip off...what's next Gearscore? <.<

[Kurnea]

Raids were around and working fine in games where you had exp loss , lvl loss , corpse runs etc without damage meters.

 

Sounds like you need the crutch OP that many of us didnt many years ago and still dont.

 

So, anything useful that games didn't have before is automatically a crutch? Well, best get rid of the free recuperation talents that let you regen health and points outside of combat. Oh, and quest helper functionality wasn't around back then, best not use that in-game since it's a crutch. Oh, and can't have auto-loot, people got by fine without that before, must be a crutch.

[Iciet]

I played that "other game" for years and yea, it started off a lot of fun, but then it became so ridiculous with all the add-ons and number watching that most of the fun took a back seat to theorycrafting and gear farming. I'm really hoping this game doesn't go that direction and I'd be happy with absolutely no add-on support at all.

[Colobulous]

It's nearly impossible to get somebody to realize that crutches are useful tools, and like any tool, they should not be used to shame and ridicule others.

[Thurgrayden]

I'd go back to Skyrim...but I took an arrow to the knee.

 

 

I've never been a hardcore gamer or raider, but I like damage meters as a way of giving me feedback on how I am doing, and as a way of learning what abilities I should combine in which order to put out the best dps/threat that I can.

[MurphyNox]

Damage meters are for bad players that aren't confident about the damage they are doing. It also encourages bad play, since people are too busy watching the meter and not concentrating on the boss and the tactics they need to use. I used to do hardcore raiding back in BC and we were told not to use damage meters, we used threat meters instead so we did not pull while trying to overcompensate for our DPS.

 

Guess what? It worked, we did not mess up much, nobody ever pulled anything accidentally and we still kept the DPS up, because we weren't bad players.

[Kurnea]

I played that "other game" for years and yea, it started off a lot of fun, but then it became so ridiculous with all the add-ons and number watching that most of the fun took a back seat to theorycrafting and gear farming. I'm really hoping this game doesn't go that direction and I'd be happy with absolutely no add-on support at all.

 

I raided WoW this year with only two addons installed, both of which were fairly optional still. Usually only one person in the raid needs keep his eye on the meters to make sure the enrage timer is going to be beaten, the rest of the raid just needs to do their job and be on Vent.

[Legonick]

I used to hate damage meters, then I took realization to the knee

[Colobulous]

Damage meters are for bad players that aren't confident about the damage they are doing.

 

People are often confident when they have less reason to be so, whereas those who are actually competent tend to be less confident.

 

t also encourages bad play, since people are too busy watching the meter and not concentrating on the boss and the tactics they need to use.

 

I'm pretty sure that DPS is one of the tactics you should be using, and that anybody foolish enough to lose sight of other mechanics (which are also covered by the meters, BTW), is not going to do so because of the meters, but because of who they are.

 

 

Guess what? It worked, we did not mess up much, nobody ever pulled anything accidentally and we still kept the DPS up, because we weren't bad players.

 

Guess what? My group used DPS meters, and nobody got fixated on a single idea to the detriment of other systems, because we weren't bad players either.

 

It was just one tool in the box.

[chrisishere]

If your getting with 10-20% of the top dps, then fine, your talent spec is 'okay', so is your rotation. But if say, your using your own special talent build and are doing the same damage as the tank - then you aren't playing the game very well.

 

The damage meter is a way of measuring if your DPS'ing well or badly.. Same is, say, your dying repeatedly says that you don't understand threat well enough, or your taking more damage/have less mitigation than you should have.

 

It's impossible to measure how well or badly a dps is dpsing without a meter... so noone can tell skill levels.

 

And trust me, with 1 unskilled player in the raid you will be wasting EVERYONES time on the hard content in the game.

 

hard content is HARD so yes, we need a means to tell if you've got a chance of being useful. Because like all things in life, so people are good at these games, most are average, and a few are just bad.

 

When I first started MMO's I though I was good, then learnt I was bad, then became good. With no means to tell I was bad I wouldn't of improved as much.

[xNethrilx]

if ppl really used it for good and to help others to bring their numbers up or to provide good feed back it would be awesome. but as all have seen it only leads to you suck comments and lrn2play noob! it is really not worth it. and ive played tons of mmos with and with out dmg meters.

 

I keep my replies to a minimum because I feel most of the nonsense on the forums is pointless babble. I do however feel damage meters are essential to the success of raids and end game content. I for one run damage meters 100% of the time (along with various others), yet I tank.

 

In instances / dungeons I use these to see who is and who is not pulling their weight. I take into account their gear, and have a relative idea of where they should be. If they are close, I never say a word. If not, I will inform them nicely that their DPS is below the required amount we need for this instance. I typically will try to help anyone who is willing to listen improve their dps, but I have in the past resorted to kicked people from groups for sub-par DPS. I would estimate that number to be a total of 50 players over my nearly 8 year span with WoW.

 

In raids (since I raid lead) I do set minimum contribution levels for my DPS, and if they do not perform I replace them. I take into account healing meters and compare damage taken for tanks.

 

I do not believe I should be made to sacrifice and frustrate my gaming experience because others feel they should not learn their class and role to it's fullest. This is not an elitist attitude, it is simply a desire to be successful. If you are okay with mediocrity, that is your own personal opinion and you should look for people who share the same opinion. The most frustrating part to these complaints is the same ones complaining about not wanting DMG meters are the ones expecting to be carried by those who do.

 

No offense to the person whom I quoted, but if you are being told this often, there probably is a reason.

[Amiable]

I appreciate folks who believe damage meters will increase their enjoyment of the game. I raided and used damage meters for years, and honestly, upon review, I think the bad outweighs the good.

 

Most of the people who post here are probably responsible users of damage meters, but many, many folks are not. Damage meters tend to fracture the community as they necessitate an arms race among the "l33t guilds" solely based around numbers. The designers then need to tune all encounters with the understanding that there are going to be a group of folk parsing out every bit of data to fully optimize their raid group.

 

The result is encounters are tuned to hard for the vast majority of folks but are still to easy to a small group. In addition, the fun of the game gets sucked out, as almost all of your focus turns to optimizing gear and rotations so you have "the perfect dps/healing numbers." LOTRO didn't have dps meters and their end game dungeon design was absolutely fabulous (in my opinion the dungeons were far more challenging and fun than anything WoW was putting out).

 

Obviously if you are a hard core raider than that is cold comfort, because that would mean even the most challenging dungeon would be relatively easy. But honestly, if you are a hard core raider:

 

1. You are likely a vanishingly small part of the player population and

2. You have a plethora of other choices on the market to fulfill your gaming needs.

 

Recreating the whole gear arms race will not be good for the game long term, see what is currently happening in WoW.

[Fallensouls]

Damage meters usually cause more problems than they are worth is why most of us are against it. We know who will be doing most of the damage in a raid or group, its a no brainer, why do I need a meter to tell me? I know who the healers are the tanks etc if im a good group leader and if some one isnt pulling thier weight its obvious who it is in a raid.

Its all common sense i dont need a meter to tell me this stuff when Im leading a group.

 

What it is , WoW pampered you guys so much you dont know how to play with out your easy buttons. You left WoW to play this for a reason stop trying to turn this game into the game you decided to stop playing. Obviously you dont like WoW anymore or you would be playing that. Dont turn this game into the game you no longer play.

Edited December 15, 2011 by Fallensouls