to all the sub 50's who whined about getting farmed

[arteous]

And just hit 50 gratz .. enjoy the fruits of your labor in whining. now you're going to get farmed by geared 50's because that's all there is for you to que up against. you had a chance to keep killing people 49 and under but hey .. you were soo buisy crying about how unfair it was that you forgot to realize that you needed them to have a chance in the mass ques so you wouldn't always face geared oponents.

 

but no . instead of asking for it to be reverted back so it would work as originally inteded these people are now whining about it being too hard to get gear (honestly if they think that it's too hard to get gear in this game i don't know what they expect. maybe ding 50 here is your full free epic set of pvp gear???)

 

Imho revert the pvp ques back so 50's and 49 and under are in the same ques. That way there will be less geared players per battle and then it will seem better for the fresh 50's. That will fix that whole issue.

 

Of course here comes the 1 million whine posts about how they need to make pvp easier to get and / or wanting all the geared people out of the ques (next they'll say it's unfair that best geared players can kill them).

Edited February 1, 2012 by arteous

[Princz]

Dont understand your post..

 

Is this a gear whinning thread?

 

Mate go to the galactic trader and spend some money getting some 49 purple... It will be more than enought to be able to stand decently on WZs. As a matter of fact i bought my self an implant from galactic trader with so good stats that only battlemaster implant will be a better upgrade....

 

Ihmo this games has some problems ... but money and gear is not them

[dannythefool]

Imho revert the pvp ques back so 50's and 49 and under are in the same ques. That way there will be less geared players per battle and then it will seem better for the fresh 50's. That will fix that whole issue.

 

Lol. No, Level 49s would just stop doing warzones. It wouldn't change anything at all except one less level to have fun at pvp in.

[JohraTon]

Dont understand your post..

 

Is this a gear whinning thread?

 

Mate go to the galactic trader and spend some money getting some 49 purple... It will be more than enought to be able to stand decently on WZs. As a matter of fact i bought my self an implant from galactic trader with so good stats that only battlemaster implant will be a better upgrade....

 

Ihmo this games has some problems ... but money and gear is not them

 

Nice, how much expertise does it have?

 

I made a similar post on someone elses thread, but it was more about the queue times. Unless its right on prime time most games take forever to start and don't even last the full duration.

 

I firmly believe this is because us geared 50's are putting the new ones off. They really need to add some expertise to the PvP gear available from the vendors for WZ comms so the new guys can have atleast some expertise from day 1.

[Princz]

Nice, how much expertise does it have?

 

I made a similar post on someone elses thread, but it was more about the queue times. Unless its right on prime time most games take forever to start and don't even last the full duration.

 

I firmly believe this is because us geared 50's are putting the new ones off. They really need to add some expertise to the PvP gear available from the vendors for WZ comms so the new guys can have atleast some expertise from day 1.

 

Why people think that expertise is making sooooo much difference?

 

40 expertise points gained from 1 champion piece is 1% + to damage and mitigation

 

now this 1% i could easily swap for +20 endurance and +20-30 to power/surge rating from another piece ... totally depends in the rest of your gear. Mate open your stats and do the math...

 

People say that Rakata gear is better than battlemaster overall... cant confirm but there are many that say that .... to be honest for my class i have seen huge differences like +30 difference in willpower stats from Columni gear.... cannot say since i dont pve that much.

 

Bottom line you can spend some credits and get some pretty decent gear to be able to do some damage and be able to mitigate a lot from crafted purple.... try it and we talk

[Acyu]

Nice, how much expertise does it have?

 

I made a similar post on someone elses thread, but it was more about the queue times. Unless its right on prime time most games take forever to start and don't even last the full duration.

 

I firmly believe this is because us geared 50's are putting the new ones off. They really need to add some expertise to the PvP gear available from the vendors for WZ comms so the new guys can have atleast some expertise from day 1.

 

You're way overestimating the usefulness of expertise. It also hits diminishing returns pretty hard. I would rather wear 1/2 1/2 pve/pvp of the same ilvl than full pvp.

[JohraTon]

Sorry, expertise makes a massive difference. I'm not talking about 1 piece and you won't find people complaining about coming up against someone with 1 piece of champ/battlemaster gear.

 

At the moment even without a PvP ear module and relics (by choice) my expertise is sat around 530 something, which gives me 10% extra damage and reduces incoming by 10%. If you think that doesn't make a difference you are sorely mistaken.

 

And your 100% right, stats wise the PvE gear is better and mixing that with the PvP gear is probably going to be the best combination since expertise starts giving diminished returns past a certain point, but that point is a lot higher than 40.

[JohraTon]

You're way overestimating the usefulness of expertise. It also hits diminishing returns pretty hard. I would rather wear 1/2 1/2 pve/pvp of the same ilvl than full pvp.

 

Your 100% right and i'd also prefer this armour mix, but that has nothing to do with how important expertise is. It does however have everything to do with the point where stacking other stats becomes more useful than stacking expertise and thats still a pretty decent way up.

[Tyranoc]

I like my expertise of 600+. the QQ'ers and whingers get what they deserve whenthey hit 50. So they dont want to WZ anymore I dont care. They can go ahead and quit. there are PLENTY out there like me who can't stand the noob QQ'er and whingers

 

 

NOOBS BE GONE!

[Princz]

Sorry, expertise makes a massive difference. I'm not talking about 1 piece and you won't find people complaining about coming up against someone with 1 piece of champ/battlemaster gear.

 

At the moment even without a PvP ear module and relics (by choice) my expertise is sat around 530 something, which gives me 10% extra damage and reduces incoming by 10%. If you think that doesn't make a difference you are sorely mistaken.

 

And your 100% right, stats wise the PvE gear is better and mixing that with the PvP gear is probably going to be the best combination since expertise starts giving diminished returns past a certain point, but that point is a lot higher than 40.

 

wonder if you read what other ppl are writting man...

 

yes you get +40 FROM 1 PIECE but there is another piece that you can buy with + to other stats FROM 1 piece again that in some cases i would easily trade.

 

The debate here is about fresh 50s and all i am saying is that fresh 50s can stand in warzones just fine with crafted purple THUS there is no real gear issue to talk about

[Ribtips]

Leave the system as is when you hit 50 you are supposed to be farmed. It's the nature of mmo's get used to it

[Dalnar]

I like my expertise of 600+. the QQ'ers and whingers get what they deserve whenthey hit 50. So they dont want to WZ anymore I dont care. They can go ahead and quit. there are PLENTY out there like me who can't stand the noob QQ'er and whingers

 

 

NOOBS BE GONE!

 

That's pretty short sighed from you tbh. If people will be bored when they hit 50 and fight 600+ geared people. They will just roll alt and pvp in lower bracket, and at the same time propose a toggle for level cap so they stop leveling in pvp.

 

So you can be high on your horse now, but don' be surprised if you end up at 50 with noone to play against eventually.

[Acyu]

That's how things are with MMOs. Those who enter early, level to max early, start to pvp early, got to take advantage of valor farm, etc... are going to be better geared than those who are only hitting 50.

 

It's like that for PvE, and it's the same for PvP.

 

You have to work for your gear, and by work I don't mean grind. The current system of RNG bags make it easy enough for people to "luck out" and get geared up extremely fast. The weeklies and dailies are not hard to do and they provide the majority of the bags for non-grinders.

 

I'm fairly casual and I got fully geared (still missing like 3 champion) after 2 weeks. I am now 50V, and I don't consider myself as very lucky since I've seen ~30Vs with FULL champion gear.

 

Gear takes time. Give it a week or two and you'll be competing at the same level as others. Battlemaster gear is not that much better than champion gears and those people are hardly invincible.

 

Sure, it's frustrated going from dominating lvl 11s at lvl 49 to getting owned at lvl 50 by other more geared 50, but that's just how every game works. Suck it up and accept the fact that you won't be dominating the WZ or controlling the flow of the game for the next week or two.

 

Don't burn yourself out by thinking you have to "grind" or win 9 games and collect 150 armaments on that Tuesday. Take it slow, roll an alt. Do your dailies, buy some 49/50 purples. Have fun despite the crap pvp system.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Acyu

[JohraTon]

The debate here is about fresh 50s and all i am saying is that fresh 50s can stand in warzones just fine with crafted purple THUS there is no real gear issue to talk about

 

Look back to my first statement and you'll see I've already talked about this. You think expertise isn't important, great, many disagree with you. The sheer number of complaints about expertise on this forum shows that.

 

Spending a fortune on purple gear at 50 which is just going to be replaced is going to put people off.

 

Adding expertise to the normal PvP gear at 20 and 40 so the difference between the haves and have nots is smaller is going to be attractive to these people. It doesnt matter if they're right or wrong on how important it is its going to attract them to take part. Good for PvP and good for the game as they dont quit and stop paying their sub.

 

I couldn't care less about how important or unimportant expertise is, its how important it is perceived by the masses here. If that is going to make them choose not to PvP because they think they can't due to a lack of expertise, that means people like me are going to be running around in WZ's by myself. Expertise isn't as important as some people make out and as you and another guy have correctly pointed out after a point it becomes much less important. So why not give the newer players a bit of a head start to get them involved instead of starting them on 0.

 

The whole point of adding some expertise to the lower gear is to get people involved and stop warzones from being what they are currently; shocking queue times and many games which don't last longer than 2 minutes.

[Princz]

Look back to my first statement and you'll see I've already talked about this. You think expertise isn't important, great, many disagree with you. The sheer number of complaints about expertise on this forum shows that.

 

Spending a fortune on purple gear at 50 which is just going to be replaced is going to put people off.

 

Adding expertise to the normal PvP gear at 20 and 40 so the difference between the haves and have nots is smaller is going to be attractive to these people. It doesnt matter if they're right or wrong on how important it is its going to attract them to take part. Good for PvP and good for the game as they dont quit and stop paying their sub.

 

I couldn't care less about how important or unimportant expertise is, its how important it is perceived by the masses here. If that is going to make them choose not to PvP because they think they can't due to a lack of expertise, that means people like me are going to be running around in WZ's by myself. Expertise isn't as important as some people make out and as you and another guy have correctly pointed out after a point it becomes much less important. So why not give the newer players a bit of a head start to get them involved instead of starting them on 0.

 

The whole point of adding some expertise to the lower gear is to get people involved and stop warzones from being what they are currently; shocking queue times and many games which don't last longer than 2 minutes.

 

 

I am not saying anything about expertise.... numbers talk for themselves.

 

On your very first day as level 50 you can get ATLEAST a pvp T1 chest.... tell me another game that you can do that ... i rest my case

[dannythefool]

That's pretty short sighed from you tbh. If people will be bored when they hit 50 and fight 600+ geared people. They will just roll alt and pvp in lower bracket, and at the same time propose a toggle for level cap so they stop leveling in pvp.

 

Actually even without that you can play warzones in the 10-49 bracket for a very long time if you just don't do much else. Which is not a real problem because you can make a character for PVP and then only go to warzones with it.

[dannythefool]

I'm fairly casual and I got fully geared (still missing like 3 champion) after 2 weeks. I am now 50V, and I don't consider myself as very lucky since I've seen ~30Vs with FULL champion gear.

 

Valor rank doesn't really say much though, only my level 20 and lower characters are below valor rank 30... and they'll hit 30 the instant they hit clevel 30 (stupid valor rank cap...)

[Kalantris]

wonder if you read what other ppl are writting man...

 

yes you get +40 FROM 1 PIECE but there is another piece that you can buy with + to other stats FROM 1 piece again that in some cases i would easily trade.

 

The debate here is about fresh 50s and all i am saying is that fresh 50s can stand in warzones just fine with crafted purple THUS there is no real gear issue to talk about

 

Oh rly? I mean, seriously. I do a lot of warzones. And open PvP, when I'm not dragged from one ops to another. When I see some random 13k hp dude with no expertise my entire focus changes. From "think to win" to "think to get the 5k crit". They do nothing to me, I hit them for gazillions of damage. I wonder how they feel, when I cast weaken mind on them, pop the bonus crits, run around for a couple seconds waiting for the telekinetic throw channel speed proc and melt them in less than 3 seconds from full to null with 1,8k crits/tick. Just to make them moar angry .

 

No expertise = cannon fodder regardless of your gear. I don't give a damn if it's crafted masterworks or columi gear, you're still fodder. Commandos actually prefer 2 columi pieces over expertise gear due to the set bonus (15% crit on grav round if I remember correctly), but everybody else... Expertise is your best friend. What you see in the tooltips is actually less than accurate or the 12% bonus I have is responsible for the incredible difference I see on every single warzone.

 

Regards,

Kalantris

[jcyrus]

I don't quite understand how it's worse to be farmed at 50 while you're trying to gear up, versus being farmed all through levels 10-49 before you even have the capability to open bags to try to gear up.

[Princz]

Oh rly? I mean, seriously. I do a lot of warzones. And open PvP, when I'm not dragged from one ops to another. When I see some random 13k hp dude with no expertise my entire focus changes. From "think to win" to "think to get the 5k crit". They do nothing to me, I hit them for gazillions of damage. I wonder how they feel, when I cast weaken mind on them, pop the bonus crits, run around for a couple seconds waiting for the telekinetic throw channel speed proc and melt them in less than 3 seconds from full to null with 1,8k crits/tick. Just to make them moar angry .

 

No expertise = cannon fodder regardless of your gear. I don't give a damn if it's crafted masterworks or columi gear, you're still fodder. Commandos actually prefer 2 columi pieces over expertise gear due to the set bonus (15% crit on grav round if I remember correctly), but everybody else... Expertise is your best friend. What you see in the tooltips is actually less than accurate or the 12% bonus I have is responsible for the incredible difference I see on every single warzone.

 

Regards,

Kalantris

 

You see huge difference because you went probably for 42-43 orange to champion gear as many do.... Sometimes i inspect ppl in warzones and i cry....

 

Regards

Princz

[KeltikTwo]

I am not saying anything about expertise.... numbers talk for themselves.

 

On your very first day as level 50 you can get ATLEAST a pvp T1 chest.... tell me another game that you can do that ... i rest my case

 

 

How exactly can you do that ?

[JohraTon]

I am not saying anything about expertise.... numbers talk for themselves.

 

On your very first day as level 50 you can get ATLEAST a pvp T1 chest.... tell me another game that you can do that ... i rest my case

 

What? yea best/worse case scenario depending on your idea of luck. And that is assuming on their first day of 50 the average player will

 

Have already saved 1k of each set of comms

Go to ilum and kill 150 players

Go win 9 warzones

 

/facepalm

 

Yep its well easy.

 

But to win those 9 warzones you need 7 other players who know what they're doing, or hope the other side is clueless.

 

And to get 150 kills at Ilum, so many factors to get these in whatever of the day is left after you hit 50 are out of your control its ridiculous to even suggest it. If you say collect crates I'm actually gonna laugh.

 

Even assuming this is done, its still totally unrelated. Congrats day 1 you have 40 expertise, your still going to get rolled. Its much less than the 200 or so expertise you'd have from the level 40 gear if they actually added some to it. Hence attractive to the masses, hence it improves PvP as a whole.

 

I'm starting to think your some PvE only player who is only here for a debate and clearly has no clue on how easy or hard it is to get PvP gear or its importance outside of your own perfect world gearing up scenario's.

 

And I couldn't care less about any other game. I don't play them. My only concern is for SWTOR and how this effects it.

[dannythefool]

I don't quite understand how it's worse to be farmed at 50 while you're trying to gear up, versus being farmed all through levels 10-49 before you even have the capability to open bags to try to gear up.

 

The current situation is, though, that you're not farmed in the 10-49 bracket. At least I'm not. I get the impression I have a chance and can make a difference at early levels... 10-20 may be somewhat hard but by then, most classes start to get their tools...

 

Even if you feel you need to reach level 30 or 40 before you can hold your own in a warzone, you can reach that point in one or two days. I don't think it's the case and I believe starting early is the better way to learn your character, but if you don't agree with me on that, one weekend will take you to a level at which you feel comfortable in warzones.

 

And the other thing is that even if level 49 characters are trying to farm warzones, they will eventually drop out of the bracket. I mean I can see how you could coordinate with some friends and then spend a few days facerolling everybody in a level 46+ premade but it doesn't seem to happen that much. After all if you're the type of player who would consider this fun, you want to reach 50 and gear up there as soon as possible.

Edited February 1, 2012 by dannythefool

[dannythefool]

Even assuming this is done, its still totally unrelated. Congrats day 1 you have 40 expertise, your still going to get rolled. Its much less than the 200 or so expertise you'd have from the level 40 gear if they actually added some to it. Hence attractive to the masses, hence it improves PvP as a whole.

 

You can actually have 100+ expertise even before you hit 50 if you buy the PVP weapons and rip out the expertise enhancements. If you do enough warzones this is definitely viable and you can still have your 1000/1000 comms and your bag in the bank. On characters that I PVP a lot on I cap out merc commendations in the 30ies despite buying gear and boxes along the way.

 

I still agree there should be some sort of level 50 PVP gear you can start buying in your forties like you can do with the level 20 and 40 gear. It doesn't have to be great, just good enough to prevent players who mainly PVP from having to resort to PVE to become halfway competitive again once they hit 50.

[jcyrus]

The current situation is, though, that you're not farmed in the 10-49 bracket. At least I'm not.

Nono, I'm in agreement with you I'm saying what the OP is arguing doesn't make sense, because it's being farmed at 50 as you gear, or getting farmed through all your levels by already geared 50's.

 

I'm absolutely loving the 10-49 bracket on my alts. It is very fun - like how the warzones were for the first week or 2.

 

When I took my second character to 50 (before the brackets were introduced), I had actually stopped playing warzones by the late 30's because I was tired of having no shot against the geared 50s, who made up the majority of warzone players on my server.