Swtor kinda sucks

[BowtheMan]

Dont bash him for fanboyism if you're choosing to ignore your own. I'm enjoying the **** out of SWTOR and i loved WoW for a long time, but SWTOR has the benefit of YEARS over WoW in that it should have everything that WoW did right, and nothing that WoW did wrong.

 

PvP is better in WoW. Global cooldowns do nothing but slow down combat and remove some aspect of skill/tricks from gameplay.

 

A fully fleshed out LFG system would be helpful, if its left out of endgame instances to encourage social interaction/guild activity thats fine. but while lvling it would be nice to que up and have the game find a match, rather than wasting an hour at the fleet.

 

And honestly who wouldnt want a dual-spec system? it does nothing but allow you to excel in more areas of the game, rather than being limited to raid DPS etc..

 

WoW was a revolutionary game. SWTOR is amazing and has a chance to be the worlds next MMORPG but dont sit here and claim WoW never did anything correctly.

[VoidGlider]

so who remembers in vanilla WoW when looting a copper vein could make you slide around in crouching position till you relogged?

 

Hehe, yes I can. Also after launch everyones characters getting lost. It took them 3 days to get them back and when they showed up again, they were all naked with no gear. Then another 3 days past before that problem was sorted out.

 

For old times sake, remember when a skilled hunter could kite a world boss dragon all the way from one end of the map the the other and drag it through the gates of the city where everyone from the lowest levels to the highest would join in the carnage. All lost now.

[pakchooieunf]

If you decide to make an MMO, and you have a couple decades worth of MMOs to reference for ideas about what you should include in your new MMO, such as LFG tools, flexible interface, macros, etc.. is it reasonable for people to expect that you will have them?

 

Of course WoW didn't launch with a dungeon finder, that idea emerged from years of play testing and analyzing. But once the idea occurs and is successfully implemented, the onus falls on other MMO developers to make sure they are offering a competitive product.

 

Note the distinction: arriving at the concept was the lengthy part, not the actual development. You should take advantage of the years of system refinement that other developers have made, rather than regressing half a decade.

[Tygranir]

If you decide to make an MMO, and you have a couple decades worth of MMOs to reference for ideas about what you should include in your new MMO, such as LFG tools, flexible interface, macros, etc.. is it reasonable for people to expect that you will have them?

 

Of course WoW didn't launch with a dungeon finder, that idea emerged from years of play testing and analyzing. But once the idea occurs and is successfully implemented, the onus falls on other MMO developers to make sure they are offering a competitive product.

 

Note the distinction: arriving at the concept was the lengthy part, not the actual development. You should take advantage of the years of system refinement that other developers have made, rather than regressing half a decade.

 

They built a functional game then released it to start building a little revenue. The other features are nice add ins that are not necessary for the game to function, thus primary development time was spent on creating the functional game, as all other features can be added in at later dates.

 

This makes sense to me. Or would you have postponed release another 6 months so you can have a dungeon finder?

[Arell]

ive played wow for about 5 years so its hard not to compare. sure the game just came out but when wow came out it had more than swtor. first of all you cant queue for flashpoints. players are so unreliable so its hard to find a good group it takes for ever.

When wow was released you couldn't queue for dungeons either. Back then we used the same system as we do in swtor.

 

Nor were there any raids, arenas, barbershops, flying mounts, LFR, transmog, badge gear, daily quests, heroic dungeons, deathknights, alliance shamans, horde paladins, actual viable feral druids or boomkins, achievements, race/gender/name changes, realm transfers, bloodelves, draenei, pandas, pokemon and quite a few other things that I can't think of atm.

 

theres too many heroic quests like i said it takes forever to find a good group and the heroics are impossible to solo.

Heroic quests are completely optional, and a quite a few of them are actually solo'able depending on class/specc/level/companion/gear/tactics.

 

the side quests are boring you have to walk across the planet to get to them its just a big mess.

That's what questing usually is like. This is not the first game like that and sure won't be the last....

 

because of the 1 zone per alliance per level it feels as though there no freedom to play the way you want and level at the rate you want because everyone is doing the exact same quests, getting the exact same gear etc.

I will agree with this bit as far as the linear leveling goes. But if you are a completionist like myself, or just enjoy questing, you will literally outlevel every planet, which gives you somewhat the illusion of being able to "decide" what planet to level on by just doing your class quests and heaving to the next planet (which you are more than qualified for to quest levelwise).

The part of looking the same is quite wrong, due to all the custom gear that's around. You are not forced to wear your quest rewards, because you can mod pretty much any item you like the look of.

 

it shouldnt even be classified as a rpg imo in almost all rpgs theres freedom to choose where you want to level. this is basically a sad version of kotor. every thing else is pretty good i guess.

Based on this statement I can say you have very little experience concerning rpg's, as pretty much the majority of rpg's are linear in some way or another. Though I'll admit that it would be nice if we had more choice in deciding where to level

Edited January 26, 2012 by Arell

[BowtheMan]

They built a functional game then released it to start building a little revenue. The other features are nice add ins that are not necessary for the game to function, thus primary development time was spent on creating the functional game, as all other features can be added in at later dates.

 

This makes sense to me. Or would you have postponed release another 6 months so you can have a dungeon finder?

 

That is ridiculous. Hey check out my new car, it was released as functional but it doesnt have a radio, air conditioning or windshield wipers, the company released it early to start gaining some revenue, they say they'll mail me the parts later.

 

If you have the opportunity to add in systems that facilitate ease of use or make the game generally more accessible, and they are left out, then the company is not releasing a competitive product.

 

Dont give Bioware the benefit of the doubt, there are things that were not included in the game that should have been in order to keep people around. Not everyone wants to play hardcore, for those people who don't a LFG tool would be a very key addition probably making or breaking their experience. Unless you want dead servers with 3 guilds worth of "elite" players, systems like LFG should have been included.

Edited January 26, 2012 by BowtheMan

[Tygranir]

That is ridiculous. Hey check out my new car, it was released as functional but it doesnt have a radio, air conditioning or windshield wipers, the company released it early to start gaining some revenue, they say they'll mail me the parts later.

 

If you have the opportunity to add in systems that facilitate ease of use or make the game generally more accessible, and they are left out, then the company is not releasing a competitive product.

 

Dont give Bioware the benefit of the doubt, there are things that were not included in the game that should have been in order to keep people around. Not everyone wants to play hardcore, for those people who don't a LFG tool would be a very key addition probably making or breaking their experience. Unless you want dead servers with 3 guilds worth of "elite" players, systems like LFG should have been included.

 

With your example, you wouldn't buy that car unless it had something you really wanted that more upgraded cars did not, right? Well, that is the case here.

 

This isn't WoW. It doesn't have what WoW has. But I am having much more fun playing SWTOR than I did with WoW. I loved WoW. It was a great game, Pre-ICC. I just really have much more fun playing swtor.

 

Your car may have AC and a dvd player, but I enjoy driving mine more. See what I did there?

[ToneDeafNinja]

first of all you cant queue for flashpoints. players are so unreliable so its hard to find a good group it takes for ever. theres too many heroic quests like i said it takes forever to find a good group and the heroics are impossible to solo.

 

If you really had played WoW for 5 years then you would have similar memories of finding any type of pug group before the queue system was implemented. Get over it and keep trying, you would know perseverance was required in WoW as well if you hadn't lied about how long you've been playing it.

[BowtheMan]

With your example, you wouldn't buy that car unless it had something you really wanted that more upgraded cars did not, right? Well, that is the case here.

 

This isn't WoW. It doesn't have what WoW has. But I am having much more fun playing SWTOR than I did with WoW. I loved WoW. It was a great game, Pre-ICC. I just really have much more fun playing swtor.

 

Your car may have AC and a dvd player, but I enjoy driving mine more. See what I did there?

 

Yes i see what you did. to continue with the analogy, while you may enjoying your car without features standard on most cars, few would call it a competitive product. While this minimalist approach may appeal to some, the end goal of any business should always be to sell as much of their product as possible.

 

If Bioware wants this product to appeal to as many players as possible and maximize their revenue, they should have included these streamlining features that the average player enjoys. not focus on what the specialty customer wants. The fact that they didn't is a mistake strategically for the company.

[Tygranir]

Yes i see what you did. to continue with the analogy, while you may enjoying your car without features standard on most cars, few would call it a competitive product. While this minimalist approach may appeal to some, the end goal of any business should always be to sell as much of their product as possible.

 

If Bioware wants this product to appeal to as many players as possible and maximize their revenue, they should have included these streamlining features that the average player enjoys. not focus on what the specialty customer wants. The fact that they didn't is a mistake strategically for the company.

 

So, with your example, motorcycles are a failing product?

[vandermire]

I think we can all at least be happy about the fact that Abicuss has yet to reply or post another thing on this topic meaning one of two things.

 

1. He realized his idiocy and moved on to play swtor more and actually enjoy the great game that it is.

 

2. He quit right after that post and is making his eyes bleed out of his head by playing WoW (in that case we dont have to listen to his whining and deal with the noobs trying to change a game into a already failing one)

 

swtor isnt perfect and has much room to grow but I'm 100% happy with what it is right now. There is a reason why we all pay monthly for this game and thats for the fact we want to see it grow and expand in new ways.

[Jellison]

ive played wow for about 5 years so its hard not to compare. sure the game just came out but when wow came out it had more than swtor. first of all you cant queue for flashpoints. players are so unreliable so its hard to find a good group it takes for ever. theres too many heroic quests like i said it takes forever to find a good group and the heroics are impossible to solo. there is only 1 area to quest per alliance which is *********** ridiculous. they should have focused more on content and less on gosh darn voice acting. the side quests are boring you have to walk across the planet to get to them its just a big mess. because of the 1 zone per alliance per level it feels as though there no freedom to play the way you want and level at the rate you want because everyone is doing the exact same quests, getting the exact same gear etc. it shouldnt even be classified as a rpg imo in almost all rpgs theres freedom to choose where you want to level. this is basically a sad version of kotor. every thing else is pretty good i guess. but bottom line i think im gonna go for another 5 years on wow.

 

Read the first line of this and stopped reading. Quit trying to whitewash WoW, it's got problems and so does BioWare's Swtor. Frankly, I was being too harsh earlier. Swtor just came out, give it time. WoW didn't have a Auto-queue at first, and it USED- I state used- To have a Community. I'm never going back to WoW after what blizzard's done to butcher it. Swtor is fun for me, if it isn't for you, go home and hang out with a bunch of no-lifer trolls that'll betray you as soon as they can if they think it'll give them ***** and giggles.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Jellison

[VoidGlider]

That is ridiculous. Hey check out my new car, it was released as functional but it doesnt have a radio, air conditioning or windshield wipers, the company released it early to start gaining some revenue, they say they'll mail me the parts later.

 

Ahh, I can see you have clearly bought a Ferrari

[BowtheMan]

So, with your example, motorcycles are a failing product?

 

No, but they certainly dont demand the consumer base that cars do. They succeed based upon the fact that they can be made for cheap yet sold to a few for a high profit margin. We all know SWTOR was not cheap to produce, and is relatively inexpensive, therefore to be successful it must appeal to a wide audience.

 

By bringing up the example of a motorcycle you're essentially comparing a game with perhaps the most mainstream name in the history of entertainment (Star Wars) to a product that appeals to a very small percentage of the population (motorcycles).

 

Essentially diluting this convo and removing any true relation to the topic.

 

The fact is, Bioware had the benefit of 8 years of observation, seeing what made WoW successful and what stunted its growth. Yet they chose to ignore and not include many aspects that made it great, and made it a household name even outside of the gaming community, do you not see that as a problem?

[BowtheMan]

Ahh, I can see you have clearly bought a Ferrari

 

Lol, again, specialty product. small market, large profit margins. SWTOR doesn't have that luxury.

[VoidGlider]

Lol, again, specialty product. small market, large profit margins. SWTOR doesn't have that luxury.

 

Hehe, I know bud. Just having a laugh. Thing is, I'm on the fence with this. I can see peoples wants/needs and can agree with them, even if I will not use them myself. But in the same respect I am a sort of layed back guy and can wait.

 

I enjoy that rocky start and sticking through the development of a game. I feel like I have helped/contributed to a better product in the end (sort of like my first car, a Mini Cooper S). If BW wants it in their game at the end of the day, it will come........ Just not in the next patch or quick enough for those who it matters too.

 

The ball is in their court as to what they want to do. Stick and see what comes, or leave and hopefuly find something more enjoyable. Online or in the fresh air

[hattmazzer]

The other thing to remember is that it's not like they developed this game in a week and had the entire time WoW has been around to look at things. The idea behind this game began developing many years ago. Those are important things to remember as well. Also, anyone who has written any kind of business model should know that you have to prioritize what product/services are most important for you to succeed. I believe this game has a great base on which to build and look forward to watching it grow. While it may not have some of the "good" tools that other games currently have, the development time for implementing similar things should be much less. Therefore the growth curve for this game should be faster than for those in the past. It will be an interesting ride and I for one intend to stay behind it.

[Jedi_Micklesto]

The other thing to remember is that it's not like they developed this game in a week and had the entire time WoW has been around to look at things. The idea behind this game began developing many years ago. Those are important things to remember as well. Also, anyone who has written any kind of business model should know that you have to prioritize what product/services are most important for you to succeed. I believe this game has a great base on which to build and look forward to watching it grow. While it may not have some of the "good" tools that other games currently have, the development time for implementing similar things should be much less. Therefore the growth curve for this game should be faster than for those in the past. It will be an interesting ride and I for one intend to stay behind it.

 

I have to agree. This game has been in development and will continue to be more fully developed in the near future. I am having immense fun with this game and part of that has to do with the fact that I played the original games and I am an avid fan of the Star Wars Universe. Are there things I would love to see added to this game? Of course. I would love to have dual spec, love to have a more comprehensive LFG system and I think those things will come in time. The game has been out a month and has a good following and from people I talk to in the game is being enjoyed by many. I think it will get better and things will improve but lets give it some time. Nothing is perfect when it first comes out and takes some time to make it better.

[pakchooieunf]

This makes sense to me. Or would you have postponed release another 6 months so you can have a dungeon finder?

 

False dilemma, straw man etc.. Try again.

 

But for the record, **** a dungeon finder - I would've happily waited another 6 months for a game that doesn't require me to stare at the lower 1/3 of the screen to monitor tiny icon timers and cool downs.

Edited January 26, 2012 by pakchooieunf

[shadowrouge]

ive played wow for about 5 years so its hard not to compare. sure the game just came out but when wow came out it had more than swtor. first of all you cant queue for flashpoints. players are so unreliable so its hard to find a good group it takes for ever. theres too many heroic quests like i said it takes forever to find a good group and the heroics are impossible to solo. there is only 1 area to quest per alliance which is *********** ridiculous. they should have focused more on content and less on gosh darn voice acting. the side quests are boring you have to walk across the planet to get to them its just a big mess. because of the 1 zone per alliance per level it feels as though there no freedom to play the way you want and level at the rate you want because everyone is doing the exact same quests, getting the exact same gear etc. it shouldnt even be classified as a rpg imo in almost all rpgs theres freedom to choose where you want to level. this is basically a sad version of kotor. every thing else is pretty good i guess. but bottom line i think im gonna go for another 5 years on wow.

 

Awesome go enjoy your panda's. You say there is not enough content yet at the same time you say there are TO MANY HEROICS. ***? I find myself having to SKIP some of the content because I am out leveling it.

[Zandragal]

ive played wow for about 5 years so its hard not to compare. sure the game just came out but when wow came out it had more than swtor. first of all you cant queue for flashpoints. players are so unreliable so its hard to find a good group it takes for ever. theres too many heroic quests like i said it takes forever to find a good group and the heroics are impossible to solo. there is only 1 area to quest per alliance which is *********** ridiculous. they should have focused more on content and less on gosh darn voice acting. the side quests are boring you have to walk across the planet to get to them its just a big mess. because of the 1 zone per alliance per level it feels as though there no freedom to play the way you want and level at the rate you want because everyone is doing the exact same quests, getting the exact same gear etc. it shouldnt even be classified as a rpg imo in almost all rpgs theres freedom to choose where you want to level. this is basically a sad version of kotor. every thing else is pretty good i guess. but bottom line i think im gonna go for another 5 years on wow.

 

Pro troll, man.

 

Not.

[shadowrouge]

I want to know why no one seems to know that there is a LFG feature in the game. Sure its not up to par with say DDO. Which IMO is the best LFG feature in any game. yes even better than the one in wow. It launched with the game and doesnt Cross sever. It list every one looking for a group, what content they are going to do and the lvl of players they are looking for.

 

LFG feature done right. Cross server LFG to me would kill this game. But doing something like DDO's would make the LFG that is here better. But it DOES have an LFG.

[FleshMauler]

...For the people comparing this game to WoW, do you realise how long it took for WoW to develop things like a dungeon finder? More raids? General game fixes?

 

To put it a little in perspective it took Bliz around 8 months to make battlegrounds. Seriously if things are upsetting you this much atm, wait 2 months and come back when SWTOR has more of its **** together. You'll be behind everyone else on content, gear, proffesion, and money, but you'll get your stupid LFG tool.

 

I am not bashing SWTOR or WoW, I loved and enjoyed WoW for [too] much of my life and think that SWTOR is a worthy replacement... keeping everything in perspective.

[Obadaya]

Hm... I really don't have a problem doing anything that the OP is complaining about. Don't even have a problem needing to get groups for optionally challenging content (not sure what what complaint is about).

 

It would be nice if there was a queue or better LFG tool, but every time I check the current tool I'm the only one flagged, so not sure how another unused tool would help. As far as being auto-queued for a group, I'd rather communicate with people to get them the group so I know what I'm getting into.

[JediKamo]

I did WoW since late Vanilla and enjoyed my time there (well until Cataclysm tbh). Now I play SWTOR with no looking back. The reason for this is that SWTOR gives me more of what I want (excellent stories and feeling heroic) while WoW seems to move away from these things.

 

I think comparing the two games is comparing apples and oranges. WoW and SWTOR give different experiences and the game one likes better will be different on the experience one wants.