Tygranir Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 EQ2 looked better but wow still looked good. it is possible for two games to look good but one look better you know. Yes, but I never thought WoW was visually pleasant. It worked, because it was Warcraft and Warcraft was always cartoony, but I would never say Warcraft looked better than Age of Empires. The fellow you quoted before said WoW looks better than SWTOR. That would be like comparing Final Fantasy 4 to Skyrim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomsaga Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) Yes, but I never thought WoW was visually pleasant. It worked, because it was Warcraft and Warcraft was always cartoony, but I would never say Warcraft looked better than Age of Empires. The fellow you quoted before said WoW looks better than SWTOR. That would be like comparing Final Fantasy 4 to Skyrim. no its not ff4 and skyrim were made in different years. i think you missed my point completely. unless skyim and ff4 were made in the same year of course.... Edited January 23, 2012 by Doomsaga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygranir Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 no its not ff4 and skyrim were made in different years. i think you missed my point completely. unless skyim and ff4 were made in the same year of course.... I get what you were saying. For it's time, it didn't look bad. That's fine. What I'm saying is that I wouldn't compare it to SWTOR at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelooney Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Assuming your day even got started Some WoW servers were down; 4 out of 7 days at launch. It was due to server overload, and that's something that's impossible to beta test. Demand for the game skyrocketed after the initial reviews of the games were out, and what was initially a rather stable gaming experience (how do you think the initial reviewers were able to play the game?) turned into the lag out fest coupled with 1 - 2 hour queues. But that speaks volume of how popular the game was, and how people couldn't wait to try it for themselves. And here's another thing - through the crashes, through the loot lag, through the servers queues and roll backs, people stuck through. WoW subscription kept on increasing at a rapid rate all the way to middle of wrath (the oft sited 12 mill concurrent subscription). Here's another thing I don't think people mention when comparing wow to swtor - if you took just the outline of the characters, could you tell what race they are in swtor? If you saw just the skeletal animation, would you say it was a sith, or the human, or the twilek? Answer is 'No', btw. But in wow, not only is each race visually distinct, just looking at the animation you can differentiate between the races. Fault wow for getting stale, of going more for profit then gameplay, of not fixing population imbalance, and dying servers (all legitimate problems). No need to make outlandish claims to make swtor look better. Let the game speak for itself. If it becomes a huge success, that's vindication. If it fails, then well, life goes on. GW2, Diablo 3, tons of other game on the horizon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomsaga Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I get what you were saying. For it's time, it didn't look bad. That's fine. What I'm saying is that I wouldn't compare it to SWTOR at all. all im saying is i dont think swtor is up to par on graphics as it should but im ok with that if it didnt run like it was ghaphically intensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikefu Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 -The argument, "the game is competing with 2012 WoW, not 2004 WoW" actually holds very little merit in terms of bugs/stability. WoW has, indeed, had 7+ years to refine its engine, to iron out every conceivable bug since its release. So far it has done exactly that -- if you observe WoW's latest patch notes, from even as far back as one year, or even two, you will notice how very few "bug fixes" make it in. Since WoW's conception, however, the bugs were numerous. Remember falling through the world? Remember the fabled "character with that name already exists" error that wasn't fixed until several years down the line? However, the stability issues that were present were but a small smear on the pages of the game's long history. Once they were fixed, no one really noticed. The "status quo" mentality that comes from bugs in video games is exactly what's happening with SW:ToR now -- whatever is wrong receives the most attention, while everything that runs smooth is taken as a given. Several months, or even years down the line, the minor quibbles today will be long-forgotten. -The fact is, many of SW:ToR's shortcomings come from one simple thing: coding a new engine. No amount of "standards" and "ideas" or any jump in technology can magically fix the complex creation that is coding a brand new engine. Human error and logistical problems will always exist, and there is no way around this. You cannot craft something as complex as a MMORPG and NOT have any sort of bug or stability issue. Some have the patience to deal with this, while others, unfortunately, do not. +1 Everyone focuses on the handful of things that have major errors and not the massive amount of things that it got right. SW:TOR isn't perfect now and definitely needs some love, but give it a few months and it will definitely get that love and then some. In 2019 a new shiny MMO will be out and people will be moaning and groaning about how buggy it is compared to SW:TOR which will have 7+ years of patches and bug fixes at that point. The cycle will be true for every MMO ever released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tygranir Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 +1 Everyone focuses on the handful of things that have major errors and not the massive amount of things that it got right. SW:TOR isn't perfect now and definitely needs some love, but give it a few months and it will definitely get that love and then some. In 2019 a new shiny MMO will be out and people will be moaning and groaning about how buggy it is compared to SW:TOR which will have 7+ years of patches and bug fixes at that point. The cycle will be true for every MMO ever released. 2019.... Twilight MMO ftw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesira Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) Um, when WoW launched they had tons of bugs, the servers crashed alot, there were tons of falling through the world situations, they even had to shut down the dungeon system for a week to fix the mass amounts of bugs with that. They got their crap together, dealt with it, and turned into the mega success that it is. SW:TOR has it's bugs, and some of them are surprising that they even exist I will admit; but very few of them were ever game breaking, the ones that were are now fixed, and the ones that remain are minor inconveniences at best. They're getting their crap together, the success of SW:TOR compared to WOW will be comparing apples to oranges. Different era, different market. Edited January 23, 2012 by Jesira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomsaga Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Um, when WoW launched they had tons of bugs, the servers crashed alot, there were tons of falling through the world situations, they even had to shut down the dungeon system for a week to fix the mass amounts of bugs with that. They got their crap together, dealt with it, and turned into the mega success that it is. SW:TOR has it's bugs, and some of them are surprising that they even exist I will admit; but very few of them were ever game breaking, the ones that were are now fixed, and the ones that remain are minor inconveniences at best. They're getting their crap together, the success of SW:TOR compared to WOW will be comparing apples to oranges. Different era, different market. i'd call ability delay anything but minor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublmaker Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 It was due to server overload, and that's something that's impossible to beta test. Demand for the game skyrocketed after the initial reviews of the games were out, and what was initially a rather stable gaming experience (how do you think the initial reviewers were able to play the game?) turned into the lag out fest coupled with 1 - 2 hour queues. But that speaks volume of how popular the game was, and how people couldn't wait to try it for themselves. And here's another thing - through the crashes, through the loot lag, through the servers queues and roll backs, people stuck through. WoW subscription kept on increasing at a rapid rate all the way to middle of wrath (the oft sited 12 mill concurrent subscription). Here's another thing I don't think people mention when comparing wow to swtor - if you took just the outline of the characters, could you tell what race they are in swtor? If you saw just the skeletal animation, would you say it was a sith, or the human, or the twilek? Answer is 'No', btw. But in wow, not only is each race visually distinct, just looking at the animation you can differentiate between the races. Fault wow for getting stale, of going more for profit then gameplay, of not fixing population imbalance, and dying servers (all legitimate problems). No need to make outlandish claims to make swtor look better. Let the game speak for itself. If it becomes a huge success, that's vindication. If it fails, then well, life goes on. GW2, Diablo 3, tons of other game on the horizon. http://vnboards.ign.com/world_of_warcraft_general_board/b19789/107608654/p1 Nothing outlandish. Just statements from players of WoW at it's launch. I personally have never played WoW, nor do I intend to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomsaga Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 http://vnboards.ign.com/world_of_warcraft_general_board/b19789/107608654/p1 Nothing outlandish. Just statements from players of WoW at it's launch. I personally have never played WoW, nor do I intend to. never played wow? should of ignored this post than kept on truckin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The time scales are also very different. The most tardcore were just hitting 60 a month in wow, the first Ragnaros kill was 5 months after release. Swtor has been cleared in under a month. BUT BUT BUT, you need to compare WOW NOW to SWTOR. Deathwing was killed in 3 hours on the 4.3 release. That content is supposed to last 6-12 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrage Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 EverQuest 2 had all these at launch and was released a couple weeks before Wow, so I guess you could say that EQ2 invented them, not WoW. WoW had them first. WoW sat in beta for like 36 months. EQ2 like 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantragk Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I have to say those talking about how planets are extremely huge and what not. Yes they are... very much so. But they're also pretty much barren waste lands. When leveling I was shocked to see more than 2 people outside of the cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aetla Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Early WoW 2004 Early ToR 2011 Guys, get serious! Seven years and tons of other MMO games for gods sake... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 WoW had them first. WoW sat in beta for like 36 months. EQ2 like 6 months. Actually, they were all in other games before WoW or EQ2 I'm pretty sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Cruiser Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Let's compare WoW of 2012 with SWTOR of 2012 instead, because that's the only relevant discussion to the consumers of 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtim Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 BUT BUT BUT, you need to compare WOW NOW to SWTOR. Deathwing was killed in 3 hours on the 4.3 release. That content is supposed to last 6-12 months. Just to be clear, LFR Deathwing was not supposed to last hardcore raiders 6-12 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomsaga Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Actually, they were all in other games before WoW or EQ2 I'm pretty sure. nope your wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauris Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Dude there were DPS and threat meters in 05/06. Just not the ones you use today obviously. There were Boss mods, that wasn't called deadly boss mods in 05/06 as well I remember using all those things for BWL when it came out and in Molten Core/AQ40. When all that stuff was relatively new. Eh... Not really. I was still the one guy in our 40 man who had to write down and time all of the boss abilities and their cooldowns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coramac Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Eh... Not really. I was still the one guy in our 40 man who had to write down and time all of the boss abilities and their cooldowns. They were out. The boss mods weren't out for the initial content at release I'm pretty sure. There was Decursive. That may have been worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauris Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) BUT BUT BUT, you need to compare WOW NOW to SWTOR. Deathwing was killed in 3 hours on the 4.3 release. That content is supposed to last 6-12 months. It took 40 people to complete a raid in vanilla. That is a lot of gearing time, and a lot of prep. It takes 10 people to do a raid in Cataclysm. You can also do raids through LFR (lol easy practice mode). In Vanilla, Rag was not the first raid end boss. There were many other before him. Deathwing was the only end boss of this patch. It took about 1 month for people to kill heroic Deathwing, which is certainly long enough in my mind. Hell, to date, only 90 guilds have killed him on heroic. Edited January 23, 2012 by Jauris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alienstalker Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 So basically your complaining that the game came out with less bugs and crap to fix, and you don't have as much wait time to get onto the game. As opposed to a game where it came out with far more bugs and crap to fix in early game and made players sit through tons of updates all the time. Yeah makes so much sense, not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Eh... Not really. I was still the one guy in our 40 man who had to write down and time all of the boss abilities and their cooldowns. Hehe I was that guy who just got out of the fire and watched my debuffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantragk Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 So basically your complaining that the game came out with less bugs and crap to fix, and you don't have as much wait time to get onto the game. As opposed to a game where it came out with far more bugs and crap to fix in early game and made players sit through tons of updates all the time. Yeah makes so much sense, not. I think it depends on who you're asking. I'm complaining about no other similar level planets to level on except for the ones you have to follow for your story line. I don't like having to go the exact same route EVERY character that I level because there will only be 4-7 quest per planet that are in any way shape or form different. The rest are the exact same every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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