Sentinels L2P. They are a good class. Some SPOILERS

[Esbia]

This thread does contain some spoilers for the Inquisitor and Knight story.

 

So I've been reading on the forums for a while now how Sentinels are a scrub class and difficult to solo etc. I just wanted to offer my two cents on the matter.

 

Firstly my SWTOR CV:

 

Level 50 Sith Assassin

Level 42 Jedi Sentinel

 

First I'll post my Sentinel spec so people can understand what types of skills I use etc:

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/jedi_knight/sentinel/?build_id=307#::f2e2f4ef5ef6e3fe5fe4fe3f20:307

 

Now, I have levelled both an assassin and sentinel to (near) endgame and I can honestly say that I have found the sentinel easier going by quite a stretch. So far with the sentinel I have been able to solo everything without much trouble. Obviously I've died once or twice, but so far I've never come across a boss who I've wiped to more than once. Now the assassin was a completely different experience for me. I would dread to come up against any elite post Dromund Kaas and would regularly wipe to a number of elite bosses a considerable number of times. For the Zash encounter I actually had to get one of my guildies to help me since I was struggling so much with it. This has never happened with the sentinel.

 

Now the argument is not that the sentinel is a better class and actually the assassin is crap etc. The argument is that my style of play differed A LOT from when I levelled my Assassin to when I levelled my Sentinel.

 

My Assassin was my first class, and I just wanted to experience the game without playing too hardcore, so I just randomly put skill points into the Deception tree without really working out a suitable build. My play style was very similar, I would use any skill which seemed suitable at the time rather than trying to figure out a rotation. It's only until endgame when I started doing HMs and Raids with guildies that I worked out a proper build and rotation for my sin.

 

My sentinel gameplay couldn't be more different. Before I even made the class, I picked out a high dps build and figured out what rotations I would need and how I would adapt early game to crucial skills lacking in lower levels. Then I ran the majority of the game as if I was in a Raid. That might sound extreme, but it's really not. You just get used to your rotations for any fight and it becomes like second nature. I didn't even struggle with the Lord Scourge fight which is considered to be a difficult fight (except the Emperor ofc which is impossible I hear). I took him down my second try, without much effort (he was same level as me btw, it wasn't was because I was 3 levels above or something).

 

 

Now for those of you naysayers who claim that the sentinel is a difficult class to play, I will teach you how to solo this class properly so you can stop QQing. One of the most important things about the sentinel is the sheer amount of utility he has. If you can use your utility correctly, then no elite or boss should get your health below 50% even without Doc.

 

A few extremely important skills (remember this is with the build I posted above):

 

Saber Ward and Rebuke: You get these skills very early on in the game and there is no excuses not to use them against eiltes and boss fights. Pop them together just before a boss fight and they won't hit you for **** as long as they're up.

 

Force Kick: Most important skill IMO. You can get this skill's CD down to 6 secs by level 27 using any good Watchman build. If you spam this enough, no boss will ever be able to hit you hard.

 

Pacify: You get it relatively late (26), but once you have it, there is no excuse never to use it. Once Saber Ward and Rebuke are down pop this on the boss and he won't be able to hit you for **** for another 6 seconds.

 

Force Camouflage: IMO much less important than the others but if you're low on health and want to quickly get aggro off you, then this is a great skill.

 

These 5 skills alone IMO make the Sentinel a much better class to play than an Assassin. The only utility I have as an assassin is electrocute which is 4 sec cc and jolt which is 12 sec cd interrupt. Ofc if I L2P with that class early on too, I would have struggled less, but each class has its advantages and disadvantages. The Assassin will have higher initial burst DPS so will take elites down quicker. But the sentinel has incredible survivability with the utility he has. By the time all of his important utility skills are on CD, he should have build up enough damage on the boss to get them down to at least 40% health.

 

Of course there is one thing. The fact that the sentinels rotations are longer and more complicated may make him seem like a more difficult class to play. But he's not. Once you master the rotation of both, both are as easy as each other.

 

L2P folks. The sentinel does not need buffing in PVE. It is an amazing class and I personally prefer him to my sin.

[wrmrstacrdwower]

So the fact that a well played watchman marginally tops out a well played DPS Guardian in DPS means the class is fine?

 

Nice to know.

Edited January 22, 2012 by wrmrstacrdwower

[Pushbutton]

So the fact that a well played watchman marginally tops out a well played DPS Guardian in DPS means the class is fine?

 

Nice to know.

 

How do you know this? We have no DPS meters so there is no way to test a equal geared DPS Guard against an equal geared DPS Sent. Unless of course if by DPS you mean the number of damage done at the end of a pvp round... Which is the most useless stat given at the end. Damage does not equal kills, your focus should be on doing the LEAST damage with the most kills. That means your damage is actually doing something rather than being wasted as healing fodder.

 

To the OP. I fully agree with you. As a player of both a Sin and a Sent, the Sent was far easier to level. Unlike you, I had a full plan in place as to what I wanted my Sin spec to be before I began, but the Sin has lower DPS and fewer survival talents for the majority of the leveling. For me there was a HUGE bump in power at level 36 with my Sin when I got my healing companion and my healing force lightning talent. I never experienced this with my Sent. I felt sufficiently capable throughout my leveling and never really ran into an issue.

[Detcelfer]

Sentinels are so weak compared to Troopers and BH's its pathetic. Whatever numbers you can pull, they can to, and do it better while at ranged.

 

Buff sentinels!

[OldxLady]

How do you know this? We have no DPS meters so there is no way to test a equal geared DPS Guard against an equal geared DPS Sent. Unless of course if by DPS you mean the number of damage done at the end of a pvp round... Which is the most useless stat given at the end. Damage does not equal kills, your focus should be on doing the LEAST damage with the most kills. That means your damage is actually doing something rather than being wasted as healing fodder.

 

Have you any idea how the "Kills" in WZ work?

 

* You only need to tuch the player and let some one else kill him for you to get a kill.

* Killing blow is who got the last hit and has nothing to do with skill.

* And solo kills just means you are not doing any objectives.

 

So yes, total damage done in the end of the much is a much better indicater of skill or usfulnss than any of the kill stats. If you are not near the top, it just means you are not doing your job as Sent which is doing damage and killing stuff.

[Soarlozer]

Have you any idea how the "Kills" in WZ work?

 

* You only need to tuch the player and let some one else kill him for you to get a kill.

* Killing blow is who got the last hit and has nothing to do with skill.

* And solo kills just means you are not doing any objectives.

 

So yes, total damage done in the end of the much is a much better indicater of skill or usfulnss than any of the kill stats. If you are not near the top, it just means you are not doing your job as Sent which is doing damage and killing stuff.

 

They are equally important/worthless.

 

There is no indicator for how effective you played, ie interupts and healing debuff. Also there has been many times that I have been able to indirectly save teammates with speed buff/protection, pacify, choke, snares, and just pure opening up on the enemy.

 

Videos mean more to sentinels performance then some screenshot of score board. It is easy to top the charts while not doing the objectives or in a premade.

 

I agree with sentinels being a good class, its a shame if I went by what forums said I would have never tried it out.

 

-Sources: 42 Combat Sent.

[Metallistic]

Oh man, one of those pretentious threads...

 

"I'm 1337, look at me. I will use this opportunity to stroke my e-peen, while ignoring significant issues."

 

First of all... Listing some sentinel skills and writing some half-assed explanations for them does not prove ANYTHING. Being Captain Obvious is unnecessary.

 

You sure wrote something, but was there anything of value? No. You did not provide any comparison whatsoever. And no, not everything is *********** OK. And this is not a L2P issue. As soon as I saw the mind-numbing, absolutely retarded title containing "L2P" I quickly realized what a pile of garbage this was going to be.

 

Both in PvE and PvP we are quite a lot behind other classes in comparison. What you did was judge the class by ITSELF and then you put out the pretentious "L2P" statement? Well pardon me, but I am allergic to BS.

 

Not only this, but you stated that the class is fine, while you only "covered" the PvE aspect (...the word "covered" in this case is STRONGLY exaggerated). I wanted to blow my brains out after reading such illogical crap. Not to mention that you speak from very limited experience. The hardest PvE fights are in the mid and upper forties. You reached lvl42 and felt like you could lecture people who roll Sentinels as their mains? I am sorry, but how can you expect me to take you seriously when you did not even do your homework?

 

The utility may seem great in theory but you exaggerate the survivability to a degree, which is laughable. I can't even imagine how you decided to bring up the survivability of the Sentinel as a strong point when in reality this couldn't be any further from the truth. I have managed to go through the PvE content without many tough obstacles, but there are other classes, who just do not have ANY due to some of their superiority when it comes to utility, healing and EVEN DPS. The issues in PvE are not so alarming, but there are definitely some drawbacks when it comes to using the Sentinel class in comparison to other classes.

 

I will say this again - I love how you skipped the whole PvP aspect and did some poor conclusion, declaring that the class is fine. The biggest problems of Sentinel shine the brightest in PvP and no, I will say it again since ignorant kids overuse this expression, this is not a "L2P" issue. Having obvious class disadvantages is not a matter of player's skill or abilities. Compared to the rest, we have really poor CC (nothing like the incredible force push, nice knockback, knockdown etc.). Also, I will repeat myself, you overglorify the survivability, which is short-lived and pales in comparison to that of most of the other classes. After our defensive CDs are down, we get shredded to pieces.

 

Whatever we can do, other classes can do it better... And survive longer... And CC better...

 

So what in the blue hell made you think Sentinel is "fine"? Judging the class by itself takes you nowhere and such method is beyond pointless.

 

So before you try to lecture the community, I would suggest putting more effort into critical thinking rather than proving yourself as being "1337" and spewing out childish garbage such as "L2P".

Edited January 23, 2012 by Metallistic

[Csdabest]

How many Sents d you see hit over 300k dmg. Now how many Inqus, Ops, BH, Gunsling do you see hit those numbers in comparison.

[Vibeth]

Another blatant L2P screamer, nothing to see here.

[deet]

Oh man, one of those pretentious threads...

 

"I'm 1337, look at me. I will use this opportunity to stroke my e-peen, while ignoring significant issues."

 

First of all... Listing some sentinel skills and writing some half-assed explanations for them does not prove ANYTHING. Being Captain Obvious is unnecessary.

 

You sure wrote something, but was there anything of value? No. You did not provide any comparison whatsoever. And no, not everything is *********** OK. And this is not a L2P issue. As soon as I saw the mind-numbing, absolutely retarded title containing "L2P" I quickly realized what a pile of garbage this was going to be.

 

Both in PvE and PvP we are quite a lot behind other classes in comparison. What you did was judge the class by ITSELF and then you put out the pretentious "L2P" statement? Well pardon me, but I am allergic to BS.

 

Not only this, but you stated that the class is fine, while you only "covered" the PvE aspect (...the word "covered" in this case is STRONGLY exaggerated). I wanted to blow my brains out after reading such illogical crap. Not to mention that you speak from very limited experience. The hardest PvE fights are in the mid and upper forties. You reached lvl42 and felt like you could lecture people who roll Sentinels as their mains? I am sorry, but how can you expect me to take you seriously when you did not even do your homework?

 

The utility may seem great in theory but you exaggerate the survivability to a degree, which is laughable. I can't even imagine how you decided to bring up the survivability of the Sentinel as a strong point when in reality this couldn't be any further from the truth. I have managed to go through the PvE content without many tough obstacles, but there are other classes, who just do not have ANY due to some of their superiority when it comes to utility, healing and EVEN DPS. The issues in PvE are not so alarming, but there are definitely some drawbacks when it comes to using the Sentinel class in comparison to other classes.

 

I will say this again - I love how you skipped the whole PvP aspect and did some poor conclusion, declaring that the class is fine. The biggest problems of Sentinel shine the brightest in PvP and no, I will say it again since ignorant kids overuse this expression, this is not a "L2P" issue. Having obvious class disadvantages is not a matter of player's skill or abilities. Compared to the rest, we have really poor CC (nothing like the incredible force push, nice knockback, knockdown etc.). Also, I will repeat myself, you overglorify the survivability, which is short-lived and pales in comparison to that of most of the other classes. After our defensive CDs are down, we get shredded to pieces.

 

Whatever we can do, other classes can do it better... And survive longer... And CC better...

 

So what in the blue hell made you think Sentinel is "fine"? Judging the class by itself takes you nowhere and such method is beyond pointless.

 

So before you try to lecture the community, I would suggest putting more effort into critical thinking rather than proving yourself as being "1337" and spewing out childish garbage such as "L2P".

 

Someone just got shut down

 

/signed

[Leekae]

This isn't my first day at the rodeo, but this class is badly broken. After playing other classes, it's sooo glaring that sentinel is weak that I literally have very little desire to play my sentinel anymore, even though he's very well geared.

 

We have no knockback

 

we must be in melee for the vast majority of our skills

 

We are the only class (warriors) that don't get an in combat self heal

 

We wear medium armor

 

Our DPS on our off hands is atrocious

 

Animation delays kill our skills

 

There's just so much more I could say, but I hope you get the point. To really play well you have to be extremely well geared and be a biochem. That's really it. Even then it's a struggle and alot of work to do your team (pvp) any good.

 

Did I mention you aren't wanted in pve groups? Yea that's a problem.

[sexysolo]

Did I mention you aren't wanted in pve groups? Yea that's a problem.

 

Not at all. Either you have a bad reputation or the group leader is a *******. We have amazing ST DPS and great survivability.

[OldxLady]

Not at all. Either you have a bad reputation or the group leader is a *******. We have amazing ST DPS and great survivability.

 

 

Ohh come on... We dont have "amazing" DPS. If you say that you dont know the class. Commando/BH has amazing DPS so does DPS speced Smugglers/IA. Sents have an ok DPS.

 

The only reason we have ok DPS or DD as some say is because of our need to build up the abilities to get any good numbers.

1. Build up focus --> To at all do any good damage

2. Build up abilities --> Start Building your dots so you can use Zen, or start with Precise Strike and Blade rush to do good crit with Balde storm ect.

3 Build more Forucs ---> To than sustain the Damage.

 

All this take time and the fact that we are meele makes our so callled DPS be low.

 

So o paper it seems like we have huge DPS and DD capability, but in reality it aint true at all.

Edited January 23, 2012 by OldxLady

[Soulaufein]

[quote=Leekae;2047167

 

Our DPS on our off hands is atrocious

 

Animation delays kill our skills

 

IMO, the two MAJOR issues for the Sentinels. In PvP, specially the animation delays and overall character responsiveness. Actually, I think if this was fixed and the offhand base damage percentage was a bit upped, we would be quite alright IMO.

 

Remember kids: Sentinel will never be a constant top DPS class. We have no AoE. What we DO have is what I like to call "meaninful DPS". And in that regard, you can be sure we are reasonable. With the buffs/changes mentioned earlier, we would actually be pretty strong in single target DPS.