Frogstomp Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Sorry I am confused, why would players who do not like the arena system claim they do not want it when it is a 100% voluntary action? There is a smaller minority of people who love arena who love the fact that your fighting on a ladder system, that there is zero chance of anyone interrupting your fight and it all comes down to you and your partners skill. Yes of course some balancing would take place on classes all arena would do is put a spot like on the too powerful classes so Bioware may allow balance. World of Warcraft had massive diversity in there classes that caused huge balance issues constantly, Swtor has very very similar mechanics entwined into each class that would save tones of nerf/buff patchs. Things Swtor could do better to Arena type pvp -> Same rewards for Arena pvp as all other type battlegrounds? (same gain rate, so people who only like arena dont have to play huttball against/with bots and afks.) ->I always felt the competitive edge of different gear was what made Arena fun the guy with the legendary hit hard that how it was supposed to work. Swtor could simply auto buff stats to the same level (just like low lvls in bgs) so that regardless of your gear it actually did come down to skill. TLDR : Arenas were fun in wow, a lot of people used them. Why are there masses of people so against in a 100% voluntary action in a game? TLDR: You say arenas were fun in WoW. I do not want another arena system set up that way. Here is why, in a few brief points: 1. The "100% voluntary action" line is BS. WoW's system "required" you to arena or fall behind gear wise. 2. 2v2 or even 3v3 to a degree makes class imbalances obviously glaring. If you want a ranked system, do 4v4 "mini" BG style on a ladder rank system since you can't premade 8v8 at this point anyways. 3. You point out that you liked gear differences, then suggest everything be auto-balanced in the same paragraph. Um... what? ----- Really they just need to add an option to do some kind of premade PVP that doesn't leave you with half a team of pugs. That way the people who really WANT the cookie cutter premade "challenge" can go bang their e-peens against each other all they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knockerz Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) Wow had how many subs, what percent pvped in the arena? Out of a few million subs, i think you would be lucky to say a few thousand used the arena at any one given time. I think this game has a lot more pressing issues at its current state then to implement an arena system. I like to say that mmos that start with pvp as a secondary playstyle are always in trouble from the get go. The bottomline as someone pointed out, casual players cannot compete for the most part with hardcore players, the two need to be separated. It would be like me playing golf a couple times a week trying to match up to Tiger Woods, its not gonna happen. You wouldnt expect any pro sport team to match up to a college or highschool team, so why would expect any different here. There is a time(practice) factor that people are not recognizing. Regardless, of the system they implement here, if they dont recognize the two completely different playstyles you will always have a component that feels underpowered. The only difference is that pro-sports are profitable and catering to elitist in mmorpg is not. It's a bit ironic without arena becoming a profitable e-sport you can't support it due to it's high cost and maintenance to population ratio that support it. That's why BW or any future mmorpg will cater to the casuals. I don't think the majority of arena elitist players realize that some of their ideas about rewarding gear to top rank players or other similar ideas is detrimental for arena, especially if they want an e-sport. You need to keep the game mechanics simple enough that viewers who don't play can follow the matches. Matches need to be exciting. If matches were as exciting as the last final wow tournament with that hunter team, then I would probably willing to pay to watch. However, almost every match consist of the same class composition, which makes matches boring fast. The level of complexity is also difficult to follow for some who never played wow. Game mechanics need to be easy enough so that games can be watchable by non-players. A lot of what arena players recommend is detrimental for arena and only helps their own ego centric believes about their game play. That's why I am oppose to most of what arena players post, cause it won't lead to major innovation in arena that will help arena become competitive like starcraft or cs. If you want arena to be recognized as an e-sport your going to have to make concessions that will deflate some of your egos and many arena advocates aren't willing to part with that at moment. Edited January 31, 2012 by Knockerz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archendrus Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 It's easy. If you don't like arenas, then you don't play it. If you don't like it, then you sure as hell don't need the gear from it so no point in whining about that either. The reason people whine is because they know they CANT get it because they don't have what it takes which again makes them feel it's unfair. Nope, and here's the reason: I like to PvP. I don't like arena. How can you say a PvP'er doesn't need PvP gear? Giving out the best gear for arena is unfair because, just as you said, "If you don't like arenas, then you don't play it." Which means, if you don't like it, don't play it, but you will be gimped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) i would be in favor of a 4v4 arena. make some smaller maps with similar objectives to the current warzones, have them still reward warzone comms so that there is no need to add addtional gear. honestly, i am tired of queuing a 4man premade only to get 4 fkuc-heads as the other half of my team, which causes us to lose. if i could queue with just 4 people and know there wont be any random outside influences on whether we win or not, i would be a very happy pvper edit: even better, have the arenas reward you with mercenary comms. would give an incentive to try a little of both, but you could still get the pvp rewards doing just warzones Edited January 31, 2012 by cashogy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunsu Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Nope, and here's the reason: I like to PvP. I don't like arena. How can you say a PvP'er doesn't need PvP gear? Giving out the best gear for arena is unfair because, just as you said, "If you don't like arenas, then you don't play it." Which means, if you don't like it, don't play it, but you will be gimped. Unless you were only able to use your gear in the arena, and i bet most pro arena people wouldnt go for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrydust Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Too much would have to change to make arena any fun in this game. If they had arenas or rated warzones's right now, it would be horrible. They didn't even try to cheat proof the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngryBuddhist Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The only way to make arenas viable at the moment would be to give everyone the teleport hack. Or the multi-hack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FtDParadox Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Rated PvP is coming, deal with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaliem Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 For starters, I previously stated I do not care about the gear being in line or less from Arena. now as for everyone complaining about the gear difference being the issue and requirement to do well, and at the same time class composition, if I scour my computer for some screenshot's (I haven't touched wow in years) of me above 2k rating in starter sets, as an unconventional comp, would that put that argument to rest. I'm sorry it might not be nice to hear, but I had a large amount of alts that I arena'ed with of multiple classes, (I'll leave it at more than 10). Some I focused on more, going for the Gladiator ratings and the best tier of weapons Others I spent time only around Tier1 wep - shoulders, purely because of the lack of drive. The simple fact is that yes certain comps were better, or more effective, but the gates were never a loss the second they opened when it came down to the 3vs3 bracket (2vs2 granted you could instant lose more often) the starter set was all that was required gear wise to do well, You could get the first rated weapons in blues, a struggle but possible. as for all the other arguments, I'm not asking for it to give me more gear, I'm not asking for it to give titles, or a ranked system even, nice but not my main want, what I like the most is the ability to spend time with friends in a way we have fun, without being forced to play with 4 other people who make our life harder on purpose it seems. and don't even get me started on world pvp. Oh and one final thing, rated bg's were the reason I left wow, getting to the top of that, "Fotm comps" were even worse, mark my words on that, all of you approving ranked Wz's are going to eat your words when it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenReafer Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Arenas literally took no thought at all. I would rather do what others talk about and have competive huttball. Create leagues and schedules, have multiple arenas teams can have for their home games etc etc. That is a way better plan for compelling game play then multi player dueling. People act like arena was some genius game development. It is barely an idea. "hey let's have 3v3 death match in a room". We should be asking for more than that. Create engaging competive and creative gameplay not just a way for people to peacock about their dueling skills. Sometimes simplicity is best. You sound like you have a lot of time to play if you want leagues and schedules. Many of us don't have that type of time and if they add rated WZs I hope its the same gear as regular WZs because there is no way I will find a team of 8 who I can get on at the same time given I log close to 6 hours a week. Also the objective based PvP would be better if death was permanent. Kind of lame to be able to run like a lemming over and over and not pay a price but to wait for a few seconds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenReafer Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 All I see here is whining for another avenue to gain pvp gear where "skill" and class balance dominates. As he stated Tatooine is the perfect place to setup an arena. If you enjoy playing in Arenas that's reward enough isn't it? Perhaps people should be asking for a non-pvp spectating area overlooking the pit in the ffa zone. Too much effort when you don't live in game. Sorry I have a job and family. I'd take scrimmishes where I can Q anywhere tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenReafer Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 A lot of these posts are: I don't want Arenas because...[Enter Assumption Here] The biggest issue is that they are all assumptions, and aren't necessarily true nor how BW would implement Arena's if they so choose to do so. -There doesn't have to be gear grind or any special gear associated with Arena. -There can be separate ability sets for Arena so that it doesn't effect PvE or Warzones. It is very possible for BW to do a good job and create an Arena that does not effect the rest of the game in the slightest. An arena would make a lot of people happy, and if they can do it in a way that doesn't "break" the rest of the game, then they probably should. I don't think anybody (or at least very few) want an Arena for the sake of L33T gear, or balancing. need to paste this over and over as it covers the only arguments people keep using. They are still sore they couldn't even get a 1800 (starter) pvp weapon lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosefeathers Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The game isn't balanced for it and i dont want to see a fresh wave of nerf posts every day about whatever fotm class is op, its bad enough already with a vocal minority of people not even playing endgame demanding changes to classes they haven't interacted with at the same level with the same gear level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenReafer Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 gratz , you just proved a lot of people's negative views on arena pvp by pulling out the 'what was your rating so shut up scrub casual 'card. All arena brought to wow was a bunch of elitists that thought their rating when playing fotm comps made them pvp gods So wrong man... So many nice guys who only palyed Arena and were high rated. The few elitist circle jerkers were a minority with their small group who thaught they were cool- the problem is they are the vocal ones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ContrailNZ Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 My biggest complaint is newbie leaders that don't mark enemy healers to focus fire. Unfortunately that is over 95% of leaders. They need to make it so everyone can mark enemy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warkat Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Arena would be ten fold better than that trade killing crap which is illum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenReafer Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 TLDR: You say arenas were fun in WoW. I do not want another arena system set up that way. Here is why, in a few brief points: 1. The "100% voluntary action" line is BS. WoW's system "required" you to arena or fall behind gear wise. 2. 2v2 or even 3v3 to a degree makes class imbalances obviously glaring. If you want a ranked system, do 4v4 "mini" BG style on a ladder rank system since you can't premade 8v8 at this point anyways. 3. You point out that you liked gear differences, then suggest everything be auto-balanced in the same paragraph. Um... what? ----- Really they just need to add an option to do some kind of premade PVP that doesn't leave you with half a team of pugs. That way the people who really WANT the cookie cutter premade "challenge" can go bang their e-peens against each other all they want. NO ONE IS ASKING FOR WOWS EXACT SAME ARENA SYSTEM- quit hiding the fact you are bad behind that. WE ARE ASKING FOR COSMETIC ONLY REWARDS for our time IF GEAR IS GIVEN MAKE IT EQUAL TO RATED WZ GEAR that is all sick of the same weak excuse over and over when there are countless posts pro arena sking for it with a different system... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absit Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Why don't I want arenas? Because it even further kills world PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geehew Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Here's what I'd like to know. Why are so many people determined to have a formal Arena system built into the game? There's an area for PvP between groups. If you really want Arena, organize it yourself. Exactly. My guess is that wouldn't provide enough false sense of worth for most players, or at least the ones arguing here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilbrood Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Arena killed balancing for pve and pvp for wow. Only kind of arena I purpose is a fun no rating ladder system. No rewards nothing. Just for fun and bragging rights. Also if Swtor put in a arena system into this game this pvp forum will crash over the amount of QQ. QQ from the scrubs to the elities.....QQ about gear inbalance in it....QQ over class comps which will then turn them into nerfs on classes cause they aren't OP by themselves but they are OP with X and X class so they must need a nerf. Arena pvp is the worst form of pvp for a MMO cause of the time it takes to balance classes for it and pve. Hey X class is OP in arena they need nerf.....after nerf X class is completely useless in PVE lets not bring them into operations. So many people don't understand what arena did to wow pvp/pve. Even blizzard regretted arena. Now I do love arena pvp but at the cost of making this game a shell no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrustyDog Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 This is not WoW. let me paste what I said in another arena thread: Pass on having arena in SWTOR. Then you will see gear obtained only from Arena, then that adds an extra step for people to grind in order to survive in any kind of PvP because theres no extra grind as it is? No ones asking for "special" gear just another option to obtain existing gear. I think the problem is Empire does not want to face Republic on an even numbered playing field. You are quite content to be the kings of zerg. My personal wish is arena with class specific gear (the same for every player) with nothing but titles. Or are you opposed to that as well? Or is outnumbering your opponent 5 to 1 as well as outgearing him your definition of good pvp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batslav Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I will agree for arena type pvp only if it does not benefit players in any way beyond having fun fighting no valor no commendations no gear also in swtor theres no 2 shoting like in lol wow and with the broken interrupt and high ammount of heals (and healers ccs/defensive cds) games will last hour or so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProJarrod Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 If Arena's where made in SWTOR a lot of people would have to play said Arena's and come to the realization that they are bad. This is why they don't want arena's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larudior Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I find this very interesting what the outcome will be , will they be implemented or not. What will the outcome be from whatever choice they make , yes it is a exciting time <3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytheape Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I find this very interesting what the outcome will be , will they be implemented or not. What will the outcome be from whatever choice they make , yes it is a exciting time <3. This is the funniest ever! I love you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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