SWTOR endgame is an absolute disaster

[Taurusaud]

I agree with your title but I also think it's more accurate if you drop "endgame" from it.

[audioedge]

You mention that you have been playing MMO's for 15years, i guess this is the first MMO you have been playing at Launch beacause from my own experience, and partipation in multiple betas and day 1 relase (Dark Age of Camelot, WoW, Rift, EQ2, Lineage, Lineage2, WAR and i could keep going...) this is by far one of the best launch i had the chance to see in thse past 15 years.

 

Since it's the closest of them all and that pretty much everyone and his mother as been playing it ill go with Wolrd of warcraft. First of all the game as been out for a solid 7 years, and still they fail on EVERY major patch server are down for 10hour more then it was expected in the begining. But still ppl would get over it only to rage the next couple days untill some fix were applied to correct some bugs

 

At launch their was no end game content, no Battlegrounds and **** loads of bugs. I remember doing 40 Mans LBRS or UBRS because this was the only thing do to. When MC first came out, the bugs were ordendous and barely playable. But again this was new ppl raging everywhere crying like 90% of the haters are doing right now allover the forums.

 

Ok SWToR might now have the potential of being the best MMO ever, BW might not have what it takes financaly to support the game the way Blizzard did. But yes atleast their is End Game content, we have Warzone both are bugged as hell but so far im enjoying it, we cleared 16HM, moslty fighting bugs and not bosses but well we went through it.

 

Trouble is when WoW come out it absolutely owned everyone else. It had alot more than most other games, and was very much fun to play. It felt epic.

 

If you release a WoW clone now, today, launch or not then your gonna have to blow it out the water. Swtor devs think voice overs and storyline did just that. Most people I know playing the game disagreed.

 

This is a mediocre game, nothing more, nothing less. If you love it, think its the best game ever, then fair play to you - go login and enjoy yourself. But dont come here telling me this game would have blown WoW out of the water 7 years ago, because it wouldnt.

[ShaftyMcShaft]

What MMO's had complete and perfectly fleshed out endgames after exactly 30 days of being live?

 

You would think in 2012 a smart company trying to steal Blizzard's 10 million users would realize "players spend the vast majority of their time at level cap. So rather than focus on mostly single-player leveling content, let's devote our resources to the endgame and launch with a dozen polished warzones and operations." But nope.

Edited January 20, 2012 by ShaftyMcShaft

[EchoTwoOmega]

Maybe one day some developers will make a game that has nothing but "end game" content (ex. raiding) for you to enjoy. They will have leader boards where you can see who is number 1 at raiding and who has the best gear and they will have achievements for world first kills and the forums will be filled with congradulations for you on your achievement.

 

 

 

 

For me there is far more to this particular game than raiding. There is 50 levels of amazing content to be enjoyed. Its a shame you missed that.

 

 

 

 

I hope you find what your looking for in another MMO.

/goodbye.

[Aramyn]

What MMO's had complete and perfectly fleshed out endgames after exactly 30 days of being live?

 

No one is asking for a perfectly complete and fleshed out endgame at release, but that doesn't change that what little endgame there is was so poorly developed/thought-out in the first place.

Edited January 20, 2012 by Aramyn

[Proto]

First and foremost let me assure you that when I say that SWTOR's endgame is a huge mess I am saying this from experience as myself and my guild are one of the most progressed around. We are 4/5 nightmare mode in EV already and most of us have been level 50 since late december. We have consumed all of the content SWTOR has to offer and what we have experienced is alarming.

 

The flashpoints themselves had (and continue) to have tons of bugs. While some of these have been fixed, the very fact they existed and went live in the firstplace is phenomenal. Until 1.1 3/4 of the flashpoints had unlootable chests. If you managed to beat the instance you would get nothing from most bosses which had chests instead of loot from their bodies. This bug existed for an entire month without Bioware actually addressing it which I find unbelievable. Most companies would have jumped all over a bug like this as soon as it was discovered and had a hotfix out ASAP. bioware however took weeks to finally address this massive issue. then there was the "one of your party is locked to a current flaspoint" bug. This bug made it impossible for a certain person with this bug to enter a flaspoint. The hilarious thing is the bug was able to be passed from one character to another like a disease (this was also the only way to fix it!). To get rid of this bug you would have to figure out who had the bug and have someone else create a lvl 1 alt who you invited to party to pass the bug onto it and then the alt would have it. This bug persisted for weeks! Talk about outrageous.

 

Raids were and continue to be even more of a disaster IMO. There are so many bugs and problems with both raid clusters and each individual fights I will only focus on the most disgusting of them.

 

1. In Eternity Vault there was a bug with master loot where if the Raid leader had master loot on and went to pass loot out on the corpse most of the loot would disapear! Only commndations and crafting mats and schematics would be on the corpse while set gear and other drops would simply not be there. The only way to work around this is to have to loot by random loot and everyone having to be careful not to roll on something.

 

2. Bosses would bug out and do all sorts of fun things. The worst involved Gharj. Gharj would bug out and make it so you couldnt re-enter the raid because you were stuck in combat even though noone was in zone. He would then KILL the entire raid while they were outside EV and in the fleet! The only thing you could do was to reset the instance and re-clear 20-30 min of trash.

 

3. The brand new raid Kraggas palace which just released a few days ago is hilariously bad. First off the very first boss, Bonethrasher cannot be tanked and has a very fast enrage timer which means tanks on the fight are useless. This means most guilds trying to get him in HM/NM mode HAVE to sit out tanks (and often melee DPS due to punishing mechanics) if they wanna kill him. Wats funny is the very next boss fight has two bosses which requires TWO TANKS on HM/NM mode. Better hope your guild has extra people who like sitting outside the zone and wont get to fight certain bosses! Also whoever itemized Kraggas palace has no understanding of the game or is downright lazy as all the bosses in Kraggas commonly drop loot which cannot be used by the classes it goes to (this may just be a normal mode issue though). My Bounty Hunter for example, recieved light armor pants with willpower on them ***! Does Bioware even test this stuff?

 

4. Finally the worst raid boss ever created is Soa, the final boss in EV. This may be the single most bugged raid boss I have ever seen. This encounter has so many bugs it would take me 5 pages to explain them all in detail so here are the worst ones. Just last night on hard mode we encountered these ones. After a wipe, sometimes the floor in Soa's room would be half missing and you would have to reset the raid and run back. On the final phase the tank has to kite Soa and get pillars to drop on him so his shield drops and he becomes vunerable. A number of times the pillar would hit him but his shield stayed up! Because of this our guild failed 3 times to Soa and turned what would have been a win into another wipe. We were unable to get beat him because of this garbage yet again. Finally many guilda re reporting Soa after patch 1.1 isnt even dropping loot except for mounts and craft junk. Bioware again is sitting on their hands and taking their sweet time with all of these issue.

 

 

 

I wont even get into PvP issues............but I think most of us are aware of the many problems there.

 

 

 

There are other things as well which are not quite endgame related but incredibly frustrating. Myself and thousands of others who have high end gaming rigs are getting awful performance in SWTOR. I get 10-20 FPS in places like PvP/fleet even though I have a 6970 for crying out loud! I get 50 FPS minimum on high+ settings in every other game I own (BF3, Witcher 2, Rift) but for some reason I get 10 FPS at times in SWTOR. Pathetic.

 

 

 

Lastly, SWTOR is missing the most basic of MMO features like a COMBAT LOG!. What MMO these days releases without a freaking combat log?!!!!!

 

 

 

I really wanted this game to be good and I was expecting it to at least be mediocre and be well polished but to my absolute shock SWTOR is probably the most unpolished and buggy MMO I have every played. How could a game with a budget alledgedly topping $200 Million be this bad? HOW?

 

 

 

For those of you enjoying the game and planning to stick with it, good luck to you and I applaud your patience. SWTOR isnt without its merits of course but as a whole this is the most disapointing launch I have experienced in my 15 years of MMO gaming.

 

 

I can sum this up in one sentence man:

 

"You're burned out."

 

This is exactly why I took my sweet time.

[ShaftyMcShaft]

Maybe one day some developers will make a game that has nothing but "end game" content (ex. raiding) for you to enjoy. They will have leader boards where you can see who is number 1 at raiding and who has the best gear and they will have achievements for world first kills and the forums will be filled with congradulations for you on your achievement.

 

 

 

 

For me there is far more to this particular game than raiding. There is 50 levels of amazing content to be enjoyed. Its a shame you missed that.

 

 

 

 

I hope you find what your looking for in another MMO.

/goodbye.

 

You're right. SWTOR is a phenomenal single-player game.

[Aramyn]

I can sum this up in one sentence man:

 

"You're burned out."

 

This is exactly why I took my sweet time.

 

Did you even read the op? His post has nothing to do with being burnt out and everything to do with endgame being complete garbage.

[Angedechu]

Just to point out something

 

I'm a player of WoW, who wish (still) to switch

 

There is an area related to end game in which TOR fails hard, and this is customer service

 

On a LFR, on of my character was ninjaed a item (this means, btw, that the boss normally dropped an item and that everyone could loot it: incredible, I know ) : I got it back six hours after report.

[Ahlin]

Bored?

No end game?

Just re-roll and do 90% of the same thing over again!

 

I know right? My usual response is thus: If I've already leveled one to 50, I'm just going to youtube the other 7 main story lines instead of repeating almost all the content over again.

 

Also, TL;DR? Really? It took all of 1 minute to read the entire post.

Edited January 20, 2012 by Ahlin

[jdnyc]

Did you even read the op? His post has nothing to do with being burnt out and everything to do with endgame being complete garbage.

 

well he made it to 50 before the end of December. 200+hrs to do your storyline alone. He probably played 19+hrs each day. I can see that burning someone out.

 

Long time to be sitting in front of a computer smashing the space bar to be first, so you can run into all the bugs and then complain about it on the forums.

[Kamiy]

People who have consumed all of the game's content so quickly are an extremely minority. BioWare knew there would be a minority. Their focus was on getting the 1-50 game completed. They can focus on 'endgame' content with patch updates.

[jdnyc]

There is an area related to end game in which TOR fails hard, and this is customer service

 

agreed.

[Angedechu]

The fallacy that people would reroll alts once at level 50 was mentionned several times : everyone knew perfectly that the well made class quests are a MINORITY. If you play a Sith Inquisitor, your game experience will be kinda alike a Sith Warrior, except you go in different caves

 

This is coming from a guy with 9 toons in WoW above ilevel 375....and who can't wait to roll his first alt, a JK on a server with rep.

[Aramyn]

well he made it to 50 before the end of December. 200+hrs to do your storyline alone. He probably played 19+hrs each day. I can see that burning someone out.

 

Long time to be sitting in front of a computer smashing the space bar to be first, so you can run into all the bugs and then complain about it on the forums.

 

200 hours? Are you joking? It takes no where near 8 days /played to reach 50. Not even close.

[jdnyc]

200 hours? Are you joking? It takes no where near 8 days /played to reach 50. Not even close.

 

200 hours come directly from what Bioware said and I spent about that getting my character to 50. I did play a lot. I did get burnt out. I did most of the bonus missions and the storyline.

Edited January 20, 2012 by jdnyc

[Angedechu]

agreed.

 

Yeah. TOR CMs and GMs are really....well.

 

In WoW, you can do basically say anything on the forums excluding death threats and or poltical/religious stuff. Here, any posts with criticism (or attempt at humor) is deleted.

[Ahlin]

People who have consumed all of the game's content so quickly are an extremely minority. BioWare knew there would be a minority. Their focus was on getting the 1-50 game completed. They can focus on 'endgame' content with patch updates.

 

You realize he's not really talking about LACK of endgame content, he's talking about bad/buggy endgame content.

[Morpheous]

Thanks for sharing that nice rant, I don't honestly know what your expecting? You want people to join you in outrage? Maybe stage a protest?

 

I for one won't be joining you, because they have been fixing bugs at a pretty steady rate. I'm not really that worried that your guild has been rushing through content and now you're upset because the bugs have made that less than smooth.

 

Most people arent 50 yet, so many end game bugs probably aren't a massive priority just yet. They'll be fixed, bugs happen... Get over it?

[ThanosTitan]

Hes not so much commenting on the quantity of the endgame content but the quality. Which is ****tay.

[ShaftyMcShaft]

People who have consumed all of the game's content so quickly are an extremely minority. BioWare knew there would be a minority. Their focus was on getting the 1-50 game completed. They can focus on 'endgame' content with patch updates.

 

And that's BioWare's big mistake that's going to kill this game. They focused on the 1-50 stuff. That's a single-player game. That's KOTOR3, not an MMO.

 

And that's fine..for a play through. I enjoyed the leveling process, and I don't want my money back from BW. They made a fun single player game.

 

Now, maybe it took the more...fervent...players under two weeks to hit 50, and you want to go at a more leisurely pace, so you'll hit it after 2-3 months. That's fine, play at your own pace. But you and everybody else will get there eventually, and then you find out the end game is non-existent or broken. You going to keep paying $15 to run in circles in the fleet?

 

Doesn't matter if you're tearing through the content or taking it slow, this problem will effect everyone who wanted to play a long-term persistent-world game.

 

The leveling content is great, and everybody's all, "oh man, SWTOR doesn't start at level 50, it starts at level 1!" And that's great...problem is the game doesn't START at 50, it STOPS at 50. And once people hit 50 you're going to see subscription numbers plummet, and no dollars means no new content means dead game.

[Abriael]

Hes not so much commenting on the quantity of the endgame content but the quality. Which is ****tay.

 

And anyone that has half the experience he claims of having also knows that NO mmorpg launched with a bug free endgame, ever. This one is actually one of the less bugged of the bunch.

 

Conclusion: either he has radical rose tinted glasses about his past MMOs, or he never played them at launch, or he's simply being irrational, or he lies.

 

Pick your choice.

[Grandpappy]

And the usual g-t-f-o crowd race to post negatives against a very legitimate complaint regarding the game. When the game is bleeding subs and you same people are complaining of the game being dead - I'll re-sub just so I can tell you to g-t-f-o Edited January 20, 2012 by Grandpappy

[Morpheous]

The leveling content is great, and everybody's all, "oh man, SWTOR doesn't start at level 50, it starts at level 1!" And that's great...problem is the game doesn't START at 50, it STOPS at 50. And once people hit 50 you're going to see subscription numbers plummet, and no dollars means no new content means dead game.

 

Really? You're talking for everyone?

 

Sorry to break it to ya, but I've been level 50 for several weeks, and I'm still enjoying the game quite a bit, so are most people I know, or have met on my server that are level 50.

 

Just because all the QQers and trolls are right now on the forums complaining about everything, doesn't represent the majority of people who are actually in game.. you know playing.

 

Thanks for trying.

[ShaftyMcShaft]

you would know that NO newly released MMO has an insane amount of end game.

 

Which is why BioWare completely flubbed this game. If they spent some of those millions on endgame content they'd have a shot at beating WoW. You would think this would be obvious to game designers in 2012. "People spend of their time at the level cap...let's make sure there's lots of content to keep them subscribing month after month!" But nope.

 

I knew this and this is the reason I am not rushing to end game. enjoy the game, if not, you should go back to whatever great MMO you crawled out from under and play with your panda.

 

Doesn't matter if you're rushing or not. Let's say it takes you 3 months to get to 50...so what? You still end up in the same place, with nothing to do. So you shouldn't be saying "lol" you should be saying "thank you OP for bringing this to our attention! BioWare, fix this crap so we all have something to do when we hit 50!"