Is there a threat display that I'm not aware of?

[Newsinz]

I get why people do not want meters etc etc. But, I like to know what my DPS numbers are so I can tweak my characters. Meh, to each their own I guess.

[Ruibard]

KTM/Omen made people lazy and bad. Now they are still lazy and bad and want their crutch back.

 

L2P people

 

This has to be the stupidest quote yet. No proof, KTM/Omen isn't a crutch, just like a spedometer is a crutch.

[theothersteve]

It is the tanks job to hold the aggro and the dps's job to pour out the damage.

 

This is exactly the problem with tanking in TOR today. It is the group's job to defeat the enemy, by any means necessary. Saying threat is the tank's job is - I apologize - simply ignorant. A DPS that opens with burst damage is a threat to the party and deserves to die and be kicked from the group.

[saltorio]

Yes there is indeed a threat meter is SWTOR. When you pull too much aggro, the target turns on you.

 

Simple. Effective.

 

I started playing WoW as a fire mage before addon threat meters existed. They are not required, learn2play.

Edited January 20, 2012 by saltorio

[Telendria]

I think that's the flaw in the threat meter argument. Why SHOULD dps know he will over aggro? It is the tanks job to hold the aggro and the dps's job to pour out the damage. Each role has nuance and thought behind them. Being able to react when things change is not only part of the game, it makes the player actually LEARN to be better at their job.

 

As a sniper, I can sit behind a rock all day popping the tanks target like a monkey pressing the space bar. But when the mob breaks away and starts heading for me, it's exciting and gives me the chance to use 1 of my MANY tools for dealing with the situation. THAT's fun!

 

That is fun for you. Not so much for tank/meleers who have to chase boss or for healers, because boss has PBAoE effect, that effects healers/ranged when he comes closer.

 

As long as there is no threat meter (and target of target), dying to aggro will always be tanks fault tho, so I suppose all those DPS can be happy there is none yet, so they can always blame the tank

[Supahhappy]

This is exactly the problem with tanking in TOR today. It is the group's job to defeat the enemy, by any means necessary. Saying threat is the tank's job is - I apologize - simply ignorant. A DPS that opens with burst damage is a threat to the party and deserves to die and be kicked from the group.

 

Which is why a good DPS gives a tank about 3-5 seconds before going all out!

 

I agree that it isn't just the tanks job, but a good DPS knows not to constantly attack a target the tank isn't trying to focus on, hit the CC'd enemies, or go all out immediately as the tank is still trying to close the distance on an enemy.

[Dark_Disciple]

how can anyone think getting one shot by a boss or trash mob is fun... i guess people saying this haven't raided hard/nightmare ops its not fun

 

its not fun for tanks who have to collect stray mob

its not fun for healer who has to either emergency heal dps or let him die

its not fun for dps who now has and 8k crd repair bill

 

i'm referring to all dps single targeting tank's target and still pulling off well into fight not at beginning.

 

'well maybe the tank is bad' you say

 

my response 'hmm can't tell because i have no omen nor is there even a simple color system where your portrait gets redder the more agro you pull'

 

being blind is never better that goes for most addons you don't want addons in the game find a like minded group to raid with or don't raid because most progression groups require things like dbm and omen. your desire to play blind devoid of numbers shouldn't hamper my ability to do so

[theothersteve]

I started playing WoW as a fire mage before addon threat meters existed. They are not required, learn2play.

 

With all due respect, Saltorio, I highly doubt you are a better player than I am. Longevity does not a hardcore raider make.

 

The problem with no threat meters, from a DPS perspective, is that you need to adjust your behavior before the target turns on you. By the time you receive the indication that you have output too much threat, it is already too late, and you've messed up positioning and potentially already caused a wipe.

 

Admittedly, I have yet to encounter a fight where pulling threat once is a serious chance of wiping, but I would be very surprised if they did not exist.

Edited January 20, 2012 by theothersteve

[MegaBubble]

It strikes a particularly irksome nerve when I hear things like this, or other "post-WoW" game implementations referred to as "necessities" or "must-haves". I've played many an MMO as a tank without such a system. When do you know a party member has threat? When a mob runs toward them and starts beating them about the head and shoulders, that's when.

 

Watch mobs closely, watch health bars, deliver your damage and aggro-grabbing abilities throughout the mobs evenly, and trust that members of your team won't suffer immediate death if a mob turns it's attention on them for a few seconds. That's the way I learned tanking. That's the way I tanked in Vanilla WoW, which was as long as I played it.

 

Before you say, "Yeah, but you never tanked [insert WoW boss] in [insert post-vanilla WoW expansion] where you had to [insert incredible feat impossible without a threat meter]", consider the fact is that those bosses aren't in TOR. The current degree of difficulty doesn't warrant the need for threat meters, or cast-over healing, or even target-of-target aiming. Not to say those would be bad additions to the game - but with raiding in it's current state they're hardly "necessities" for competent raiding.

 

But hey, what do I know. I'm just some guy that believes that no one should be compelled to download third party mods in order to be able to handle content that was designed around the game's original UI. Personally, I hope not to see add-ons like this pop up (although I know they will). As you alluded to in the OP, they're just another tool for eltists to use to determine who's "worthy" to join their Hardmode group. I dread the day when I have to hear "Sorry, you can't join this HM run - your gearscore isn't high enough."

Edited January 20, 2012 by MegaBubble

[TheHeadCapper]

After you die a couple times you should have a good idea of what it takes to take threat of the tank without the screen telling you.

 

Skilled players learn to understand aggro, noobs need the screen to tell them.

[Vydor_HC]

You don't need a meter to manage threat, it's just a compilation of data shown to make hard encounters far less difficult. I've never played a game with one, don't see why this game needs one. Learning your class and how to manage threat is an art form that needs to be learned over time playing your class, not reading a meter that does all the work for you.

[Ruibard]

Yes there is indeed a threat meter is SWTOR. When you pull too much aggro, the target turns on you.

 

Simple. Effective.

 

I started playing WoW as a fire mage before addon threat meters existed. They are not required, learn2play.

 

Hmm, or you could prevent pulling aggro by simply having the meter show you how close yo are to pulling and probably optimizing the use of your CD. But then again being optimal on this forum is a curse isn't it?

[LexonLightsaber]

stopped reading there.

 

SWTOR is modeled after WoW, go see the interview that James Ohlen (Game Director) did with Eurogamer.com.

[TheHeadCapper]

With all due respect, Saltorio, I highly doubt you are a better player than I am. Longevity does not a hardcore raider make.

 

The problem with no threat meters, from a DPS perspective, is that you need to adjust your behavior before the target turns on you. By the time you receive the indication that you have output too much threat, it is already too late, and you've messed up positioning and potentially already caused a wipe.

 

Admittedly, I have yet to encounter a fight where pulling threat once is a serious chance of wiping, but I would be very surprised if they did not exist.

 

You pretty much proved he is better by stating you need threat meters to understand aggro in a game.

[TheHeadCapper]

Hmm, or you could prevent pulling aggro by simply having the meter show you how close yo are to pulling and probably optimizing the use of your CD. But then again being optimal on this forum is a curse isn't it?

 

Not all of us need little flashing lights to tell us when to press or stop pressing buttons. Hope they dont add threat meters so it shows the scrubs who do not understand aggro that they are indeed, scrubs.

Edited January 20, 2012 by TheHeadCapper

[Ruibard]

After you die a couple times you should have a good idea of what it takes to take threat of the tank without the screen telling you.

 

Skilled players learn to understand aggro, noobs need the screen to tell them.

 

pugs. pugs. pugs. pugs.

 

You know getting around your server and meeting new people on the server are BAD BAD BAD ideas.

[Ruibard]

Not all of us need little flashing lights to tell us when to press or stop pressing buttons. Hope they dont add threat meters so it shows the scrubs who do not understand aggro that they are indded, scrubs.

 

Ad hom attack? LUL.

 

kkthx for showing you don't have an argument other than everyone should be as bad as I am.

[TheHeadCapper]

pugs. pugs. pugs. pugs.

 

You know getting around your server and meeting new people on the server are BAD BAD BAD ideas.

 

A + B does not equal 5

[InnateOne]

you could always go by the 3 second rule... If you give the tank a few seconds before tearing into a target, in any game you'll generally find you won't need something to monitor threat anyways. Be smart about it.

[theothersteve]

Before you say, "Yeah, but you never tanked [insert WoW boss] in [insert post-vanilla WoW expansion] where you had to [insert incredible feat impossible without a threat meter], the truth is those bosses aren't in TOR. The current degree of difficulty doesn't warrant the need for threat meters, or cast-over healing, or even target-of-target aiming. Not to say those would be bad additions to the game - but with raiding in it's current state they're hardly "necessities" for competent raiding.

 

Well said! I agree with your entire post. Hearing that those bosses do not yet exist is encouragement; thank you. I am worried for the future, however. I won't get too worked up over hypotheticals.

 

One major argument I have with you: I'm requesting a threat meter, not addons. I would prefer the threat meter to be part of the built-in UI rather than it be an addon.

[TheHeadCapper]

Ad hom attack? LUL.

 

kkthx for showing you don't have an argument other than everyone should be as bad as I am.

 

Its cool i understand some people need the game to tell them when to press buttons instead of figuring it out themselves.

[ThanosTitan]

You pretty much proved he is better by stating you need threat meters to understand aggro in a game.

 

Ur a dumb baddie.

[TheHeadCapper]

you could always go by the 3 second rule... If you give the tank a few seconds before tearing into a target, in any game you'll generally find you won't need something to monitor threat anyways. Be smart about it.

 

The last sentence in your post is usually what throws the meter kids off.

[Ruibard]

you could always go by the 3 second rule... If you give the tank a few seconds before tearing into a target, in any game you'll generally find you won't need something to monitor threat anyways. Be smart about it.

 

Generally waiting works great. But some abilities can be bugged or it's a deal with efficiency. Some tanks can pull off great threat at the start of a fight because they use ability A B C instead of D X Z. Also it's about optimizing CD usage as well. Each tank is different and as someone who pugs often each tank is different.

[theothersteve]

TheHeadCapper, you may wish to review people's responses to your posts. It would seem that the vast majority disagree with you, and your posts are not particularly constructive.