Mrs_Murder Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I don't understand why people seem to believe that pyrotechs do less damage than arsenal, or less damage in general. I do between 200 and 300k damage in a round, depending on the length and downtime between action. My dots tick for 6-800, my rail shot crits for 3.5k, my thermal detonator crits for 3.5k, power shot crits for 2.5k, the slow effect from combustible gas engine is amazing (plus its dots also tick for 6-800), and I have great mobility. I melt faces. I'm ALWAYS topping the list over most damage. Rotation: thermal detonator, incendiary missile, rail shot, unload (free railshot), pew pew with guns, thermal detonator, switch target -> incendiary missile, rail shot, rinse and repeat. The free rail shots are lol. All melee classes change their mind as soon as my dots, TD and RS hit them. The slow effect is very effective against operatives (you can even backpedal because of the slow). I basically do 6-7k damage instantly because of TD and rail shot. So yeah... I don't get why people complain or why there's even need for a guide. Maybe you're just not doing it right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs_Murder Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) on 1 you will have a problem, if a melee gets on you about all you can do is rapid shots and hope for the best. it does require more thinking than arsenal (imo) because you rely on many of the default merc skills. . Lol bullsheep. 1 vs 1 is no problem. Even against lvl 50s with champions/battlemaster. The only ones who are a problem are counselors, since they can do a heap load of damage and still heal like a freakin champ. But my dots and bursts get them eventually. Melees are the easiest since we can kite them with ease. I even backpedal. "all you can do is rapid shots and hope for the best"? Sounds to me like you're doing it wrong. You have 3 instant abilities, 2 of which crit for over 3k (one which is free 90% of the time), 1 which ticks for 6-800. Not to mention the burn/slow from combustible gas engine. It's perfect against melee classes. I don't get why people say we don't have bursts. 6k in less than a second is not burst? 3.5k in one shot is not a burst? Edited January 14, 2012 by Mrs_Murder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sobakozoid Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) Lol bullsheep. 1 vs 1 is no problem. Even against lvl 50s with champions/battlemaster. The only ones who are a problem are counselors, since they can do a heap load of damage and still heal like a freakin champ. But my dots and bursts get them eventually. Melees are the easiest since we can kite them with ease. I even backpedal. "all you can do is rapid shots and hope for the best"? Sounds to me like you're doing it wrong. You have 3 instant abilities, 2 of which crit for over 3k (one which is free 90% of the time), 1 which ticks for 6-800. Not to mention the burn/slow from combustible gas engine. It's perfect against melee classes. I don't get why people say we don't have bursts. 6k in less than a second is not burst? 3.5k in one shot is not a burst? I think, your server doesn't have decent republic players, good equipped and skilled. I'm very very would like to see how do you kite skilled sentinels with thier speed buffs and reduced CD on force jumps. And how you burst them for 6K when they turn on all their defense skills, which makes your damage like 10-800 at best crits. Edited January 14, 2012 by Sobakozoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs_Murder Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) I think, your server doesn't have decent republic players, good equipped and skilled. I'm very very would like to see how do you kite skilled sentinels with thier speed buffs and reduced CD on force jumps. And how you burst them for 6K when they turn on all their defense skills, which makes your damage like 10-800 at best crits. We have plenty decent republics with full champion/battlemasters, lots of premades. Kiting? My blasters apply a slow effect. There ya go. If the enemy uses shield or similar abilities that just absorb 90% of my damage, I run away and find someone else to fight. I don't waste my time like that. Unless it's 1vs1, then I take my sweet time kiting them, dotting, insta-free heal myself etc. Edited January 14, 2012 by Mrs_Murder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightmgl Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 What I don't understand personally is where the talk of Pyrotech mobility comes from when they need to use Power Shot and Unload to proc their Rail Shots which is the combo for all their burst. The burst goes in the toilet just as bad as Arsenal when you are interrupted or have to move. I see both as being viable from experience but I see Arsenal as having the better Single Target and Pyro as having the better AoE (Dotting up whole groups of players is hilarious), both having pretty bad mobility to put our real damage and Arsenal taking a slight win for Survivability because that 10% shield is up all the time if you're doing it right. Oh Pyro also seems very nice for taking out high armor targets where the 55% armor pen isn't quite enough to turn them into paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tconeal Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Arsenal has its heatseeker missiles while on the move. Pyro has thermal detonator + all of your dots.....pyro has WAY better dmg while mobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xesorla Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Dude, we will speak again when patch 1.1 with its bracket for 50s hit the servers. It will be very soon. Then you return here and tell us how good you are against whole team of champion equipped 50s. You need to just switch to arsenal, pyro isn't for you. I already face multiple 50s in champ gear in each wz I stay in. If I see its gonna be me facerolling a lower lvl bunch, I leave. That isn't fun to me most of the time. In short, patch 1.1 isn't going to change anything for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tconeal Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 Dude, we will speak again when patch 1.1 with its bracket for 50s hit the servers. It will be very soon. Then you return here and tell us how good you are against whole team of champion equipped 50s. So your saying he will have better survival when everyones champion equipped? lol? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OklahomaSooner Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Bumping useful information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejita Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 pyrotech has always been superior to arsenal for pvp its just for most players and most players ARE baddies, they do better by simply hiting tracer missile over and over and over, the complex rotations of pyrotech makes them think its worse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infighter Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 pyrotech has always been superior to arsenal for pvp its just for most players and most players ARE baddies, they do better by simply hiting tracer missile over and over and over, the complex rotations of pyrotech makes them think its worse Or maybe people might just enjoy that spec more. Anyway, I respecced to Pyro a bit ago and I seem to be having some problem heat-wise... any tips? Also, which skill do you think is the best suited for TSO? I was thinking about Incendiary Missile. This is my current build. Rapid Venting taken for said heat issues and Degauss taken because I think it's very valuable against Sorcs and everyone who doesn't use dispellable slows/etc. I took System Calibrations because I wanted to test something, but I will most likely remove it as soon as I decide my new build. I really want to remove Rapid Venting for Automated Defense or Energy Rebounder, but can't do that until I really what the heck I am doing wrong when it comes to my heat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fafson Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Or maybe people might just enjoy that spec more. Anyway, I respecced to Pyro a bit ago and I seem to be having some problem heat-wise... any tips? Also, which skill do you think is the best suited for TSO? I was thinking about Incendiary Missile. This is my current build. Rapid Venting taken for said heat issues and Degauss taken because I think it's very valuable against Sorcs and everyone who doesn't use dispellable slows/etc. I took System Calibrations because I wanted to test something, but I will most likely remove it as soon as I decide my new build. I really want to remove Rapid Venting for Automated Defense or Energy Rebounder, but can't do that until I really what the heck I am doing wrong when it comes to my heat! Yeah, System Calibrations can go; it's not needed. What is your current rotation or what is it that you are doing? I've yet to overheat as a Pyrotech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infighter Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 (edited) Yeah, System Calibrations can go; it's not needed. What is your current rotation or what is it that you are doing? I've yet to overheat as a Pyrotech. Incendiary Missile > Thermal Detonator > Rail Shot > Unload (fishing for a proc) > Rail Shot if it procs/rapid shots Then I try to use Power Shot for another proc, keep Thermal on CD and Incendiary on the target. If I'm running I just spam rapid shots until I've took some ground to Unload/PS. I think one of my problems is that I instantly IM the next person I get into fight with, even right after I killed the one before, which builds up quite a bit of heat, but that's the only way I know to have a non-rng burning effect on the target for increased damage. Would it be a better idea to use Rail Shot only if procced? The damage is high, so I always thought I should use it everytime I can. Edited January 16, 2012 by Infighter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicenewtonz Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Or maybe people might just enjoy that spec more. Anyway, I respecced to Pyro a bit ago and I seem to be having some problem heat-wise... any tips? Also, which skill do you think is the best suited for TSO? I was thinking about Incendiary Missile. This is my current build. Rapid Venting taken for said heat issues and Degauss taken because I think it's very valuable against Sorcs and everyone who doesn't use dispellable slows/etc. I took System Calibrations because I wanted to test something, but I will most likely remove it as soon as I decide my new build. I really want to remove Rapid Venting for Automated Defense or Energy Rebounder, but can't do that until I really what the heck I am doing wrong when it comes to my heat! I prefer energy rebounder over degauss, most slows are from channeled abilities so you dont even remove them when you shield, and the amount of cooldown reduction you get is actually pretty significant and lets you shield almost every encounter in a warzone. For thermal sensor override i exclusively use it on fusion missile, the spell does high damage upfront and the dot is also very high in an aoe, the only thing that prohibits its use is the 33 heat cost so i always use TSO on it and usually use power surge on it as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tconeal Posted January 16, 2012 Author Share Posted January 16, 2012 Incendiary Missile > Thermal Detonator > Rail Shot > Unload (fishing for a proc) > Rail Shot if it procs/rapid shots Then I try to use Power Shot for another proc, keep Thermal on CD and Incendiary on the target. If I'm running I just spam rapid shots until I've took some ground to Unload/PS. I think one of my problems is that I instantly IM the next person I get into fight with, even right after I killed the one before, which builds up quite a bit of heat, but that's the only way I know to have a non-rng burning effect on the target for increased damage. Would it be a better idea to use Rail Shot only if procced? The damage is high, so I always thought I should use it everytime I can. Your doing it all right, just make sure you weave in rapid shots to keep your heat decent. As long as your using TSO and Vent heat every cd you will be all good. Your combustible procs actually do really good damage so we benefit off our auto attacks more than any other class. Yes, use Rail Shot every cd. Once you get full champ/centurion gear, the Rail Shot has a 50% chance to crit! Always use Unload over Power Shot unless your lining up burst, then you want to stick with your Power Shot. I just LOVE pyro. 1. Thermal 2500 2. Powershot 2000 3. Rail Shot 2500 4. dots??? 5. Profit. P.s. Crits on fully geared bro's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzut Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Concerning the two "spare" tier six skill points: Should I put them into Degauss, Automated Defenses, or Energy Rebounder, and why? (I consider Infrared Sensors to be mandatory. It's too valuable to know when a Shadow, Assassin, or Operative is sneaking up on you. I have learned that once these types of characters get behind you in melee range, it's pretty much over unless you can break whatever CC they are using; for this reason, I am currently using Degauss.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infighter Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 I don't think Infrared Sensors is really mandatory... think about it, ops (and sins, I think) can spec into a talent that increases their stealth level by 3 and they have a skill that increases their stealth level by 15 on a minute CD. Also, to see a stealther you need to have them in your frontal cone. Which means, if a stealther really wants to sneak on you, he'll do it and your infrared sensors would've been not useful at all. The shorter CD on Stealth Scan is nice, but you should be only using that skill when they Vanish most of the times. Which is once per fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobamech Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 I actually use it more than once a fight. You also have to remember it adds up to 2% extra range and melee defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzut Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 In my experience, enemies usually sneak in front of me and then melee strafe behind me. Also, how exactly does stealth work? The higher the enemy's level, the longer it takes to spot them at close range? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatherjimbo Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 What about PVE? I'm not interested in PVP but I hate Arsenal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzut Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 As Mercenary? Sorry. Arsenal is clearly better than Pyrotech in PVE because he can just plant himself somewhere and lob armor penetrating missiles at bosses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobamech Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 There were times in PvE where I had to kite bosses or elites when my companion was down. For those times, pyro is clearly better than arsenal. I can dot, heal up, and get back to battle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatherjimbo Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 As Mercenary? Sorry. Arsenal is clearly better than Pyrotech in PVE because he can just plant himself somewhere and lob armor penetrating missiles at bosses. Well I guess I'll scrap my BH until they balance the trees then because sitting in one spot lobbing missiles at anything while my blasters sit on my hips does not appeal to me. Thanks for the info, saved me some pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombifikation Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 @ The OP, thanks for this, helped out a lot with the issues I've been having adjusting to a less mobile class than im used to in mmo's. Question to you all then, how do you configure your gear? At least at 40 there are no sets with crit / surge on them, do you just get crit gear and then get surge mods? Or is there some set I don't know about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sionsays Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 (edited) I wouldn't be so certain that Pyrotech can't match Arsenal in PVE as well. It's difficult to say because there is currently no parse or combat logs available. Also, (imo), it's hard to come by crit/surge gear at low levels, and easy to get crit/alacrity which benefits Arsenal. Another thing to think about is a lot of times bosses are mobile, or your switching targets during boss fights. Sometimes they don't all just stand there. -Another think about pyro, is at low levels it's lacking compared to Arsenal. Edited January 16, 2012 by sionsays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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