Sad to see some people quiting already....

[BurnsTwoThree]

Its not sad at all, let the idiots leave

 

True that. Let the bads go. Same kids who probably complained WoW content was too hard even when they dumbed it down to the point where anyone with half a brain could clear raids on Heroic difficulty minus the end boss of the tier.

[Jooji]

If people are so impatient they'd quit a new MMO a month in then I'd hate to see their patience IRL, such as with raising a child. lol.

 

While I wish SWTOR would have released more polished, it's not far from being a great game.

[Ravezaar]

an with GW2 coming out in 3 months, tor really needs to pick up its pace. I know I wont be subbing for another three months with the state of pvp an game in general as it stands.

.

 

Iam in Closed/Core Beta of Guild Wars 2 and sorry to upset you but its not gonna be outt until 4th quarter of 2012. Most likely a x-mas release as SwTor

[BegaTasty]

True that. Let the bads go. Same kids who probably complained WoW content was too hard even when they dumbed it down to the point where anyone with half a brain could clear raids on Heroic difficulty minus the end boss of the tier.

 

You youngsters, really need to learn the difference between young teens complaining an "adults" who actually know a little more than you do. Being 44 myself, I have been round a little while an played a damn site more MMO's than you. So I will ask one more time, please keep your angst an hate to yourself, we don't want it. This thread is meant to be about constructive conversation between mature adults....

[Irishbrewed]

Yeah, but there are grinds and there are grinds. Grinding WZ comms to purchase gear isn't bad. Grinding comms to play the lottery?

 

It's like back in TBC where you had to get keyed for heroics before you could grind your hero gear for raids Except the RNG makes it worse. Get to 70. LOL go run some lowbie dungeons to get your rep up, you aren't good enough for heroics yet! Have to grind before you grind.

 

Yeah I hear ya on the gear lottery, I'm not a huge fan of that. But not quiting because of it. It's not as easy as buying epics but it's not a deal breaker for me. I really enjoy the pvp in this game.

[Irishbrewed]

You youngsters, really need to learn the difference between young teens complaining an "adults" who actually know a little more than you do. Being 44 myself, I have been round a little while an played a damn site more MMO's than you. So I will ask one more time, please keep your angst an hate to yourself, we don't want it. This thread is meant to be about constructive conversation between mature adults....

 

I'm 30....

 

Everyone's age ? .......

[BegaTasty]

Iam in Closed/Core Beta of Guild Wars 2 and sorry to upset you but its not gonna be outt until 4th quarter of 2012. Most likely a x-mas release as SwTor

 

Fair enough mate, though I wouldn't mention your beta if I was you, some lads will report you for the giggles of it.

None here mentioned shinys by the way other than its fun to explore the world an kill random mobs for fun an enjoyment of maybe finding something cool.Along with making money. Tor for some reason doesn't have that, an they deliberately stop you from doing it.

[AnAssassinOfTime]

Yeah, but there are grinds and there are grinds. Grinding WZ comms to purchase gear isn't bad. Grinding comms to play the lottery?

 

I do not understand this sentiment at all. You're not playing the lottery. The rewards are tokens that you can use to purchase the first tier of PvP gear at your leisure. As an ADDED incentive, there's a chance to get a random piece of tier 2 gear.

 

And this only applies until Valor 60, when you get bags that bump it up to tier 2 base with an ADDED incentive for tier 3.

 

It seems the problem is that because there's a CHANCE of an extra reward, people feel they are entitled to that reward, and then when they don't get it, they feel the system is broken.

 

I'm not entirely happy with the reward system - they need a way to directly earn Merc Commendations again - but you ARE grinding WZ to purchase gear.

[Dystopic]

Something that has always bothered me: People who think time investment = Difficulty. Difficulty should be based on mechanics not whether or not you have a job. Within the current PVP system it's not hard to get gear. It is extremely frustrating, time consuming, and stupid. But it isn't hard. You could sit in a corner and do nothing and you'd end up with gear if you did it long enough. If you want a system that isn't "free" and requires some difficulty than you should be advocating changing the current system as well.

[Irishbrewed]

Something that has always bothered me: People who think time investment = Difficulty. Difficulty should be based on mechanics not whether or not you have a job. Within the current PVP system it's not hard to get gear. It is extremely frustrating, time consuming, and stupid. But it isn't hard. You could sit in a corner and do nothing and you'd end up with gear if you did it long enough. If you want a system that isn't "free" and requires some difficulty than you should be advocating changing the current system as well.

 

Ranked war zones incoming.... Just sit tight they hear ya.

[BegaTasty]

I do not understand this sentiment at all. You're not playing the lottery. The rewards are tokens that you can use to purchase the first tier of PvP gear at your leisure. As an ADDED incentive, there's a chance to get a random piece of tier 2 gear.

 

And this only applies until Valor 60, when you get bags that bump it up to tier 2 base with an ADDED incentive for tier 3.

 

It seems the problem is that because there's a CHANCE of an extra reward, people feel they are entitled to that reward, and then when they don't get it, they feel the system is broken.

 

I'm not entirely happy with the reward system - they need a way to directly earn Merc Commendations again - but you ARE grinding WZ to purchase gear.

 

Thats part of the issue mate, it isn't about wanting free shinys. You cant call the game pvp when all you do is farm /bot/share your account with friends to gain your shinys fast as possible. World pvp for instance is souly about going out an fighting for yourself, rewards or not.

At moment because there's no way to compete with BG botters world pvp is non existent. people already pass each other an wave instead of fighting, because there's no point in it.

Either remove the pvp gear an call gear "gear" for all, or add world pvp properly, including merc commendations, an 2x the drop rate sicne world pvp si much harder than BG farming.

 

both sides work just fine.

Bioware really need to do some homework on pvp BEFORE wow, an take some notes. Because wow/rift pvp is not a good system to focus on. As we can see already from the number of people that have had enough.

[Quesa]

Kinda feels like RIFT. Leveling was sweet, fun n stuff. Get to 50, it's just a strait grind.

[Flexplosion]

To those who don't care that pvp'ers will be leaving... are you really that dense? you need bodies to make an online game work. if the majority of pvp'ers don't enjoy the game, they'll leave and those that stay will be left with less people, a *******r economy/auction system, less choices for guilds (the list goes on). Then you can look forward to server mergers and eventually full out failure and shutdown. Warhammer/Conan anyone?

[Punnyjunior]

Rift at least had world pvp at lv 50 or below when the game released at first month

[Dystopic]

I do not understand this sentiment at all. You're not playing the lottery. The rewards are tokens that you can use to purchase the first tier of PvP gear at your leisure. As an ADDED incentive, there's a chance to get a random piece of tier 2 gear.

 

And this only applies until Valor 60, when you get bags that bump it up to tier 2 base with an ADDED incentive for tier 3.

 

It seems the problem is that because there's a CHANCE of an extra reward, people feel they are entitled to that reward, and then when they don't get it, they feel the system is broken.

 

I'm not entirely happy with the reward system - they need a way to directly earn Merc Commendations again - but you ARE grinding WZ to purchase gear.

 

You know what? if champ gear didn't exist it would still be an insane grind but it would be better. As it stands, champ gear does exist and it's a lottery until you hit valor 60. And it's a problem IMO. I'm currently valor 52. I'll be getting valor 60 sometime. I still think it's heavily flawed and needs work. There needs to be a WZ comm set that is comparable to a level 50 dungeon set to get new players ready to start. There isn't one. Right now the game is brand new and people are already coming up against fully champ/battlemaster geared players when hitting 50 not to mention while leveling. Imagine what that's going to to be like for new 50s in a month. It's going to keep people from playing. In beta there was a lot more PVP gear available while leveling, they removed it. They removed the blue level 50 pvp set as well a couple patches ago. They need to start putting in more gear.

[Irishbrewed]

To those who don't care that pvp'ers will be leaving... are you really that dense? you need bodies to make an online game work. if the majority of pvp'ers don't enjoy the game, they'll leave and those that stay will be left with less people, a *******r economy/auction system, less choices for guilds (the list goes on). Then you can look forward to server mergers and eventually full out failure and shutdown. Warhammer/Conan anyone?

 

I think you might be over stating the amount of people actually leaving....

[BurnsTwoThree]

You youngsters, really need to learn the difference between young teens complaining an "adults" who actually know a little more than you do. Being 44 myself, I have been round a little while an played a damn site more MMO's than you. So I will ask one more time, please keep your angst an hate to yourself, we don't want it. This thread is meant to be about constructive conversation between mature adults....

 

And this guy was probably one of the one who couldn't down Heroic content in WoW even though they dumb/nerf it down more and more each patch.

[AnAssassinOfTime]

Thats part of the issue mate, it isn't about wanting free shinys. You cant call the game pvp when all you do is farm /bot/share your account with friends to gain your shinys fast as possible. World pvp for instance is souly about going out an fighting for yourself, rewards or not.

At moment because there's no way to compete with BG botters world pvp is non existent. people already pass each other an wave instead of fighting, because there's no point in it.

Either remove the pvp gear an call gear "gear" for all, or add world pvp properly, including merc commendations, an 2x the drop rate sicne world pvp si much harder than BG farming.

 

both sides work just fine.

Bioware really need to do some homework on pvp BEFORE wow, an take some notes. Because wow/rift pvp is not a good system to focus on. As we can see already from the number of people that have had enough.

 

I don't bot or share my account. I log on, group up with some friends, and queue for Warzones. I was responding to a complaint about the reward system that I feel was unfounded.

 

On the issue of world PvP, clearly there are problems there. Ilum is a massive failure. Outlaw's Den, ditto. And I mentioned in my post that Merc Commendations need to be a reward somehow. But "world PvP" in questing areas is, in my opinion, never a structured or coordinated affair. It typically involves a higher level player preying on a lower level player that is otherwise engaged. There aren't usually rewards for that in the MMOs that I have played. You do that for fun and satisfaction.

 

So, that said, what would you like to see BW do to encourage this sort of world PvP?

[Shrick]

Just play the game hey, do your quests, meet new people. The game has been out for a short period of time, Rome wasn't built in a day. They have already announced an update, 1.1 Rise of the Rakgouls. Think about what would happen when you give it say what, 6 months? There will be a whole lot more content, stick to it.

[Dystopic]

 

So, that said, what would you like to see BW do to encourage this sort of world PvP?

 

I want a star wars themed Isle of Quel'Danas. On a PVP server that was some of the most fun I have ever had in an MMO.

 

The Isle was restricted to max level players. There was a faction only base area and a shared base area. A world boss to fight over. Large enough for big battles but not so huge you were scattered. Dailies that could be accomplished without too much effort and others that required braving the red name tags.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Dystopic

[AnAssassinOfTime]

You know what? if champ gear didn't exist it would still be an insane grind but it would be better. As it stands, champ gear does exist and it's a lottery until you hit valor 60. And it's a problem IMO. I'm currently valor 52. I'll be getting valor 60 sometime. I still think it's heavily flawed and needs work. There needs to be a WZ comm set that is comparable to a level 50 dungeon set to get new players ready to start. There isn't one. Right now the game is brand new and people are already coming up against fully champ/battlemaster geared players when hitting 50 not to mention while leveling. Imagine what that's going to to be like for new 50s in a month. It's going to keep people from playing. In beta there was a lot more PVP gear available while leveling, they removed it. They removed the blue level 50 pvp set as well a couple patches ago. They need to start putting in more gear.

 

Well this is a different issue, and I agree here, but this is an inherent problem with PvP. In WoW, there wasn't an "entry level" PvP set for 3 expansions. And even if you introduce one, it's not going to be enough to allow a player to compete one-on-one with a battlemaster. I don't believe this is an issue though. PvE works the same way - a Nightmare Ops boss will decimate a tank in "entry level" PvE gear.

 

Now, in WoW, the issue is minimized by introducing virtual "tiers". Arenas and rated BGs tend to attract the more geared players, leaving the normal PvP maps to a less geared crowd, leveling that playing field a bit. But at the end of the day, this is how every game works - you get your face beat in until you have the gear to compete. I lost a lot of WZ and died a lot of times working to get my Champ set. We all have to go through it.

[TheRiddick]

Kinda feels like RIFT. Leveling was sweet, fun n stuff. Get to 50, it's just a strait grind due to expertise... or in rift it was valor. Bioware was just plian stupid for implementing this IMO..

 

But hell what do I know. I just log on to get my daily then be bored for a few hours .... :/

[AnAssassinOfTime]

I want a star wars themed Isle of Quel'Danas. On a PVP server that was some of the most fun I have ever had in an MMO.

 

Fair enough, though I know a lot of people that hated that zone. Ilum had a chance to be that. Decent map, cool concept, but there's no mandate or incentive to populate there.

 

I totally agree that the game feels grindy and stale at 50. But I played classic WoW, and at 60, I felt the same way. I'm willing to give the developers at least 6 months to iterate and improve.

 

If others aren't, I can certainly understand that.

[pawestman]

You sound like you don't like the concept of MMOs, not only this game.

[Dystopic]

Fair enough, though I know a lot of people that hated that zone. Ilum had a chance to be that. Decent map, cool concept, but there's no mandate or incentive to populate there.

 

I totally agree that the game feels grindy and stale at 50. But I played classic WoW, and at 60, I felt the same way. I'm willing to give the developers at least 6 months to iterate and improve.

 

If others aren't, I can certainly understand that.

 

I agree the framework is there for this to be an amazing game. But that doesn't mean everything is fine right now and if people don't express themselves nothing will happen and the game will flop. I would like for this game to do well. I originally planned 3-6 months grace period and i think that's enough. if there are no signs of improvements then it's very reasonable IMO to drop the game.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Dystopic