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Private combat logs?


Devorin_Sargothi

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-nods-

 

I understand your point, but it's that "bad form" that becomes the norm. Thus making the overall gaming experience bad for ALOT of players. Not because their performance is necessary poor, it may be, but because of the way it is analyzed and used against them. Using the tool to destroy the community takes place far more than using it to build the community. I wish that weren't true, but I've been around these games long enough to know that it is.

 

I don't understand. I've never seen someone perform adequately and be demonized using dps information. I've seen gearscore requirements for raids that were much higher than you really needed, but those were farming runs, not progression raids.

 

Can you give an example?

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I don't understand. I've never seen someone perform adequately and be demonized using dps information. I've seen gearscore requirements for raids that were much higher than you really needed, but those were farming runs, not progression raids.

 

Can you give an example?

 

Just look at these forums and posts about these tools is enough. The way supporters of the tool treat those that are against it, that's all the proof you need. That animostiy on display here is the same that gets shoved onto people in the game. To pretend that doesn't happen is just trying to put on a good face to make others believe the tool will always be used in a pious helpful manner. That's as far from the truth as it gets, its exactly the opposite.

Edited by Vydor_HC
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do you think you see more of the park running through it or walking through it?

 

maybe they should remove leveling? lets just all start at max level and go right to killing bosses as fast as possible. ever consider that maybe if the content took longer to get through they would have more time to produce better content?

 

Really? I mean seriously? This is your opinion? If the game ever becomes this 'walk in the park' you so desire, that'll mean the death of any interesting raiding or end-game for that matter.

 

I can only remain interested after levelling so many alts before I stop playing completely.

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Yep I call this a solid win for the Anti Meter crowd.

 

Everything is proceeding as I have foreseen. :csw_redsaber::D

 

Yep. Have fun figuring out who just caused the wipe.

 

Oh wait, they're going to make everything super duper laid back so that you only wipe if you're literally sleeping. So have fun I guess.

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I can only remain interested after levelling so many alts before I stop playing completely.

 

No, that's actually the plan. Bioware is dumb enough to try it and these people are dumb enough to believe it.

 

Raiding and PvP were lies all along! Getting 97 characters to level 20, that's where the action is!

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Just look at these forums and posts about these tools is enough. The way supporters of the tool treat those that are against it, that's all the proof you need. That animostiy on display here is the same that gets shoved onto people in the game. To pretend that doesn't happen is just trying to put on a good face to make others believe the tool will always be used in a pious helpful manner. That's as far from the truth as it gets.

 

Bingo and that is exactly why it isn't happening....Bioware said at SDCC while they thought of WoW as a touchstone Bioware would not embrace the nasty mean-spirited hyper competitive atmosphere that Blizzard has. And a lot of folks here have been making sure the devs are reading some of the downright rude posts from the pro meter crowd. I say they did it to themselves.

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Just look at these forums and posts about these tools is enough. The way supporters of the tool treat those that are against it, that's all the proof you need.

 

One could swap the roles around in that statement and it wouldn't be any less true given the way you're presenting the argument.

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Just look at these forums and posts about these tools is enough. The way supporters of the tool treat those that are against it, that's all the proof you need. That animostiy on display here is the same that gets shoved onto people in the game. To pretend that doesn't happen is just trying to put on a good face to make others believe the tool will always be used in a pious helpful manner. That's as far from the truth as it gets, its exactly the opposite.

 

What I'm asking for is an anecdote from someone who did some dungeon or something and performed their job sufficiently, and later someone used data from the run to incriminate them. Surely with all the animosity on display here, someone must have a story to tell.

Edited by Devorin_Sargothi
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Yep. Have fun figuring out who just caused the wipe.

 

Oh wait, they're going to make everything super duper laid back so that you only wipe if you're literally sleeping. So have fun I guess.

 

I plan to.

 

I see a very bight future for TOR as more and more people who are turned off by the pro raider mentality shows up; I think that is why the population is still growing .

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When they call us E-Peeners and jobless fatties that doesn't count.

 

Actually if you look at it the ratio of folks who say that are pretty small and actually call anyone names on these forums and you will get suspended no matter what side of the fence you are on.

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Competitive guilds will leave in droves if there is not combat log soon and Causual Joe will be left. For now. Bioware doesn't need to release new content if all Causual Joe does is BT HM at most.

 

They don't view this as a threat. This is precisely what they seem to want.

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Bingo and that is exactly why it isn't happening....Bioware said at SDCC while they thought of WoW as a touchstone Bioware would not embrace the nasty mean-spirited hyper competitive atmosphere that Blizzard has. And a lot of folks here have been making sure the devs are reading some of the downright rude posts from the pro meter crowd. I say they did it to themselves.

 

Rude posts aren't exclusive to the 'pro meter' crowd as you say. Stop trying to paint everyone on with the same brush.

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Rude posts aren't exclusive to the 'pro meter' crowd as you say. Stop trying to paint everyone on with the same brush.

 

Their entire argument amounts to this! The only argument they have is that damage meters are exclusively used by jerks. They literally cannot do as you ask and still hold the position they do.

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Rude posts aren't exclusive to the 'pro meter' crowd as you say. Stop trying to paint everyone on with the same brush.

 

I never said they were; personally I don't care for rudeness on either side, but I do see a heck of a lot more of it on the pro meter side.

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Really? I mean seriously? This is your opinion? If the game ever becomes this 'walk in the park' you so desire, that'll mean the death of any interesting raiding or end-game for that matter.

 

I can only remain interested after levelling so many alts before I stop playing completely.

 

you are misinterpreting what i mean. I say walk in the park meaning experiencing everything. If you are running through it you are not fulling experiencing the park. But thank you from proving my point for me. if you had read any of my other posts you see i'm opposed to making the game easier with mods. how can anyone consider themselves "hardcore" if they are asking for ways to make the game easier a month into it?

Edited by guided_by_voices
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Just look at these forums and posts about these tools is enough. The way supporters of the tool treat those that are against it, that's all the proof you need. That animostiy on display here is the same that gets shoved onto people in the game. To pretend that doesn't happen is just trying to put on a good face to make others believe the tool will always be used in a pious helpful manner. That's as far from the truth as it gets, its exactly the opposite.

 

here here! :)

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OK, here's the deal.

 

WoW's lore and characters are "charming", but apart from a bit of occasional indulgence in the mythos and a bit of childlike immersion now and then, few people take the roleplaying in that game "seriously" ("serious" in the context of a game of course), apart from some of the very young players and incurable romantics and furry-lovers ;)

 

It's true that Blizzard are, and always have been, geniuses at creating fast-paced, competitive gameplay. For many players of WoW, they could be playing any old game in any old "virtual world", it's the feel of the combat and the competitive nature of the e-sport (both PvE and PvP) that matters.

 

BioWare aren't trying to compete in that arena. Their strength has never particularly been combat. They are usually competent enough at combat (any deveoper has to be), but it's not their main strength. Their strength, what they're good at, what has made them an AAA developer loved by many, is the roleplay and immersion.

 

So it stands to reason that if they enter the MMO field, their MMO is going to place a great deal of emphasis on storytelling, immersion, VO, dialogue and choices.

 

That doesn't mean they're going to neglect competitive PvE and PvP (and their accoutrements like combat meters, etc.) altogether, of course not. And when it works (when there's no ability delay, as there isn't sometimes), it's fun enough.

 

So competitive players coming to SWTOR are barking up the wrong tree if they're thinking that BioWare are going to turn SWTOR into yet another ultra-competitive game. It would, indeed, be foolish of BW to do so. There are other games that do competitive PvE and PvP better.

 

For BW, their main interest is going to be in attracting people who a) are already fans of the BioWare "style", and b) people who want to roleplay being the Star Wars universe.

 

If they lean too much towards pleasing the competitive crowd, they're going to alienate the crowd they are able to please the most according to what they're best at doing.

 

And I'm not saying it's a black and white thing - it's always going to be a bit of a compromise in some way. I'd say that damage meters for personal use (e.g. test dummies with damage meters) and possibly some kind of metric for Operations, are likely to be the compromise they make. That's as much quantification as min-maxers and competitive players really need, without intruding too much of a competitive aura into a game that's primarily a roleplayer's game.

 

So much for arguments of the type "unless BW turn this into a more competitive game, it will fail". On the contrary, if BW don't play to their strengths, the game will fail. (Min-maxing, remember? :) )

 

The only valid counter-argument to this line of thought, so far as I can see is: will they be able to make enough roleplaying content to keep the game going? I don't see any reason why not - especially considering that they've said they've got enough VO for another year and a half of content down the pipeline.

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The only valid counter-argument to this line of thought, so far as I can see is: will they be able to make enough roleplaying content to keep the game going? I don't see any reason why not - especially considering that they've said they've got enough VO for another year and a half of content down the pipeline.

 

So it really is "Hurr derr voice acting" after all, huh?

 

A year and a half of voice acting! That's their plan, is doling out little bits of voice acting?

 

Why the hell does that cost $15 a month?!

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Competitive guilds will leave in droves if there is not combat log soon and Causual Joe will be left. For now. Bioware doesn't need to release new content if all Causual Joe does is BT HM at most.

 

So...lets look at just how many "Competitive guilds" there are in TOR.

 

Not that many.

 

In fact I see a lot of friendly pug raids so far....so a game succeeding without having to embrace a Lord of the Flies mentality.....What's wrong with that? I mean other than the hard-cores desperately wanting it to fail because they aren't kow towing to them.

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