Do you support an in game version of Recount. Please give reasons for your answer.

[Buur]

This is just inanely boring. I wrote my first program in '79, that mean damn all in the current context.

 

You 'work' in IT, that's cool, you don't 'work' in a game. If you are going to hold people accountable in a PuG, I pity you, as you left the whole 'game' idea behind some time ago, and should not really be in a group at all, unless they're all willing to be 'accountable' to each other.

 

If the group mess up, f*** up , whatever, leave it be and try again with different people. You don't have to be constantly watching other people to pick the one you want to hold accountable.

 

It makes me sad to think there are people like you on this game and I might run into you.

 

You know there is a way of replacing weak links without being a jerk? You are aware of this right? I am not looking to make anyone feel terrible I just want to play with other people who have a similar skill set. Sorry you can't see the difference.

 

So rather than replace one individual you expect people to constantly replace their entire group?

 

I am going to guess you are a firm believer in participation trophies.

[ferroz]

I'm against all Mods, so opening the game up to an outside DPS meter will invariably let other mods be developed.

Off topic for this thread. The thread topic is specifically about a BW created, integrated meter.

 

Because we have a bunch of idiots that migrated over here from WoW and think that having a decent DPS number makes you good. This attitude is something that should be fought.

Eh, blaming wow is kind of silly, meter mania predates the existence of wow.

 

Because I'm rather oldschool in the opinion that if you can't figure it out yourself then you're bad. I'd personally love it if they took DMCA claims against all wiki and guide sites.

Using a meter is figuring it out for yourself.

 

Using recount is the same as using the game client. If you're going to object to the former, You'd better not be logging into the game to actually figure out your dps, or you're a baddie.

 

Once meters are out they impact EVERYONES gameplay. You all saw the morons in WoW after recount became mandatory and god help us about Gearscore.

Recount isn't mandatory. Neither is Gearscore. Neither of them ever has been. Edited January 16, 2012 by ferroz

[TItanten]

Incorrect, BioWare could easily develop their own meter and put it into the game. They don't have to open up the game to mods to have a damage meter in the game.

 

Also I don't understand how you can say that if someone as a DPSer is doing poor DPS that they are still doing a good job. Their job is to DPS. If their DPS is low, they are doing a poor job. I am not going to make someone feel bad for being a bad DPSer, but as a tank, I would like to be in groups with DPS that are at least competent.

 

Like I said, an outside DPS meter, thus a mod.

 

They already alluded to a personal-only dps meter being developed.

 

 

 

Now there's a good dpser and a bad dpser. You can do 40x the dps of the next person, but die every single fight in the first mechanic. That's a bad player.

 

You can also do slightly lower dps, but live to the end of the fight every time: That's a good player.

[Krazeh]

Because they play for enjoyment and then one day they need a group to get a class mission done or something like that and along come Mr. Elitist on Training Wheels telling them they need to re-spec, get new rotations cuz their dps suxorz! Lolz lrn2ply wow ****.

 

That's one reason..

 

So go find a different group then? And tbh in the absence of things like recount 'Mr. Elitist on Training Wheels' will just find some other reason to be a ******* when you end up wiping on a boss, whether that be your gear or something you did or didn't do during the fight. People will be *******es with or without recount, the only difference with recount is there is some specific data being used.

 

Now there's a good dpser and a bad dpser. You can do 40x the dps of the next person, but die every single fight in the first mechanic. That's a bad player.

 

You can also do slightly lower dps, but live to the end of the fight every time: That's a good player.

 

Which is why people pay a lot more attention to the damage done part of recount rather than just DPS.

Edited January 16, 2012 by Krazeh

[Buur]

Like I said, an outside DPS meter, thus a mod.

 

They already alluded to a personal-only dps meter being developed.

 

 

 

Now there's a good dpser and a bad dpser. You can do 40x the dps of the next person, but die every single fight in the first mechanic. That's a bad player.

 

You can also do slightly lower dps, but live to the end of the fight every time: That's a good player.

 

And you can do the most dps and live to the end of the fight and be a great player. Or you could do bad dps and die at the beginning of the fight and be a terrible player. Or you could live throughout the fight and do less damage than the guy that died halfway through the fight and be a bad player. Or you could.... shall I keep going?

Edited January 16, 2012 by Buur

[Happylol]

Oh god, setanian is posting again.

 

This is the guy that said meters were cheating and using an analogy that every professional sport has been using for 30 years!

 

To whoever said they played EQ and were top 3-

 

Were there super tight enrage timers in EQ? I did not play so I am being serious here.

 

In all honestly, I don't even care about having a meter or not.

 

What I care about is the fact that the operations are being tuned around enrage timers instead of being tuned for boss mechanics, and the former pretty much requires you to know your overall group DPS output.

[Fissile]

Not only that, but recount/skada reports a lot of other interesting information to ferret out who's failing at what mechanic, from 'what killed me', to 'interrupts', or 'who broke CC', etc.

 

Maybe it's not going to be an issue with 8 man raids, but with 25 (and all of the spell effects that come with that) its a much welcomed tool to review what just happened and why, and come up with strategies to correct the problem.

[trublmaker]

Oh god, setanian is posting again.

 

This is the guy that said meters were cheating and using an analogy that every professional sport has been using for 30 years!

 

To whoever said they played EQ and were top 3-

 

Were there super tight enrage timers in EQ? I did not play so I am being serious here.

 

In all honestly, I don't even care about having a meter or not.

 

What I care about is the fact that the operations are being tuned around enrage timers instead of being tuned for boss mechanics, and the former pretty much requires you to know your overall group DPS output.

 

No counters. EQ raids were strat based...

Edited January 16, 2012 by trublmaker

[TorqueoMilitaris]

this tools doesnt gives anything else, but informations. Anyone can check others gear by right clicking on them, but why should we check every people's gear in the group 1 by 1 to see, they geared enough to the fp/op what we want to clear. There are requests already to join an op group, like:

 

-lfg healer/tank/dps to xy op/fp with least an average gear

 

soon will be looks like:

 

-lfg healer/tank/dps to xy op/fp min full epic

 

and so on

 

A gearscore like tool just save some time to check everyones gear

 

DPS tool is same. Its only giving informations about how ppl can play with their class. And thats needed. Race is good, and always a challenge to do things better. Ppl with less dps/heal can see, they do something wrong, can ask others, what should they change in talent/gear/rotation to do it better. And if they cant do it better for long time, sadly they"ll be out of the stronger teams. I agree those, who doesnt want to carry weaker players on their back, if they doesnt shows any improvement for long time.

[TItanten]

And you can do the most dps and live to the end of the fight and be a great player. Or you could do bad dps and die at the beginning of the fight and be a terrible player. Or you could live throughout the fight and do less damage than the guy that died halfway through the fight and be a bad player. Or you could.... shall I keep going?

 

 

He was just asking how a person could do low dps and still be a good player.

 

 

 

God I wish you guys actually liked Pandas...

[Buur]

He was just asking how a person could do low dps and still be a good player.

 

 

 

God I wish you guys actually liked Pandas...

 

What difference does that make? Pandas aren't out yet and probably won't be for 10 months.

[TItanten]

this tools doesnt gives anything else, but informations. Anyone can check others gear by right clicking on them, but why should we check every people's gear in the group 1 by 1 to see, they geared enough to the fp/op what we want to clear. There are requests already to join an op group, like:

 

-lfg healer/tank/dps to xy op/fp with least an average gear

 

soon will be looks like:

 

-lfg healer/tank/dps to xy op/fp min full epic

 

and so on

 

A gearscore like tool just save some time to check everyones gear

 

DPS tool is same. Its only giving informations about how ppl can play with their class. And thats needed. Race is good, and always a challenge to do things better. Ppl with less dps/heal can see, they do something wrong, can ask others, what should they change in talent/gear/rotation to do it better. And if they cant do it better for long time, sadly they"ll be out of the stronger teams. I agree those, who doesnt want to carry weaker players on their back, if they doesnt shows any improvement for long time.

 

Heck, we could say "No people with english as second language", but that'd be just as wrong as basing invites off something as circumstantial as gearscore.

[Setanian]

but that doesn't make the information less important or useful.

 

Both useful and important are subjective terms. What I would say is this; They are only really useful and really important to those who cannot play without them. If you cannot play without them, maybe this game is too difficult for you.

[Happylol]

No counters. EQ raids were strat based...

 

Ok thats what I thought.

 

The SWTOR fights right now are 100% DPS based.

 

The first boss in EV is basically DPS as hard as possible, heal a 15-17k burst, and stack when he missile barrages.

 

The 2nd is basically tank and spank with movement every minute.

 

4th is 100% 1v1 DPS solo boss. (2 minute enrage solo)

 

5th is basically see if you can DPS the boss in order to beat the enrage(which ATM is mathematically impossible)

 

I would love nothing more than to worry more about boss mechanics than DPS, but it is not possible ATM.

[TItanten]

What difference does that make? Pandas aren't out yet and probably won't be for 10 months.

 

Just seems like so many of these posters' MMO resumes say only:

 

 

WoW - 6 years.

 

Raider. Copied strats straight from Wiki. Never completed content without googling it first. Relied completely on addons.

Edited January 16, 2012 by TItanten

[Fissile]

He was just asking how a person could do low dps and still be a good player.

 

 

 

God I wish you guys actually liked Pandas...

And I wish there weren't so many people like you that have massive hardons for the halcyon days of vanilla WoW or EQ where the game seemed actively designed to be a pain in the rear.

 

Bosses weren't harder then, it was just harder to know what the issues were because the problems hid behind obfuscation (i.e. which of the 40 people were AFKing) or required a soul-crushing grind to collect resistance gear.

 

You probably are an LFG hater as well, I presume?

[trublmaker]

Ok thats what I thought.

 

The SWTOR fights right now are 100% DPS based.

 

The first boss in EV is basically DPS as hard as possible, heal a 15-17k burst, and stack when he missile barrages.

 

The 2nd is basically tank and spank with movement every minute.

 

4th is 100% 1v1 DPS solo boss. (2 minute enrage solo)

 

5th is basically see if you can DPS the boss in order to beat the enrage(which ATM is mathematically impossible)

 

I would love nothing more than to worry more about boss mechanics than DPS, but it is not possible ATM.

I have never played WoW, Perhaps my viewpoint would be different if I had.

[Setanian]

You know there is a way of replacing weak links without being a jerk? You are aware of this right? I am not looking to make anyone feel terrible I just want to play with other people who have a similar skill set. Sorry you can't see the difference.

 

So rather than replace one individual you expect people to constantly replace their entire group?

 

I am going to guess you are a firm believer in participation trophies.

 

I have no doubt that you might not want to make others feel terrible. That is not being sarcastic at all, so, don't take it as such.

 

But, WoW has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that a huge majority will mis-use it. You only have to read these forums to see all the kiddie LolZ, Lrn2Play, Get back to Wow, kindergarden chat. And you want to give these people tools to help them epeen themselves?

[TItanten]

And I wish there weren't so many people like you that have massive hardons for the halcyon days of vanilla WoW or EQ where the game seemed actively designed to be a pain in the rear.

 

Bosses weren't harder then, it was just harder to know what the issues were because the problems hid behind obfuscation (i.e. which of the 40 people were AFKing) or required a soul-crushing grind to collect resistance gear.

 

You probably are an LFG hater as well, I presume?

 

LFG is fine. Cross-server LFG is a bane on MMOs.

 

And if you can't beat a non-enrage boss then I'm just saying that you're not good enough.

 

Enrage bosses are stupid. Take them out and there would be no reason at all to have any dps meter.

[Setanian]

And I wish there weren't so many people like you that have massive hardons for the halcyon days of vanilla WoW or EQ where the game seemed actively designed to be a pain in the rear.

 

Bosses weren't harder then, it was just harder to know what the issues were because the problems hid behind obfuscation (i.e. which of the 40 people were AFKing) or required a soul-crushing grind to collect resistance gear.

 

You probably are an LFG hater as well, I presume?

 

As a matter of interest, how far did you progress in EQ raiding?

[Fissile]

I have no doubt that you might not want to make others feel terrible....But...You only have to read these forums to see all the kiddie LolZ, Lrn2Play, Get back to Wow, kindergarden chat. And you want to give these people tools to help them epeen themselves?

I'm guessing you don't see the self-irony of you stating this while simultaneously insulting people as "needing training wheels because this game is too hard"?

[TheSkate]

Ok thats what I thought.

 

The SWTOR fights right now are 100% DPS based.

 

The first boss in EV is basically DPS as hard as possible, heal a 15-17k burst, and stack when he missile barrages.

 

The 2nd is basically tank and spank with movement every minute.

 

4th is 100% 1v1 DPS solo boss. (2 minute enrage solo)

 

5th is basically see if you can DPS the boss in order to beat the enrage(which ATM is mathematically impossible)

 

I would love nothing more than to worry more about boss mechanics than DPS, but it is not possible ATM.

 

So this mythical recount clone is going to make the mathematically impossible boss possible?

[Setanian]

Ok thats what I thought.

 

The SWTOR fights right now are 100% DPS based.

 

The first boss in EV is basically DPS as hard as possible, heal a 15-17k burst, and stack when he missile barrages.

 

The 2nd is basically tank and spank with movement every minute.

 

4th is 100% 1v1 DPS solo boss. (2 minute enrage solo)

 

5th is basically see if you can DPS the boss in order to beat the enrage(which ATM is mathematically impossible)

 

I would love nothing more than to worry more about boss mechanics than DPS, but it is not possible ATM.

 

Why are you not lobbying BW for some real raid content than the current garbage then?

[Setanian]

I'm guessing you don't see the self-irony of you stating this while simultaneously insulting people as "needing training wheels because this game is too hard"?

 

I don't but I'm sure you can explain it to me, I'll be delighted to pick it apart.

[Happylol]

I have never played WoW, Perhaps my viewpoint would be different if I had.

 

Whether or not you played WoW really doesn't matter, the point is that most WoW Heroic bosses are designed around enrage timers which is also the case in SWTOR.