Why aren't we allowed to complain?

[Yfelsung]

As a RPer you need a background story sufficient enough, so that you are able to create your own story. I'm quite confident that you guys all having the same story going for you and the same companions at your side helps a lot with that. Or the means given by BW to create your RP (like the ability to sit on chairs).

 

ToR provides to much background for each character to really allow for RP (and thus a community), and offers to little of an enviroment for good RP (technical aspects here).

 

You don't understand.

 

As RPers we're going to make up our own stories when RPing that are independent from the main story.

 

But as we're RPers, story is important to us, we love RPGs, so experiencing a well written story (and the SW story is AMAZING) is something we enjoy just as much as PvP and Ops.

 

If the Dev came to me and said "Okay, we can give you two new raids or 4 more ours of class story per class" I'd take the 4 more hours of story.

[bandraoi]

Nearly every mmo can be considered a beta at all times they are all in some form of upgrade and patch cycle. Bugs will exists FACT how quickly a company addresses them and communicates with the community can do a lot to alleviate player rage.

 

We live in an imperfect world and to be honest we have had the holidays slap bang in the middle of the launch the game was probably overhyped and im sure bioware would have liked more time to polish it but when you get in bed with the devil (lucas arts) you dance when the devil commands.

 

Bugs will get fixed tempers will get frayed no game has been perfect netiher wow rift eq or guildwars and to people shouting gw2 it will have probs as well.

 

People are paying customers they are entitled to opinions, if life in front of the screen makes folk rage so much they need to get out more...its a game after all

Edited January 6, 2012 by bandraoi

[freakuancy]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

Because its all you do.

 

Uninstall and go 'way.

[AchYm]

All these fanboys. OP never said he expected a bug free game, no one did.

The problem is a lot of these bugs were reported in beta.

And here we are 3 days in a row servers down fixing bugs that should have been fixed back in beta.

 

The ability delay makes it impossible to PvP on my marauder.

Having a 2second delay on almost all my abilties is insane.

[zolthie]

Because its all you do.

 

Uninstall and go 'way.

 

Typical biodrone comment, sigh.

 

Facts are facts, SWTOR lacks alot and that will be its downfall.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Notannos
removed inappropriate language

[Skovick]

The only issue I've run into is not being able to abandon some older quests on planets I'm no longer questing on. But I've gotten prompt replies from customer service on ways to try and fix the issue, and on how to contact customer service if the problem isn't resolved. I can't ask for much better service then that.

 

Other then that I'd have to look back to lvl 5ish when Satele was still a "littles" for th jedi Knight story. Lvl 35 now and enjoying Hoth/Quesh (spelling)? At work atm.

 

Keep up the good work Bioware

 

 

P.S. I did have a issue on my scoundrel where my abilties would often get interupted while in cover, but it seems to have been resolved which has been a big plus.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Skovick

[MikeMonger]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

Because you're not complaining. You're arguing that WoW and Rift as oh so much better than SWTOR. In which case, you should stop complaining and play WoW or Rift.

 

No the game isn't perfect. But if you'd rather be playing other MMO's, you should be playing other MMO's.

[stupidhero]

You don't understand.

 

As RPers we're going to make up our own stories when RPing that are independent from the main story.

 

You form your own community. That's what you're saying here. To do so you use the background given by the SW I.P.., and your characters story forced upon you by BW, i.e. you guys face serious personality disorders. Unless you ignore your characters story, at which point

But as we're RPers, story is important to us, we love RPGs, so experiencing a well written story (and the SW story is AMAZING) is something we enjoy just as much as PvP and Ops.

 

If the Dev came to me and said "Okay, we can give you two new raids or 4 more ours of class story per class" I'd take the 4 more hours of story.

 

You just like to experience a good story, and want to build upon it using a sufficient enviroment.

[Vlacke]

Advice to OP:

Go back to playing WoW and/or Rift since you are so obviously in love with those games.

We don't need your comparisons and complaints here.

[Skovick]

facts are facts, sw:tor has an awful lot in place already that many more people enjoy than whine about. Facts are, they've addressed every single one of your 'issues' in a press release, q/a or update. Facts are, you don't care.

 

you and your less than one percent of the current subscriber basehave been cluttering up my forums since ega day #1. do not kid yourself, that is a real number, you are a minority and the rest of us don't care. It is math. You are wrong. Sorry.

 

i have personally detailed some of the issues that need to be addressed in this game in a constructive manner. So have a few others. the rest of you are just attention grubbing doom-and-gloomers who have very little idea of what they are even complaining about and aren't qualified to rate a game of candyland let alone a multi-million dollar mmo project.

 

you are a discredit to this generation of gamers and a discredit to mmo fans.

 

this

 

nuff said

[LogicalPremise]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

I think the major issues with complaints fall into three catagories:

 

1) Rejection of complaints based on comparisons : quite frankly, a lot of people are sick of having SWTOR compared to WoW or even hearing about WoW. Many people playing the game left WoW because they couldn't stand it. Stating that WoW does something better may very well be true, but using as the primary support for why you don't like something basically implies you'd rather be playing WoW.

 

Worse, all too often the complaint is about something that a lot of people have no issues with. Take ability response times. The mouse turner/keybind people who have good reflexes and are use to WoW-response time levels are furious about this, because it feels like your character is a nerve damaged wreck. But there are a lot of players who a clickers and keyboard turners, who respond within that .5 second gap and so never even see it. When they see complaints about something they LITERALLY aren't seeing, and then comparisons to WoW, they reject the argument as just pointless.

 

2) Rejection of complaints based on investment : the other half of why things aren't taken at face value is (as with your example) is the expecation that SWTOR must meet "expectations" when literally EVERYONE has different definitions of what this so-called baseline is. And every one of them (LFG, LFD, DPS meters, add-ons, etc) is cool with one person and infuriates another.

 

Some people are invested in SWTOR (fanboys) because they need something to defend. Others are invested in it (WoW-haters like me) simply because it isn't WoW. (Srlsy, dog, game could use Atari graphics and be about *****-slapping Darth Malgus through a hoop and I'd play that over WoW). There's no arguing or reasoning with these groups in terms of suggesting SWTOR emulate other MMO's because the appeal of this one is that it doesn't.

 

3) Repeat, repeat, repeat : finally, too many complaints are simply the same thing rehashed. When you have 70+ threads on issue X, and issue X affects 4% of the player base, the other 96% are pretty much sick of hearing about it because it's not issue Y that affects THEM. Examples? My FPS is fine. My PvP is pretty fun. I haven't run into a SINGLE queue or show stopping bug. Literally my own problem is graphical artifacts (laser light show ftl) and issues with the garbage that passes as an AH.

 

For me, all the threads about ability delay mean nothing (clicker here! Clickers for life!) and the stuff about can't log in never affected me. I know people are not making it up -- one of my friends literally now has a nice SWTOR CE paperweight due to this -- but it doesn't affect ME so it's hard for me to get upset about it.

 

When random person X comes in ranting and railing that the game is "doomed" and "sucks"...and I am having fun ... how am I supposed to take this person seriously?

[Heliotic]

"Why aren't we allowed to complain?"

*posts an 11 page thread*

 

The people who don't like SWTOR need to stop pretending (for whatever reason) that their opinion is being silenced.

[SlickDevlan]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

 

Oh look, "this" chick again posting more opinions as "facts" and calling out anyone who disagrees with her as "someone against legitimate issues"...again, while posting a 100% opinion based list of crap.

[Fraxture]

I think the major issues with complaints fall into three catagories:

 

1) Rejection of complaints based on comparisons : quite frankly, a lot of people are sick of having SWTOR compared to WoW or even hearing about WoW. Many people playing the game left WoW because they couldn't stand it. Stating that WoW does something better may very well be true, but using as the primary support for why you don't like something basically implies you'd rather be playing WoW.

 

Worse, all too often the complaint is about something that a lot of people have no issues with. Take ability response times. The mouse turner/keybind people who have good reflexes and are use to WoW-response time levels are furious about this, because it feels like your character is a nerve damaged wreck. But there are a lot of players who a clickers and keyboard turners, who respond within that .5 second gap and so never even see it. When they see complaints about something they LITERALLY aren't seeing, and then comparisons to WoW, they reject the argument as just pointless.

 

2) Rejection of complaints based on investment : the other half of why things aren't taken at face value is (as with your example) is the expecation that SWTOR must meet "expectations" when literally EVERYONE has different definitions of what this so-called baseline is. And every one of them (LFG, LFD, DPS meters, add-ons, etc) is cool with one person and infuriates another.

 

Some people are invested in SWTOR (fanboys) because they need something to defend. Others are invested in it (WoW-haters like me) simply because it isn't WoW. (Srlsy, dog, game could use Atari graphics and be about *****-slapping Darth Malgus through a hoop and I'd play that over WoW). There's no arguing or reasoning with these groups in terms of suggesting SWTOR emulate other MMO's because the appeal of this one is that it doesn't.

 

3) Repeat, repeat, repeat : finally, too many complaints are simply the same thing rehashed. When you have 70+ threads on issue X, and issue X affects 4% of the player base, the other 96% are pretty much sick of hearing about it because it's not issue Y that affects THEM. Examples? My FPS is fine. My PvP is pretty fun. I haven't run into a SINGLE queue or show stopping bug. Literally my own problem is graphical artifacts (laser light show ftl) and issues with the garbage that passes as an AH.

 

For me, all the threads about ability delay mean nothing (clicker here! Clickers for life!) and the stuff about can't log in never affected me. I know people are not making it up -- one of my friends literally now has a nice SWTOR CE paperweight due to this -- but it doesn't affect ME so it's hard for me to get upset about it.

 

When random person X comes in ranting and railing that the game is "doomed" and "sucks"...and I am having fun ... how am I supposed to take this person seriously?

 

I always give a wall of text the 1st paragraph to get my attention, and pull me in.

Yours did just that.

I think I have been doing a futile attempt to say what you just did.

 

Thank you, this is the exact truth of the matter IMO.

[artilleryshell]

I enjoy the game. Crazy, I know.

 

I also enjoy the game, however, it is broken. I would like bioware to fix the game so that I can play.

 

Is that so wrong?

[kiddeth]

WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch.

 

 

 

with this one sentence you have killed your own argument by letting the people know that were there that you have no clue as to what you are talking about.

 

there was no part of WoW that was smooth in it first few months.

[icecoldone]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

I don't agree with you that this game is a total disater. I think it's far from it. I accept your points i really do. But to answer your question as too why you get so much hate. Let me explain. Cos you don't SHUT UP!!!. The forum is filled with your repeated crying. I love this game but had to post on the pvp forums about 4 major game breaking bugs. Check on the pvp forums "This is a game breaking bug for me" by icecoldone.

 

So us "Fan Boyz" complain about issues too but the difference is you whiners don't shut up and whine about trival matters. From your list it seems that you really like WoW.

 

I think your list is very vague and your not really sure what your talking about.

 

What do you mean by in terms of efficiency. What does that even mean.

 

more to the point it seems to me you whiners need to go out more and your just burnt out on mmos. I know cos i was for 2 years and didn't play an mmo for over 2 years and now i'm back and i'm fresh and ready to play. I've seen people like you on every realeased mmo.

 

And guess what on every realeased mmo you hear the terms "We're playing a beta" It seems that the mmo community just hasn't gotten around to understand how large a project an mmo is. Especially this one. In fact i am blown away by the amount of content they have.

 

I don't consider people like you true gamers. You just spend you life infront of a computer and are upset about your personal life being not more than it is. Problem for everyone is alot of you don't know this cos your so far down you hardcore road that you know you've wasted so much of your life on it it would be an insult to your legacy to quit now and admit defeat. So all you do is go around expecting every game to be perfect. And if it's not you cry.

 

QQ Wow is a rubbish game cos i found a bug. QQ QQ QQ

 

every game gets realeased with bugs this one has one of the fewest game breaking bugs i've seen ever. REally it truly does. so stop QQing and try and enjoy your game

[Norumaniac]

We ARE supposed to complain, its the only way to get stuff fixed.

 

We also paid for the game and are supposed to pay every month.

[Xenich]

I think it's less about the pace and more about how entertaining the level is

 

Character development in RPG's is often the "entertainment" of such a game, otherwise the game would simply be an adventure game without stats to which you went around exploring the story/world and then moving on. When you introduce a complex character development system such as this game has (crafting alone in this game has multiple complex trees for tailoring a style of play for a character, not to mention the numerous commendation vendors and the fact that you have an entire party of companions to gear up), the development focus and point of the game becomes that progression. That is, for many who play these types of games, the entire point is the progression of that character as such.

 

So, level pace becomes extremely important as if you don't have time to experience the depth of the content, then there is no point to all of the depth. As I said, at 50 it isn't an issue as you have plenty of return for the effort you put into the system, but the 1-50 game is simply a waste of complex content due to the pace of leveling.

 

Even if you stop questing and simply grind grey missions for cash to obtain all that the system has to offer, as soon as you go back to normal questing progression, you have invalidated your gear within a couple days of play. That is, you can't experience the game through normal progression. You either gimick the game to keep from leveling with boring grinds or you play normally and bypass all of it until you get to 50.

[Skerry]

most of the "white knight" people are just sick of people complaining that the game isnt exactly like WoW....if you doubt me, I could pull up dozens of links proving my point, but I really don't feel like it...you can look for yourself.

 

2 different games.

 

Play or don't play. It's as simple as that.

 

Pretty much this.

 

There are indeed a handful of people who just bash on complainers for any reason possible.

 

MOST however, have no problem with critical thinking and constructive feedback; what we do have however is a great deal of outright whining and crying. Calling lack of features bugs, and condemning anyone who likes the game in order to elevate themselves above.

 

The game has issues; many recognize this. However as soon as you attach hyperbole, lies and false prophecy to the game - THAT is when people take issue.

[Breeti]

People are allowed to complain. It is just that other people are allowed to complain about the complainers. Vicious cycle isn't it.

[Voradoor]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

Heres the diffrance, this game hasnt even been out a month. I know I know blah blah its still unfinished..a new car should run aswell as a 7 year old one. we've all heard the refrances.

But fact is this isnt a car its a MMO, ive been in almost every MMO since DAoC during lanuch.

 

Fact is this stuff happens man, bugs missing features not a single MMO to date hasnt had this issue.

While I do agree the game is missing features it should have, is it game breaking? nope I play every night and enjoy it. so my game is not broken, just needing adjustment.

 

The game has a ton to work on, no doubt but its far from beta come back and use some reason and you'll be allowed to complain all you want.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Voradoor

[davidpop]

You are allowed to complain, but peole keep making pointless posts like yours.

 

Really this > that > thisthat

 

 

*** is that?

[ViceGat]

The game is still in beta. This much is obvious. There are a ton of bugs which make the game incomplete.

 

Why are so many people against other people complaining about legitimate issues? This game is a complete failure at the moment. Someone asked me, the other day, to give my run down of SWTOR, WoW and Rift and this is what I came up with:

 

Rift > WoW > SWTOR in terms of difficulty (cutting edge raiding)

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of combat smoothness

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of accessibility

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of story

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of efficiency

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of PvP

SWTOR > Rift > WoW in terms of levelling

WoW > SWTOR > Rift in terms of balance

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of playable content

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of 'size'

WoW > Rift > SWTOR in terms of MMO

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of RPG

SWTOR > WoW > Rift in terms of number of cinematics

 

I do not care if WoW came out in the year 2004, the fact is we're in 2012 and many of the things SWTOR currently lacks WoW had, and was praised for (smoothness of combat) during it's initial first few months of launch. My accurate breakdown of WoW, Rift and SWTOR doesn't make SWTOR any less of a game, for me. I want SWTOR to succeed, but it needs to be brought up to present day expectations.

 

If you have legitimate issues with the game, you have every right to complain about them, no one should stop you from doing so. The issue is with those few who are obviously trolling or just dumping on the thing to see how others will react to their post.

 

How you write your post can also sometimes be misconstrued as a troll if all you are doing is to vent your anger rather than calmly and logically explaining your problems so others can understand your point of view, and possibly come to the same conclusion you have.

Edited January 6, 2012 by ViceGat

[Nexxa]

Cranberries is at it again, I see. One of the more effective trolls this board has to offer, judging by this mess of replies. If this is indeed a trolling attempt (as the last whinefest was) then well played, but if you're actually trying to pass this drivel off as opinion then... I... heheheh... strongly, strongly disagree.