Anyone else think that the high level solo quests are way too difficult?

[MariLupus]

Got to agrea about Syo Bakarn though he only needs one other player. Main problem with soloing him is if you are targeting your comp for a heal which is likely as he puts out a lot of damage you don't see if he is using a skill that you must absolutly interupt.

 

Apart from him the only other real problem area was Qesh. Multiple sith mobs are a real pain as they break CC so easily.

 

Healing sage build BTW.

Edited January 8, 2012 by MariLupus

[Cynthesis]

Leveled 1-38 as Seer Sage with Qyzen tanking

Leveled 38-44 as Balance Sage with Tharan healing

 

No issues either way. Be sure you are grabbing the 9% reduced ability cost from the TK tree and possibly the 100 force increase. As balance I can solo Heroic 2+.

Typical Elite pull: Shield yourself. Open with a weakened mind. Tele throw till PoM proc. Use proc on mind crush. Pop force wave if it's a melee mob to kick it back. Tele throw as it reapproaches to slow it. Reapply shield. Use stun. Slow + Force dash if health gets low to create distance for Tharan to heal you back up. Mobs typically die very fast and I end up around 80-90% hp. Remember as balance you can talent so your force lift will hit 2 weak/standard mobs along with the strong or elite and Tharan can use holiday to cc another. Makes taking on 2 Strongs and an elite very easy.

 

Tharan will also usually continue to try to cc elites if it's the only mob out. While your damage will prevent that cc he usually gets the timing right and ends up preventing casts from the mob.

 

Another key is remembering which abilities are worthwhile to save the interrupt for like lightning storms. Don't worry about the quick cast abilities they tend to do little damage and leave you with your interrupt on cd when the big damage one comes

Edited January 8, 2012 by Cynthesis

[Morvoldo]

i thought that fight with the multi sith in qesh was quite a pain but very duable as shadow infil MM (mind Maze) the lightning one (they were the hardest) and take the other 2 while theran was healing, its after that at Voss i had trouble, couldnt even complete 1 quest as each had an elite to kill and force cloak and MM became usless as they spawned when activated FC and they vanished to be spawned again, Kinectic spec was the only way i could kill on Voss and Corella, i could at least use Nadia for norms and theran for heals on elites in that spec but i also Notice that most Consulars went Sage (wish i did) Edited January 24, 2012 by Morvoldo

[QuintessaSHeera]

Absolutely...I'm a straight Seer Healer type, so it can be outrageously difficult to do some of the quests if I'm going it alone. I've learned to stay out of range of most of the big bads and let my companion do most of the work, but straight healing can get kinda boring (and it can take a long time to take down elites with only one person hitting/attacking and I'm stuck only healing/buffing them).

 

So, I just run with my husband's smuggler. We do all our quests together. It was the only way we could get some of our quests done.

[Reeny]

It's really easy as Kinetic tank spec with Tharan healing.

U can even take down certain Champions.

Some Champions just do too much damage though.

 

Also have to interrupt whenever u can.

Tharan's Holiday also provides good interrupts.

 

DPS spec with Tharan healing would be harder as u take more damage.

[SoonerJBD]

Gear properly. Use interrupts. Use force armor.

 

Move around and use line of sight. You can jump behind a pillar and throw a quick heal on yourself. Use your cooldowns.

 

You shouldn't have problems.

[Phydra]

Gonna step in and weigh in on this one as it has become something of an annoyance to me as well.

 

First things first - I've been playing healers in MMOs for darn near 20 years (kid you not) and, while I'm probably not the greatest heal machine to ever hit the planet, I'm no slouch.

 

Here, I'm a level 50 seer who has paid meticulous attention to both my companion's armor and stats as well as my own. I grok the notion of letting Qyzen tank and making good use of my abilities and rotations. I'm not sloppy with positioning. I understand and use LoS when it's there.

 

This said, it is annoying as all get out to find most 2+ heroics are not designed to actually be *2* and usually mean that *+*. Since Voss, I have had to call on my trooper buddy for every last one of them.

 

Walking into a 2+ and finding every pull to be a minimum of two elites (and usually two strongs), all of which hit harder than they should, and most of which have overclocked stuns or AoE effects is... just... not... fun.

 

LoS is minimal mitigation as it saves me, but kills my tank. (Ya can't heal what you can't see).

 

Chicken-dancing (rapid position changes) is not a solid tactic if you're over the age of 35 (come on, folks, physiology is physiology); if I wanted to dance like this, I'd go to a damn dance club.... or play a console game.

 

What I take away from these quests is that, ultimately, they're not designed for "you and your companion" as that *2* but, instead, "you, your companion, and a friend" (hence the *+*). If so, then BioWare needs to make it crystal clear this is the case. If not, they need to revisit it and downgrade it a bit. A challenge is fun; repeated defeats is not. It's that simple.

 

Finally, I see a a few folks peeping in to run some comment along the line of, "No trouble for me... maybe it's you." and frankly, these folks are missing the point. If an encounter is generally UN-fun and UN-winnable (or gets the rep for being so to all but the FP/OPS/PVP/Purple geared players and theory-crafters) it is effectively a loss as the bread and butter of these games are the "middle of the roaders", not the early content exhausters, the specialty players, the focused theory-crafters, or the folks who have muscle to call on at will to "roflstomp" things.

 

This isn't a moment where "lrn2play" helps anyone, and there's enough disgruntled feedback to reasonably make the case that it isn't "just" a matter of "skillz". But, frankly, even if it were, the outcomes are bad for BioWare as perception creates reality and every one of these players is opportunity won or lost to expand and solidify the playerbase.

 

Upshot: Feedback is relatively consistent and for no more reason than this, the matter deserves a closer look and acknowledgement.

 

My $0.02 worth... take it or leave it as you prefer.

[Reeny]

Heroic 2+ and 4+ quests arent really designed for solo player plus companion.

 

Some strong classes can do certain Heroic 2+ at same level or if you out-level it by a lot.

[Dyinn]

Shadow Tank here. 1st try and kill with Nadia. Whats all the fuss Edited January 29, 2012 by Dyinn

[Requimo]

It's really easy as Kinetic tank spec with Tharan healing.

U can even take down certain Champions.

Some Champions just do too much damage though.

 

Also have to interrupt whenever u can.

Tharan's Holiday also provides good interrupts.

 

DPS spec with Tharan healing would be harder as u take more damage.

 

I second this, Kinetic Shadow with Tharan is easy mode. I could even kill champs with good use of cds and med pacs. Gold elites were np whatsoever. I sometimes even take Zenith or Nadia with me to make lvling harder .

 

I think inf spec is a bit behind at lvling than balance and kinetic. It seems more like a pvp dps spec.

[KilmarFyrewynd]

49.99 Inf Shadow (literally need 1 kill for 50) and the only problem I've had was Stark. Granted, I'm not at Syo yet, but what I have been doing is swapping Shadow Technique for Combat Technique when I get to a hard hitting boss and make sure to pop my defensive skills and pop an endurance stim.

[Incodicent]

If your a sage and having problems, your speced wrong, end of story. it's fastest and easiest class to level with. Go split talents in Balance/Telekentics and you'll face roll everything. PM me if u want the details on what talents to get if it's not plainfully obvious.

[elvigy]

Gonna step in and weigh in on this one as it has become something of an annoyance to me as well.

 

First things first - I've been playing healers in MMOs for darn near 20 years (kid you not) and, while I'm probably not the greatest heal machine to ever hit the planet, I'm no slouch.

 

Here, I'm a level 50 seer who has paid meticulous attention to both my companion's armor and stats as well as my own. I grok the notion of letting Qyzen tank and making good use of my abilities and rotations. I'm not sloppy with positioning. I understand and use LoS when it's there.

 

This said, it is annoying as all get out to find most 2+ heroics are not designed to actually be *2* and usually mean that *+*. Since Voss, I have had to call on my trooper buddy for every last one of them.

 

Walking into a 2+ and finding every pull to be a minimum of two elites (and usually two strongs), all of which hit harder than they should, and most of which have overclocked stuns or AoE effects is... just... not... fun.

 

LoS is minimal mitigation as it saves me, but kills my tank. (Ya can't heal what you can't see).

 

Chicken-dancing (rapid position changes) is not a solid tactic if you're over the age of 35 (come on, folks, physiology is physiology); if I wanted to dance like this, I'd go to a damn dance club.... or play a console game.

 

What I take away from these quests is that, ultimately, they're not designed for "you and your companion" as that *2* but, instead, "you, your companion, and a friend" (hence the *+*). If so, then BioWare needs to make it crystal clear this is the case. If not, they need to revisit it and downgrade it a bit. A challenge is fun; repeated defeats is not. It's that simple.

 

Finally, I see a a few folks peeping in to run some comment along the line of, "No trouble for me... maybe it's you." and frankly, these folks are missing the point. If an encounter is generally UN-fun and UN-winnable (or gets the rep for being so to all but the FP/OPS/PVP/Purple geared players and theory-crafters) it is effectively a loss as the bread and butter of these games are the "middle of the roaders", not the early content exhausters, the specialty players, the focused theory-crafters, or the folks who have muscle to call on at will to "roflstomp" things.

 

This isn't a moment where "lrn2play" helps anyone, and there's enough disgruntled feedback to reasonably make the case that it isn't "just" a matter of "skillz". But, frankly, even if it were, the outcomes are bad for BioWare as perception creates reality and every one of these players is opportunity won or lost to expand and solidify the playerbase.

 

Upshot: Feedback is relatively consistent and for no more reason than this, the matter deserves a closer look and acknowledgement.

 

My $0.02 worth... take it or leave it as you prefer.

 

Kinda missed the boat on this. We're not talking about Heroics. The thread is about the solo quests and the elites in them. I can't comment on Shadow, since I've only played one to about level 20, but as a Sage Seer, if you can't solo the class quests you're doing something wrong or you're just way underleveled.

 

The Heroic 2+ means 2 players, generally, not you plus your companion. There are some that can be soloed though if you're well geared and can play the class well.

Edited January 30, 2012 by elvigy

[Felade]

I've had some trouble on Voss, sometimes in the most unexpected places, I'm kinetic shadow, using 31/0/10. I use Nadia for a companion, and I do a lot of LOS and cooldown management. I keep the gear as updated as possible.

 

Voss has been tough. There's been several fights where I've only just barely survived. It may be doable but it just isn't fun to sit there and think "I won but I really just got my butt handed to me and I only barely made it out alive." We play to feel like heroes not like throw toys.

 

Quests I had no problem with: Attis station, Stark (LOS kicks his butt big time).

 

Quests I have had problems with: The mature cyberbeast elite (with KW up, even level, up to date gear, he was hitting me for north of 4k on a normal swing - oh and did I mention he has a gap closer too?). Also the Double trooper-type strongs on one of the bonus quests. It is kind of odd to have to kite as a tank while soloing.

 

Force cloak hasn't worked for fight resetting for me in quite awhile; they keep aggroing Nadia and then I'm screwed. They need to make story mobs not aggro until you attack them, or make them spawn across the room - it really messes up classes who depend on that setup from stealth to do their best work.

[Whatsalightsaver]

I'm never one to think PVE content is too hard. I was a heroic raider all the way up through current WoW content, but I'm going to tell you right now, the last boss in the consular storyline (whom I will not name) is broken. Straight up broken for an infiltration speced shadow. There's no way, even using three separate interrupts (mind snap, low slash, force stun), is the damage this boss is putting out anywhere near manageable.

 

There's a difference between a boss who's mechanics are interesting and challenging (which is fun) and a boss who's just built around over the top mathematical superiority that it just comes down to getting you face beat in by very simple boss abilities (not fun).

 

I don't expect to do dungeons and raids in crap gear, but I at the very least expect to finish class storylines with things I randomly pick up while I quest. I'm on my way back to the fleet right now trying to find some more armor for Qyzen that won't have him destroying my poor lizard in the first 15 seconds. This is a waste of my time.

 

Also, Heroic Moment is clearly needed and having to wait 20 min between legitimate attempts is just stupid. Oh, I'll make attempts in between that time, but the damage is unreal and I haven't been close on any attempt where I didn't have hero. I just vanish and try again every 5 min.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Whatsalightsaver

[pmalygris]

I started fighting Stark when I first got the quest. I was 15,10 and change.. 43 I died died and died..

 

My last fight was at 46: 32, 2, 2 full seer. Died after a protracted fight that went on for a LONG time.. Net take away.. Bring more guys..

 

Brought level 50 guildie, a guardian, waisted Stark in 2 minutes or under..

 

Back in beta.. Some of the quests were so difficult.. they were nearly impossible.. sand and blood, 4 + elites in a small cave.. Enemies of the republic...these where adjusted they are almost easy now..

 

I even healed EoTR, with my Scoundrel! A scoundrel!! hehe

 

They are adjusting things.. I have bug reported Stark 2x and followed through with Email.. They know there is a bug, and they know it is very tuff to bring Nadia there and have her do enough damage..

 

 

ok .. rant/ off

 

Mal

[RonaAnor]

As a kinetic shadow i have had little trouble lvling, mostly on par with the quest lvl, somtimes under. Been mostly using tharan, used Nadia a bit on voss to max her afection. Only had some trouble on voss when i had negleted gearing Tharan, made him die realy quik if the mobs had aoe. That made the first class quest boss on belsavis hard til i got the timing on pulling tharan out right, only class quest that was hard for me as i took the last guy on my first try. And once i got him geared up again i had no problems.

[Zhiroc]

One thing I don't see anyone mentioning is how their character level compares to the quest levels. I do everything, with the exception of PvP, and I find myself generally far above the stated levels. For example, I just reached Belsavis (listed as 41-44) at level 46, and I've since become level 47.

 

The level difference is probably one of the largest sources of disparity between people who find the quests easy/hard.

 

Because I'm so much above the quest levels, and since I tend to leave Heroics 'til the end, I usually end up with them being grey to me. So I try to solo them just to make it interesting. I've found that in some cases, it's a cake walk. 4 elites can pound on me at once and my health bar hardly moves. But other times, it's virtually impossible for me to win against three elites (meaning two, since I CC one). But then I come back in two levels, and it's cake walk time again...

[Phydra]

something that boiled down to yet another version of "lrn2plai"

 

Thank you for the helpful contribution.

 

*cough*

 

As to the thread, agree with Whatalight and others who point out that there seems to be quite a bit of diversity in what a particular rating means from place to place; the effect is no sense of confidence that level/strength ratings mean much, let alone are reliable indicators.

 

In some places through my first level 50's efforts, they made a lot of sense and felt really reliable. That ended, oh, roughly about the time I left Tython.

 

Since then, it seems that each planet is pretty much a reboot in which you have to re-learn what the rating/ranking system is "for that planet" as relates to "what weak means", "what strong means", "what elite means", and even "what champion means" on occasion. (Example: There is a same level champion on Balmorra that I could easily wax and a same level champion in the very next area that I couldn't win against until almost three levels above it.)

 

I get that planets might well have been designed in segmented/siloed/segregated fashion, but someone really needs to lay out the mobs level and rating to level and rating across the span of planets and see for themselves how inconsistent they are... it does matter and likely will become more important as the game ages (i.e., gracefully, i hope!).

[Ancaglon]

I levelled all the way to 50 as a Kinetic Shadow, choosing tank gear. My advice to a levelling shadow is, go full Kinetic as soon as you get your ship, and kit out C2-N2 for healing till you get Tharan. As long as there was not more than 1 Champion or Elite in the pack, I could pretty much always out-last them.

 

For later questing, Nadia's DPS allowed fast kills with regular/strong mobs, but I usually called on Tharan for tougher fights.

 

In terms of levelling, I was over-levelled up to Alderaan, then I skipped most of that, and Belsavis, and ended up pretty much exactly the right level for the Story quests.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Ancaglon

[Obmifik]

as a shadow tank, i had no issues while leveling. i was even soloing +2 or +3 champion mobs with tharan.

[Nempo]

sorry but i agrea with the Op and i have also noticed that since level 40 shadows have gotten weaker mainly on Voss (which is a hard planet anyways) but we seem to now lack any dps, some elites dont even get touched by our stuns and refering to elite quests where you gotta kill an elite boss of some sort is now on Voss done by summoning them so we cant even use our stealthed abilitys or even cloak as they disapear ready to be resummoned, so shadow spec is totally gone outa the window, i'm iInfiltration also and before i was kicking arse so to speak now i can barly tackle a few mobs, they see me in stealth so i realy have to be quick to Mindmaze or thats it i'm screwed seen as most good abilitys require us to use in stealth.

 

its just bad, some others are having same trouble others are not but most of the time there higher than the mob anyways Or Sages Not shadows

 

and i have run FP and done some HC but have to carfull as i have that connection lagging crap thats going about with this damn game trouble is i like the game

 

Stealth is not invisibility. You must aproach from behind them...not from infront and you must move fast. You don't have all day to line up the attack.

 

Voss is a gear and skill check. If you were having trouble you weren't geared properly or using all of your skills properly.

 

Shadow Tank...hit 50 in under 2 weeks (before they did some of the rebalancing) and never had an issue anywhere. The real issue is people get comfortable only need 3 or 5 skills when you should be using all of them for maximum efficiency. 35+ the game starts throwing mobs at you that takes more attention, by Voss you have to treat encounters like you would hard FPs. Interupt properly and take nothing for granted.

 

This is what is right witht he game. It SHOULD challenge you and it SHOULD frustrate you a bit when you go in still using only a handful of skills.

[JonalethIsradia]

I levelled as a pure Seer Healer all the way through to 50 and didn't have much in the way of difficulty. A few very, very irritating moments and fights (I'm looking at you, Fearless / Stark) that I needed a hand with, but otherwise I got all the way to the end without aid.

 

Its probably fair to say that the dailies and some of the regular quests aren't Healer friendly - being either too long or too hard to complete, since it quickly gets boring waiting for your companion to chip away health even with you pitching in, let along doing it 45 times - but overall we're no where near as gimped as healers in other MMO's are on the damage front, and can readily hold our own in PvE with a respectable DPS output even as a healer. Healers arent DPS machines, obviously, but its far superior to playing a Priest in WoW or anything else you might care to name.

[IveBeenNerfed]

Kinetic Tank, Lvl 46 here. Spending alot of time on Voss recently and I can say that it definitely is harder than most of the other solo content. I'm a damn good tank, but I don't fancy myself "leet" in anyway. I actually screwed up and did the Belsavis class quest chain between 40 and 41 (i.e. the mobs were about 3 levels above on most pulls) and to be honest those quests were nowhere near as hard as some of things I've run into at the correct level now.

 

That said, I've only had one quest that has given me a massive amount of trouble; Gormak Sabotage. The Tech Guard and Tech Shaman just totally annihilate me. I wouldn't have a problem if I could start from stealth and MM one of them, but given that the set up of the quest specifically doesn't allow that, I can't pump out enough DPS to kill one of them before the other breaks the stun/mind snap/spinning kick/Holliday stun rotation I try to keep up. And before you say I'm under-geared and need to l2p, I have about 12.5K health at 46 which from everything I've seen is anywhere from middle of the road to pretty damn strong.

 

It just seems to me that building a solo quest that certain classes are nearly incapable of completing without a lot of luck is not really good design.

[Aryzyra]

Some encounters are mis-labeled or out of tune.

 

For example, there's a +2 on Balmorra (iirc) that has +4 pulls (2 gold and 3 silver I think it was). Abused the entrance aggro drop to beat the first pack, but the second was the same, so I ditched it. And the optional quest line with 2 silvers dropping down on Voss has something notably funky with their damage output.

 

 

I don't know if this is actually a spoiler, but the Act 1 final boss is a level 34 elite. I had barely turned 30 on shadow when I was sent over to him from Alderaan. So basically a 4-level jump in content. He could resist the interrupt, but luckily there are plenty of other options.

 

 

Anyway, it's kinda easy to see the spots where there's some incongruity in design, but most of the solo lines are very accessible.

 

With sage, LOS/kiting abuse is typically the answer to anything challenging. With shadow, kinetic and managing Holiday trivializes champion fights.