State of assassin in 1v1 pvp?

[kidbs]

Are you even 50 yourself? You would know then that Overcharge Saber pops stealth, so you can't do that from stealth and still get off a Spike.

 

Where are you getting this garbage? Now I know you're pulling ***** out of your ***. Get to 50 and L2P. Yes I am 50 and yes I wreck people as an assassin.

[kidbs]

Umm last time I checked, 30s ago, I can Overcharge Lightsaber, Recklessness and Relic while stealthed. I leveled and currently pvp as Deception. I have 35pct crit and 85pct crit bonus, Chain Shocks are just wicked, especially when followed up with a Discharge. I regularly crit Shock for 3.5k with a 2k chain shock proc behind it. Then throw out a Discharge that crits fairly ofthen and the person is already at 50pct or so. By then I usually have a Maul proc ready or Voltic x 2 and reset Shock.

 

Fully talented out Shocks are just nasty and aren't directionally limited. Don't forget to use Deflect if you're being attack by saber or blaster fire and use your interrupts, you have 4 of them (Jolt, Low Blow, Electrocute and Overload).

 

It's good to see that at least one other assassin is aware of how to play as deception.

[Cealog]

I have no idea where people are getting their 1 on 1 PvP experience since I average 1 of those experience per 5 matches. The vast majority of the time I either get focused fire by 5 guys immediately and die regardless of what I do, or they leave me alone and I can kill anybody that's not a healer at 50% health repeatedly with a combinatino of Maul/Discharge/Assassinate. Here's what 1 on 1 looks like:

 

Against healer - You get them to like 50%, you're at 70%. You Maul + Assassinate + Maul, and then try to Jolt/Low Slash/Electrocute to stop their heals. You'll usually fail because Jolt only stops one heal, and they're likely to use their CC breaker for your stun and lightning bubble out of Assassinate if not prevent it outright. At this point you're at like 50% health and the healer is at a low resource level with 80% health. They'll evntually kill you 2 minutes later.

 

Against ranged class - They toss you + root, you either take the CC and then die, or you break it out of it and then they stun you and you die. If there is a wall behind you so that you're still within 10m after the initial toss, you'll usually win the fight, but this isn't reliable by any means. This is a good time to pop Recklessness but I suck at doing it, because this allows you to hit them back from range and the enemy might panic and use their stun on you from range (which is totally advantageous to you, since you can only do one Force Lightning in 6 seconds from range even with Recklessness). If they do that, you'll most likely win.

 

Against melee class - Not counting guys coming out of stealth, this is roughly even but it's overall a disadvantage because due to lag there's a very good chance when you get them to 50% (and you'd be lower than 50% since our burst is from the 50% point), you'll get the dreaded "Effect Condition Failed" or "You're not facing target" when you attempt to do a Maul -> Assassinate -> Maul combo, and then you die horribly. Save your Low Slash/Electrocute for 50% because you might have some chance of actually getting a Maul off in the lag. Of course you could just die before they hit 50% waiting that long to use your CCs, but if you whiff on your Maul then you have absolutely no chance of winning.

dont forget about Force Shroud after you break your first CC against a range. The trick is timing when to use it right before they try to stun/knock you back a second time.

[Eddbert]

Deception spec I win 90% of my 1v1s hardest being healers. Go operative if u wanna win every fight. Once they get geared they can kill you before there stuns are up.

[punman]

Where are you getting this garbage? Now I know you're pulling ***** out of your ***. Get to 50 and L2P. Yes I am 50 and yes I wreck people as an assassin.

 

That's funny, it's popped me out of stealth every time I've used it. Not saying you're wrong, if that's the case, but now I have to figure out why it's doing that. So, apologies, but only if my UI is being screwy for some reason.

[Astarica]

dont forget about Force Shroud after you break your first CC against a range. The trick is timing when to use it right before they try to stun/knock you back a second time.

 

Does a resisted knockback/incapaciate effect build the resolve bar? The problem is ranged classes have a multiple CCs and if you don't have a full resolve bar they'll almost always find a way to lose you. All KB/stun seem to be instant anyway, so it's not like you can react to it, but it's probably a good bet to use Force Shroud as soon as you close in melee range.

 

In theory after a toss you should do something like Recklessness -> Force Lightning, and then Force Slow them from range and then Force Speed back in, and Force Shroud as you get in melee range. Problme is that Force Slow only has a range of 10 and without it, it's very easy for the ranged guy to lose you via terrain, and of course there's no guaranteed any of those cooldowns will be up either unless you're talking about a strictly 1 on 1 duel. The more useful abilities like Overload/Force Shroud/Saber Ward are usually already down at the beginning of any large scale encounter.

 

I still think Force Slow and Force Lightning should have a range of 30m to allow us to put pressure on ranged class from range. There's absolutely no way we can actually defeat them from range but it'll at least stop them from getting free shots. The PvP set bonus increases the range on Jolt/Force Slow by 5m but I think you shouldn't require a high end set of gear to address the class's short coming, and besides it's only 5m.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Astarica

[Cealog]

Not saying it is right right, but I tend to save my CD in large scale battles and just rely on my priority tree. I will pop CDs if i have to keep a node until help arrives. I will use CDs if carrying the ball or 1v1 or now even some 2v1 if the two are weak.

[Cowflab]

I see a lot of failure in this thread. If you are trying to play this class as a melee rogue, you're doing it wrong. Assassins play very much like an enhancement shaman that can stealth, in WoW terms. You have the capability to reset fights on your own accord if you use a bit of common sense. I usually don't have trouble with much of anything other than a well played ranged class, but then again, who doesn't?

 

If you insist on playing a melee heavy spec, which I don't know why you would, try the 18/23/0 armor pen maul spam spec. If you get the opener, you are more than set up to burst your target down at your leisure. The force regen offered by that spec is amazing. I personally roll with 7/31/3 spec and fair just fine.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Cowflab

[chewborca]

For those playing deception at 50, like I am, are you using a chain shock build like this one:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200MZhGrRkhMbtzZf0c.1

 

I haven't been, as I've taken a 8/31/2 with a decreased cooldown on force speed / force shroud.

 

It seems pretty effective this way, I just wonder if the extra damage from chain shock is more worthwhile than the armor penetration from charge mastery.

 

Thoughts?

[Astarica]

For those playing deception at 50, like I am, are you using a chain shock build like this one:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200MZhGrRkhMbtzZf0c.1

 

I haven't been, as I've taken a 8/31/2 with a decreased cooldown on force speed / force shroud.

 

It seems pretty effective this way, I just wonder if the extra damage from chain shock is more worthwhile than the armor penetration from charge mastery.

 

Thoughts?

 

I can't imagine playing Huttball without the faster Force Speed talent if you care about winning at all. I prefer to deathmatch even in Huttball but there are times you absolutely have to try to score a goal and nothing in the Assassin entire line up compares to the ability to potentially Force Speed twice during one possession. I guess it's okay if you're in the side with less people so you only see Huttball 1 out of 3, but the side with more people pretty much sees Huttball 3 out of 4 times!

[Windkull]

When I was specced deception I won every single 1v1 in world PVP where i got the jump, but lost most when I didn't because i could mind trap the opponent's companion and just burn. The extra stealth and the high burst (50% in 2-3 hits) would take down even most healers. As darkness, it feels like PVPing as a prot warrior or something, just sitting their shield blocking and grinding away. I really miss the 3k ++ mauls I would get as deception, the best I get on shocks are ~1.5-2k on a crit with recklessness... A bit higher when chain shock goes off.

[punman]

I can't imagine playing Huttball without the faster Force Speed talent if you care about winning at all. I prefer to deathmatch even in Huttball but there are times you absolutely have to try to score a goal and nothing in the Assassin entire line up compares to the ability to potentially Force Speed twice during one possession. I guess it's okay if you're in the side with less people so you only see Huttball 1 out of 3, but the side with more people pretty much sees Huttball 3 out of 4 times!

 

I refuse to make talent choices for huttball. Yes, a faster force speed is useful. But a huge damage increase to shock is better ALL the time.

[Astarica]

I refuse to make talent choices for huttball. Yes, a faster force speed is useful. But a huge damage increase to shock is better ALL the time.

 

Shock doesn't seem to hit hard enough to effectively kill people in PvP without being buffed up by 2 Thrashes, and if I can hit them with Thrash, I usually don't have problem killing them either.

[Punnyjunior]

it would be so much better if the game didn't have lag bug in pvp

it screws your maul combo

 

ppl can brag whatever they want but the fact is your life would be so much easier if you roll Ranged classes in this game [ pvp ]

[Warlyik]

Go Madness, throw on Dark Charge, guard a healer, and equip Shield Generator. Only thing you need out of Deception tree is the Maul Proc Talent. Dump extra points into Darkness for the obvious damage increases. This also works well for PvE (Lightning Charge there, obv and a Focus instead of Shield).

 

High survivability, able to deal damage from range (only weak spot is far range, but that can usually be avoided). Kite melee with dots, stop ranged in their tracks with Creeping Terror. Proc Maul Crit + Assassinate Crit will deal with almost anyone sub 50%. (Crit/Surge enhancements and gear only)

 

Had a match earlier today with 440k damage 58 kills (2 deaths I believe). Next closest to me in that match was someone at 150k. I regularly do anywhere from 200k to 350k, but that 440k match was my highest so far. And yes, it was against roughly equal opponents.

 

I'm slowly converting Deception Assassins to my Madnassin ways.

[JT_Zap]

Lvl 34 Full Deception. I wreck people in pvp atm. Opening with Discharge and Shock then trhashing. Popping Blackout, cycling interrupts makes a joke of anything. I stay clear of guardians because I choose not to go toe to toe.

 

If you get 2 v 1'd during the fight, force cloak. Focusing on healers and ranged, I make a very good living in pvp.

[Astarica]

I'm starting to think the trick for PvP is use Dark Charge because without it, you just die way too easily. It's not that our DPS is bad but there's a lot of ways for us to be taken out of the fight and you got to have some way to stay alive until you can get back in melee range again. It's not what talent you have that matters exactly, just the fact you didn't die should give you plenty of chances to do DPS. Of course, picking Dark Charge means you should stay away any talent that boosts other charges.

[Micos]

I'm starting to think the trick for PvP is use Dark Charge because without it, you just die way too easily. It's not that our DPS is bad but there's a lot of ways for us to be taken out of the fight and you got to have some way to stay alive until you can get back in melee range again. It's not what talent you have that matters exactly, just the fact you didn't die should give you plenty of chances to do DPS. Of course, picking Dark Charge means you should stay away any talent that boosts other charges.

 

i agree. And you get the option to guard with Dark Charge, thats almost always more important then killing someone 2 seconds faster. I like Surging Charge a lot, but almost never use it in PvP.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Micos

[dudebroproguy]

learn to be good, bads.

 

assassins are gods 1v1, so long as you get the opener and you initiate the fight on your own terms. deception spec or darkness/madness spec.

 

I've taken down level 50 operatives even after they've knocked me down, it isn't hard, learn to kite with force slow and keep as much distance in between the target as you build up momentum for shocks and discharges.

 

a couple consumables won't hurt either.

[Spigotwelder]

chain shock gets absolutely 0 benefit from VS OR assassin training

 

it's not nearly as good as you think

 

also it will eat recklessness charges on its pitiful damage

Edited January 4, 2012 by Spigotwelder

[punman]

Shock doesn't seem to hit hard enough to effectively kill people in PvP without being buffed up by 2 Thrashes, and if I can hit them with Thrash, I usually don't have problem killing them either.

 

Shock hits rather a lot harder than Thrash or Voltaic Slash (when you get it) and after 2x Induction costs less, AND has a 10m range so you can hit them out of melee. Why wouldn't you use it?

[Glixx]

Is everyone talking about level 50 pvp? It seems like a lot of people are playing a different game than me. At level 50 with a good Deception build, Shock is just nasty. With Voltic Slash bonus, Induction and Chain Shock, I can crit for 3.5k-4k initially and proc a 2k Chain Shock behind it, follow that up with a Discharge and the person is normally down to 50pct health or lower. By this time Duplicity has probably proc'd and you can Maul them in the back by strafing around them or using Low Blow.

 

If you're running around trying to spam Maul, you're probably having a difficult time staying close and staying behind the target. You're probably also low on energy and waiting for it to recharge. The trick with our DPS is to only shock when you have 2xInduction and only Maul when you have a Duplicity proc.

 

I have Insulation for pvp survivability, probably not needed for pve. I have Entropic Field for all the AEs flying around in warzones, probably not needed for 1v1s. I have stacked Crit and Surge where I can giving me a 33pct base Crit chance and an 84pct Crit Multiplier.

 

This is my spec:

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200ZGGMRkGMbtzZf0c.1

[Omite]

@Glixx - OMG WHERE'S YOUR AVOIDANCE????!!! You're gonna die!!!!

 

 

edit: Saved your life

Edited January 4, 2012 by Omite

[Keengamer]

Operative is much better 1v1 pvp but they'll probably get nerfed soon since they're *********** ridiculous

[Glixx]

@Glixx - OMG WHERE'S YOUR AVOIDANCE????!!! You're gonna die!!!!

 

 

edit: Saved your life

 

Honestly, I'm using Discharge a whole lot more than the CC breaker. With the exception of Hutt Ball, how often do you get chain stunned? You can Force Shroud out of snares and roots, or Force Speed to negate snares. I'd rather have more Discharges which are ranged and nasty when they crit.