Auxili Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Edit: You either choose: #1- More empire-versus-empire warzones or #2- World pvp, a healthy republic faction on pvp servers, and empire-versus-republic pvp. But you cannot have both. If bioware gives us #1 without any benefit for Republic pvpers, then we can say goodbye at any chance of having #2. To those who wants the republic faction to have an active community on pvp servers, please do not underestimate the effect more same-faction warzones will have. Now that more same-faction warzones will be added, the only incentive players ever had to roll republic on a PVP server is being removed. Thus, faction imbalance will get worse unless Bioware has something up their sleeves to make Republic an attractive choice for pvp guilds and players. Faction ratios on any pvp server is at least 3:1, favouring the empire. I've been doing /who on many pvp servers and this ratio is very clear and immediately noticeable (not theory). Even 2:1 would be horribly imbalanced for a pvp server. Is something going to be done to 'attempt' to bring faction ratios closer together, to at least 1.5:1? If bioware has stated they aren't going to be doing anything regarding faction ratios, then I'll be fine with that, so long as I know. It prevents me from wondering about it. (this thread is not about "whether or not there is faction imbalance". Leave that to another thread if you wish to question the facts, thanks!) Edited January 5, 2012 by Auxili Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Where's your metrics to show this 3:1 ratio? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxili Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 Where's your metrics to show this 3:1 ratio? counting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSykes Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Faction ratios on any pvp server is at least 3:1, favouring the empire. I've been doing /who on many pvp servers and this ratio is very clear and immediately noticeable (not theory). Is something going to be done to 'attempt' to bring faction ratios closer together, to at least 1.5:1? There are many reasons people are rolling Empire - it's not just the 'bad guy' appeal. Bioware can do many things to make the Republic more interesting and appealing for neutral players. To start, level 50 republic armor is really ugly. I don't mean to be negative but this is pretty undeniable (before 50 its fine). Notably the jedi armors. The republic fleet is ugly with a lot of unused space and stone walls. The empire fleet is crammed with detail. There's nothing I can think of that's better on the republic side than on the empire side. If bioware has stated they aren't going to be doing anything regarding faction ratios, then I'll be fine with that, so long as I know. It prevents me from wondering about it. Faction ratios would probably shift a decent bit if the Republic gear didn't look fruity and silly. I know I originally rolled Empire because the gear is 10x cooler at the higher levels, but decided to re-roll after I hit 50 due to the epic PvP queues and I kind of regret it after seeing Republic high level gear.... I can be just as evil as a Republic player... but I can't look as cool as a Empire character no matter what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 counting? You have the ability to see every character on a server at the same time and count them? How? Hint: I'm getting at the fact that personal experience/anecdotal evidence is worthless. Hard metrics or nothing. Anything else is just conjecture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spetsnazos Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 empire buildings/story/classes are just done better. Play coruscant and play dromund kass and tell me what you think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MachopBot Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I prefer Empire over Republic because of one reason. The story! Republic class quests pale in comparison to the Empire, but this is of course just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkeus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I really need to look up the article but from what I understand, there isn't as much of a faction imbalance as people think. Heck, I think they reported 850,000 Sith compared to 810,000 Jedi, or something like that. Damn, I need to find that article again. Ah, here it is... http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/12/26/a-lot-of-people-are-playing-the-old-republic.aspx Edited January 2, 2012 by Darkeus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxili Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 empire buildings/story/classes are just done better. Play coruscant and play dromund kass and tell me what you think That's my point. Is bioware going to make the republic have stories/architecture/armor that is as well designed as the empire counterparts? And I don't mean "looks the same as the empire." But rather, looks like the same amount of care and thought was put into them. (ie not having generic druid armor for consulars, and samurai armor for jedis, etc). Ofc this is also a gear customization problem at 50 which has to be fixed (appearance tab please). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dingoperson Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Welcome to a million similar posts on the PVP board The consensus is: 1. Learn to enjoy Huttball! 2. It probably isn't going away because there's probably licensing reasons that same-faction can only "play-fight". 3. But there might be more sports modes in a few months time. How about "Hutt Curling" or "Sith Pool - Manipulate the Balls with the Force"? 4. If desperate you can reroll Republic and PvP to your heart's content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkZenith Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Actually, I think the OP is right, though I wouldn't know by what ratio. On my server (Hydian Way), I see nearly twice the number of people in one place while playing Empire; the Republic Fleet seems dead at times, but the Imperial Fleet is so jam packed that it often lags like crazy when I first load in. I guess people just prefer playing the bad guy, and frankly I can see why. Sometimes it's just so damned satisfying. Edited January 2, 2012 by DarkZenith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxili Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I really need to look up the article but from what I understand, there isn't as much of a faction imbalance as people think. Heck, I think they reported 850,000 Sith compared to 810,000 Jedi, or something like that. Damn, I need to find that article again. Ah, here it is... http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/12/26/a-lot-of-people-are-playing-the-old-republic.aspx That's 100% incorrect. You can go into any high pop pvp server, and do a /who. It's not rocket science and is NOT theoretical. It's as fact as fact gets. The denial is getting irritating from a factual perspective. Check it out yourself people, I put in a lot of work to confirm the 2-3:1 ratio (2:1 after 11pm mostly, 3:1 at all other times) Also this is NOT a thread about "is the empire side more populated or is it myth?" If you disagree with the facts, please make a thread stating "republic and empire is balanced". This thread is about a solution, not proving facts to people who don't want to type in /who. Edited January 2, 2012 by Auxili Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkeus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 That's 100% incorrect. You can go into any high pop pvp server, and do a /who. It's not rocket science and is NOT theoretical. It's as fact as fact gets. The denial is getting irritating from a factual perspective. Check it out yourself people, I put in a lot of work to confirm the 2-3:1 ratio (2:1 after 11pm mostly, 3:1 at all other times) Also this is NOT a thread about "is the empire side more populated or is it myth?" If you disagree with the facts, please make a thread stating "republic and empire is balanced". This thread is about a solution, not proving facts to people who don't want to type in /who. Hey, go argue with the FACTS in the article. Because without anybody to back up your "facts" with another study, it is still just theory. And you know, you don't have to type /who. Just press O.... lol Come on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuryNL Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I really need to look up the article but from what I understand, there isn't as much of a faction imbalance as people think. Heck, I think they reported 850,000 Sith compared to 810,000 Jedi, or something like that. Damn, I need to find that article again. Ah, here it is... http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/12/26/a-lot-of-people-are-playing-the-old-republic.aspx Don't care what that article says. All right now: Republic fleet: 60 ppl Imperial Fleet: 240 ppl Coruscant: 90 ppl (Exceptionally busy, usually a lot less) Dromund Kaas: 170 ppl Ord Mantell (spelling): 24 ppl Hutta : 72 ppl Tythos: 40 ppl Korriban: 130 ppl No imbalance? Riiiight. Now these are just the places I can check right now because I can acces em on both sides on the same server. Ohh pvp: 30 matches of pvp Empire: 29 matches of Huttball 30 matches of pvp Republic: spread among all warzones equally almost. No imbalance? I doubt it. And it doesn't even seem THAT bad on this server. Edited January 2, 2012 by FuryNL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxili Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Hey, go argue with the FACTS in the article. Because without anybody to back up your "facts" with another study, it is still just theory. And you know, you don't have to type /who. Just press O.... lol Come on.... Jesus, do you people really want me to redo all the work I did and take screenshots, simply to prove correct what everyone already knows is true? (That empire out-populates the republic side heavily on pvp servers) That's not going to happen. If you play on both factions, the facts are clear. If you don't, and don't want to do a /who, then continue to derail this thread. edit: both jung ma and HoG have around 240 imperials at the fleet, and 130 republicans at their fleet. around 60 level 50s in the entire server on the republic side, while there are around 230~ level 50s on the empire side. Each republic starting zone has around 40 people. The empire starting zones have 80. I've cross-checked this on many servers. Some, like Tarentatek and veela have horrible ratios (around 5:1 empire). Some are more balanced, like jung ma and HoG (helm of graush). Arrowhead is relatively similar to jung ma and Hog in terms of balance. If you don't want to do a /who and check things out, don't call us liars. You're the skeptic without reason. Edited January 2, 2012 by Auxili Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkeus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Don't care what that article says. All right now: Republic fleet: 60 ppl Imperial Fleet: 240 ppl Coruscant: 90 ppl Dromund Kaas: 170 ppl Ord Mantell (spelling): 24 ppl Hutta : 72 ppl Tythos: 40 ppl Korriban: 130 ppl No imbalance? Riiiight. Now these are just the places I can check right now because I can acces em on both sides on the same server. Ohh pvp: 30 matches of pvp Empire: 29 matches of Huttball 30 matches of pvp Republic: spread among all warzones equally almost. No imbalance? I doubt it. And it doesn't even seem THAT bad on this server. Hey, just quoting stats that have been put out. Just the messenger. Seen other ones that say similar things. I am sure there are more Imperials, that is how it goes. But how big the imbalance is, don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkeus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Jesus, do you people really want me to redo all the work I did and take screenshots, simply to prove correct what everyone already knows is true? (That empire out-populates the republic side heavily on pvp servers) That's not going to happen. If you play on both factions, the facts are clear. If you don't, and don't want to do a /who, then continue to derail this thread. Again, the article in no way derails the thread, you just don't like what is in it. Lol.... Oh, and on PvP servers?? Oh well.... Edited January 2, 2012 by Darkeus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuryNL Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Hey, just quoting stats that have been put out. Just the messenger. Seen other ones that say similar things. I am sure there are more Imperials, that is how it goes. But how big the imbalance is, don't know. Not a personal assault bro ;p Just stating that I don't believe the article. Or: Maybe everyone made a sith and jedi (smugglers and troopers are rare, even when compared to IA and BH) and then kept playing the sith, but the jedi are still counted in that article... It's probably not active characters, but characters created ;p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baizak Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Over 850,000 Sith Warriors and over 810,000 Jedi Knights created. From the article referenced earlier...It in no way means that it is balanced. This is just the number of those class's that was created across all servers. It is in no way indicative of population imbalance and is not a valid counter argument to the core of this discussion...just sayin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shillen Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 It's pretty obvious that there is a severe imbalance in favor of empire. You don't need to count every person on each side on every server to verify that. Ever take a stats class? You don't need a particularly large sample to make an assumption with a very high confidence level. We've all seen enough evidence that the empire severely outnumbers the republic that we know it's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuryNL Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Over 850,000 Sith Warriors and over 810,000 Jedi Knights created. From the article referenced earlier...It in no way means that it is balanced. This is just the number of those class's that was created across all servers. It is in no way indicative of population imbalance and is not a valid counter argument to the core of this discussion...just sayin Idd... Every sith player wants to at least ''have'' a jedi as well. Even if just for teh lulz. That's why it's so equal ;p It's not active players ;p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Just a small point: The guild window doesn't show the right amount of people. The LFG tool doesn't show the right amount of people. Most player lists in the game are broken. I wouldn't put too much stock in doing /who and going by those numbers. I'm not saying there's no imbalance, I don't have metrics one way or the other, but that's the problem, none of us do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuryNL Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Just a small point: The guild window doesn't show the right amount of people. The LFG tool doesn't show the right amount of people. Most player lists in the game are broken. I wouldn't put too much stock in doing /who and going by those numbers. I'm not saying there's no imbalance, I don't have metrics one way or the other, but that's the problem, none of us do. Why is everyone /who'ing Left top corner says exactly how many players there are @ the same spot as you are ;p And I haven't seen it bugged yet. Edited January 2, 2012 by FuryNL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feskitt Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I would have been a BH for the Republic if there was such a thing. I'm at 10,000 LS points. "The Pure." Yeah, I clash w/ Sith Lords all the time. (Usually just through dialogue choices) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkZenith Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Just a small point: The guild window doesn't show the right amount of people. The LFG tool doesn't show the right amount of people. Most player lists in the game are broken. I wouldn't put too much stock in doing /who and going by those numbers. I'm not saying there's no imbalance, I don't have metrics one way or the other, but that's the problem, none of us do. Ah, not just me then. I was wondering what was going on with that, hope they fix it soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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