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WooduckAUS

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    2.5+ PVE DPS Leaderboards V2

    in The Harbinger

    Posted

    updated also Mychar.. what relics are you using now? just curious if anything changed... am so pissed that they upgraded every dps but deception because of pvp whiners... they could have easily put in some npc only effects. when the best in the world was only 100 dps ahead of me i could stay deception but now people on here i was beating; easily beat me by 500 i can no longer ignore madness. :( sad day in Sams world. Let ssee if i like this rotation any better then the old one.

     

    My gear is the same, i have full 180's plus 1 Dread Master implant, relics are both Dread Forged.

     

    Infiltration didn't get any love but eventually they'll get back to it, just a matter of time....possibly a lot of time.

     

    I've been balance since before they killed it with 2.0 and removed shadow strike. We pleaded to get it back and they said no, its not part of the rotation. So they give us spinning strike instead, guess they didn't want to admit they were wrong. Rotation is a bit more interesting now and the spinning strike adds nice burst and in burn phases when you start hitting 2 spinning strikes in a row, it almost feels unfair...... Rotation is a little different now with the increase damage to MC too, i'm still trying to figure that part out exactly myself. So its more or less pre 2.0 balance, which i did enjoy, so i'm happy.

     

    Its definitely worth a look, you'll be happy with the numbers, especially in raids!! So much fun. And not as boring anymore, lots of dots and procs to watch. Then when they fix infiltration, you can always go back! I'm struggling with balance in pvp though, so their may still be a place for infiltration. Reg WZ's you can put up good numbers with balance but for ranked, you can't beat the stealth burst factor of infiltration.

     

    Give balance a go, i think you'll be impressed!

    2.5+ PVE DPS Leaderboards V2

    in The Harbinger

    Posted

    Haven't looked at this thread for a while... so not sure if it is even active anymore but all you shadow lovers out there, lets get parsing!!

     

    WE ARE BACK

     

    I never made it to the pts, so i had my very first go at the new rotattion this morn. Here are my first 3 attempts. Stacked a tonne of crit in the 3rd. Can't do anymore now but you'll definitely be seeing me back on this thread!!

     

    http://www.torparse.com/a/694404/time/1402413813/1402414069/0/Overview

     

    Thats the best one in it, 3902, and i have a tonne things to fix up....... looks good so far.

     

    BACK TO THE DUMMYS!!

    A reply to the devs question on Sage/Sorc Heals in PvP - ideas

    in PvP

    Posted

    Another thought, what about creating separation. They seem to want us to kite, heal, kite, heal.... I'm ok with this, as it creates some kind of skill cap. So working with this idea, what about adding to the weaken mind talent in our tree. Targets affected are not only slowed but can't leap to target either. That way we can create separation from melee giving us precious moments to get heals off. LOS'ing range has never been a problem thanks to force speed, this would give us a tool to deal with melee. The WM talent is already high enough in the tree, so the dps sages can't use it and it wouldn't affect pve in any way shape or form....

     

    They leap in, in the middle of all the chaos that happens there after we apply weaken mind, force speed away and continue to heal as they slowly chase us.

     

    Or, targets within the area of our quake are affected by a slow as well.... creating more separation. Kite, heal, kite, heal..... Mass slows for everyone!!

     

    I don't think these ideas will change our "style" of healing but add to the mechanics already in place, without making us op.

     

    Thoughts?

    Comparing healers in an operation

    in Combat Styles

    Posted

    I normally mando heal with a scoundrel healer beside me. For a reference point we would both average around 4k-4.2k ehps on nefra in nim. This has been fairly consistent. If i drop below 4k, then my partners heals will be slightly higher to compensate. seems that the incoming damage for that fight requires around 8-8.5k ehps.

     

    For ***** and giggles, i've been healing on my sage of late for something different. Same fight, same group, same scoundrel healer beside me.

     

    Scoundrel ended the fight with 3.5k ehps and i with 3.1 ehps on my sage. Pretty sure the incoming damage didn't drop that significantly, i assume the variance was simply from my sages bubble and the 100% effectiveness of it. My guess in this fight, based on previous healing numbers, my bubble would have allowed for at least 1k ehps maybe more given the scoundrels heals were a lot lower than the 4k effective state previously. Had it counted in parsec, we may have seen my sage as high as 4.5k ehps.....

     

    On another note, running parsec while healing pvp, i noticed around a 20% difference between the in game heal total at the end of the match and the parsec info. I assume this is from the bubble not counting in parsec either....

     

    I think you can compare ehps numbers between healers in the op they are currently running but have to keep in mind the class differences. Some fights are better suited to certain healers. I know if i'm working my *** off and the other healer has a lower than usual ehps number, then i'll be sending him a whisper to pick his game up. At the end of the day, as long as you clear the boss and no one dies, it was a good pull. If you keep on wiping, then parsec is an effective tool to isolate where the problem maybe.... heals, dps, tanks.....

    A reply to the devs question on Sage/Sorc Heals in PvP - ideas

    in PvP

    Posted

    like I've stated in other posts sorc/sage need a spam-able instant heal weather that be a reworking of dark heal/benevolence or resurgence/rejuvenate in combination with a tweak of static barrier/force armor....

     

    If thats what you want, go roll a scoundrel....

     

    I don't want the play style of a scoundrel on my sage. Playstyle is fine, just needs tweaking for ranked pvp utility.

    A reply to the devs question on Sage/Sorc Heals in PvP - ideas

    in PvP

    Posted

    Sage output is not in a REALLY bad place, just needs a little tweak, if anything. I like the idea of a small nerf to scoundrels better tbh.

     

    8m reg pvp is fine, sages can do really well there. I prolly average 1-1.5mil in regs. 2mil+ if conditions are perfect. Not very often does my sage get out healed.

     

    4m ranked is where we need help..... 2 big problems i see. Casting and salavation.

     

    I don't think we need any major rework, just a small tweak.

     

    For casting, maybe rework mental alacrity with either a shorter cooldown or possible work like a full bar or resolve and give total immunity for 10 secs. That would help with the casting situation. Shorter cooldown and interrupt immunity would work imo.

     

    Salvation. What can i say about this.... top tier ability and virtually useless in ranked. 1st reason is tied in with the first problem i described, casting. 2nd issue, everyone has to sit in it, group for 10 secs for it to work. 3rd issue, IF you get all 4 people in it (which i wouldn't recommend in ranked...) its a fairly lack luster heal on only 4 people.... This is our top tier ability and you can barley use in in ranked.

     

    Like someone said before, give salvation a hot, so people can run through it to get heals and then a hot after they leave. Would be a great help for pve and pvp utility. 2nd idea might be making it instant. I honestly don't believe it would make us op in pve but would give us another option while being targeted in pvp. Then change the buff of resplendence to maybe help the other heals THAT WE CURRENTLY HARDLY EVER USE. This option would be a nice rework that imo, would be welcomed with the sage community.

     

    As for set bonuses, i think the idea of removing the lose of health for noble sacrifice is rubbish. This is the only interesting part of our healing rotation atm. We have to balance our health/force while healing. Also in ranked, you won't be alive long enough to need to use noble sacrifice..... Currently i use 2 piece pve and 2 piece pvp. for the reduced bubble cooldown and reduced healing trance cooldown, BOTH essential in any form of pvp. Haven't thought about it too much but what about insta-salvation for a 4 piece bonus for pvp. Don't think the benefit would be enough for pve peeps to use all 4 pieces but would make a huge difference for the pvp community.

     

    I'm not suggesting all of the changes are needed, maybe 1 or 2 just to help our utility in pvp AND pve.

    Sage healing in 4m ranked.

    in PvP

    Posted

    So we all know ops/scoundrels are the op healing class for ranked......

     

    I've got a sage healer that i would like to make competitive in ranked. In 8m i almost never get out healed and can keep up with the best of them (thank you salvation). In 4m though.... sadly given our top tier ability is virtually useless, we don't seem to have the healing power to keep up with the OP class atm. Add all the group utility/survivability of the ops/scoundrel and its understandable why sages can't compete. With a good group in front of me, i can be fairly helpful. With a bad group..... well...... i'm not much help. I've spoken with some good scoundrel healers (2000+ rank) on my server and they say you just have to carry the bads to get the wins. Not sure how i can do that with my sage.....

     

    In the interest of being more useful in ranked, i would like to hear from other sages and get some ideas/tricks that maybe i'm missing in 4m atm, seeing i'm fairly new to ranked. Mainly q'n solo but do some group ranked when i can.

     

    In the interest of credibility, leave you characters name and rank please.

     

    Myhealintoon (sadly) 1200's.

    Need help with sorc dps

    in Sage / Sorcerer

    Posted

    yeah i'm not that dumb, i know the only time i use force lightning is from affliction proc and yes, i do always have something queued up.

     

    Sorry man, wasn't trying to be a douche, just trying to help.

     

    Seriously though..... i stick with my last comment. You are hitting force lightning on average every 4.5 secs, the cooldown for the affliction proc is every 10 secs. You are using force lightning on cooldown AND with the proc = dps loss. Allowing for the icd on the proc + fitting it into your priority list, you should be using it every 12secs or so. Your parse shows that you are using it WAY too much.

     

    Try parsing with ONLY when it procs. That does explain all your issues here, give it a go.

     

    I'm just going by the parse you posted last.

    http://www.torparse.com/a/605736/2/0/Damage+Dealt

    Need help with sorc dps

    in Sage / Sorcerer

    Posted · Edited by WooduckAUS

    okay best parse yet, i added the armor reduction and health reduction to the dummy (1.5mil, wasn't sure what the difference in the size of health pool meant) http://www.torparse.com/a/605736 2600 dps 39.69 APM and only didnt crit TB once, though i have noticed i can get a bit trigger happy with thundering blast and lose out on an instant chain lightning every now and then.

     

    1 x affliction = 2 TB

     

    This is the easiest way to stop this from happening and easiest way to follow affliction. Cast affliction, very next gcd is used for TB. Usual fillers in between. As soon as TB is back up cast it again. Now your fillers again and then 1 gcd BEFORE TB is off cool down, reapply affliction. Then straight into TB next gcd. Rinse and repeat.

     

    There will be a few seconds, before you reapply affliction, that will be affliction free... But that is ok. Reapply the gcd before TB. Trying to keep it up 100% of the time will result in a dps loss and makes it harder than it needs to be. I don't know of any top parsers that do it any other way.

     

    As for your apm numbers, you say you always have something precasted...... You don't. Plain and simple. If you did, your apm would be higher. Now that I've said it, let's try and fix it. Something that helped me was extending my "precast" window on my abilities to 1sec. I think default is 0.5 iirc. That way you can click your next ability halfway through the animation of your gcd. Earlier the better that way you can look ahead at your next few moves. If you have bad lag, which it sounds like you do, you may have to compensate by clicking even earlier. Trial and error. Also, mashing buttons as fast as you can, multiple times to activate an ability can delay your next ability. Once you get the hang of it, it should just be 1 click/button push halfway through your current gcd to activate your next ability. Clean and smooth.

     

    Still haven't looked at you parse (@ work right now), but someone wrote that you were only hitting a few moves between your next TB? Is your lag giving you dead gcd's? Where you activate an ability, lose a gcd but nothing happens? Have you noticed anything like this? Could explain your apm and dps, if you do always have something q'd?

     

    I'll try to look through your parse when I get a chance and see if I can notice anything else.

     

    STOP THE PRESSES - FOUND THE PROBLEM

     

    just went and opened your parse...... *slaps hand to forehead* Is force lightning the equivalent of TK throw for sages (sorry I bat for the other team)?

     

    If so, STOP DOING IT!!

     

    You only use it with the proc from affliction. This will explain you apm, your lack of lightning strikes and ultimately your lack of dps.

     

    Try that out and let me/us know.

    Need help with sorc dps

    in Sage / Sorcerer

    Posted · Edited by WooduckAUS

    thanks for the reply. my total force accuracy in gear is 107.64% i assumed the 3% from talents would cover the rest but obviously not.

     

    i don't use shock in my general dps rotation, because per GCD LS does more average damage than one shock would and if i use shock instead of LS, then i miss a chance on Lightning Storm and Forked Lightning proc.

     

    http://www.torparse.com/a/601479/6/0/Damage+Dealt

    new parse with better results. 100% crit TB 0 resists this time. Though still only averaging 2400.

     

    Most of this was answered by the previous poster but the main thing i noticed in the revised parse was your APM. You were sitting ~36 apm. Top parsers will sit ~42. THIS alone will be enough to boost your dps around 200-300, at least!!

     

    If you don't have a dummy on your ship, buy it quickly. Lag on fleet is horrible. If you do have a dummy on your ship, then you need to practice your rotation better. You should ALWAYS have an ability "queued" up before your previous ability finishes cast. Practise practise practise. The only tricky switch with pre-queued abilities is with your force lightning, that one will cancel the channel if you hit the next ability too early.

     

    Other than that, i had a quick look at your gear, force acc HAS to be ~110%. 440 rating iirc. 0-2 pieces of alacrity are acceptable and comes down to personal preference. Crit anywhere from 0-200 depending on preference. I run ~180 while raiding, feels more consistent. All of this is just nit-picking and doesn't really matter until you're going for BiS.

     

    If you get your apm above 42 with your 2 pieces of alacrity, i think the dps you'll get will be around what your gear level will allow. I didn't go through your parse because i think the bulk of the problem is your APM, after you fixed your accuracy and hitting TB without affliction.

     

    I hope this helps. DPS on Sage/Sorc is balls of fun!!

    Questions: Round II

    in Shadow / Assassin

    Posted

    Point is, Madness' is missing that *key* damage, that *key* flavor and that *key* burst. Best way to fix all three? Why not bring back Maul?

     

    Those magic words EVERY balance/madness shadow/assassin has been waiting to hear.....

     

    BRING BACK MAUL!!

     

    /vote +1

     

    Yours truly,

    Happy Shadow.

     

    Now to finish the next 15 pages of this.

    2.5+ PVE DPS Leaderboards V2

    in The Harbinger

    Posted

    also do you ever upload your raid parses? am curious to see how you perform in one. dummys are fun but i always try to compare myself in raids more.

     

    Tbh, i wouldn't say i'm great in raid dps. I NEVER dps, I've tanked and healed from the beginning. I've only just started dps'n a few weeks ago, as our raid groups "mains" are all geared and finished, we've started gearing 3rd & 4th alts etc.....

     

    Yesterday was the 2nd time i've run dp on my shadow and the first time i've completed it, df as well. I don't think we broke any records, but we (Ewokcrusher) and I were running with 2 other slingers. We were all in parsec and it was pretty even across the board, as far as dps goes. Ifiltration won a couple, balance won a couple, slingers won a couple. We certainly weren't carried and i'd say it was pretty even the whole way, between the dps.

     

    If i get a good run with him, i'll post up some numbers for you to compare. From what i've heard Ashwinx is a full time shadow dps with Intrepid i think, so he would have some good parses uploaded i'm sure.

     

    If you have any republic toons, i'd be happy to run with you anytime.

    2.5+ PVE DPS Leaderboards V2

    in The Harbinger

    Posted

    I feel you brother i have stopped parsing. Gets too expensive lol. I need to save up adrenals then i will start again. BTW impressive parse without a MH. What else are you missing? The MH gave me a good 100 dps when i finally got it.

     

    I imagine it would get insanely expensive if you are buying/crafting adrenals for dummy runs.... i know i would have blown through a few getting this parse. I use re-usable stim and adrenal :D much cheaper.

     

    My gear... iirc, i still had 1 or 2 x 72 enhancements left. Rest was min/max's 78's. MH was 72. Ears & implants were comm oriconian and pvp obroan relics.

     

    Since then i've grabbed the DF ear and 1 x DF relic. I have a 78mh on my sage but i have nothing to transfer it across.....:( Frantically trying to win the sword off CZ in DF HM but been unlucky with rolls this week.

     

    Once i get the MH across or win a new one, i'll get back at the dummy and see if i can crack the 3600's like i see on the world leader boards.

     

    On a side note...... I had the pleasure of running my shadow with Ewokcrusher yesterday, through DP and DF HM in a pug run. Let me tell you, it was beautiful!! 2 x shadows, back to back, dps'n up a storm!! Poetry in motion.

    Shadow PVE DPS buff.

    in Shadow / Assassin

    Posted

    From my calculations, a simple way to bring Infiltration on par with top DPS classes (not including smugglers/agents) would be to simply change Force Synergy to 12% crit chance bonus and 12 seconds duration AND lower force cost of Low Slash to 10. This way, we can actually use it in the rotation (without Shadow's Respite) during the 3 GCDs between 2 Projects, and it still takes skills to use well.

     

    Those 2 changes would give a 5-10% sustained DPS boost without affecting burst potential (especially for PvP).

     

    For Balance, I haven't done any simulation yet but if the change on Force Synergy is not enough, I can't see any "easy fix". The thing I would like to see for Balance is a PBAoE Force Breach so that Lambaste can be actually useful and an addition to Lambaste in order to reduce Whirling Blow's force cost. Also a new skill (instead of Mental Defense) that would give melee attacks on a target affected by Sever Force a X% chance to grant [skill], making the next Shadow Strike free and not respecting Global Cooldown with a Y seconds limit rate

     

    (vote) +1

     

    Any BW peeps reading this. Problem solved. Put him/her on your pay books.

    Shadow PVE DPS buff.

    in Shadow / Assassin

    Posted · Edited by WooduckAUS

    tldr; i think both balance and infiltration deserve to be used in both pve and pvp, as does every other class with a spec that is under performing in one aspect of the game or the other.

     

    I thought i read someone a few posts back saying that there were certain fights where infiltration shined already, because of the down time due to boss mechanics. Due to the ramp up i'm talking of, balance would not be perfect for every fight either, target switching etc.....

     

    I'm not saying don't play infiltration in pve, i was working under the assumption that certain fights already worked reasonably well for infiltration, not so well for others. Similar to where slingers have certain specs that shine with certain boss fights, so would shadows.

    Shadow PVE DPS buff.

    in Shadow / Assassin

    Posted · Edited by WooduckAUS

    If the changes to the 4 piece set bonus you speak of would fix our pve issues, it sounds as though the pvp community would probably drop the pvp set pieces and use the pve ones, unless they also made an op change to the pvp set bonus (yes, that hurt my head)....? I was under the impression infiltration was in a pretty good place atm in pvp, would this make us stupidly OP in pvp? So how do we fix one without making the other op?

     

    If infiltration was at a reasonable place in pvp (burst) and certain boss fights in pve (if mechanics allow), how about we work on fixing balance as the sustained dps in the shadow spec?

     

    It used to be a top tier dps pre 2.0 and then they took our SS away saying it was never meant to be part of the rotation. So they want us to be a dot watching spec.... ok, what if we have a new top tier balance ability that would bring us into line with the other sustained dps classes without giving us too much burst in balance. I would prefer my shadow strike back but that isn't going to happen, so, i was thinking something along the lines of a 4th dot. Something that could ONLY be applied when the other 3 dots are rolling and to make us not completely op, only available once every 30secs. Over a 5 min fight that would be around 200dps increase bringing us in line with the top tier dps classes.

     

    It keeps the idea the devs want from the balance spec (dot watching), without making us op and giving us too much burst because there would be a large ramp up time. It wouldn't be overly effective in pvp because its only available once the other 3 dots are rolling, once every 30 secs. In pvp the player would be dead before you get the 4th dot rolling most of the time (i'm looking at you hybrid gunslingers, how many times after you've done all the ramp up in pvp, has the target died before finishing your wounding shots.....?).

     

    This would fix one spec without making the other one op, in both pvp and pve. I know the peeps who want to run infiltration on every boss may not agree, but like the slinger's, what's wrong with switching specs between boss fights....?

     

    Just a thought.

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