Well the fact that you can not be charged at and can detect stealth already gives you a huge advantage over melees, so i don't think you need even more. You way out? Use that rofl skill of yours. And since you will be in cover again no one can charge at you (not like the other range classes). From all the classes in game is the ops probably the only one that deserves and needs a group mezz. Those warriors usually use it offensively and not as a way to escape, so seems like they don't really need it.

Well the big deal should be that he, as a melee, has more Force Bonus Damage than my min/max Brutalizer Sorc and this while using blue implants and green relicts .... When do you finally implement a hard cap for bolster like (10% below most recent pvp gear). In this way they can put on whatever they want to, but will never be better than the with PvP gear. In addition there will be an incentive for them to get the real PvP gear and also use it!

He is exaggerating, or just a bad. Granted sorcs made a big step forward (after they had been free skills for 2 years). Many people still think its a free kill and then die because they aren't anymore, and then you find those bads in here whining. And Sorc being "OP" is also exaggerated. There are plenty of classes you will have a hard time killing them (if the player is not a compelte retard). You are also whining about 2 or more sorcs on the same team ... well that works for almost every other class as well. For example if there are 2 deceptions sins they can burst one down to a few % HP and using up all his dcds within the first few seconds... And what LoS is worse for melees? Are you kidding? If you are a ranged class and the enemy walks just something like 2m behind a pillar / box / whatever the distance you as a range class have to walk to get the target back into sight is tremendously longer (basic geometry).

Are you serious or on drugs? Gearing advantage? Have you looked at the difference between two subsequent pvp sets? And then there is still bolster ... If you lose all the time then it is not due to them having better gear but due to you lacking in skill. And why the **** are you complaining about people having "geared to the uppermost lvl"? Brutalizer gear has been out for 2 months or so. When are people supposed to get max gear in your little world? Maybe by now we should all be completing our Centurion gear (t1) ...

I don't know what you are complaining about as a sin. You got stealth, you got plenty of cc, and if you expect to solo another dps and healer then your understanding of balance is broken beyond hope .... To me it seems like a simple l2p problem on your part. You are just whining because sorcs aren't as easy to kill as they used to and you low to medicore skill level is simple not enough anymore. Just because a class gets buffed 2 times in a row doesn't mean it is OP. But all you do is look at who gets buffed (without understanding what got buffed and why) and then start complaining. Anyone complaining that he cannot solo a healer-backed damage dealer cannot be taken seriously.

Never going to happen, as they can make you pay for it via Character Transfer! You might not be able to transfer to servers in the other region but as laggy as this game is, it doesn't make sense to merge European and US servers anyways. In addition look at the last server merge. They didn't lift a finger until we had to make appointments with the other fraction in order to open regular warzones. Since we are not even close to that point they won't be giving up the potential revenue from those fee-based Character Transfers.

Well if one class got too much and the other too little then you have to work on both ends. Otherwise you will end up always adding more and more CC (or dps) or alternatively taking too much away from one class without really making the other class any more viable. For example taking away a CC from class B won't really help class A to avoid or delay incoming damage. It might help to change the balance in a duell between those 2 classes, but it does not help with respect to any of the other classes. And I agree with you on the dps jugg part. They didn't have a nice season 1 ... but so did dps sorcs. That 10sec selfstun was not much of a help ... there were too many other things missing. Anyways that's a different topic

Again a stupid answer. You logic is: Class A needs more CC. Class B got too much CC. So let's not give CC to class A. It should be: Class A needs more CC. Class B got too much CC. Take away some CC from class B. And give the needed CC to class A. Whoever class A and B might be. Otherwise balancing will always be screwed. And the Dps race BW has started in trying to achieve better balancing will continue. Right now BW is trying to fix the issue of heavy-armored bursting class having more CC than squishy classes by boosting squishy classes' dps. That's one way of doing it but it we continue down this road we will end up 1 or 2 hitting each other - where is the fun in that. Instead BW should find a good balance between boosting dps and CC. One side note: BW should move the talent for cast time reduction in the madness tree further up, to prevent some hybrids from accessing it and having even more CC than they currently have.

Well I guess CT preventing capping is an unintended side effect. Initially DoTs had this feature, but it was removed back in the days as it is kinda ridiculous.

What kind of statement is that? If you go for ELO: I got 1800+ so my statements have to be more right than yours! Concerning your second statement: If we had accepted what they did in 1.2 and that H2F answer we would still be screwed. Until lately life as dps sorcs in PvP was horrible. All the other classes could also find "other ways to make them pay". It is stupid that classes that have to kite have less stuns than classes that don't have to kite. If you think there is too much stun in this game start reducing it by taking it away from classes for which it is not part of the basic class design. Squishy classes need more CC or higher burst than less squishy classes. Otherwise it won't be balanced. And before anyone accuses me to re-roll FOTM: I have played that sorc since release even through the worst of times when everybody else re-rolled.

So, why should I have to use medpack or def CD just because someone is hitting me with burst damage? Well obviously YOU can. But if you run away from people that should run away from you, you are doing it wrong and totally deserve to die. But just because your tactic and/or skill sucks doesn't mean that the DoTs need nerfs or changes to the way they work.

Well first of all: DoT = damage OVER TIME. That means you got time to react or to heal. A DoT based class will never kill you as fast as a burst based class. Secondly: Why should dots be cleansable? You can't cleanse away burst damage. And while you take the full amount of burst damage immediately, DoT damage (due to its nature) gives you even more time to either kill your oppenent or get some heal. With the amounts of cleanse possible in this game it would be ridiculous to make DoTs cleansable because the DoT using class would spend some 2-3 GCDs to get the DoTs up , meanwhile doing almost no damage- and then you can just cleanse them with 1 GCD. So the dotting class wasted a lot of resources and 2-3 GCDs, and in addition got CD on its dot, but didn't really cause any significant Damage. At the same time to burst based class will probably have hit the DoT class with some 15k damage.

What kind of argument is that: "There are tons of other classes that got more mezz than needed, so for that reason this class should not get instant mezz despite being needed." Why do heavy classes like jugg/pt need aoe mezz/stun, while squishy classes don't? Why do deception sins need even more cc? Why do madness sins need instant WW but not Madness Sorcs, despite using basically the same attacks. With the exception that sins have stealth and are thus going to be the once that start the fight. What about snipers? They are immun to interrupt and charge. They can detect stealth. And they can even make themselves immun to stun. In addition their Damage output is tremendous. But for some reason they need instant mezz. This mezz will be by far less effective than the other classes AOE mezz, as it is used by a DoT class, so in a 1on1 it will break pretty soon. And in a group fight it only takes out 1 player and not the entire group. And your argument: "just get a good group" also applies to all the other classes, so I guess we can remove some of their CCs.

Yeah because buffing the damage a little bit is not going to solve other, more pressuring issues. That dps boost was obviously meant for PvE, since you won't be standing still spamming FL a lot in PvP (except if the other team sucks, but then this extra damage won't matter anyways). People only see the 25% but have no clue what the real effect is. It's not like the overall damage output has been increase by 25%. No, it a 25% increase of a "DoT" that has to be channeled to cause damage. It is nothing more than a 5th tick on FL if the target is affected by Creeping Terror. While this is a better change than being nerfed or getting melee attacks, it does not solve any of the big issues - but what else can be expected of a PvE based change.

Well try getting that WW off when you are being focused in arenas. You are probably playing warzones against some randoms and cast you WW from a save distance. Same won't work in arenas. I agree there is a lot of cc in this game. But the main flaw here is, that there is a ton of cc given to classes who are neither squishy nor have to kite. And why do deception sins need a 1 sec free cast time reduction but sorcs don't? No other class got more cc than a deception sin. But none of you is complaining about giving them more cc potential. That makes you just a bunch of hypocrites. If you wanna talk about reducing the amount off cc in this game maybe start with the instant AOE mezz. Look at juggs they don't use it to save themselves (like sorcs would do) they use their mezz offensively. If at all an AOE mezz should be something that is intended to be used as a defensive tool (like operatives) to save your life and give you some time to escape. The instant WW is needed for the madness tree in PvP. If you are under pressure you don't have the time to cast 1 or 2 secs to get that mezz out. You a) can not afford to stand still, and b) the enemy won't let you use it. If you use PS they will simply knockback you. In addition right now there is no penalty to use stunbreak on electrocute since this is the only viable stun option sorcs got. I know for commandos the situation is somewhat similar but at least they got the option to make their mezz instant. The idea of giving sorcs even more DCD is ridiculous (as long as the other classes don't get more DCDs). We are supposed to be squishy and not some form a force-using-tank. That's why we should have kiting tools and tools to prevent incoming damage (such as a mezz) and only.

bla bla bla If you look at the timespan from release to now and check out which classes have been OP at which point during this time, you will come to realize that for almost any given point in time there has been a warrior/knight AC that was considered to be OP (well maybe not by them but by all the other classes). You somewhat sound like someone who is always playing the FOTM class and thus never sees a balancing issue, since he is playing the OP class, and nerfing that class would make life so much harder. Oh btw. playing FOTM might be smart (depending on what you are trying to achieve) but it is definitely does no sign for skill. And to be honest, while i appreciate that they are finally paying attention to balancing (after they have basically ignored it for 2 years), that ED should have never hit live let a lone stay there for so long. But thank god it didn't take them another 2 years to figure that out.

Well while I agree that sorcs are not in a bad state, you statement is not entirely correct. Killing juggs with their 40sec ED was a problem for any class. Only the worst juggs would deny that this was completely OP. Now that their DCD is in line with the other DCDs I think the fight is more balanced. Concerning the snipers. I don't know what you are complaining about. They are in a good spot. Their damage output is huge, they can not be charged at (unlike all the other range classes), they can not be interrupted (unlike all the other range classes), they can detect stealth all the time, they can make themselves immun to cc. They can also roll from cover to cover to build up some distance (and again melees can't use chage to get to them). So they really got a ton of tools. They may lack the healing ability but their immunity to interrupt and cc as well as their tremendous damage output makes up for that. As for the buff for madness sorcs ... well I don't get that quite either. Other changes would have been much more appropriate. But I guess this change can solely be attributed to PvE. As you won't be able to constantly spam FL in ranked warzones (unless your team is superior or the enemy ignores you - which usually is not the case). Thus the buff is not as big as you make it seem. 25% seems like a big number, but when you think about it, it is nothing but a 5th tick of your FL on a specific target. And as I mentioned above, you are usually not able to spam that much FL anyways since you are usually being focused or got a melee sitting on you which prevents standing still and casting this attack (if you want to survive). So it is a buff, that was implemented probably for PvE and is thus not fully appropriate for PvP, but it is not as tremendous as you are trying to make it seem.

Bioware just favors warriors/knights. It has always been this way and probably always will stay this way. They just switched the op-ness between the advanced classes of warriors/knights. BW also sees sins/shadows as some form of warrior/knight, that's why you got those ridiculous strong deception sins. The average fanboy/kiddy will expect the jedi knight / sith warrior to be the strongest class. And since for kiddies everyone fighting with his lightsaber is a sith/jedi this also explains why they keep the sin so strong. But no one watching the movies expects a non force user to be strong. That's why they keep the melee force classes so strong and all the other classes so weak. It's better for the business. What other reason could there be. If they truely would have tried to restore balance then the OP class would have changed every few patches as they tried to adapt the classes. But the fact that the balancing basicially hasn't changed in 2 years shows what they really want.

Maybe the above is the result of Bioware no taking anythign seriously. Basically they crippled sorc with 1.2. Then they ignored sorcs for about 2 years. Only to finally going back to pre 1.2 step by step and buffing sorcs again(at least for dps). So basically the past 2 year have just been a huge waste of time. But I have to admit that at least for DPS sorc / sages they are in a decent spot right now compared to where they used to be. Though some issues remain, such as GCD for DCD (the amount of benefits they provide to no justify GCD, if you compare it to other classes and their DCDs). The missing instant WW on madness and the 360° knockback to handle those server lags. Some help with Force Management especially for healers and madness/balance because killing yourself to get resource is futile, especially in PvP. But honestly, discussing changes in here is nothing but some form of group therapy. They don't give a damn what we are writing in here. There have been so many "feedback" threads which never lead to anything. There have been countless normal threads discussing what is needed and 99.99% of them remain unanswered and probably also unread by Bioware. If they wanted to they would know anything there is to know about this class and could implement changes accordingly. Those "feedback" threads are just opened to keep you bussy and your hopes up, so that you won't leave this game. It is much cheaper to open a thread in the forum than acctually do some research, implement changes, and test those changes.

If they play their game as they envisioned it then they must be taking something while they are playing the game. That would also explain those contradictory answers. The setting doesn't really matter as you usually got healer both in PvE and group PvP. So either we are supposed or not supposed to use our heal abilites at all. BW please make up your mind. But this much can be said: If you don't use your heal abilities espeically not you bubble you are screwed in PvP. I wonder how you envisioned us sorc / sages playing PvP without the bubble.

Well devs not playing the game or class they developed is like a chef not eating the food he cooked ... a bad sign.

This seems like simple smash monkey problem. Marauders only looking at their overall damage at the end of the game now think that their class is broken. They cannot handle the fact that they can't smash entire groups into oblivion at the same time. Their class has changed, but their play style hasn't. They are still charging into the biggest group of enemy players they can find, just like they used to. Only difference is the overall damage it lower as they don't get auto-crit on every target. But that auto-crit on entire groups and the resulting high damage at the end of the game was tehri purpose in life. At the end of each round they could tell other people what noobs they are because they did less damage than the smash monkey. Well since this charge-into-group-and-smash-them-all-to-death is not well as it used to anymore they have no clue what to do and feel castrated when they look at the overall damage at the end of the game. It really is just a l2p problem.

Well animations are nice and certainly add some atmosphere to this game BUT no one is playing a game solely for the light show. You can play a game with broken/boring animations as there are still some challenges and competition left. But no one will play a game if the mechanics are broken and all that works are flashy animations, as it will become pretty boring pretty fast watching the same light show over and over again while there is basically nothing to do. And I don't know why people are complaining about mechanics, obviously we are in a good spot right now if we can afford to ask questions like adding melee attacks to the most squishy class in this game or whether there will be something on the Cartel Market. Sarcasm aside: The first answer was inevitable but still is a joke. At least they were a little bit more creative than last time and didn't tell you to heal to full under pressure What this class needs is DCD off GCD (all of them). BUT add a GCD if you use the Bubble on someone other than yourself. Anything else would be ridiculous at the current balancing situation. Instant Whirlwind (minimum as Madness, maybe even as Healer, but not as Lightning/Tk as they got their stun bubble to help them escape). 360° degree knockback. Not because we are too lazy or too stupid to direct out knockback at the intended target but because BW is unable to fix their server lags / positioning problems which cause our knockbacks to miss, despite being perfectly executed from our point of view. No Health cost on Consumption / noble sacrifice. If necessay put a cd on it. Finally some decent 4 piece set bonuses. This is a bloody joke. We have had those utterly useless 4 set bonuses for over 2 years now, while other classes get something like a 10% damage boost to their main attack (jugg smashers) or crit for their main attack (rail shot). All we get in PvP is bonus on an ability that us almost useless as it somewhat suicidal to us it and an extended range for lesser skills. Granted the +5m range on Interrupt can be useful BUT you are usually within the 30m range anyways as you want to do more than some shock damage every once in a while AND because you are getting focused anyways which means all the enemies are within the 30m range as they are trying to kill you. Ok granted their healer might be a bit further away, but with several enemies unloading their damage onto you as the most squishiest class in this game you have other concerns than interrupting their healer! Oh yeah I forgot there is the sniper class with extended range, so there might be some use to that extended range after all ... oh wait I forgot, you can't interupt those guys! So get you act together BW and finally grant the sorcs some decent 4 piece set bonuses. For the Healer (Mystic) set the eliminating the Health cost to noble sacrifice / consumption seems appropriate. Or alternatively some cost reduction for the small heal. For the DPS (Master) set something like a reduced cooldown on Crushing Darkness or Polarity Shift or slight increase to the self heal / bubble are something you should consider. I would suggest 1 Sec cast time reduction on Whirlwind but thanks to 2.8's free 1 sec cast tiem reduction for all sins that would give instant whirl wind to the stun kings aka deception sins. Otherwise this would have been a great set bonus for both the sins and the sorc and give Madness sins and sorcs the possibility to get an instant whirl wind in combination with the talents.

Well same is true for both Heal and DPS PvP 4-set bonus. They are almost useless.

This is probably going too far. They should rather provide us with the tools to avoid some of that getting stunned or enable a decent performance afterwards. Helpful would be DCD off GCD like all the others classes. Give back 360° Knockback as they are unable to to fix those positioning problems / server lags which cause our knockbacks to miss. Plus all the other range classes got 360°knockbacks ... there is a reason why. Give back instant mezz as a way to avoid/delay some of those enemy stuns or to improve the chance of getting away afterwards.