Loved how this game launched. Hate what patch 1.1 has done to pvp and its only been out for about 2 hours. Ilum is zergfest and more laggy. 50 pvp queue doesn't have enough players to even get a match to last the whole time. #didtheythinkthisthrough

I would bet against that. At some point people can no longer play a sub par experience when compared to the newer stuff on the market. While SWTOR has a lot of things in common with WoW and quite a few things are missing because the game is young, there ae a couple simple factors that will keep people from going back to WoW: 1) Graphics 2) Voice-Acting 3) Incredible Role-playing experience. I'm not gonna say SWTOR is more polished cuz its not yet. but theres a reason why a vast majority of people aren't playing older games even though those games are built better. SWTOR is the next gen MMO and I don't believe enough casuals will go back to WoW considering how much SWTOR trumps WoW with those 3 factors.

I agree with this guy. Rift devs do a hell of a job and that game is hitting all the right buttons. The problem with rift though is its the worst intellectual property of the 3 mmos. Rift is a better game than WoW in my opinion but nothing about the lore or the characters will get you wrapped up into the game world

An Opinion of someone who was never really into WoW: WoW -------- Pros: Huge community; Massive amount of Content; Most Casual-Friendly MMO; Large amount of Features; Great Economy for crafting; Above Average Lore Cons: Very dated and boring combat (IMO of course); Graphics don't compare to Rift or SWTOR; Very mainstream community that can be extremely immature at times; Best days are long gone. Rift ----- Pros: Very good graphics; Combat is above average for an MMO; Soul-Speccing system is unique and refreshing; New content put in very often, much more frequently than all other MMOs; Excellent Dev Communication with player base; Rift battles provide a nice, unique teaming experience. Best patching system of the 3 games Cons: Quite possibly worst lore of all MMOs; WoW clone besides rift battles; Crafting seems mundane and not that important. Very grindy endgame (could be considered pro or con); Most content is added without much of backstory; Smallest player base of the 3 mmos SWTOR --------- Pros: Very polished game for launch; Best lore of all the MMOs (and I dont even like star wars lol); Best storylines of All MMOs; Lots of leveling content at launch (many quests do not need to be completed and alts will have a completely different experience); Most balanced PvP system; Above Average Graphics Cons: New game so end game content is not fleshed out; Can feel like a single-player game if player does not seek out social activity; More difficult leveling than most MMOs; Too new to predict how successful the game will be; Currently worst of the 3 MMOs for World PvP

I agree with you there 100%. The MMO I was playing before this was Rift and that PvP grind was ridiculous even for me and PvP is all I usually do. You had to have multiple ranks to even be slightly useful. Increasing valor rank caps and stuff will only exponentially increase the problem like you say. However not giving these rewards at all might be an even worse solution. Only thing I can think of is that BW will have to create many bracketed solutions that will filter stronger players from weaker ones. Or they can go the WoW route and make it so it takes little time at all to end up with really good gear and leave the extremely good stuff for a small part of the population that will either do arena style stuff or rated BGs. Not sure what solution I like more.

Lol @ the condescending tone of the post. You hit it spot on really except for the fact that plenty of players only PvP in MMOs (I agree there are less PvPers than PvEers) and that there is no logical reason why a raider who spends 10 hours a week raiding should have gear thats better for PvP than someone who spends 10 hours a week PvPing. Is Raiding more difficult? For most people it definitely is. But being able to beat on some NPCs shouldn't make you more l33t than someone who spends the vast majority of their time playing against actual people.

I think you're the confused one. You got to 50 before the majority of players, therefore you will get to temporarily feel Uber. However 3 months from now when everyone has a 50 then it starts to balance itself out. It's not BW fault that they cant automatically create a population of players to fill a 50s bracket and everything be balanced. With all MMOs, things take time and with the majority of players not being 50 yet there really is no way of knowing if your level 50 sniper in half expertise gear is really that overpowered. Considering how much time and money BW has put into this game, Im pretty sure you'll need your durability against other level 50s with that same amount of gear.

People who complain about expertise or valor or whatever you wanna call a PvP stat in any MMO are just upset about not being able to win whenever they want to. It's all about being a timesink and having a reward for the players who put the most in. The stat is put in to give PvPers a reason to keep PvPing and to reward them for time played more than anything else. As someone has already brought out, currently it doesnt even take much time to get the good expertise gear at 50. If a guy is unemployed and can play 16 hours of the day he can be rewarded and will have better gear than the guy who works and only has 3 hours to play. Its fair in the sense that you get what u put in. New PvPers will always have trouble joining because once a game has been established its much harder to defeat players that all know what theyre doing than to play the game when it first releases and play in matches where over half the people playing are still figuring the game out. Being a newbie and losing to someone who has been PvPing since beta has nothing to do with expertise gear.

Troopers, are from what I've seen, the best PvP healers but I think its a little too early to scream nerf. Ive haven't seen many run them that great and usually when I do they're part of a premade so I know that player is pretty legit anyways. But as far as troopers healing goes, it can be countered but you need a dedicated effort to counter them. From my experience with them, a Powertech BH can lock them out if they spec to shorten the cooldown on their interrupt. That tells me other classes probably can too but you have to be specced the right way to do it. If you aren't specced correctly then yes it would probably take 2 players to interrupt each of their heals. A trooper that isn't healing is pretty much insignificant and even one that is healing just requires you to pay more attention to them instead of just randomly choosing targets and doing whatever you wanna do.

Yea definitely take your time with it. My main is a 48 Powertech BH and when I rolled an inquisitor I definitely noticed how quickly they got their CC abilities. Another thing that might help out is to either go tank or heals. DPS at low levels seems to be really gimped right now. I wasn't really feeling my character spec wise until I decided to go tank instead of DPS. Really didn't have much dps drop off and increased survivability A LOT. The change will help greatly in PvP and PvE.

1 thing about this game is each class does not develop equally. A level 10 inquisitor has about as much CC as a level 35 Powertech BH. However eventually all the classes have a lot of CC tools. You just have to realize the game was not balanced around having each class be equal at level 20 or 30, its the end result that matters.

Definitely best PvP i've experienced in MMOs so far. I rate it much higher than WoW, Rift, CoH, and Champions Online PvP. I don't understand burst complaints, as all the other games will have u die from 1 character in instances where you will get 1 shotted while SWTOR has basically made every fight a lengthy one (exception ofc is lvl 50 vs lowbie). Definitely best class balance and I can't really speak on framerate issues or abilities not firing off correctly as I have a good gaming rig and have had zero issues with running SWTOR. Almost every spec seems useful in PvP and Huttball is probably the most fun battleground of all MMOs (once you learn how to play it of course).

You guys need to relax. They will obviously address this issue soon enough, just like they did with level 50s in PvP. Roll an alt or something for the next month if you have so much time that you're worried about looking like a 50 tiered out clone while most casuals are still trying to get their first 50.

Your experience doesn't sound anywhere close to what I've seen from PvP healing in this game. Before 40, dps classes are worse than healers and tanks in PvP. Even after 40, good healers need to be coordinated to take down or they have to have crappy teammates. I've went against quite a few good healers in PvP so far that did a really good job of keeping people up. Healers are probably only being soloed by someone who has a much greater level than them or they probably aren't good healers.

People will probably take Sylvan's post as him being an elitist but I support what hes saying. It feels so good to not have people Macroing it up and posting on the forums their macros for every nub to copy. You learn your class. Your instincts and understanding of how each class and how the game works is what separates players right now. I too went biochem because its nice as a tank to have some nice heals and buffs to surprise your opponent. What I'm loving most of all is people who farmed rating in WoW thinking that they can come over to this game and wreck ship. You can succeed in WoW just from queuing. Sorry that doesn't translate to the other MMOs.

Yea the people in this thread are pretty much correct in my opinion. The bolstering really does make a huge difference. Honestly, the people who really have a system are the baddies even though I hate saying its a L2P issue but it is. Multiple times I've been in Warzones and I'm like hmmm this guy is a really good player and he happens to be in the 20s. At the same time you'll have teammates that are in their 30s and are garbage. Player skill level is more of an issue right now than 40s battling 19. Now matches where 6 of the 8 players are 50 is not too fun but that rarely happens currently.

Man the forum QQers are ridiculous. Level 50 bracket probably didn't make sense at launch because there were so few 50s. In ever MMO, its a power race. Be the first to hit max level, be the first to get the new gear and so on and so forth. It was expected that at some point the power levelers are gonna have the advantage in PvP. Its like that in EVERY game. I was an avid PvPer in Rift and I don't wanna hear the garbage about this pvp being worst than rifts. The PvP in this game is the best I've seen in a casual MMO and no I don't have to be level 50 to enjoy it. While I got in on day 2 of early access I'm only level 44 right now. In the last week, it has gotten to the points where pugs are no longer winning as much but the solution to that is run a 4 man premade with your friends or guildies. MMOs are always meant to be social and it will always favor the people who team up over people who PUG. If you wanna queue for PvP before you even have the sprint ability that is your decision though it is probably not a wise one. Of course level 50s who run alts and are low level seem to do pretty well considering their level so it usually comes down to a l2p issue as well. But don't say a whole game wasnt ready because BW did not satisfy you with the usual brackets you are accustomed to. If they did brackets during early access and the first couple weeks PvP would've been very boring.

I've given WoW pvp multiple chances over the years since my friend plays that game religiously and I just never felt it was exciting or balanced in my attempts to enjoy it. The combat was always boring to me and I don't get the idea it was greatly balanced either. I've felt that pvp in WoW was more gear based than any other MMO pvp I've played. Gear doesn't even matter in Swtor PvP unless you're level 50.

This guy explains the experience perfectly. I've seen level 19 players who are more effective than level 35 players no matter what the class is. It's more about knowing how to win and play more than it is about your spec. Bounty Hunters are damn good. I love the versatility of the class. But I know an inquisitor and a juggernaut that I can simply admit are better than me even when I'm playing at my best. I do better than most inquisitors on my server but those 2 players just seem to have more success than I do. You don't scream nerf, you figure out what the opposition is doing and try to adjust.

The game is ready, but its obvious Bioware has decided world pvp isnt a priority. I mainly play MMOs for PvP but I agree with Bioware that world pvp really isn't worth the time. If you're looking to keep millions of players, world pvp is not something that attracts a huge player base. World PvP can be exciting in an MMO, but there are many many other features and things to worry about.

I see you trolling, brah. Keep up the good work!

As others have brought out, this is probably a tech issue with your computer and or connection, not the game itself. As far as being kited by range, what is your spec. Lvl 50 sith juggernauts in my guild are wreaking havoc in pvp but I heard marauders are garbage.

I believe CC can be really tough on a player depending on level because of how many powers you have. My all-time favorite moment for PvP so far went like this (I play a BH): While trying to stop a ball-carrier in huttball, I used my cable move to pull ball-carrier onto a lower level bridge away from their healer. Ball-carrier uses a knockback move that knocks me off the bridge onto ground level. I then use jet charge to fly back and hit ball-carrier while rooting them. Ball carrier still alive and running so I then use my shock charge move or whatever that stuns them for 3 seconds or so. Then ball-carrier uses his CC break move to escape and then his healer uses a force pull move that brings ball-carrier all the way to the healer whos in front of goal-line. It was kinda epic gameplay that had nothing to do with DPS but was full of CC and location positiioning, even on the part of the healer. The problem though is if you're level 12 or 16 going up against characters that have about 4 different options to cause u to lose control of your character or mobility because you have no powers then it can become frustrating (magnified moreso if there is a low level against multiple characters past level 30). Thats why level brackets may need to be put in place even though bio-ware has done a heck of a job with attribute and health scaling.

I think this game has the best casual PvP you'll see on the market. SWTOR is going after WoW so don't expect the PvP to be extremely hardcore though. I feel bad for people with lag or connection issues because it's probably a computer problem or internet connection problem as none of the gamers I know here in Vegas have had even the slightest technical issues with the game so far. Back to PvP though, it seems that until you hit 50 at least, going pure dps is worthless. I think that extends to PvE in this game as well. Thankfully, this game makes playing a healer or tank spec very easy. As someone who usually plays a glass cannon build in PvP in most games, I'm loving how powertech tank BHs play once you 30. In huttball I feel like I'm Ray Lewis on defense lol. The best part about Huttball is that the best players aren't good because of the spec, its because of their creative ways to score or defend. I'm very interested if they can create more battlegrounds like huttball that add creative mechanics to traditional mmo battlegrounds.

PvP in this game is pretty damn good. Only thing I can say is that 50s will eventually need their own bracket because they have access to expertise gear. Finally ran into a match where the other team was mostly 50s and most of my teammates were low level and they were dying quickly. Only seen 1 match like this though with many hours of pvp played so far so the system is fine except for once 50s get the expertise gear.