it interrupts his play... and for some people (myself included) that's a bigger cost than any supposed benefit. I'm pretty sure that can only be done by people in your party, so that's consensual. So that's not really analogous to the plague. In wow: you can only have the costumes (from it's various events) that prevent you from acting applied by people in your party. You can't do that to random person standing in the bank. If the plague could only be spread to people in your group, the person you're arguing with wouldn't have ever gotten infected...

No, the only realistic scenario is mandatory inoculations and an extremely harshly enforced quarantine. Anything less lacks verisimilitude. No, you should play the way that you want to. Ferroz prefers it that way, but that's kind of irrelevant to the matter.

there's the also bug that was reported where someone lost a piece of gear due to the explosion. I need to track that thread down and see if he's gotten reimbursed yet (I think it was columni boots if you want to search around for it). the CDC has the power to quarantine people. Quarantining a space station or warship with a very finite number of entry points should be easy; it should be part of the standard safety protocols. The idea that the fleet wouldn't lock down entry after the disease was spotted and then follow up with a very strict quarantine of anyone who shows sign of infection is really far fetched. It's kind of absurd for you to make that unilateral claim. Clearly some of them ARE griefers. No, losign a match is not insifnificant. That doesn't actually prevent infection (unless they hot fixed it so that it's no longer transmitted in warzones). I'd say that's an absurd stance...they should be playing the content they enjoy. If they enjoy pvp over everything else, they should be doing that, not playing the way that Raeln prefers just because Raeln prefers it that way.

Sadly they're not... I mean, there's the technicality where someone can log off and unsubscribe to the game to avoid it... but the person you're responding to is clearly asking for it to be optional while still allowing people to play the game.

No, that's not true at all. I was infected before I could see the screen, due to people sitting at the load in. That was totally unavoidable. There are people sitting on the pvp terminal; you can avoid getting it from them only by luck or by avoiding pvp (which is the reason that some people play the game). You could argue that they can avoid it by not pvping, but that's as absurd as saying that people can avoid it by not logging in this week. Indeed No, even PvP portions of those events are totally non intrusive. The opt out method for that is to not do them. the opt out method for this is to either spend credits (up to 50k per day, for example, easily more than 10k even for someone with less playtime like me) or avoid so much of the game that it's not worth logging in. So this event is FAR more intrusive than the ones in wow. NPCs aren't pc's That would make 0 sense from an RP perspective though; we're not talking about a planet where someone could potentially land anywhere... it's a space station (or warships) with a finite amount of entry points, which undoubtedly has a protocol for locking down people from entering. No, if it was that simple, you we wouldn't be finishing up with our 3rd iteration of thread... not to mention any othe threads. Actually, it lasts until death or 6 hours, and the former is going to happen a lot quicker than 6 hours for a pvper. There are people who are spending more than 20k per day (including one who claimed to have spent 50k in a day) to stay plague free while pvping. You know, I find it kind of laughable for you to make any sort of big deal out of namecalling... that's pretty mild compared to the stuff you see being directed the other way on virtually every page of these threads. I've literally seen whole pages of pro-event posts disappear because they were so filled with name calling.... and I have my page size set to the max size.

That doesn't make any sense... his complaint was about having to repeatedly go get stims after wiping because they were being infected after wiping That doesn't say anything about not watching for debuffs, just that hacing to break the raid to deal with people who (it seems to me) are likely griefing, since they're sitting at an op rez point. It seems kind of unreasonable to assume that they're there for any purpose other than infecting people who are trying to raid rather than participate in the event.. That I have a purple crystal and am uninterested in a black/green one (I don't like black core sabers), that I don't like rakghouls and don't want a pet, and that I like the way my companions look and don't have any interest in diseased versions of them. So: do you agree, I haven't actually called for a curtailing of the event? That in fact, that entire claim is entirely bogus? Correct; 33 pvp matches, so he did a little better than 1 per match. My guess is that he managed to avoid getting reinfected in a few of those matches. What exactly is belittling about "personally, I hope not" in response to a request to extend the event? I don't understand you at all. oh wait, I think I've got it figured out... your quotes are off by one here. someone corrected him saying milleniums; he responded that he wasn't an english speaker, along with a snide remark about being multilinguil (which another poster responded to). I still have an interest in latin so pointed out that it's a latin word, and it's pluralization rule doesn't actually follow the english ones, it uses the latin one (2nd declension neuter iirc). I'm still not sure what you think was belittling about it. It's an aside based on an interest in language. No, the wow ones are much less intrusive. if you look at things that are analogue to the plague, say... costumes during halloween or easter... those can only be applied if you;re in the same party. The general rule in wow is that you can only inconvenience people you're partied with... there may be some exceptions, but I can't think of any off hand.

THere's some of that going on... mostly aimed at people leveling false accusations. There's very little, if any of this. It's been about name calling since the first iteration of the tread. Whole pages of pro-event posts were removed because of name calling. Even now it's hard to go a page without seeing it.

No, several of them are specifically arguing against any form of opt out. Runeshard in particular was quite vehement about it. I can go back to those posts and grab some other names if you really want me to. There are definitely griefers using the plague to grief people. It costs me time. In one case ~20 minutes (pvp loss caused by the plague stun at the wrong moment). The guy who spent 50k to stay plague free yesterday definitely had an in game cost. Pretending otherwise is just silly. I'm not sure what you think I've taken out of context. Blaming these people for future events becoming easy and boring is kind of absurd ... since they're leveling complaints specifically about a portion of the event that is nothing but easy and boring. What exciting parts of the event do you think people are complaining about? Standing around in fleet afk is one of the primary features of this event: the masses of people standing in fleet and exploding, and it's the piece that people are arguing against in this thread.

Who was it that was claiming that people didn't sit on the pvp vendors? http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=422996

What does getting rid of the buff before the raid begins have to do with getting infected after a wipe?

Interesting claim, since that's all most anyone's asking for... and people continue to argue against it. ... are you seriously saying that standing around in fleet afk is difficult and exciting? I really hope you're talking about something else.

Correct, that's his claim Also correct, that's part of his claim. Where are you drawing this statement from? If you're going to say he's lying, then don't mince words... just don't put words in his mouth and then call him a liar for the words you've added. I find no reason to assume that he's lying; if you want to dig into it, do so. He might come back and respond (or might not if he's actually unsubbed over this). I'm familiar with the word... I'm asking where are you claiming that I said that? Can you quote it? I mean, I don't remember asking for it to be curtailed. In fact, I think I've repeatedly corrected people that made that assumption since the first iteration of this thread... Since you didn't actually answer my question, no.... it's not...

It is pretty difficult, when you're loading in and have a load screen in front of your face... Really, they should prepare for people to be standing on the respawn point exploding when they zone in? personally, I think that he's pretty justified in being upset if that's what was happening, and it's kind of absurd of you to pretend they're somehow at fault. Were they wearing a short skirt or something? Out of curiosity... where did I ask for the event to be curtailed in some fashion? Be sure to check the pages immediately before that post, since he was saying that I had done so repeatedly on the pages immediately before that. I mean, I can't find anything like what he's talking about.

I'm not sure how you'd get that... he said that they were infected AFTER the wipe. he's claiming to have gotten infected after they wiped. So my guess: people clustered around the re spawn point for that op outside in fleet? I haven't bothered with ops yet, so I'm just assuming that wiping in an op works like it does in a flashpoint, with the respawn point outside in fleet. No, if I level as usually I'd definitely get infected by the people clustered around the pvp terminal.

No, I'm pretty sure you haven't seen my whining about the plague at all. I notice that you didn't quote me doing so... unless you're using some weird definition for whining... just FYI: answering people's questions and pointing out false information isn't whining. Mid January did someone mention a flashpoint? I look forward to them actually adding one of those; this one lacks the "awesome rewards" bit... that's what the vast majority of the "haters" have been asking for since the first iteration of this thread.

Personally I suspect that they're people who get their jollies out of intentionally infecting people that don't want to be infected. It's the only reason I can think of that they'd be so vehemently against it. No, I'm pretty sure you haven't seen me asking for the event to be removed. Care to quote me doing so? I notice that you didn't respond to the question there; there's a word for people who are evasive when questioned about their unfounded accusations and then flat out lie about them like that...

The sentiment remains incorrect ... I'm not asking for it's removal either. I'm really clear how "doesn't like rakgouls and is thus not interested in any of the rewards of a rakgoul based event" = anti-social and seriously... where have I QQ'd?

I'm not sure what you think is QQing in the text you just quoted. He's patiently explaining (again) that the infection does not provide any benefits to people who aren't interested in those things. The person you're responding to isn't one of the 2 or so that have asked for it to be removed. False; time is being taken. People have lost warzones as a result of it; that's not just a few seconds... Indeed... the fact that mechanics of the infection encourage griefing is at the root of the objections that are being raised. It's kind of silly to offer "it's the mechanics" as a counter argument to that... no, there's no maybe about it... definitely. No one has claimed otherwise... why do you keep coming back to this strawman? I've seen/heard it in all 3.

Because the penalties of the plague outweigh all of the rewards combined. Indeed, it is to some people. I'm glad that you finally recognize that. Yes... that's why people are complaining about it.

Both of those potentially swing the tide of battle, turning a win into a loss. For me, it's not enough to entice me into logging into the game; it's not worth the downsides, by far. Obviously this isn't correct, based on the guy that had to spend 50k in a day to stay plague free... rakghouls are the result of a conversation that started off with something like "hey how can we shoehorn zombies into the starwars mythos" ... if you believe otherwise, then I think that you're out of your mind. It's nice that you believe that everything that people have created that is star wars is canon... but there is indeed a school of thought that only the movies are actually canon (they only consider G-Canon to be actual canon). You're not going to convert any of those people by insisting that vader has encountered rakghouls... because he didn't encounter them in any of the movies. Whether they're canon or not, there's certainly a group of people that believe that they're a detriment to the mythos; arguing that they've been in since KOTOR doesn't really add any support as far as those people are concerned.... they still believe that they're a garbage addition to the mythos. You've disagreed with people saying that they should be respected as such while making snide comments about them; it seem pretty clear that you do not respect them as human beings... in fact, based on your word choice I expect that you basically regard them as sub-human. They're the ones that kept this thread alive... No, actually it's an absolute term. Are you really going to argue this strawman?

No, just that they deserve the respect that any human being deserves as a human being. No, posting snide remarks and rude comments about them is the part that's "bashing" ... it's not enough for you to just hold the opinion that they as human beings have no value and that their goals and desires are meaningless. You actually have to post about it

No, I pointed out how you were being disingenous... I gave 3 examples in fact (3rd one was edited in after the initial post). Actually, until the last few posts in this thread I was 3rd, behind 2 people who are in favor of the event... wyhen I got up this morning I was 5th or 6th I think Skolops is 10th and has less than half as many posts as the pro-event people above him (closer to 1/3 in one case). I already answered that question. I'm not willing to log in to the game in it's current state; I'll log in with the event is done. Until then I can spend a fairly minimal amount of time posting on the forums. A better question is why were Freyar and DieAlteHexe the top posters in this thread until I hit my lunch break... The number is a finite number, so by definition it's measurable... so infinitely smaller is false.

No, people don't need rated warzones to care about winning or losing. So that's not the end of the story. Sure, YOU don't care about warzone wins and losses without rated warzones, but it's ridiculous to insist that noone should care bout them. You disagreed with the person saying that it's sad that people don't. Maybe you should bash them a little less, and respect your fellow human being more, eh?

You should respect them as fellow human beings. Respecting others is part of being a decent human being. the part where you say that Skolops or I are bantering about having the event removed. The part where you imply that it's just us and then follow up and pretend that you weren't implying that. The part where you imply that Skolop's is responsible in keeping the thread alive currently ( he jumped back in after a fairly long haitus and isn't participating currently). among others I can measure 40 people. It's pretty easy.

Do you even realize that serious pvpers do everything they can to eliminate the chance of a random event causing a loss? No, a single stun in the wrong time can make a vast difference in both of those matches. For example: getting stunned during the first minute of play can make a huge difference in civil war, by turning the tide of the initial push. Winning the fight at a control point and then being interrupted by a stun can be the difference between capturing it and holding it the entire match vs losing it to their reinforcements. It can be the difference between controlling 2 points the entire match vs controlling 1 match the entire match, which is far more than a 5 point difference. in voidstar it can be the difference between capturing one more than your opponent and winning by xminutes, or not being able to capture that last point and losing by x minutes. in huttball, exploding right before you cross the goal line can make the difference between winning and losing due to score. That said... I've had both of those situations happen: I've lost in void star right before I could click on the computer terminal, as I was force speed running toward it. I've lost twice in alderaan by 5 points.