Not to get in the middle of it, but did you read what you posted? Full access was Dec. 9, 2014 on SoR. It is now Jan. 26, 2017. This recent Dec. 9. 2016 was in fact two years and now we are past that. How are you coming up with that it hasn't been over two years?

No it isn't. Most of them are seriously laughing at this. It is painfully obvious at this point that EA has no intention of putting much serious investment in this title. The competition is absolutely making SWTOR look like an utter joke with the content they are putting out in a year. Heck, ten year old games like LOTRO are outpacing what BW is putting out in a year. It's done. Put a fork in it. They are talking about having One Op and One daily area by the end of the year. It is literally a complete joke. That is what they want you to pay $180/year for. Too funny.

Your being sarcastic, right? They have a competitor that has dropped 4 raids a year for the last two years and has 9 new raids dropping this June. You think 1 Op boss every 60 days is even interesting to any serious raider when a competitor is dropping raids faster than raiding guilds can clear them before the next raids drop? Flashbacks of all the articles during the TORtanic years are suddenly seeming like we may be seeing them again once EA reports on Q1 earnings. I have a feeling, like usual, their is not going to be any good comments about SWTOR's business at that time.

You comment makes me think of something that was said to me from a business manager once over 20 years ago. "You don't decide to finally start running in a marathon at mile 5 when the leader is one mile from the finish line." What he was referring to is once you fall too far behind your competition, it is too late. It is obvious from this stream (and the looks on their faces the whole stream), they are in panic mode. Very wrong decisions were made over the last two years (and the teeth kicking they decided to give a good portion of their paying customers with this GC system) and now, they are at mile 5 deciding it is time to run, whereas many of their competitors are at Mile 25 with a mile left to go. They announce the START of a new Op in April with the rest probably coming every 60 days until the end of the year. One of their competitors has 9 NEW raids dropping in June, along with 12 NEW dungeons (which will bring the in game total to 59 dungeons). SWTOR players are going to get ONE Op and ONE daily area. It's not a case of too little too late, it is a case of it's just too late. Seriously, if you are a raider, would you rather wait on a trickle of one raid over a year or move to a game that currently has 18 raids (12 8-man and 6 24-man) and has 9 more coming this June (6 8-man and 3 24-man)? In addition, it also has 12 NEW 4-man dungeons coming in June with another 6 slated for release throughout the remainder of the year. And this is just for the raid/dungeon group content.

Just for reference, name a sub based MMO that delivers less content? WoW - more content FFXIV - more content ESO - more content (and that is hybrid) GW2 - more content Heck, TSW, run by a small company with a small development staff has put out an entirely new zone (Kaiden), with a completely new game system (Aegis), with three new high-level dungeons and a raid in the last two years. Even a ten year old title, LOTRO, has put out more content in the last two years than SWTOR. So, are we going to compare SWTOR to what as far as content production? A slam together small team title, or serious titles. Even A-grade (not triple A) are putting out more content that SWTOR.

Stop you are the one obfuscating. Any other MMO on the market that charges as sub fee (and many that don't) regularly deliver group content (dungeons and/or raids). BW charges a sub fee and hasn't delivered a single raid (or flashpoint for that matter) in more than two years. It is complete and utter BS that a game with this IP backed by a company as big as EA cannot even keep up with competing MMOs on the market. How can one title, run by a company less than half the size of EA, deliver 18 NEW dungeons and 8 NEW raids in the course of a year but EA/BW cannot deliver a single one in two years?

See I disagree with that final assessment. EA is the second largest gaming company with $4.5 billion in revenue (and they are not far behind Activision with $2.6 billion in revenue). Square Enix does $1.9 billion a year. So how can a company with less than half the revenues of EA seem to have a budget where SWTOR does not? If EA wanted to they could in fact do what SE did with FFXIV. But they don't and for good reason. They have sunk a lot of money into this without seeing the return they had hoped. That is simply because since it's earliest development, the title has been mismanaged as it still is today. Square Enix recognized that and when they fired the original producer and actually hired one that cared about the game and the brand, engaged with the customers, and then delivered what they wanted - he turned something that started as a failure into a growing success.

Expect too much? If I expect any less it will be NOTHING. I am only comparing it to what other company;s provide for content updates to their player base and SWTOR is woefully lacking versus most popular MMOs - woefully lacking. Expecting them to at least deliver, for $180/year sub fee, what other MMOs have done is NOT expecting too much - it is expecting them to at least compete in the market. Do you have any idea how much content FFXIV players, who pay the same $180/year, have got for their money in content in the course of a single year? More than BW has put out in ALL FOUR of their expansions. In other words, what BW has charged subs 4 years of sub fees for, SE has given to their players in ONE YEAR. On the augment thing, NO, you are incorrect. Glyphs and Signets are the equivalent of the set bonus and that is given throughout the game. Augments are attached to your skills and actually enhance what they are capable of. It would be like have new sub-skills you could attach to your current quick bar skills to make them do additional things. Furthermore, that is a very small company that could give more in their scenarios than BW could do in Uprisings. I have 19 days left and I am done. I am done not just because of their determination to intentionally PO a good portion of their customer base, but also because I can go elsewhere to any other MMO and get a ton more for the same money that BW gives. They don't deserve any passes on this. For a title that was once supposed to challenge WoW, they can't even put out enough content in a year to match the smaller MMOs on the market.

Then the game should not have a sub. It should be B2P like TSW. By the product and play. Otherwise, what the heck are you paying $180/year for. So, too many people defending BW are giving them a pass for what any other MMO would provide for regular on going fees.

Okay, for two to five year old content (except for the Uprisings, which I will get to in a minute), it is a PATHETIC amount of content for an MMO that is five years old. Let's look at an MMO that is only three years old to this one being five years old. It has: 18 Raids (12 8 man and 6 24 man) 47 Dungeons 4 World Bosses 11 Mini-games 6 PvP modes (from 1v1 duels, to 72 player battles) As for Uprisings, they are a complete joke. Cut and paste assets and maps to give the illusion of some group content being added. That they could do five of them in less than 60 days should show how little effort is needed to produce them. Funcom, a much, much smaller company did a lot more in their best comparable content known as scenarios, which cam e with issue 9. While those maps and mobs were reused assets from the game, they at least put some thought into them. They have an objective to defend survivors from mobs. They have unique systems rewards (augments) that help enhance your character and their skills more (and they are the only way to get them). They have random events and bosses which changes the dynamic of each and every scenario. They can be played solo, duo or as a group. They have FOUR levels of difficulty (from Novice up to Nightmare). This is what some small content, even reusing assets, looks like when more than five minutes of thought is put into it. If your a sub paying $180/year, you should expect something NEW for your money. Not two resets on gear to play the same content you have done a thousand times over.

In simpler terms, those still paying are being played for suckers. The EA MO in a nutshell.

I would contend that this is a result of how BW has handled the feedback on the forums. When you ignore the vast majority of feedback, it presents the feeling of frustration and, more importantly, the uselessness of giving such feedback. So it then will degenerate into a whine fest. Case in point, with the announcement of the GC System, thebeta on the PTS, and the launch of it, there was a TON of feedback offered on what was wrong and how to fix it. BioWare chose to ignore 100% of it. Thus why we have what we do today.

You see, here is the problem that any developer who wants to put out and maintain an MMO faces: 10% of players are solo (story) players 10% are light group players (4 to 5 man content) 10% are casual raiders (like Ops but progression is not their big thing) 10% are casual PvPers (unranked) 10% are hardcore raiders (progression and focus) 10% are hardcore PvPers (ranked and mainly play for PvP) 10% are roleplayers 15% are casual, all content players 15% are hardcore, all content players This has been stated many times by developers experienced in the space who have pointed out the fallacy of discussions about one group being bigger than the other. The reality is an MMO is comprised of a bunch of minority groups that together make up the total customer base of an MMO. This is why content and expansions need to focus on ALL types of content for the diverse audiences. This is why almost all MMOs who deliver content on a regular basis offer something, every year, for all those player groups. In addition, an expansion in any other MMO means something for ALL those player groups in an expansion. SWTOR has spent the last two years focusing on one minor group. To tell people, in all seriousness, that content that have already done a thousand times over that there is still plenty of new content is dismissing the needs of 90% of the player base based on the list above. This has been SWTOR's problem in a nutshell for the last two years and is the main reason why the sub base keeps declining. And before any goes off on resources, EA is the second largest (by a very slim margin to Activision) gaming company in the world. If they wanted to invest in this title and really have a powerhouse MMO on their hands (like Square Enix did with FFXIV) they could. This issue is the title has been mismanaged since beta, and still is today, and thus why EA hasn't put a lot of investment into the title since launch. Finally, for all those who want to defend the story because you enjoy it and it's new, fine. Just realize that no MMO can survive on one of those player groups alone. So you should be very concerned that if the other 90% aren't getting anything they will leave for an MMO that delivers their needs. If that happens, there will be no more story because BW cannot survive on that one segment of customers alone.

There is plenty of evidence contrary to your assertion. But you know this because it has all recently been presented in another thread. Yet there is zero evidence to support your assertion. It is a completely fictitious number. Oh, and of course the EA financial reports and comments on the game don't support your assertion either.

Which is.... that there has been a population decline since Jan. 3? The graph is showing a decline since the beginning of the month!

Well then, your observation seems to be bucking more than one source of disagreement (even on your own server): http://mirror.torstatus.net/shards/us/trends I am done with this point. Yes, Harbinger is the one server that BW needs. It will keep them in business. The other 16 servers are not needed at all.

I made the claim and backed it up with the video proof. You simply go by your observation without reviewing the proof. And apparently, there are a lot of people who do not share your optimistic viewpoint on server populations: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=910932

Yes, because ONE server is an example of all 17 servers.

Here you go, have fun: https://www.twitch.tv/tcthief/videos/all Also notice what a big streamer he was for the SWTOR raiding community. Also notice how, since that last videos that I described above were posted, he has stopped streaming SWTOR altogether. Be forewarned, on the 6 hour and 14 minute one there are a lot of people on voice chat at the time discussing their being fed up and moving on. This streamer was known to be helpful for people wanting to learn about raiding and becoming very good at it in SWTOR. So, sorry, it is not BS. You can watch for yourself.

Too funny. You need to spend some time on Twitch. Like watching TCthief who logged into EVERY SINGLE server (both NA and EU) to show there wasn't rising populations. Yes, every single server. He did a little over six hour live stream to show that those making the claim you are, are in fact completely wrong. How many threads are there about certain servers being completely dead? Asking for free transfers or mergers? The truth is, this game could probably be run on four servers at this point. Just because they keep 17 servers going with 13 of them being almost dead doesn't mean things are going well. Your second statement is too funny. You do know that they released Patch 5.1 yesterday, yes? You do know they put in major changes to the GC and gearing as a response, yes? You do know that four live streams (three of them emergency ones after launch) and a survey from EA on the expansion itself is a good indicator that things are going the opposite of what you claim. They are declining because of a lack of diverse content. That is what is and has caused the decline. Does the new gear system change that? No! What would change the decline? Regular updates on new and diverse (story, PvP, FPs, raids, dailies, mini-games, etc.) content. Sorry, but the evidence at this point since the 5.0 launch is that things are in fact NOT going well. Just because PvP queues are popping faster doesn't mean more people, it means many that are left are doing PvP because of the efficiency of the CxP rewards - that is all.

Two things. 1.) Any business should care about ALL of their customers. They were successfully serving both in 4.0. So to say a company doesn't care about a portion of their base is utter and complete toad droppings. 2.) Pre-5.0 there were already multiple paths for everyone getting gear. Casuals had crystals, PvP players had WZ commendations and raiders had Ops tokens. Stop spewing the BW propaganda about this being easier or better. It has nothing to do with that at all. No one, NOT A SINGLE PERSON, was complaining about the gearing methodology of 4.0. This has nothing to do with making it easier or more accessible - it was already that. People who haven't read the forums or patch notes are confused as heck with all these tokens and pieces now - so it actually made it WORSE. This system is about one thing and one thing only - trying to keep people subbed longer with a major time sink to do content they have already twice grinded gear (3.0 and 4.0) for. This is simply a half-baked bandaid trying to cover for the fact there has been no meaningful group content added to an MMO in over two years.

Actually, it is easier - and less expensive - to work on keeping your existing customers than attracting new ones. CAB (churn and burn) business models NEVER work out in the long run. Be honest, if you were in charge of this title, made an announcement (but still hadn't implemented the change) of a major change to a product and saw the uproar and negativity that happened on your forums, two of the biggest MMO newsites, one of your most popular fansites, on reddit and in many social media channels - would you still blindly go ahead and implement it or would you use a little common sense and say maybe this is not the right way to do it? Or would you just do it and say, oh well, we can just go after more customers to replace the old ones with our 5+ year old game? While they may not deliberately chase people who left the game, why would you deliberately do something to push them out of the game in the first place? Especially when you had something similar before (with a different color lipstick) in the 1.0-1.6 era and it chased away 1.8 million of your 2 million subscribers?

While you do make some good points in your post, I respectfully have to disagree that 5.0 forum uproar is no different than 4.0 and 3.0. It isn't even close. With 4.0 the biggest uproar was about the level scaling. However, first, there were probably about 10% of the threads on that than there have been on the GC system. Secondly, there were no where near the number of unsubscirbe threads and third, those threads tended to have an equal balance of those against the change and those supporting the change. I, for one, supported it because I saw how well it worked in GW2. In addition, there were not four emergency live streams from the devs talking about major changes to the expansion, nor a survey from EA specifically on the expansion. This time around, those supporting the GC system in the forums are clearly in the minority. With 5.0, there are a ton more threads of complaints and unsubscribes that is more reminiscent of the first six months after the game launched and 1.8 million (of the initial 2 million) left the game. There have been major changes already introduced (none to the benefit of the player base) along with live streams and surveys. Remember when they stealth nerfed companions and heroic credits? Remember the uproar (which still wan't even close to what it is now on the GC system)? Remember how they fixed both of those in the very next patches and communicated that they were doing it less than a week after the uproar? So one has to wonder, with the uproar being bigger now than it ever has been, why are they completely ignoring the majority of the feedback if it is larger now than it was with the companion and heroic credit nerfs? But, as they say, the proof is in the pudding and none of us are going to know the true effect until EA, sometime in May, reports on their Q1 earnings.

And many still have left. Go to a lot of those in the Off-Topic unsubscribe threads who listed X number of days left that we are now past that time, click on their name to see their post history and you will notice a lot of them have NO posts after the date they said they were unsubscribed. I would also say four livestreams with a month and a half of 5.0 launch, all with changes to the GC system, a big patch of even worse changes with 5.1, a survey from EA, and the sudden desire to actually start communicating with the players this week is a very good indication that things are not going well. They are suddenly following the same damage control plan that they did with the guild summit - and we all know how that turned out. I am one that has 18 days left then done. My sub actually had lapsed near Christmas but I had to purchase one month more just to do some guild transfer items.

It was this bad once before. In about the two to six month time frame after launch.... when 1.8 million of the initial 2 million people left the game. As BW later admitted, they were in "serious trouble". I guess that's why today when we used to have 180+ heavy to full servers, we now have 17 servers where four of them might see standard loads for two weeks after an expansion launch. History my not repeat itself, but it has a funny way of rhyming.