Tumri
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Posts posted by Tumri
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If they are spec'd into CC, they aren't doing much healing - if at all. (pro-tip bubble counts as healing, and if they get decent healing on a chart, it's because they are bubbling OTHER people - oh no!)
Hard to kill? lol, oh noes, a 3k bubble with light armor. So hard...
AOE damage? lol
Single target? Who doesn't? But it's also one of the lowest burst in the game.
Bad's are bad's.
Sorcerers and sages are one of the easiest class to kill endgame, unless they are spec'd into healing, but then they have low damage and low cc.
I'll just copy-paste this here. It's unbelievable the number of Sorcerers that don't even know how their bubble functions and how it compares to mitigation. 99% of Sorcerers I've seen on forums and in games have no idea their bubble even scales with health and healing power(from Willpower and Power).
Static Barrier Math(PvP)16k+3.5k(Static Barrier) = 19.5k w/16% mitigation = L (Light Armor)
16k+0 = 16k w/24% mitigation = M (Medium Armor)
16k+0 = 16k w/30% mitigation = H (Heavy Armor)
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20k damage(6k internal/elemental) in 20 seconds:
L = 11,760(Kinetic/Energy) + 6k(Internal/Elemental) = 1740 health remaining
M = 10,640(Kinetic/Energy) + 6k(Internal/Elemental) = -640 health remaining
H = 9,800(Kinetic/Energy) + 6k(Internal/Elemental) = 200 health remaining
40k damage(12k Internal/Elemental) in 20 seconds:
L = 23,520(Kinetic/Energy) + 12k(Internal/Elemental) = -16,020
M = 21,280(Kinetic/Energy) + 12k(Internal/Elemental) = -17,280
H = 19,600(Kinetic/Energy) + 12k(Internal/Elemental) = -15,600
Conclusion:
Now think about this for a second. When will you reasonably be taking 40k damage in 20 seconds? Keep in mind PvE DPS on a stationary target is around 1500DPS for most classes. In PvP you can reasonably expect a player to do ~1k DPS to a human target. For Sorcerers with a single bubble to have less mitigation than the Heavy armored classes with the most physical mitigation in the game two well geared players would need to beat on the Sorcerer for a full 20 seconds without interruption. If a Sorcerer manages to cast a second bubble from having one pre-cast prior to this happening then the Heavy armor is better at an astonishing 80k over 20 seconds. With this in mind it is safe to assume that Sorcerer light armor is more than made up for by Static Barrier.
Static Barrier is not overpowered. It is also not underpowered. With the above information in mind and a lack of offensive dispels in the game we can count Static Barrier as a counterbalance to Light armor. Sorcerers are no squishier than any other class because of Static Barrier and therefore extensive CC compared to other classes is not justified by their Light armor.
7. A bubble that provides between 3.5-4.5k absorption. Since average health pools are on average about 16k this can be looked at as an instant 20%-30%+ health gain on a 20 second cooldown. They have light armor but this skill makes them far tankier than most DPS specced players in any situation where the players aren't receiving external heals for extended periods of time and even then it's pretty much outright better than heavy armor. This bubble is not overpowered as it's essentially a counterbalance to their light armor. What makes it over powered is the talented CC that comes with it(More on that below). [static Barrier][static Barrier Absorb = 16.4% Maximum Health + 3.27 * Healing Power] - Source: http://www.torhead.com/ability/VIBtDV/static-barrier - See "Effect Details" and scroll down to "Action"(Subeffect 1)
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A stance for Healing/Lightning/Madness might work. It would fix the hybrid spec issue I guess.
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Powertech grapple will make them very relevant in Rated WZs and beyond. Marauders are 1v1 kings but you'll find their 8v8 usefulness is lacking.
Go with Powertech for now. Marauders aren't the greatest choice right now especially with rated WZs coming.
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Your calculations involved no DPS rotations or nothing to statistically back it up. It could very well have been %5, 10%, 60% or 90%, but you chose a number that backed up your argument. Hence why it's a fallacy
OK. Deadly Saber + Rupture. Maybe I get 2-3 real melee attacks in between. I repeat this till I kill you. 80% of my damage was internal.
That's a number that's twisted to back my argument.
Claiming situational changes in someone's rotation in your argument's favor is a bit stupid when I could just as easily do the same but with more success considering armor ignoring damage is typically on a CD. In a situation against a kiter anyone will be using their longer CD armor ignoring abilities more.
Your refusal to accept the fact that literally every common spec has at least 30% unmitigated damage is just stubbornness when in fact that's the absolute most generous unmitigated damage value I could use. I could have easily claimed Marauders do most of their damage through DoTs when against Sorcerers. I could have even more easily claimed that Arsenal spec Mercs have 55% armor penetration and therefore used a 55% unmitigated damage value.
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I hate the fact they are adding meters. That announcement actually made me reconsider continuing my subscription. I'm taking a wait and see approach right now. But I'm really not interested in dealing with the stupid, elitist, gear addicted mindset that comes along with that stuff....again.
How does DPS awareness cause a gear obsession? This game is already gear based. Right now it doesn't matter if you're good if your gear is bad since PUGs have no way to judge if you skill picks up the slack in gear. You can bet when my guild does HM EV/KP alt runs we typically don't take anyone that's not in mostly columi. With meters or logs we'd be more comfortable taking someone less geared.
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What the OP is suggesting is like saying Starcraft should remove hotkeys so that only players who have 500 apm can be competitive... yeah, no.
More like removing macros so the game requires more than 10 APM for certain classes.
SC2 at a platinum/master level requires 250+ APM or you're typically worthless FYI. 500 is what skilled Zergs can pull during big battles.
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30% armor pen is much different than 100% armour pen, did you think maybe that's why the reason is was nerfed from 50% and the OPS whined so much.
So you're saying only 10% (at most) of your damage comes from dots or your scoundrel... sounds about right I guess though most scoundrels don't even dot me up because my armor is soo low ... much different from the 30% huh ?
And if your sentinel does 40-60% unmitigated damage, the tanks would be whining by now, so I'm calling BS on this one. Especially since you ' haven't ran the numbers'.
People do a lot more than 30% unmitigated damage. In my calculations I was being overly generous so that responses like yours wouldn't criticize me for biased calculations. If anything you're the one being biased claiming that you only have ONE DoT that is internal damage when in fact Death Field, Crushing Darkness(your highest DPCT ability), and Affliction are all internal. Even a hybrid spec Sorcerer's damage will have a large portion unmitigated.
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Healing Power Coefficient is 2.59
http://www.torhead.com/ability/aERBMbN/defense-screen#classes
"Effect Details" -> Action(Subeffect 2)
Needs a buff IMO. It's outclassed.
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1 cunning = .14 healing power
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Yes it will be inaccurate to a certain degree. But so far I don't think buffs and debuffs would change your rotation that much as it's always heat/force/energy that will keep you from going all out.
??
Who said anything about heat/force/energy? That shouldn't stop you from "going all out" in any circumstance anyways since a good rotation will mean you never run out of your resource.
I was talking about lacking raid debuffs that directly effect your damage. I record footage of me soloing a 136k hp mob and divide the health by the time in seconds to get DPS. If I get ~1750DPS without these -20% armor debuffs and a class with the armor debuff tests at ~1750DPS I would technically be ahead in a real raid situation since those debuffs effect everyone's DPS but in a solo test setup not all classes get it. It's the same with Bloodthirst.
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Pick a random mob-group and use a stopwatch.
Some of us have already been doing this. The problem is you can't account for raid debuffs like -20% armor reduction. No class in the game is completely unaffected by these sorts of debuffs. It ends up being sort of inaccurate in a comparative analysis of DPS.
once those meters come out, your going to get the players that say "LFM for xx raid. must be able to pull a minimum of xx damage"Basically they don't want yo play with you unless you're good or well geared enough to make up for it. They should have that choice. It's their run and if they want to get it done quickly with minimal hiccups and good speed that's their prerogative. Who are you to say "You MUST take me no matter how much I drag you down in terms of DPS"? They pay their $15 a month to play how they want to play. You pay $15 a month to play how you want to play. If you don't want to play LIKE them don't play WITH them.
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A significant part of the more "hardcore" crowd is already a bit agitated by the lack of logs/meters at launch. It's going to need to be added pretty soon.
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I mean I love bacon, donuts, pizza, pasta and MOAR BACON! but that doesnt mean putting all of it into a blender is going to be a good thing!
A bacon/donut/pizza/pasta/MOAR BACON! drink you say?
Shut up and take my money!
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And make stopping the huttball carrier impossible yea right........
Make the huttball carrier unable to leap or get pulled. Solves both the problem of overpowered pull/leap teams and also makes it so DPS means something in huttball(killing the carrier).
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10/10 - Couldn't stop laughing all the way through lol.
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I think knockbacks should give resolve based on the total distance it makes you travel(counts the Z axis). If you're knocked down off of anything you should get instant full resolve. Knockbacks also need to be toned down honestly. Force Push is a crazy long distance as is the PT knockback. AoE knockbacks are also a very large distance. Knockbacks should be about strategy not "hit this to send your target(s) flying". Currently knockbacks are capable of knocking you off of ledges even if you manage to position yourself correctly so your back is facing a long strip of platform because they can simply reposition themselves in half a second to be about 5-10 degrees off and the distance of the knockback is great enough to push you off entirely.
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Tank/marauder with pocket healer is also OP in group. We should nerf tanks/marauders and healers. Nice logic there:rolleyes:
I know about this class, its OP in 1vs1 and even more OP in group. So it would ne only fair that we nerf THAT class first, now wouldnt it?
You use the "OP with a healer" and "OP in 1v1" argument a LOT. Nothing in this game revolves around 1v1 or 2v1(What you're basically saying with the pockethealer bit).
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Give a class everything just = God mode
Hybrid CC-Heavy Spec Sorcerers.
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The 5 minute CD does hurt. But, if you pop your Frenzy to give 30 stacks, then Blood Thirst as soon as a round of Voidstar starts, it would help a ton in wiping enough players to plant quickly. It has it's uses, it's just not spamable. Heck, even super useful if you're trying to either hold the Huttball for a tie win or if you're trying to kill their carrier.
I'll give you the pathetic heals though lol. Only really useful on ourselves and the dot crits for semi-burst.
But, you have to look at the big picture for the healing debuff. 20% on top of the 30% trauma debuff. A healer only healing for 50% can't keep that gig up for long
Like I said. There are uses but BT is so limited that it's basically a non-factor in large PvP situations. If Arenas get released it'll be great though since typically smaller confrontations revolve around burst.
The healing debuff is alright. I didn't say it was bad. I was just saying that it's a mediocre reason for us to exist in group v group combat. It's also the ONLY thing we truly bring that is reliably useful. Our speed boost is a joke in comparison to bringing an extra Sorcerer because of all the tricks they can do with jump-sprinting. It's also not available when you need it unless you hold your fury(which is bad). That's why I'm saying take away our great 1v1 ability and make us better in group PvP. I want something that makes us viable for real PvP and not just hunting down loners on the sides.
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D:
http://www.torhead.com/ability/8cvm3LN/bloodthirst
Most amazing group-wide buff in the game.
Also, only healing debuff in the game? Amazing to help your team take out healers or high priority targets.
Oh, and (albeit only 6% whenever you can get the fury for it) heals for your group as well.
Even a speed boost for Huttball if you really want to go there. Marauders are great for groups. You just can't Force Leap into a pack of 4 people and expect to get **** done.
Bloodthirst is okay but the 5 minute cooldown severely limits the effect it has on a game. Realistically if I were forming a rated WZ group I wouldn't even consider this a plus.
Deadly Throw is okay I suppose. Most of the time it's not going to help as much as a stun though. It's more effective to just CC one of the other healers and tunnel the other while he can't really heal at all. It may be the only heal debuff in the game but it's not really as useful as Mortal Strike was in WoW. 20% healing isn't a severe advantage by any means.
The heals are pathetic. You have some self heals that are decent but the actual group heal is 6% in total and it doesn't matter. A decently geared healer can heal about 5k with a crit in 1.5 seconds.
The speed boost is meh. I would definitely recommend using it in Rage spec but other than that it's only okay for Huttball. Fury is a precious resource and Berserk is basically required to put out any real semi-burst with Anni spec.
Overall we may have some utility moves but they aren't all that useful. In a group situation the fact that we can't do any damage without jumping means we either pop CDs and pressure something or sit pretty in the back. We're good in 1v1s but Voidstar with PuGs is a pretty good indication of what rated WZs with true 8v8s(not a bunch of idiots spread out all over the place) will entail: A bunch of ranged DPS with the occasional Assassin/Operative with SWs getting destroyed by focus fire whenever their CDs aren't all up.
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Ahhh okay. Didn't know that. Strange though that I've seen some talk as to how a good Carnage player is tough to deal with if they're focusing on you. I'll have to look into it eventually and see what tweaks could make it better for pvp, or if it's just a lost cause.
It's definitely viable if you have a buddy that can keep people from kiting you. Powertechs work wonders in that regard. Their slow on main attack + grapple make you both a formidable force. If you don't have someone that will always be helping you with anti-kiting then it's sub-par.
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The fact you think Marauders are 8v8 Chumps tells me you should stick to PVEing and not pvp anymore.
Marauders are close up there to Sorcs in how good they are for groups.
Lol. Ok buddy you keep thinking that. They're tanky for about 15 seconds and then they fall over to AoE damage and ranged focus fire. Unlike PTs they can't pull people out of range of their allies. They have to rush into the middle to do anything. They also have sustained damage that requires some time to ramp up so they're not as good as Operatives or Assassins who can at least burst and get out in group situations.
They're built for winning 1v1 scenarios. They're terrible in group battles.
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Funny thing actually, I have only seen ONE Carnage specced Marauder. And ZERO Combat Sentinels. I haven't personally tried out the Carnage tree, as the Annihilation seems to suit me perfectly, but I might have to.
I've heard they're supposed to be completely viable builds for PvP. Maybe those are just the most difficult to be effective with? I'm not sure, but all I know is nooooobody on my server sub-50 uses it.
Has nothing to do with skill. Carnage requires stupidly high uptime to do damage. It's all frontloaded attacks with no real cooldown attack outside Force Scream. This means it's automatically terrible for PvP outside maybe a 0 Sorcerer warzone(lol who am I kidding, that's not going to happen).
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It's just an oped 1v1 class simple as that.
Ok
Nerf our 1v1. Make us not suck at group PvP.
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Take away my Undying Rage. Please. Just get rid of it. Kill it with fire. I won't cry because I couldn't care less about e-peen duels. It's practically worthless everywhere else.
In return make me not useless in group PvP. I hate being a 1v1 king and an 8v8 chump. Being useful for just running around putting pressure on healers and killing turret classes is unsatisfying. We're not good for anything else though..
In return for Undying Rage give me a knockback.
OR
In return for Undying Rage + Saber Ward(Make it Juggernaut only) give me an enemy pull(like Death Grip).
P.S. - If the above two options are unacceptable I'd trade Undying Rage for our "Phantom" talent to be build into Force Camouflage and have the talent get replaced with something useful for raid damage like "This talent reduces any damage you take over 10k(in a single hit) by 20%".
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success at 1x1.
That's why you don't see how they're overpowered. 1v1 is absolutely pointless and irrelevant. They're overpowered in group PvP.
Heck, even super useful if you're trying to either hold the Huttball for a tie win or if you're trying to kill their carrier.
Sorcs and Sages need 2 Stances so they cannot Heal and DPS at the same time.
in PvP
Posted
Deathmark Hybrid
Forked Lightning Hybrid
Yes. 38/38/38 specs indeed. You could argue their base healing capabilities are being exaggerated when not using a hybrid heal spec but that's about it. Your base healing ability is the best in the game by the way. No other class can do it better without being specced.