I never said any of those things, and telling me to "keep my mouth shut and go back to playing" is pretty much the definition of rude and uninviting. Whatever it takes to keep that oversized ego in check my man. I was asking for an explanation and your post pretty much proves there isn't one that's readily apparent. Thank you for proving my point. I'll part by letting you know what I don't think I have "a say." I just want to understand, and your nastiness proves even you don't understand. You're just blindly mimicking whatever is stated by Bioware.

I'm not an angry nerd at the moment, not about this. The way it's framed, people went to Ilum (not an exploit) looted chests (not an exploit) and then did so frequently. Apparently doing it frequently leads to it being an exploit. In reality, it seems like they set the game up so that doing this was rewarded. The solution is obvious - create a minimum level for visitation or the looting of chests. It probably wasn't a good thing from the way they described it, but just out and out banning people who were, according to all information available, following the mechanics of the game but doing it far too often for Bioware's tastes is bad. Hotfixing it would have been a much more elegant solution, but as it stands it seems like Bioware is foisting undeserved blame on some people. I don't claim to know everything, but if there's some other side of the story that hasn't been discussed please let it come to light. I'm trying to be as fair as possible, but as it stands even the post that was conceived purely to justify these actions doesn't do a very good job of doing so. I mean, they banned credit sellers - excellent. No one can complain about that. But this seems iffy. I mean, if I run warzones non-stop and do a piss poor job am I exploiting the PvP system because I'm doing it so often that the reward becomes great? What if I post a lot of auctions over and over and flood the market (with goods I intend to sell)? I'm really looking for a justification here but I don't see it, only the bold statement that this constitutes exploitation and we should just accept that. They're guilty of selling credits then. The chests on Ilum ought to have nothing to do with it, yet it is the prime focus of the discussion for much of the post.

Sounds like a design flaw Mr. Reid, not exploitation. Take responsibility.

I can only imagine what other games being discussed in the frame of the TOR forums would look like. Didn't like DA2 because you spent the whole time in Kirkwall? It's not the developer's fault, it's the fault of the player for not appreciating that they even have that one city!

Quoting for great justice. This is the hope that I hold onto.

No they didn't, are you kidding me? People hung on the words of people like Furor. I think the FoH website was one of the most popular EQ related websites there was. His input was so valued that Blizzard took him in on the development of WoW. He now makes a fine amount of money off the fact that he was a jerk of a raid leader that did world firsts and knew encounter design well. Again, rose tinted glasses. You don't want Bioware to make the game like EQ, it would fail hard.

At the bottom of the page when you post a reply you can rate the thread. Tada!

These forums have proven to me that people don't do their own research before spending their own cash. The game never really promised to be what you seem to want it to be. It's doubtful it ever will be.

If you hate playing with other people and make the acquisition of gear your sole goal then yes, it's really the gear! For some others, it's the fun of playing with others on a regular basis (multiplayer content has tons of replay value) and challenging/conquering the toughest encounter you can. Many people who play this way find gear to just be a means to their ends. I hope this helps.

It's cool guys, he isn't actually serious.

Rose tinted glasses. EQ was the home of some of the most ridiculous outlandish gamer behavior I've ever seen. Furor of FoH in particular acted like pretty much the greatest waste of space on earth, and he did so on a regular basis. See, you got by because you ignored those people. Try to do it again, it isn't hard.

It's all a damn red herring used by people who are bad. The reason people left WoW is because it's 7 years old, the playerbase is jaded and the world isn't new. It has nothing to do with the ability to parse data or addons. If that was the case, that game would have failed a LONG time ago. What really sickens me is that everyone makes these anecdotal arguments and then totally mischaracterize the other group as people who want to lord it over others. In actuality, I want to tell people like YOU to back off when you claim a wipe is my fault and it clearly wasn't. Bad players like no data because it means they can pin faults on their more capable comrades. I am now completely convinced of this. It's the same people who got carried through Molten Core by better players and who want the game to be just like that.

I never said that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWoYmTAfDbk But yeah, we've been saying this since before launch man. If you hated WoW, you will eventually hate this game. They are too similar for that not to be the case unless you hated WoW for superficial reasons (don't like fantasy, hate warcraft story, etc.) "Is that fear I smell?" -Sith Inquisitor, 50 different world quests

Used to be shocking, now it's just downright amusing.

I don't have the time and even if I did this computer doesn't have TOR on it. Pretty simple.

People who post things like "knowing your DPS means you'll stand in fire and never CC things!" are basically admitting they don't know what they're talking about. Developers want a combat log and the ability to parse it. Have fun.

What does Hillsbrad have anything to do with this? Pretty sure the game launched with "world PvP" (even though hardly anyone uses it, shocker).

I will quote this post when subs start to drop and hope you are around to see it. See you in 6 months. I hope I'm wrong. Pro Tip: Every MMO since WoW with a big budget gets showered in praise right before it bursts into flames. Look at the game, not what a couple people are saying about it.

I didn't play any of those games aside from WoW (and none of them are what you'd point to as commercial successes) but WoW had Fully customizable UI A combat log(!) Great character control All at launch, and TOR does not. TOR has a lot of points over launch-era WoW, but there are big gaps such as the aforementioned ones that really make the game feel like it wasn't ready for launch. There are things they should have done and they didn't do them. People are now reacting to this. This should not in any way be surprising. In fact, you shouldn't be so alarmed because people making complaints about the game aren't saying it's a failure. They're simply saying that it released unready. More people need to chill when this game is criticized. Seriously, I can come up with 5 things the game did well and 5 things the game could do better off the top of my head. If you can't come up with ways to criticize/laud the game even if you love/hate it, your opinion is most likely useless. Actually, I knew this was coming when they squeezed it in right before Christmas. If the forums weren't wiped, I'd be able to link you to posts where I said I knew the game would be lackluster in certain respects because they were scrambling for a Christmas release.

If you're seriously asking this question, Christmas sales. Which were great this year, btw. If you're lamenting how the game isn't really "ready" in general then i'm right there with you. I'd have waited half a year for them to clean up what is a game with tons of promise.

All you can do is point out how ridiculously absurd some of the assertions made on this forum are, and take solace in the knowledge that Bioware developers don't think like the average fanboy on this website. They'll continue to defend any potential imperfection, even claiming it's a boon to the game. They aren't defending Bioware, they're defending their own judgement. If the game is a flop they made a poor judgement and so they rush to attack anything that suggests such. It's the only reasonable explanation I can come up with. I mean, if you think not having a combat log is a good thing all I can say is that it's great that you aren't developing MMOs.

Might as well have tattooed "I'm clueless" on your forehead, because that's what this post means. OP is spot on about pretty much everything and I'm glad that I'm not alone. However, I think Bioware already knows about these problems because we've been talking about them for months and months. I think it's less a problem of what to do, but more than they're unsure of how to do these things in a timely manner. This statement doesn't apply to all of the things mentioned in the OP, just a majority. I really wish they'd come out and SAY SOMETHING on the FORUMS though. Maybe threads like these will mean good change will come quicker. Maybe it doesn't mean anything. Either way, voted 5 stars and posting this message for support.

I got to 50 playing a few hours every day just questing. I even skipped playing at all for 1-2 days at a time twice during this launch. It is not hard to get to 50 in this game. This impression that if you're not below 50 you're doing it wrong just has no basis in fact. Developers like it when people take this stance though because it takes responsibility off of them (the people responsible for making the game enjoyable) and puts it on the consumers (who are free to play the game how they please within the confines of legality). That's why they'll continue to encourage it. They released a game that was not prepared to be launched in the name of Christmas sales, and people are expressing their displeasure with that now. Expect more of it until the end of the month when at least a quarter of the subs completely vanish almost instantaneously.

While I would agree that it would be a great boon, there are so many more important things that we just haven't heard anything about.